So i want to start a game with new Players as Gladiators.
I was thinking that the advantages are that the players a clear frame to start within, can interact with pieces of the setting and a clear goal at the beginning, to buy their freedom.
But how to i keep the initial idea interesting, despite cracking down on player agency before the game even starts and instead of devolving into a "fight of the week" type of game, what nobody wants in the group. NPC interaction is of course always a nice thing but what other can there be besides their owner and trainer?
What was the live like for actual arena Fighters in the real world?
There were far fewer fights to the death than are normally portrayed in movies and such. Fighters were investments and their death would mean the loss of a lot of money.
It was not terribly uncommon for people who had run out of money or declared the equivalent to bankruptcy to sell themselves into slavery. (There were laws governing the protection and rights of slaves.) Some people are even known to have become gladiators for the prestige, though this happened less often.
Still there was a risk of death and serious injury. Medical treatment for gladiators was top notch for its day. Provided you were worth it. They knew how to set bones very well and how to speed recovery of breaks.
I've forgotten precisely what the diet consisted of, but it was meant to build up not just muscle but enough fat to add some additional padding.
Grayson Evans
>I've forgotten precisely what the diet consisted of, but it was meant to build up not just muscle but enough fat to add some additional padding. I think it was a large part peas and oats, gotta get those gains.
Already told my players that they are not axe-crazy psychopaths but much rather showmen and not everything will be "fight X till he drops". Reenactments of "historical" fights would be one option as are things like tournaments in different styles like wrestling and the good ol' "punch the monster to death"
>Still there was a risk of death and serious injury. actually something that could be affected by the setting and the widespread availability of simple healing magic for things like flesh wounds and bleeding. So fights might be more violent.
There is also the social aspect that they are slaves but might be allowed to roam the city as long as they are marked as slaves or some magic keeping them in the city.
I'm having doubts about the idea that the PCs should always try to win, the fans will have their Favorites and when some demi-human comes along and tramples down Chad McAwesome it could very well result in the PCs being accused of rigging the game in some way or at least harm their fame.
Have the PCs all be on one 'team' fighting other teams trying to earn their freedom. Some of the other teams are purely in here just to make things interesting or gain fame. This make the campaign more like a tournament arc, where you can have drama in downtime or gain sponsorship deals or set up cool fights where they team up with some pther teams for a gimmick fight of some sort.
To that end, you can set it up so that it can be in the PC's best intrest to take a fall to build up another faction for later use. Maybe once they build up some reputation, their manager pressures them to take a fall, since it will get more funds they can use to get weapons. Just spitballing.
Christopher Lee
Rome's gladiators and arenas could be quite complex and flavorful. Caesar actually had one built filled with water. There were actual galleys inside, with crew fighting each other.
If you want or need deaths, pair your players against criminals marked for execution.
They could also be hired as legal champions, fighting duels to settle judicial matters.
>If you want or need deaths, pair your players against criminals marked for execution. >They could also be hired as legal champions, fighting duels to settle judicial matters.
Damn you user and your great ideas and historical knowledge. I have the feeling that the campaign will be much more social than expected (if the players want that of course)
Also pretty good too, was thinking that it would make sense for them to be one team since all of them are some form of beast person (no idea if they are furries and as long they aren't in my face with it i do not care)
Being sentenced to death via fight, only to turn out that your opponent is a larger duck and you will never have your honorable death could be considered a special kind of cruel.
>a special kind of cruel Oh for sure. Having some asshole say he wants to save you for a greater humiliation to come is a hell of a plot hook for later battles.
Colton Martin
Keep in mind that roman gladiators were basically rock stars. They had tons of adoring fans and groupies, play up that aspect.
Brayden Walker
Gladiator fights were the main event of an all-day celebration.
>Morning was devoted to political announcements and executions >Midday was animal hunts, followed by lunch (often provided by a company or politician who is loudly announced) >Afternoon were gladiatorial games, with the best always saved for last
Juan Torres
Thanks.
It may sound cheesy, but gladiators actually had sponsors and advertised things like "Cladius' olive oil" at the arena.
