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/osrg/ OSR General
James Watson
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Carter Thomas
What're your favorite sets of rules for magic item creation, /osrg/?
Jaxon Thomas
Describe your ideal lowlevel dungeon.
If that would take too long, then just your favorite monster, favorite trick, favorite trap.
Ayden Bailey
Simple, relatively short, but flavorful, with a single magic item waiting at the end.
One I've been meaning to do for a while involves a tower in the middle of an active volcano. You enter through the roof, then descend down into the depths, ultimately going below the surface of the lava. It's all really cold there, though, and the heat of the volcano is kept out, by your ultimate prize - a single Ring of Fire Resistance.
The ring is in the finger of a statue depicting a great ancient murderhobo that was buried here. As soon as the ring is removed, the entire tower loses its fire protection and is swiftly consumed by the lava: grab what you need and GTFO.
Thomas Howard
The Rules Cyclopedia ones, by far. (Are they the same in B/X?) They're a bit mathy but they have great, great advantages like granting XP the first time you make something new, covering the creation of absolutely crazy shit like flying castles, and unlike AD&D they don't shit all over the player for wanting to use the ability.
I do like the Holmes rule about scrolls as well though, not hard to see why that's so widely adopted in OSR circles.
Christopher Ramirez
>1e Psionics
>there's Psionic Strength which is determined by rolling 1d100 and adding/multiplying stuff; points are spent to use powers
>Psionic Ability is 2 x Psionic Strength and does nothing but Gygax listed it in the MM anyway
>Psionic Attack Strength is one half of Psionic Ability and used for psionic attacks, every time your Psionic Strength decreases it does too
>Psionic Defense Strength is the other half of Psionic Ability and used for psionic defenses, every time your Psionic Strength decreases it does too
Why do psionic characters have 3 pools of Psionic Strength that all increase and decrease together instead of only one?
Why did Gygax decide that Psionic Ability was an important monster stat despite it doing nothing?
Literally what did he mean by this?
Tyler Hill
There's a trap in the first Evil Within game that I want to try with rookies, because I think it fits well with something I've been thinking regarding building confidence for players.
In Evil Within, at one point the MC has to go through a corridor lined with spikes on the walls, and it's pretty obvious the walls will close in and turn him into swiss cheese given all the ancient corpses and bones on the ground but there's also no other way through. At the far end of the corridor there's a locked door, another corpse and a tile on the ground that matches a slot on the door. The corpse belonged to an adventurer, and he wrote on his diary how he got here with the tile only to find out it could fit in one of two ways (front and back), and he has no way of telling which one will unlock the door instead of triggering the trap. Since he's desperate, he writes how he'll gamble on the 50/50 chance. Of course, it didn't work out for him, and now the MC has to succeed where he screwed up. The tile in fact fits in both ways, he just has to commit to one.
Observing the tile some more lets you realize one of the sides is spattered with blood. Since that means that side was facing outwards when the trap triggered, you have to put that side facing the inside of the slot in order to open the door safely.
It's an easy puzzle if you think about it a little, but that is the point: show players that thinking things through is rewarding, that they can escape certain death by observation and planning, and they'll be more eager to pit themselves against harder content, instead of being demoralized upon facing a gotcha trap and losing characters from the getgo.
Eli Stewart
>Why did Gygax decide that Psionic Ability was an important monster stat despite it doing nothing?
I believe that this is an artifact of the Monster Manual being written first, just like the monsters all having OD&D/Basic armor class. The system probably looked different at the time so Gygax had to fudge an explanation for the stat being way too high when he got around to writing the rules in the DMG.
The rest is pure autism though. Psionics has always been a busted-ass system. Works best if you only use powers and leave combat out entirely.
Ryder Thompson
This is a good trap, thanks for sharing it. Never heard of that game as well, so odds are my players won't know it either.
Jeremiah Gomez
It's a neat game, really cheesy and gory but also pretty fun. The second game was one of the best games of 2017, though it loses some of that cheesy charm.
Dylan Cooper
when it comes to Psionics, it's probably best to not bother giving it a unique system and just repurpose the existing magic system instead
Bentley Walker
I'm retrocloning 1e psionics right now so that's a no go. Also, that's what Pathfinder did and it sucks ass.
Ayden Green
The most fun I've had with psionics is 3.5 psionics desu
David Morales
Give credit where credit's due: 3.5's psionics are the least shitty of any edition.
I also like Tome of Battle.
