/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

The Mage Cookbook has a surprising amount of fluff about a bunch of mages from different groups getting together to eat. It has a dash of cringe (which is probably unsurprising given it's the Mage Cookbook) and a perplexing amount of vitriol for celebrity chefs though.

Beast and Beast's players are worst things in either WoD. Mage's powerwank is downright soothing in comparison.

Printed or in our personal chronicles?

Because the way Mekhet often are content to live with a single human or with a family, sometimes even under someone's bed indefinitely, seems pretty comfy.

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Alice from the Gangrel corebook seems pretty comfy.

Is this still about "tone" and stuff or is there an actual problem?

>Phil: Sex when there’s not presence is the staring at the headboard, staring at the ceiling. Thrust, thrust, thrust, thrust, thrust. Ah! Yeah, oh! Was it good for you too? [slight pause] Please.

F A T H E R ' S T H R U S T I N G C O C K

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Both. Most players that wanted to play Beast I've met were, while not exactly That Guys, pretty cringeworty to play with even to me, and I've attended a few ERPs that degraded into full blown orgies, played Black Tokyo, Slasher chronicle and few other games with full-blown chaotic evil sick fucks. Not exactly an endorsement of my own character, I'm well aware.

Constantinople by night's layout description is maximum comfy

My group is good.

>savor [deep breath] [speaking slowly just above whisper] the taste
>[slowly, drawing out words in a whisper]
>[heavy repetitive panting]
> If I was just thrust, thrust, thrust, I actually find out …

Ok.

I see it as a splat for (as someone else described it here) taking IM's 'personal world' and cosmic scale jist and bringing it down to work with street level play, and to flesh out the astral section of the setting. I don't see any reason to be upset at all, especially now that Hero-Beast hybrids are a thing.

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>Hero-Beast hybrids

Can you elaborate on that a bit?

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If you've played with them a long time before and you've picked Beast to play together it's wouldn't be that bad I guess, though playing another Splat would be better, and most of them can have a similar bent to the Beast if you tweak it enough. Just be wary of new players that are Beast enthusiasts.

According to the kind user who helped us yesterday, a fourth form of inheritance by which they craft a special Anathema weapon, slay their own Horror and embed it in them. A hero can still kill the HeroBeast by drawing the sword in the lair and other beasts can tell you're fucked up. They have Satiety that is permanently sealed at a neutral level, no expenditures, etc., and can gain hero powers.

Oh and, a way to make site focused adventures with environmental threats more salient to nwod. Basically the thing that completed nwod for me.

CoC does that better if you throw away overused silly monsters and play gradually tainted characters.

works for that as well.

>Why are spiritfags and woofs so adamant about spirits having access to Spheres? If spirits are so big and strong then shouldn't they be able to stand on their own without having to rely on access to another splat's powers and mechanics?
Well, as far as Revised goes technically only Demon Lords (much weaker spirits than for example a Maeljin Incarnae) were explictly said to have access to infernal enhancements, spirit charms and Sphere magick (and in cases archspheres); the book even said archmages watched themselves around Demon Lords.

Here's how Demon Lords compare to greater spirits in power: "Although they have material counterparts that may rival them for cosmic power, these spirits give evil a human face. Unlike the Urge Wyrm Incarna they resemble, these lesser entities have distinct personalities and measurable powers. Most are ranked as Lords by the Hermetic texts; all things being equal, however, greater demons may well exist as dark gods or Maeljin Incarna. Such evils cannot be faced directly, however, and are therefore missing from demonic catalogues."

For these greater beings such as Incarnae and above their power is just beyond understanding and the traits used in Werewolf aren't sufficient to describe such spirits

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Leave the Spheres to Mages and Mage-created beings (that includes spirits, woofs, whatever).
Tell everyone else to fuck off.

>Here's a researched answer to your question.
>REE NO

Hum, Call of Cthulhu is a highly flanderized take on HPL's work focused on the meme elements, I wouldn't ever consider using it instead of Chronicles of Darkness for anything but that. CofD is probably better if you want something in the spirit rather than the superficial form of HPL adventures.

Ah, I see.

