Horus Heresy General /hhg/

If it was that or no Horus Heresy, than yes, but otherwise no, 8th edition is a dumpster fire of an edition and I hope they undo some of the changes next edition.

>Vehicles are just meat shields now that inevitably take forever to kill, no longer can a lucky melta hit one-shot a vehicle, now you need to pour retarded amounts of fire onto even light vehicles to kill them

>Templates being removed makes horde armies significantly more powerful and in addition with the loss of vehicle facings makes actual positioning a lot less important.

>Instead of tank shocks vehicles and ramming, tanks now fight like infantry or walkers in assault

The other stuff I can forgive to varying extents, but this shit just fucking ruins the game in my opinion. Other things I don't like but can tolerate

>Models and their equipment is all bought separately, I love flipping from page to page to find out how much a guardsman costs, then a lasgun, then a meltagun, then see if the sergeant costs more, then see if any of his gear costs points

>Independent characters no longer join units

>The number of weapons that do dX wounds, if it was only lascannons, krak missiles, power fists, and other anti-tank weapons I would be cool, but there are too many

>Everything seems to have more wounds (primarily to compensate for dX wounds weapons)

Things I like about 8th edition

>You can choose warlord traits

If monstrous creatures were so bullshit compared to vehicles, why not nerf monstrous creatures instead of turning all vehicles into monstrous creatures?

WHEN

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This is going to be my last reply to that topic because this is the /hhg/ after all, but actually wtf

>super heavies, flyers, disregard for Force Organization Chart, hardon for detachments
all of that is fixed what are you talking about

Initiative, Old AP, old Morale old Character rules, templates and scatter dice were objectively terrible.

keywords are objectively better than none because they're more robust and more modular.

New vehicle rules at least don't invalidate them by design and old vehicle rules weren't tactical either as you could always cheese a better firing arc anyway, which resulted in nobody running them. Also it led to retarded shit like people parking Rhinos back to back.
Arcs of fire also were a ridiculous addition to a system where nothing else uses it.
Old vehicle rules were just that, tacked on stuff that works in skirmish scale of 2nd ed but not beyond that.

>overly complicated at the same time
8th literally plays twice as fast as 7th

>Vehicles are just meat shields now that inevitably take forever to kill, no longer can a lucky melta hit one-shot a vehicle, now you need to pour retarded amounts of fire onto even light vehicles to kill them
... How is that a bad thing

Christ, how much autism do you need to prefer a completely broken core system weighed down by legacy shit to an actually elegantly designed system?
I hope HH migrates to 8th and people like you just leave the hobby for WW2 autism or something.

>And the ability to play 30k armies against 40k ones is probably good for the community
This is something I can agree with. 30k v 40k was always fun and was a good way to get people interested as it in no way decreased the pool of potential opponents.

SOON. Winter 2018 or Spring 2019.

And my god, if the model is anywhere near as badass and sexy as that picture, I will slit my face in joy

How will they give him a vehicle tho?
Will he have a jetbike option, or a landraider base?

Simon (the guy who's been scupting all of the primarchs) said he wants to do two seperate models: one on foot, and one on jetbike.

Unfortunately, he doesn't get to decide if that is something he can do, but then again if Jaghatai doesn't have a jetbike then he can't use his main RoW. Instead he's stuck... leading his traitor sons. lol.

fast Razorback with assault viechicle for Khan and gottagofast special rule that allow it to move up to 24

>Initiative, Old AP, old Morale old Character rules, templates and scatter dice were objectively terrible.
Templates and scatter dice made movement and positioning matter
>Should I space out my units? Nah let me bunch up all my dudes and units as much as possible so I can get as many as I can under my AOE buffs

Initiative made close combat more in depth as you had to consider your ability to tank wounds until your guys got to strike. Should I give everyone power axes? Probably not because some of them will die to the enemy before they can strike, I should give some of them power swords, power mauls, or leave them without power weapons so they can tank wounds for my axes.

>which resulted in nobody running them
Where the fuck did you play? My group always had a decent number of vehicles, with the exception of Tyranids and some Tau players.