Hunter Carter
I've asked this before but I'd like to hear more answers (preferably from people that have it)
how are the dmsguild's print on demand Rules Cyclopedia copies?
Jaxon Diaz
>that spoiler
David Powell
that's more down to Paizo being incompetent than the idea itself being flawed, although I guess 1e style Psionics could work if you extremely streamline it
from what I've heard they're actually pretty decent, supposedly the art is slightly muddier, and the text slightly lighter than an original print run RC, but overall it's supposed to be perfectly usable
Ryan Gomez
Apparently really good until about a week ago, when they posted a new scan that was something like half the price to POD but also significantly blurrier. I haven't seen either so I can't verify this, but that's the feedback going around at the moment.
Luke Price
>Literally what did he mean by this?
Loss from combat or general use, but you [can defend too much and only be able to attack] or [attack too much and only be able to defend].
Supplement III is ambiguous (general use might require some amount total rather than some amount from both pools?), but was probably intended to work the same way.
>Why did Gygax decide that Psionic Ability was an important monster stat despite it doing nothing?
That's a straight port from Supplement III with some renaming and errors.
In OD&D you have a Psychic Potential and your max PSPs is twice that plus some numbers (your PSPs being evenly split between two pools).
All the monster entries list Psychic Potential (except Intellect Devourers (which list Psionic Strength), Mindflayers (which list Total Psionic Strength), and Titans (which list Psionic Potential)).
Though we also get this charming sentence near the start of the book,
>Psionic attack strengths for monsters are stated in the paragraphs dealing with psionically endowed monsters
so fuck interpreting that.
The MM just takes whatever number was listed, ignores the label, and treats it as how many points they have to attack with.
Grayson Baker
>The Rules Cyclopedia ones, by far.
>When a character tries to create a specific type
of magical item, he may fail. His chance for suc-
cess is rolled on d100
>([Int + Lvl] x 2)-(3 x spell level) = %
Damn they ain't bad at all, I really need to investigate RC more.
Isaiah Rogers
Dumb newbie question, but do all the Basic D&D use the same general rules? At least for the first book stuff. Like B/X/ BECMI and RC
Aiden Collins
Hope this helps: home.earthlink.net
Evan Jackson
Yes.
AD&D isn't the same general rules, but it is also very similar.
Leo Anderson
Calm down, Monte.
Jason Miller
I like the dumb simple Yoon-Suin Psionics.
For every HD or level, something with psionic ability has d6 psionics points which can be expended to use psionic powers – and
which recharge each night spent sleeping. Psionic abilities are as follows:
Minor telekinesis (moving an object smaller than a dog, lifting something, levitating a small object) 1pp
Major telekinesis (moving an object bigger than a dog, attacking with an item telekinetically) 2pp
Psionic mind blast (does d4 hp damage per pp spent; hits automatically)
Clairvoyance (can ‘see’ a known location within 100 yards per pp spent, for 1 minute per pp spent)
Mind-reading (can ask the DM a single question about what an NPC knows) 2pp per question
Nicholas Thomas
Classic Gygax.
>home.earthlink.net
Domo arigato, Mr. Anonimosu
Luke Rogers
Yeah Ive played though almost every other D&D from oD&D to 5e, but none of the Basic line, which seems to be a lot of peoples favorite.
Mason Martin
What kind of a short quest or hurdle would you have to go through to get a fleet of Shou Lung dragonships on your side?
Benjamin Lewis
>really good until about a week ago
>Wizards puts something great in place, then buttfucks it for no apparent reason and/or crass economical factors
I wish I were surprised.
Leo Bell
Explain how a ship as big as this one's drawn to be has a tonnage of 45 fucking tons. Shit, that house it has for a quarterdeck could probably fit a higher tonnage than that
Gabriel Myers
Dunno. Maybe the Spelljammer helm is making it lighter even when no one's actively lifting it?
Cameron Watson
Aren't you forgetting about the ridiculously low cargo capacity? pic related can carry 24 tons.
Ryan Brooks
maybe it's in space tons
Gabriel Rogers
>helm is making it lighter
That's not what tonnage means. Tonnage is the cargo volume of the ship. The weight of the boat is called displacement (due to Archimedes' Principle, the amount of water displaced is equal to the blah blah you got this).
Ian Parker
What the FUCK? I didn't even notice that "cargo" was listed separately for some reason. And yeah, I know the numbers are dumdum; your pic is an excellent example of the exact point I was trying to make.