One of my players already mentioned it and took her group of fans as her community. Already looking forward to playing some ancient low aristocrats arguing about which female gladiator is the merriest and how the change in rules affected the expectations for future competitions. basically nerds arguing about their waifus and the meta.
This makes for a nice two step combat, first partake in the execution and manage your resources in a way that you can still compete in the main event.
Aiden Fisher
Executions were wildly varied depending on the whimsy of the local courts, by the way. Methods include everything from strangulation, to crucifixtion, to being fed to the lions (useful as it leads right to the midday event of animal hunts) to getting raped to death by a donkey, which was mentioned in The Golden Ass by Apuleius (the only novel from the 2nd century to survive in its entirety.)
Jayden Bennett
Good to know and kinda expected from an early culture but i don't think my players would have a lot of fun crucifying people.
tho animal hunt can be a lot of fun in a high fantasy setting.
There is also the possibility of fighting against war criminals and subverting the expectation that the first Fight would be the "easy" one.
Prisoners weren’t given a chance, user. They’re meant to die in that pit and no sane dominus is going to let his gladiators die in the warm-up round.
Landon Hughes
a female gladiator is called a gladiatrix and the plural is gladiatrices, they were considered an exotic rarity by their audiences and only used for the biggest most lavish events
also shirtless but i don't think most players will go for that
Wyatt Long
I understand that, but that doesn't mean that a fantasy setting has to be a perfect imitation of real life. Even more so if the setting is glorantha and a hoplite might just start throwing fireballs at you.
user, my players are adult humans (which isn't worth anything) who are aware what amount of degeneracy others are comfortable with. titty gladiatrix for everybody
So they used pottery shards to make tickets, that makes a lot of sense considering that paper is expensive and printing them would require a printing press which wouldn't be a thing for 1500-2000 years pore.
That is a pretty good PDF, besides all the edgy art.
The stuff about the pottery tickets and the schools is good to, even more with the binding contracts. PCs can be basically free men as long as they keep their training regime and do their fights, maybe not leaving the city too but i guess that's fine, there is a lot of adventure potential for expert fighters in a large magical city
If this is a setting with D&D magic, one of the animal hunts could be temporarily transforming the arena into a mock wilderness where the audience can see everything but the ones on the arena floor can't see anything.
Matthew Wood
>If this is a setting with D&D magic Nah man Glorantha magic. Basically everybody has some innate magic but getting to the advanced kinds take a lot of time, practice and life restrictions and still doesn't make you immune to getting stabbed really hard. But having magicans spice things up sounds like an good idea.
Was thinking about how magic could affect the arena fights and what preventives measures could have been put into place to to keep the fans save.
Will prolly go with some enchanted lead ring around the "stage" that eats magic and melts if it gets overcharged.
I need radical ideas for radical fantasy gladiators.
>piscium hominum Born near the see he spend his early manhood fishing and fighting off smaller seamonsters, now he is in debt and stands atop the sand and blood to secure a good live for his family.
>Doodloper A stoic figure from the souther continent. Rumors claim that his mask is actually the remains of his villages god he slew himself. Nobody has ever seen him without it and it's unclear if he wears the god or the god him.
Chadus Maximus Generally okay and swole dude who everyone aspires to be. Looks weird when he "strides".
You know, this also requires somebody to come up with the idea as legal punishment AND somebody who tries, or already knows, how to execute it.
What the fuck
Nathaniel Ward
Arenas got used for tons of shit besides fights having the players help out with some of that stuff could be interesting. Like maybe some really big musician is playing the arena and the players get assigned to bodyguard him as a promotional thing.
Cameron Butler
I heard it was just some BS that a butthurt Christian made up to make the Romans look even worse and there's no account of it anywhere outside of that book.
Andrew Smith
I really like how the artist's sig is a back tattoo on that guy
Eli Gonzalez
Makes more sense that two super degenerates coming up with some /b/tier legal punishment and then make it public soeveryonbe can see that you and your mate are /b/ tier degenerates.
Liam Perez
When we are already on the topic of punishment in the arena, What would, the lunar empire, some entropy worshiping, magical culture, who are otherwise quite advanced and civilized society deal out as punishments in the arena ?