I'm actually the guy who originally asked the question. Whoever responded to you is somebody else.

Don't see any reason unless running a WtA focused chronicle.

Doesn't look too tough. I'll just shove Forces 9 up its ass. :^)

>Beast and Beast's players are worst things in either WoD

That doesn't explain why no one has shared Enemy Action.

Leave broken magewank in Mage. Gifts are great enough as they are if you use them wisely, there's no need to let woofs and their pet spirits use everything.
Sorry.

>Phil Sex

I think I'm going to be ill...

Too bad even a weak Demon Lord that has existed since before mankind evolved from dirty apes could already have Forces 9 powered by arbitrary high levels of Arete an Willpower

"Force of Whenever a Mage Tries to Use Forces 9 He's Booted to An Alternate Reality Where He is Free to Live His Delusional Power Fantasy"

I'd go with:

Vampire chronicle: Everything uses disciplines, including spirits. Werewolves are "lupines" that are absolutely everywhere in the wilderness but not particularly often encountered in the cities, and most definitely.

Mage chronicle: Most supernatural things use specific rotes. Vampires and werewolves are weird products of mythic threads, but just werewolves and vampires, not garou and kindred. Spirits may use either.

Werewolf chronicle: Default take on spirits. Vampires are most often fomori as well. Mages are per Book of the Weaver.

Demon chronicle: As noted, most things are covered in terms of lores. May use some hunter mechanics if appropriate as well due to obvious tie ins.

Hunter, mummy, kuei-jin and wraith: Probably would use full crossover mechanics, as these are much more heavily implied to be in an everything goes crossover universe.

Interestingly, demon seems to crossover into hunter and wraith, which are themselves crossover universes, but demons don't seem to ever themselves encounter specific kinds of vampires, specific kinds of werewolves, technocrats, iirc. in dtf books, afaik.

CofD usually turns into "PC fuck yea, everyone gets superpowers". Except perhaps the Vigil.

Anyone else think Demons of the High Umbra are mega boring?
>muh big over arching plans
>muh don't manifest directly, manipulate boring npcs
>muh give you shitty demonic investments that are weak as shit
Meanwhile based Banes actively destroy existence.

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Too late. I already turned myself into God.

Exactly, you think you did, just like the Demon Lord intended when he created his Force billions of years before you were born

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Nah it's fine. I actually still agree with you desu.

Demon = Mage > Changeling > Vampire > Werewolf > Wraith > Hunter

Is this the right order?

Ok? Per what I LIKE is IM's personal world stuff and cosmic scale jist and bringing it down to work with street level play, to flesh out the astral section of the setting, and per , site focused adventures and an emphasis on dangerous environments.

Ultimately, one can like or dislike Beast but while high tier mages can go on interplanar romps too, Beast gives PCs the keys to the multiverse from the getgo without having to wait til they are able to curbstomp everything within (per Mage) and without having to spend powers on it and be inherently fucked up by the process to the point that PCs just plain aren't going to do it (per Demon).

I find Beast very reminiscent of Planescape and Ravenloft of all things as a result.

Umbral demons can still manifest directly in the world, only they're so powerful their Avatars need avatars (called proxies)

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I'd put Werewolf over Vampire personally, but otherwise it looks fine. Outside of Lore Mastery Demons are kinda overhyped though.

Fair, whatever works for you.
My point was more use full crossover mechanic if you really must, but fade other splats in the background otherwise, and dont let your players use stuff from foreign splats. Let vamp have it from angry truck-sized woof with Gifts. Don't let vamp use Gifts. Let vamp try, and most likely fail to leash and collar the woof if he really wants to, though. Let woof and his pet spirits awoo and fuck some mage's day up. Don't let woof and his pet spirits use Spheres, etcetera...

Do nuWoD

>beast
>like planescape

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(arch)Mage>Demon>Werewolf>(shit)Mage>Changeling>Vampire>Wraith>Hunter

I don't know enough about that watered down pile of piss to rank anything, sorry.