Luke Hughes
>A later addition under the new "Miasmos" moniker included a small number of sealed vats, but Quafe has demanded that those be accessed solely by corporate representatives, and not by crew nor capsuleer.
Isaiah Diaz
>Domo arigato, Mr. Anonimosu
Please don't kill me and wear me as a suit. If we go to the right hospital, you can get my skin off safely.
Joshua Murphy
>he doesn't like magic kung fu powers
pleb
Xavier Cox
Oriental Adventures had better magic kung fu rules.
Juan Bennett
Don't lie to me, user. Don't lie to yourself
Ryan Baker
>Describe your ideal lowlevel dungeon.
I wrote it.
Wrote 2, actually, except the 2nd one is more of a heist.
I'd like to do a horror one at some point.
Decent trap. A little deus-ex-machina to have the adventurer there with a diary, but it's a good bit of observation training anyway.
Nicholas Martinez
to be fair we have no idea yet how this has effected the POD product
Ryder Cruz
Fuck low level dungeons. There are a million of them already.
Describe your ideal HIGH level dungeon.
Julian Rodriguez
I still think we need a book of manuals.
Jace Price
Even better, a level neutral dungeon.
Levi Long
An dungeon split across 3 times. Being built - occupied - ruined. Gates and machines allow PCs to travel between the different times to acomplish different tasks, change the future-past-present, and steal the same item three times. Once they have three copies of God-Killer Spear or something, they can pierce the lunar gorgon in its three eyes, blinding it and turning the moon back into flesh, allowing for...
Yeah, I don't really know past this point. But it's a good idea!
Or heaven. Fight your way into heaven and topple the gods.
Or hell. Pic related.
Carson Rivera
You want a tower instead of a pit?
Then maybe an inverted pyramid, to give you lots of room at the top.
Hunter Walker
Rules for long jumping? I.e. jumping with a running start? When I ran track in high school the top male students were getting over 20ft. Olympic and World record for men are a few inches over 29ft.
Carson Sanchez
I will delete this post in a bit.
Could you answer my question from last thread?
Adam Powell
Roll-under Strength check with a +2 bonus
Jacob Harris
Is it possible to make a rules light narrative game that is still OSR enough to be backwards compatible with actual old school modules? Basically dungeon world except old school and not shit.
Adrian Campbell
A sunken ship trapped in a black and cold abyssal ocean. The souls of the passengers and the crew are fought over by demons and devils. The party arrives, must break the stalemate.
The dungeon itself is the ship, severely dilapitated and rusted at the best of times, outright corrupted and twisted by demonic/infermal presence at worst. The fiends, meanwhile, are like the gangs in A Fistful of Dollars or Yojimbo: their leaders are far too strong for the party to take on, and the best they can do is to play the two sides against one another and hope there's not too much collateral damage.
Then they'll need to find a way to return the ship to the mortal realm.
Angel King
You can jump 10 straight across, an extra 5 feet with a running start, and another 5 feet if you you can make a jump roll (open doors roll modified by Dex).
Christian Sullivan
Did you make this up or is this codified?
Brayden Price
>Could you answer my question from last thread?
I'm.... not entirely sure I can. I don't think I understand it.
Owen King
Isn't that just World of Dungeons?
Kayden Mitchell
Colossal monster machine hybrid (been done I know, but wait) that rampages through the campaign map in a random and/or flowchart manner based on what it runs into, eats, destroys, etc. while you are inside it. As you move through parts of the dungeon it effects how the colossus fights the realm. Maybe even two of them, and you have to break into one and highjack it to make them fight.
Being built might be tricky to keep the players from accidentally the whole dungeon from existing at all, depending on how much like Primer you want it to get. I haven't even read Thulian Echoes yet, but I think it has something like this.
Nathan Butler
I don't believe so. Narrative games are not easily compatible with the OSR design principles.
It's a bit like asking "can I take a modern SUV through a tiny italian city's medieval core?". Sure, you can, but you're going to run into a lot of problems getting it though alleyways designed for pedestrians and cattle.
But hey, who am I to tell you what's possible? Either do it or don't; speculation gets you nowhere and accomplishes nothing.
You can jump about 10 if you're wearing armour and/or carrying stuff. If you're not wearing anything substantial, 20'. If you need to go farther, Strength test with a +2 bonus (roll under) and a penalty equal to the number of items you're carrying. Limit is still 30' unless you're an elf or a rabbitling or something and can justify the leap.