I'll bump with some art because I love gladiatorial combat.
Whenever my group gets captured I generally have them thrown into an arena to fight to death. It started out as way to give them something to fight while they regroup and plan an escape but now it's an essential quirk of my games.
Seems like a good idea unless your party gets captured on a regular basis.
Usually i let my players pay ransom from their community and make it a social encounter to tell the winner that they are just barley worth some ransom, to keep the costs low and not be sold as slaves either.
Michael Murphy
I've also been planning a gladiator-style opening for a campaign. Thank you for this thread.
I'm GMing a gladiatorial campaign and it's starting as very promising. This thread is actually pretty useful for hints or ideas. Thank you all anons.
Samuel Gonzalez
so are you
Christian Brown
Being aware that I may sound edgy, I do like the style of his swords as gladiator weapon, besides the tip. A serrated blade with 2 cm long teeth may look dangerous, but if it's light and only the points are sharpened you get a rather "safe" weapon.
There would be quite some initial blood and likely lasting scars, but both could be seen as a plus in this sport.
Brody Nelson
Death by Hydra sounds good and brings a point across. You do not have a "real" arena unless you have a mascot monster.
Cameron Clark
>I've forgotten precisely what the diet consisted of They were called at the time "barley eaters" or "hordearii" because they were vegetarian or at least mostly vegetarian. Most food was barley and wheat, or beans. Most meals were meat free. They drank a vinegar and plant-ash (ie burnt plant, not the tree) either as an energy tonic or to help strengthen bones. There is some suggestion they were heavier than average,
Make an effort to describe guard patterns, riots, etc. Set up methods for them to escape. Not like, "the wall busts open on session 3", but more like "You're just participating in these fights until you're done planning your escape"
Joshua Wright
Now you just assume that they want to escape via illegal means.
If i would tell my players that they are gladiators they all would create someone who, and get this, would be a decent gladiator. It's not like anybody would throw "joe cottonpicker" into a ring with a sword and tell him to fight to the death, gladiators are qualified to be what they are and it can come with a quick way out of slavery, fame and out of slavery with a basket full of money for each fight if you are good.
Matthew Evans
>Caesar actually had one built filled with water. There were actual galleys inside, with crew fighting each other. It was called Naumachia and it was awesome. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naumachia
They're a real-life Precursor civilisation complete with advanced technology for most of human history. Seriously, Rome stood for over 500 years, over a thousand if you count Byzantium. That's a mind-bogglingly long stretch of time, that's like a fucking fantasy Empire level of longevity.
truly, the mediterrane was the cradle of western civilization.
Dylan Garcia
Gladiator campaign is the kind of thing that I want (maybe genre swapped to wrasslin or futurewrasslin or Running Man) but I'm not sure how to do 1v1s in a way that's engaging for the sidelined players.
How about having combat teams for your sci-fi HEMA gladiators?
Evan Turner
You need a little context to understand what he meant by that.
In "The Golden Ass," the main character (Lucius) is turned into a Donkey through a witch's spell, and over the course of the novel is owned or stolen by various people of varying socioeconomic status and occupation. Near the end of the novel, Lucius is bought by a purveyor of unusual beasts - as Lucius the Ass is shown to have extraordinary intelligence - and at one point rented by a decadent noblewoman who desired him to mount her. He is unable to perform, as he discovers the purveyor has sold him to the local magistrate to be used in the Shows where he is meant to rape an adulterous murderer to death, and then torn apart by lions after the act. During the show he chooses to flee through the exit, and eventually finds himself upon a beach.
Owen Young
Yeah that's an option. It gets away from the kind of images that attract people to the concept in the first place. It's like hearing "how i balance scifi sword vs scifi gun???" and replying "give everyone guns they are better."
Evan Anderson
Maybe try a middle way, have team fights but not to the death. Have some form of sportsmanship and let the players form bonds (in whatever way) with their rival team so the player think "finally, THAT asshole is mine".
Yeah I was leaning towards something more like that. You can't have dramatic wrasslin style feuds if nobody survives a loss. Doesn't help maintain the other players' interest when one player is 1v1ing their nemesis though.