>all those augmentations
>still using a keyboard to interface with the computer, just with extra fingers
That picture triggers me every time

Not that overhyped when you factor in the possibility of ancient Earthbound/Archdukes having Faith ratings of 40+; and that having high Lore Mastery (and other appropriate Lores) means you can singlehandedly end the world; or that even if a faction of Faustians had the combinated Faith of 10,000 thralls they could already start to rewrite the cosmos

Demon=(arch)Mage>Werewolf>Changeling>Vampire>Wraith>Vampire>Hunter

>"Outside of Lore Mastery Demons are kinda overhyped though."
>mentions Lore Mastery in his response post

>old
Archmage > Demon > Mage > Vampire > Werewolf > Changeling > Wraith > Hunter

>new
Archmage > Mage > Demon > Mummy > Geist > Beast > Werewolf > Promethean > Changeling > Vampire > Hunter

Demons have the greater potential because there's the possibility of redeeming yourself and becoming an angel again

>nuWoD

Archmages > Mages > Mummies / Demons > Sin Eaters > Werewolves > Prometheans > Changelings / Vampires > Hunters

Deviants will likely be below Changelings and Vampires but above Hunters

Of course, certain min/maxed or combat-built characters may shift categories a little.

Princess > Purified > Archmage > Mage > Demon > Mummy > Geist > Beast > Werewolf > Promethean > Changeling > Vampire > Hunter

Forget Beasts. I would put them at the same level as Sin Easters.

Imagine how easy it's going to be to waifu Luna as an Archmage in 2e

Dat ES Withstand Practice of Entities

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>Princess but not any other fansplats

Luna is slumming it when Archmages can take Rank 9 and 10 bitches.

Go read C20. Changelings are now mini-mages and can easily BTFO Vampires given the massive buffs their cantrips received, the fact that they now have Unleashings, and the incredibly low EXP cost for Arts in comparison to Disciplines (4x current rating for all Arts) as well as the fact that you can cheese Realms by spending temp Glamour.

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She will be mine.

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You also don't stick your dick in crazy, and Luna is basically the spirit of crazy.

I'm totally stealing that art. I might use it for antagonists in my setting.

Demons get broken powers to compensate for abysmal wits of their players. Bad mages are as squishy as mortals. Tremere and necromancer vampires can wreck wraiths, but rest of them are pretty helpless.
Mummy should go first, but nobody really plays Mummy. Hunters can ruin some really bad monsters since everyone keeps underestimating them and they still get some powers besides.

Man, vamps certainly got nerfed in CofD.

>and most definitely not fighting Veeky Forums and McDonalds for the fate of the world while vampires and technocrats are oblivious to it

Pentex's existence may very well imply Werewolf is a crossover central setting, or at least Pentex is. Kinda like Wolfram and Hart, something that has a one way influence on other realities to an extent. Not sure.

None of this is particularly canon, of course, but its weird how Fallen do believe in multiple stacked realities, DO encounter the multi crossover splats (hunter/wraith) but DON'T encounter everyone and everything else, with their powers not even having a defined effect on non demon, non mortals at all.

To the extent that woofs deal with Pentex, I would actually have full on creatures from other splats emerge, even vampires with WEIRD TRICKS. I'd have those that gain employment under Pentex largely leave their own realities behind and emerge into the Apocalypse dimension/timeline, and they can't necessarily tell the difference. I would absolutely let PCs potentially destroy and triumph over Pentex, but they would find that the more they antagonize Pentex, it starts drawing on its resources from the multiverse and encounter bullshit from other gamelines.

Ah yes. Well, lupines, iirc, have Celerity 2-8 and double stats in not-crinos. I may go so far as to have them be reverse abominations (ie have all the VtM lupine stuff plus the WtA garou stuff).

I would not normally have the mage spirits and werewolf spirits ever meet, though most definitely mages who got too big for their britches (borderline genocide tier) regarding werewolves or vampires would most certainly start facing werewolves and blood sorcerers summoning paradox spirits, magick wielding spirits, and all manner of insane fuckery.

if you define yourself in terms of mini-mage you already lost fairyfag; vampires have consistently BTFO'd mages (i.e massasa wars)

vampires > mages > mini-mages

They're weak as shit in CWoD as well, despite the protesting in the thread. The "ONE SUPER SECRET ABILITY" meme really is true.