>Also it led to retarded shit like people parking Rhinos back to back.
I have never seen this, more to the point it makes more sense than leman russ tanks advancing sideways because fuck, it don't matter

>8th literally plays twice as fast as 7th
Bullshit

>... How is that a bad thing
Because it isn't fun to spend all day slowly chipping away at a vehicle's wounds. How many wounds do titans have, like fucking 70? Even basic tanks can have over 16 wounds.

Nope. Same as others, 8th is absolute trash in both general and faction rules.

not as soon as the twins.

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^ This. All of it.

Also
>people using "objectively" and "better" in one sentence considering subjective opinnions.

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Have all the primarchs been together at one time? Are there any primarchs who never met each other throughout the span of the great crusade and heresy?

Ullanor, Nicea and Terra had most Primarchs.

All of them? No. However, all primarchs met and spoke to all others at least once, even if it was through a hologram projectorif not physically face to face.

>However, all primarchs met and spoke to all others at least once, even if it was through a hologram projectorif not physically face to face.
Is this actually mentioned anywhere? I mean I can see it being true, but at the same time I feel like some like Alpharius may have never actually had a reason to contact their brothers.

The most there have been together is at the censure of one of the lost, as revealed in ATS

And people whine about how Magnus got assblasted. More people came to shit on ol' Lossy, his Legion got not only destroyed but entirely erased, and ever afterward he was just sort of ignored until he became forgotten.

Goulding mentioned there were two older pieces of lore that had to be dealt with when they actually solidified the primarch discovery order. First, that all primarchs were found before the missing legions were gone, and second that every primarch met each other before the start of the Heresy. One of those old codex statements of "This had to happen, but we give no details on how."

I'm pleased with the way it's gone and the decision to stick with 7th. Not a fan of 8th and have entirely given up on 40K.

30K started out as the niche game of choice for more mature players, who wanted a more fluff focused and less competitive game style and flourished because of that. Then the plastic sets were released and everyone rushed to it because it was the new cool release, after 8th the vast majority of those players upped stakes and move on but they would have anyway once necromunda or whatever was the new thing in town hove into view.

Every other thread starts with the 'dead game' moniker, but the threads keep going, the community is alive online and most of the mature players who got into it and made it a thing in the first place will continue the good work. But then again I'm quite an old school player and have never quite bought into the newer need for a new release every week to keep me interested, my projects tend to be longer term and less focused on what's coming out next in the release schedule.

>that all primarchs were found before the missing legions were gone
They may have softly retconned that, pretty sure there's a bit of lore about Corax's first meeting with Emps. Can't remember what book it was in, but it was something like:
>E: You have 17 brothers, Corax.
>C: I dreamed there were 19.
>E: LOOK AT THAT SQUIRREL.

>Every other thread starts with the 'dead game' moniker, but the threads keep going, the community is alive online

WHFB gets threads as well, but that game's not going anywhere.

How did Konrad Curze get his name? He was a loner who skulked around in the shadows and ate people. When did he sit down and choose a proper name and surname? The Nostramans only ever called him Night Haunter.

He was a big a Heart of Darkness/Apocalypse Now fan.

I think Emps named him that, or at least called him Konrad on their first meeting.

I would love to have HH book about Vehicles like Imperial Armour books.

FUCK YOU

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A reason, or honestly the time. According to this timeline, which may be off, by the time Alpharius was found Lorgar had already fallen (Lorgar's "Pilgrimage" in 966, Alpharius assumes control of the XXth in 981). Still, that's 30 years he would've had to meet up with others, so maybe he had.