Brandon Foster
Could always do a "protect x from the other team" type of game where you must protect a prisoner marked for death from the other team killing them and likewise for theirs. Also maybe do something with a rival team or something. Look at Gladius (it is a really good game)
Julian Reyes
Expand on gladiators beyond the stereotypical movie lore of slaves being forced into fighting in the pits. Gladiators often decided to be as a profession , men died of course but the ones that survived got rich. They also had a weird status between freeman and slaves but certainly had far more mobility and freedom to go about their business than just being in a slave pen all day and thrown out to fight as movies portray,
Then again as an aside most movies get this wrong about ancient slavery..
Gladiators didn't only fight in the arena too. They were often sent to noble houses as party entertainment and they were initially part of funeral rites.
You could have the group sent to a noble house as part of the nights entertainment to spy on them.
There's also nothing stopping your party having homes and families of their own within the city.
Andrew Gonzalez
You could let them do prep work to convey bonuses to the person 1v1ing. Like the rogue poisoning the opponent the night before to through him off his game or the wizard researching a spell to power up the fighter, or even just the other fighter in the party helping him train before hand. If your still worried about them being bored during the actual fight you could let each player declare they've done something retroactively then play out that scenario to see if it worked. For example in the 1v1 the opponent crits against their teammate so the rogue declares that last night he slipped some drugs into the opponents food, you play out that scenario and if he succeeds the crit gets reduced to a glancing blow. If he fails then it proceeds as before.
Hunter Thompson
>initially part of funeral rites. Is there more information on this ? Because in the setting I use ritual combat is quite a big deal
>You could have the group sent to a noble house as part of the nights entertainment to spy on them. Also an great idea.
Colton Fisher
>Gladiators didn't only fight in the arena too. They were often sent to noble houses as party entertainment
This calls for a Decadent Malcolm McDowell Ancient Party Simulator game.
Ian Price
Really, really simply. As the pic you upped shows the centre of the Colosseum is a pit below street level. They just opened several sluice gates fed by the aqueducts into Rome. When they were done they opened the gates to the drainage sluices which fed into the rivers. They found one of these outflow tunnels only a few years ago.
Sometime between AD 85 and 89 Domitian ordered the construction of extensive stone works in the Colosseum. These led to all those ramps and elevators that you see in the film Gladiator but they also meant that boats couldn't be used there anymore.
You can if you have dramatic interruptions to the fights WWE style
Leo Ross
IT WAS ME CLAUDIUS IT WAS ME ALL ALONG
Bentley Ward
>"Bah gawds, Quintus! Those two Samnites just jumped into the arena and battered the Dacian to a bloody pulp! Mars have mercy, no chariot should ever be used in such an unnatural way!" >"Indeed, Publius my friend. The ferry over the Styx will be full tonight. This bloodbath was brought to the fine people of Rome by the Collegium of Aventine Hill Pig Farmers. Buy a hog this week, and get free libations for your sacrifice."
Gavin Nguyen
Jumping in late but, not op but, how long do you guy think is fair for the PCs to have to compete before they made enough money to buy their freedom? What if they don't want to keep being gladiators afterwards? Also, how do you guys think gambling on the game's should be handled?
Wyatt Stewart
For realism I would say that two years, around 8-10 fights should be more than enough for most slaves.
Once they are free they don't have to be gladiators anymore, but tell them that one or two fights as free men would greatly help their financial situation.
I doubt that slaves would have enough money to do any meaningful bets, but depends on the setting.
Colton Cooper
That's totally a thing im going to use in my game. If we don't hit JJBA level of flashy in a high fantasy arena, then I'm doing it wrong.
Jeremiah Cook
>Is there more information on this ?
They were called Bustauri
Read Dio, Pliny & Plutarch.
Pliny, XXXIII.53: Plutarch, V.9
Dio, XLIII.24 Dio, LIV.2.4
Luis Long
For best immersion, be sure to rehearse the intonation and hand movements of the splendid newsreader from HBO's Rome; the latter are based on writings by ancient rhetoricians. youtube.com/watch?v=xH0kO5qcPf8 >Wine to be provided by the Capitoline Fraternity; and cakes by the Guild of Millers. The Guild of Millers uses only the finest grains: true Roman bread for true Romans.