Doesn't come up a lot; I just invented these rules based on how I'd adjudicate it during play.
Jaxson Garcia
William Richardson
Balls-out skyship assault. The party must infiltrate the enemy sky fortress and disable its magic shield emitter before the enemy fleet blasts the allied skyships out of the sky. Yeah, it is a Return of the Jedi ripoff (fuck it, make flying ewoks or some shit help the PCs if you want) but most importantly, press on the timed aspect of it. PCs can't be too careful dealing with the sky fortress' security mechanisms and guards, every minute they waste is a minute the allied fleet doesn't have.
Cooper Hall
issue #93 from Dragon Magazine, so from 1st Edition days. It is titled "Short Hops and Big Drops." The thing I like about it is that it gives characters with good strength and dexterity a fairly good chance at being able to jump over a 10' pit, whereas halving the base numbers in the non-weapon proficiency basically mean that one without the proficiency can jump over a 10' pit. The base of their jump distance is strength + dexterity, which is then used to calculate the distance. A combined total of 6-7 gives you a distance of 3 feet. For every additional two points this increases by 1/2 foot. So, 8-9 is 3.5 feet, 10-11 is 4 feet, 12-13 is 4.5 feet, etc.. An average person (12 Str. and 12 Dex.) would not be able to clear a 10' pit with their jump distance of 7.5 feet, and I like that. Jumping 10 feet is a pretty hurtle for your average person. At a combined total of 34-35, though, you can clear a 10' pit, if you have ample running room (twice the distance of the obstacle you are trying to clear, so 20 feet for a 10' wide pit). One's jump number is adjusted based on conditions (rough ground, landing spot is higher or lower elevation, encumbrance, class, race). And this number is guaranteed to succeed. For example, someone with a jump number of 10 (meaning they can jump 10 feet) will always make it over a 10' pit if he has 20' of running room. If the ground he is running on is uneven then his effective number is now 9, as he cannot build up enough speed. There are rules in place for attempting something beyond your jump number. So in the example with uneven ground the jumper has a 30% chance of succeeding. such as -1 for slippery or uneven ground, -1 for halflings or dwarves, +1 for elves, etc.
Lucas Ross
Giant slaughterhouse cult dungeon that gets more and more like a nega-dungeon the lazier and deeper you go. Basically that demon horse dungeon some blogger posted about a while ago.
Kevin Thomas
I like adding just a small bit of randomness to this so that players can't quite make this a ruthlessly mathematical procedure at the full extent. Assuming a running start, Str + 1D2 or 1D4 feet. Remove X feet for each level of encumbrance (however your encumbrance rules work).
Adam Ramirez
Made it up.
John Watson
>Is it possible to make a rules light narrative game that is still OSR enough to be backwards compatible with actual old school module
Beyond the Wall exists. So yes.
Wyatt Morales
>Being built might be tricky to keep the players from accidentally the whole dungeon from existing at all
Ah, but the designers planned for time travelers and aren't happy. Lots of murderous construction robots. Best bet is to make small subtle changes to help you later. I figure it'll be cool.
Haven't read Thulian Echoes, but it's by Zzarchov Kowolski so it will either be a work of genius or total shit. I've found his stuff offers no middle ground.
Ayden Wood
Not even close, that's just Dungeon World with most of the rules missing.
Brayden Garcia
Cool, thanks.
Joseph Sullivan
I understand what trepanning is, you goose.
I just think that
>GLUG MUs have been trepanned and cast by tipping their hat when the right spell is about to hit the hole.
>What if the spell hits their hand? Where do MD play in to this?
is, to me, too convoluted to answer. What's a GLUG? Are you stating that GLOG wizards literally have hollow heads and slosh out spells, or is this your analogy for what they do?
I'm happy to answer questions, but stop being fucking obtuse. It's not a charming habit. Artsty farting about is for modules, not QA sessions.
Isn't this Broodmother Skyfortress?
Zachary Rogers
>Isn't this Broodmother Skyfortress?
Is it? I thought that was for settings without skyships being a thing to field entire fleets of.
Jacob Sanders
Well, the core of it's the same. Just make it bigger and make it eat skyships for dinner.
Or make the Skyfortress a new thing, a superweapon to end all superweapons. Adapt the content, not the setting.