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Last week I mentioned wanting to use my spare bits to make a small army to leave at my LGS as a loaner force. We're trying to get a Zone Mortalis league set up, so I think it would be nice to have an army on hand to allow those interested in HH a chance to give it a try.
Since we already have TS, NL, IW, and SoH players, those are off the table. I've tentatively narrowed it down to the following options:
Imperial Fists
>+solid, easy rules to learn. Look good in mkIII. I haven't made a heavily militarized/regimented army in awhile, so Fists would be a bit different for me.
>- yellow is a bitch to paint, IFs are popular enough that we might end up with a player later
Blood Angels/Emperor's Children
>+ after seeing the Sanguinary Guard bits used in HH models, I've kind of wanted to try it out. These two legions fit that aesthetic well. Both are pretty fun to paint.
>- one of the locals plays 40k ECs and has confirmed he would play them in HH. BAs don't have anything beyond their base rules, and their speedy/jump gimmick doesn't translate to ZM well
Space Wolves
>+ I enjoy kitbashing and have spare SW bits around. Slayers should do well in ZM.
>- Grey is kind of boring to paint. SWs are different enough from other legions that I worry they won't accurately represent the game as a whole.

What do you think? Is there another legion I should be considering?

>Space Wolves
do it

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EC or IF would probably be best from those you mentioned. I'd consider Salamanders, Alpha Legion or Iron Hands. They have fun units and rules, aren't necessarily toppest-tier but are still pretty good, and their rules are either fairly flexible or fairly easy for a beginner to deal with.

I'm looking at getting some Shapeways bits and there's a new material on offer, Black Hi-Def Acrylate. Or at least it's new to me, never seen bits offered in that.

Any idea if it's better for 28mm scale parts than frosted detail?

That pic is dizzying, can anyone make a quick list of Primarch order?

Need a legion?
Why not Ultramarines?

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So you don't think the whole "playing by their own rules" thing would be too much of a problem?
Or, judging by your picture, are you just trying to be funny?

Alpha Legion might be interesting. From what I understand, ALs can actually pull of infantry lists outside of ZM games, so they're be more usable in other game types, which is a plus. I've just never really liked their 30k colour scheme, and using their Third Edition chaos colour scheme (the semi-black look) would feel wrong.

Just not a fan of the legion, really. Same with Iron Hands and Salamanders.

>Just not a fan of the legion

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As I understand they have several different paint schemes, all of which are canon for 30K if I remember that little blurb correctly. I myself go for the 30K one, but with scales and serpents in green rather than ALL details in silver - looks pretty good.

>Just not a fan of the legion, really. Same with Iron Hands and Salamanders.
ah well everyone's entitled to their opinion. even when it's clearly pleb tier

Horus
Russ
Ferrus
Fulgrim (I thought he was found relatively late)
Vulkan
Dorn
Guilliman
Magnus
Sanguinius
Lion
Perturabo
Mortarion
Lorgar
Khan
Curze
Angron
Corax
Alpharius

I wouldn't set up AL as a loaner force. While on the one hand the versatility is handy, it could be overwhelming for a new player, and/or give them false expectations as most legions won't have that many options at the start of a game.

Of the three you mentioned I'd probably recommend fists, as they get bonuses to both dakka and choppy (albeit mainly in challenges unless using special units/gear) allowing a new player to try out different styles, while still being "vanilla" enough that the army will give a good representation of how a legion army plays.

I would say Fists are the best because they are a flexible legion (good for newcomers) than work well with Zone Mortalis.

Well, I'm convinced. Fists it is.

Thanks for all the advice and help, everybody!

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REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEally looking forward to hearing more about them. Be sure to post pics when you're done!

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Will do, user.

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The emperor told him he was Konrad

To be honest having an ugly name like that would turn anyone into a genocidal madman

>Konrad
>An ugly name
Better than 80% of male names I see on a day to day basis

Jesus Christ where do you live?

America. What do you consider an attractive name? Alex? Mitch? Cody? Kyle?

Literally none of them. I guess it's cultural, those names all have really soft sounds in them, Konrad isn't much better.

Daily reminder that BL artists hate Ferrus

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>Literally none of them.
They weren't meant to, I was saying those are terrible names.

>really soft sounds in them, Konrad isn't much better.
How the fuck are you pronouncing Konrad? What the hell do you consider a good name?

>again with the wrench
Could at least give him a hammer (not canonical, yes, but he wasn't wielding a wrench on isstvan either)

Can you guys help me understand Challanges? It says that for the duration of a challange, the combatant models use each others Strength and Toughness.How does that work? Do they just trade stats?