Jackson Powell
Those are great, thanks user
John Miller
This thread has me thinking about a gladiator tabletop that's 10% tiny dude pushing and dice, 10% sports manager, and 80% mordheim random events.
Jordan Roberts
Do you got a name for it?
Thank you my man.
Oliver Flores
No I haven't really figured out specifics, but overall I want: >specific arena owners, either named NPCs or randomly rolled, that decide whether losers are spared and introduce random events ("I'm bored, release the tiger!") >actions leading to other actions for rube goldberg type train wrecks >Free for all with NPCs as the standard game type, but with bookkeeping minimized
Xavier Bell
It's not a very long thread yet, but there's some good ideas here, does anyone think it should be archived?
Adam Cox
>If we don't hit JJBA level of flashy in a high fantasy arena
Holy shit, is that a motherfucking JoJo reference?
Grayson White
I think that poster either missed by a couple of letters or is dumb.
We have this thread every once in a while and it hasn't really done anything completely new yet.
I dunno I haven't been around in a while but most of the stuff here I'm vaguely familiar with.
I'm poking at gladiatorgame and trying to make it into something that doesn't take ages but is also engaging. Also trying to either cut or justify all of the things I want to include (minis, measuring distance, etc)
William Foster
>measuring distance That's literally what a grid is there for.
Chase Collins
You also got good old fashioned pit dog style fights where criminals who havent been nicked cant go to the arena and watch the fights up close so they either kidnap you or offer a sum of gold to fight their personal stable of fighters who was unceremoniously tossed out of the arena because they dont fight like the way the government wants and left with nothing but how to fight in a pit and little else.
Said underground fight pits would be either in the outskirts of town or at the harbors shipping ports the crime lord use to smuggle his wares and with a purpose as well. You break it and it comes out of your earnings
Alexander Jackson
I used to hate measuring and now I like it, but I'm looking at grids and Move As Far As You Want In A Straight Line also.
Weren't gladiators back in the day more like professional wrestlers than slave soldiers? Hell, is there a hack for the WWF Basic Adventure Game for gladiators?
Dylan Torres
You are correct but being a slave and being a professional gladiator aren't mutually exclusive.
You need to get a little away from the american picture of slavery when talking about roman slaves.
They were a lower class of people but they were still considered people and people selling themselves into temporary slavery to get out of debt wasn't a rare thing to happen. And not all slaves did heavy physical labor or where prostitutes, tho those did certainly exist even back in rome. Especially partial sex slaves, like knocking up the Household girl.
But, compared to the overall status of morality, slaves were very much people.
Cooper Cruz
Yeah, I know that slaves weren't treated like shit in Rome like they were in the US, but it makes me imagine a scenario where gladiators are like modern day professional wrestlers more than they actually were. From weird gimmicks to bizarre accents to being from all over the Empire, and even with plots like "You thought Gallius the Goth had killed the Iron Iberian in the ring? Well you were wrong! The Iberian is back and he wants revenge, next on GLADIATOR SMACKDOWN!"
Ayden Campbell
Some more to that.
Slaves could buy their own freedom and own things, tho technically it belonged to their master but practically it belonged to them.
Heavy labor slaves were -usually- convicted criminals or prisoners of war, so the public interests in how they were treated was rather low, i.e. they usually died a few years or months into slavery.
There were also cases where masters only let the slave earn enough money to buy his freedom when he became too old to work. So the master now had money to buy a new slave, used the old one to the maximum and the old one needed to rely on charity because he was too old to work. I imagine that this was considered a "dick move" even more so as the "ex-slave"(ancestry) part of the population grew
Luis Ross
Honestly, that idea sounds awesome and gladiators HAD large groups of fans. And making a media drama out of it with barkers in the public places doesn't strain the narrative form me one bit. Getting people invested into something is an old hat and humans gotta human.Death was a thing that happened but they also got the best possible medical care once they became more or less famous.