Dominic Rodriguez
>fighter attack bonus is 2/3rd level
>thief and cleric base attack bonus is 1/2 level
>mage attack bonus is 1/3rd level
Thoughts on this? Also:
>clerics do not cast spells but instead learn "prayers" of which they can use a number per day equal to their level. Include stuff like battle blessing (allies get +1 damage for 1 hour) or restoration / remove curse prayers, or summoning rituals (I know summoning can be very powerful so this would be limited). Oh and healing, but these prayers would be straight d8s of cure without modifiers.
Ethan Garcia
>OSRIC locks 50% of content behind some gay compatibility license
KnKA was a mistake
Ayden Thomas
Tbh with the stats you gave this seems obvious. 10+Str (score, not mod) feet if entirely unencumbered. Every encumbrance level up (with everything between carrying nothing at all and burdened to 9" move counting as one level), lose some appropriate number of feet. 5'? 3'?
Ryan King
I'm asking if they literally do.
Justin Young
I'm not even Skerples and I'm pretty sure the answer is no. Where in all of the stuff written about the GLoG magic system did you get that idea?
Luke Turner
>I will delete this post in a bit.
>31 minutes ago
Nolan Wood
Ah.
No. No they do not.
David Perez
How do the spells get out?
Jack Bailey
how are spells actually different to prayers?
Angel Gomez
Literally.
Joseph Miller
Psionic Combat is busted so badly that you're better off throwing it out. The rest is OK.
Easton Cox
How often do characters tend to die in your campaign?
Andrew Campbell
Rarely, death can disrupt the narrative
Carson Walker
Reasonably frequently. About 1 every 3 sessions, on average. Some characters have lived for 14+ sessions. Shortest ever lifespan was 5 minutes in-game (and maybe 10 minutes out of game).
Most deaths are due to risk-taking behavior, stupidity, and a sheer delight in trying silly things for fun.
Dylan Evans
I have a reputation for running ww1 style meatgrinders.
Noah Evans
I have one myself! They're pretty great and much preferable to a pdf(at least to me because I like physical media). There are some inaccuracies such as different text size, and some pictures quality being compromised due to it being a print of a scan, but if you want the physical cyclopedia and don't want to shell 70+ for a copy that has seen significant use and most likely has some wear, then I recommend it.
Jackson Wood
I'm into storygame meta-mechanics, so I have a PC die every time someone on /osrg/ says "die."
Crap, look what you made me do, that's three in a row now!
Julian Fisher
>meatgrinders
Is that what we're calling Cave Whores now?
Xavier Flores
In this campaign, not much death as of yet, but I've been running low level modules. My own dungeons may be more deadly with it's traps and tracks. What are the rules for traps btw, OSR? Is it true that there's a chance that they won't straightup work in Basic?
Jaxson Harris
It depends entirely on the player, t b h. As much as people talk about high lethality in old-school D&D, some players just get it, while others get it in the neck.
Ryder Cox
This 2bh. High lethality can come from a bad roll or two, but unlike in later editions of the game there isn't really much of an armor to protect your character if you miss up so you just open yourself up to raw punishment.
David Ramirez
>Is it true that there's a chance that they won't straightup work in Basic?
Pit traps trigger only on... IIRC it's 2 in 6 for every person who steps on them. It's not really a malfunction, though, it's pure evil. A pit opening up in the middle of the party is much worse; if they have a loose marching order they may get divided by the pit with one or two guys taking damage, and if they're in tight formation, the longer it takes for the trap to trigger, the more people will fall in.
Thomas Howard
Oh yeah, how is that game going by the way?
Colton Gomez
I find this is pretty true. I have one player who has lost only one character (crit by a bugbear at level 2),
I have 2 players who are a little more flamboyant in their playstyle and one of them dies at least every 3 sessions.
Daniel Rodriguez
Where does it say that in the Cyclopedia or is it only really elaborated in B/X?
Kevin Davis
I haven't got it on hand right atm but it should be in the Traps section of the chapter DM Procedures, I think?
Jaxon Gonzalez
So with B/X, The magenta colored book is Basic and the light blue covered book is expert.
What is the difference? Is one worth reading over the other? Do I need both or just one?
Or should I just opt for the BECMI version?
Brody Cox
Expert builds on Basic in terms of both new rules and higher levels. But even if you're just playing Basic, you'll want the Expert book, which is not true for the higher books.
Wyatt Hernandez
>What is the difference?
One is level 1-3 and another is level 4-14. There are other smaller differences too.
>Or should I just opt for the BECMI version?
*inhales*