Seydkhan/Seidxhan/Seywan (spelling and pronounciation differs but the meaning is more or less the same), Dilvin, Mihrivan, Kevok, Ferzan, Iskendere, Kardox, Berfin, Rengin...

Names with a bit of bite to them.

Why is he using a stormcast eternal hammer?

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does that hammer haft have fucking picatinny rails?

It was actually that part that was retconned. In the hardcover version it's explicit that the Emperor is referring tothe two primarchs not yet found, missing #2 and Alpharius, NOT the two lost primarchs.

You forgot missing primarch #1 as the 3rd found, and missing primarch #2 as the 19th found.

Where did you get info about founding order of primarchs?

The big cheese of the HH shared the official list.

Does AL work well for ZM format games?

That's not even close. That means they're using their own profiles instead of fighting against majority WS and T. It's 1v1, is been this way since heresy started.

Will you lynch me for idea of converting that Guy into AL praetor? I can't stand BaC guys anymore.

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Which book is it anyway? Like I said, I couldn't remember, and couldn't be bothered to re-read every single Corax novel and short story to check.

Shave off the crux from the shoulder and snip the ones hanging from his shoulder shield, and he's pretty kosher.

You could use Armillus Dynat as a base?

I like 8e a lot and there's a fan made HH 8e version up on DakkaDakka. I've linked it below: dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/731421.page

Who here has played this game before? Was it decent? Would you recommend?

Does anyone have pics of that reposed Sigismund that an user was posting a while back?

Oh okay thanks. That's a weird way to word it though. Why not say "use their own Strength an Toughness"?

Lads I've just finished the first four Heresy books, plus Legion. Is The First Heretic a good next call? Wanted to go with Thousand Sons but the Audible narrator is atrocious tbqh so will skip it.

Dynat has no termiarmour. Besides, if anything I'd rather have Skorr in my army, easily favourite named character model in whole warhammer, and I am usually strongly in favour of My Dudes.

Question, crux imperialis is defintielly post heresy symbol, but how about imperial eagle? Viable for Traitor forces?

>Viable for Traitor forces?
Sure, they were just too lazy to remove it or kept it on to spite loyalists. EC are the only ones allowed to use the Palatine Aquila which is different.

Eversor Assassin from Warhammer is one of my favourite ideas on how assassinations should be done.

1. Find the most violent and psychopathic person you can get your hands on
2. Biologically and mentally 'modify' them to be a living weapon of absolute lethality
3. Put ALL THE DRUGS into them to make them that much more MURDEROUS
4. Suspend them in a constant state of comatose suspension in between MURDER missions
5. DRUG THEM THE FUCK UP and have them MURDER someone unlucky sod

Best part, if they ever die, they explode. As in surgically inserted to every Eversor Assassin is a chemical concoction that triggers near death. The Eversor actually explodes and everything near it is consumed by the explosion.

A deranged psychopath with an axe cleaving through 100 henchmen to kill the target still counts as an assassination. All the drugs make them basically unstoppable, unless you manage to evaporate or remove the Eversor's limbs. I cannot stress how lethal and hilarious these assassins are.

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Extra funny for AL, since WHO KNOWS IF THEY'RE LOYAL

Tumblr tier

wrong thread, sorry

>Be Invictus Suzerain
>Fighting Word Bearer traitor scum
>Casually block a clumsy attack
>Typical of Lorgar's rabble
>Shield bash him into a wall
>He scrabbles at my shield in desperation
>Draws the sword I decided to strap on there
>Stabs me in the face with it
Hoist by my own petard!

>Tries to grab sword
>Sword is just a decoration
>Split his head open with my axe
>Word Bearers, when will they ever learn?

>not giving your opponent a fighting chance

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The better to split skulls with.

High speed, low drag.

Theres probably a chapter of marines with at least one of each of these names in their ranks

>giving your opponent a fighting chance
Reminder that phosphex is the proper way to drop pod assault.

Thousand Sons is really good.

The First Heretic is good too, and it leads on to Betrayer which is even better.

>Berfin
>Names with a bite to them
Sounds like something you do after too much drinking.

Deliverance lost