They did, but werewolves were better than vampires in owod, even without the bullshit minmaxing.

The dog barks because it is small.

lol ok vampfag whatever you say

If you want to jack off in crossover with vampire and not deal with the drawbacks of a vampire, just get "Coils of Things with Z in the name."

On the other hand, aside from the time I was ambushed by a horde of powerful burger spirits, I have never felt weak as a vampire in Requiem. Majesty away. If you think they are a mage, don't, just befriend them in the mundane way.

>tfw the changeling teleports the tremere chantry into a volcano with a flick of their wrist via wayfare 5
>"B-BUT MUH MASSASA WAR!!!!!1!! MUH ORDER OF HERMES!!!!!!!!!! I BET THE MAGES DID THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
>the mary sue vamps cry out in horror as they plummet into the magma below

lul

vampires lose to wizards and fairies too bad so sad

The Massassa Wars were the some of the most egregious examples of utterly ridiculous develop-fiat, plot armor, don't kill the cash cow, the writers were high shenanigans in rpg history.

Yup. You start off getting to explore the multiverse and have a decent shot of peaceful interaction.

In, say, Mage, you can't really go into, say, the Shadow until you gain the power to ... mind control almost everything in the Shadow, to say nothing of the elements that you need to be an Archmage to explore, which kind of renders the exploration element lifeless and a foregone conclusion.

it's not me seeing, it's the fellow Hermetic Rebecca

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>If you think they are a mage, don't, just befriend them in the mundane way.

Douche Mages befriend non-Mages or human sleepwalkers? Who knew?

I think I'm going to need oWOD and CofD page citations.

>matter 3 prime 2
>drop meteor on thaumaturgical ban
>no prime 5 needed

nothing personal tremere

>Attacks at night
>Doesn't use Coorespondence at all
>No Umbrood familiars
>No real strategy whatsoever

Both Massassa Wars have horrible writing.

But the tremerefag thinks it's amazing writing

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>path of conjuring
>create rare material that instantly dissolves meteors

nothing personal mage

>it's not big enough to dissolve something the size of manhattan

fail

Everyone always focuses on the Tradition when discussing vampires. Tradition mages are poseurs.

Other than vampire genocide would have been bad for WW sales in the 1990's, why hasn't the Technocratic Union exterminated the undead menace? They killed an antediluvian just with Forces 5 and no archmasters. The average fang should be considered little more kindling with delusions of grandeur.

Every time I play a vampire, I befriend mages just fine.

Not to mention that vampires most often wind up seeming the most in charge with the most temporal power, and having an easygoing personality plus treating the mage as a wise advisor has always worked.

Mages will usually respond very favorably to a prince or archbishop treating them with special respect, even if said prince's domain has like 3 vampires, one of which is the prince, one of which is Some Guy, and one of which is the prince's mom.

>it's not big enough to dissolve something the size of manhattan
why are you houseruling how the material works? it has some uncomprehensible property that just makes the meteor disappear

great argument

They killed an Antediluvian using four correspondence 4 spells

it was fucking hilarious

>b-b-but he was weakened tho
vampfags will never stop crying

bitch if you want to go that far i'll just throw matter 5 at your junk

This is a good thread

If mages weren't written as absolutely retarded in the oWOD, there would have been a vampire genocide shortly after Mage's release. WW was not prepared for the Gay Goth rebellion or willing to sacrifice Masquerade sales, so we have the metaplot we do today.

In nuWOD/CofD, WW no longer cared about protecting vampires, so they had to compete without help. Now, they can be picked on by changelings! Mages are just overkill.

it's not whether you're weaked or not, it's whether you're prepared

hence canonically a much weaker methuselah (weak even by methuselah standards) that could prepare managed to seal russia from technocracy, killed most tradition mages and technocrats in there, drained several nodes that destroyed technocract constructs and only let a few enslaved cabals live

the few technocracts that survived were forced to band together with other reality deviants (tradition mages) just to survive LUL

>This is a good thread

It would be a better thread if some nice Anons shared Beast Player's Guide and Enemy Action.