When are we going to short this shit already?

How does it keep btc above 10k exactly?

Print tether, buy bitcoin. Arbitrage between usdt exchange and USD exchange. Wash trade tether to keep it at parity with USD

and yet no one is fucking talking about it on a serious level. It's nuts

Why is tether a problem, even if it isn't backed by real money? The fact is that you can exchange it for other cryptocurrencies at a rate parallel with real money, and then exchange back afterwards. Actual fiat money behind it would make no difference to the use of it.

Tether isn't going anywhere. If you knew exactly how the Fed was able to print trillions in QE without hyperinflating the dollar, you would see how the same strategy has been employed with tether as a weapon against the federal reserve.

The U.S. government will not stop the counterfeit dollars inflating BTC from tether, because it would expose the same strategy used to inflate the stock market.

It was called alchemy a long time ago, it still works amazingly.

wow 100m! you mean like they do everyday! what a shocker!

Just exchanged all my tether for fiat on Kraken. its over

It seems to me theres almost no downside risk to shorting it? USDT will never ever ever go above $1.02, under any circumstance.

But it can always go a lot lower, pennies on the dollar if they pull any shady shit or are actually insolvent.

yes

Why would it ever go above or below the value of a dollar? ;)

You guys crack me up. Tether will stay valued at $1 as long as the illusion holds that it is backed by fiat and thus always worth one dollar.

>Why would it ever go above or below the value of a dollar? ;)
You mean like right now where it is worth $1.02?

There is a freely traded usdt/USD market on kraken and it regularly goes up to 1.03, its even been up to 1.07. Months ago it also went to 0.9x.

thats almost no risk

Sure, tethers can gain a few cents with demand, lose a few cents in a sell off, that's simply because some traders are willing to pay a slight premium for liquidity, or lose a slight amount to jump back to crypto quickly.

How does that change what I said?

Truely WOKE niggas know that the value of both USD and USDT is the same.

Zero.

Yes. Kraken also offers leverage on that pair so you can short.

You must be a nigger if you can't understand that 1.04 != 1.00.

That's not entirely true as long as the delusion of "real" money holds.

It goes up and down for a variety of reasons but my point is that variation is tight and predictable.

If USDT company goes insolvent because they've pulled an exit scam or printed shitloads of pretend money, the price of USDT will crash to pennies. That'd make your shorts really good.

i swear you are the only sane person here

You must be a chink

I've met niggers smarter than you

So if the price of gas changed from $3 to $4 and back to $3 in a day, did the gas price change or did the value of a dollar?

Jesus Christ where did you all learn macro econ

USDT cannot crash unless we invade the British Virgin Islands.

comparing tether with the FED is like comparing you local craft beer to InBev.

Start fucking up with inbev sales and they will crush you to death.

If it works for the fed why can't it work for crypto

other than using futures for shorting all of crypto... how do you short a particular stock... is there option trading somewhere that I don't know about.

Exactly.

They are using a bankers trick and it can't be stopped because that same trick is why the USD has value right now.

It can totally work for crypto. It doesnt even matter if they print money out of thin air, as long as everyone using it assumes it is still backed.

USDT is a really interesting currency and I swear their business model is easy as fuck.
>Take money from neets
>Buy bonds with half the money
>Get audited so it all checks out
>Keep accepting money from neets, payout whenever anyone asks, keep buying bonds and t-bills

I dont understand why they'd need to print usdt without having it backed with cash or bonds. Unless they're purely bullish on btc and want to scoop it up at sub 10k, but thats not whats happening.

THIS

When they get audited it is actual the bubble bursting. Hope you all can take these losses.

Most brokers and exchanges will let you short equity. You'll need collateral for margin though.

Otherwise, try put options. Similar leverage but the cost is up front.

Yes goy, tether is ending crypto

As long as they have the liquidity to buy back when the market starts falling below $1 they are fine.

Does anybody have an answer for this?

How do you option trade in crypto? How in the hell do you think you can short anything?

Futures can short the entire crypto market but not one particular one like USDT.

yes Ive done many option trading for stocks.
never for crypto.
never seen a place to buy a call for ethereum for instance. what am I not understanding

Kraken is not big enough to support a bank run on tether, plus they only pay you USD as long they have faith in being able to trade it to someone else. The USD they pay out is not coming from Tether inc's currency account.

Have you ever tried to buy usdt? Its closed to the us market and everyone I know in the EU that tried to buy tethers directly from the EU via wire couldn't.

You borrow coins from the exchange or a funding market to sell at the current price.

Lmao

If you only knew the state of global economies

You know all the immigration in Europe is so they have more citizens with high net worths (avg is negative so zero is high) to keep debt solvency (Deutschbank)

You know China builds empty cities because they need the infrustructural assets to keep the low currency legit on paper?

You know that canada is about to have a massive real estate crisis, since the whole country rode out bailout and is primarily on var rates?

The stock market is only high because the Fed was purchasing assets with money they poofed into existance to increase market caps so the companies had enough equity to borrow away the liabilities?

What the fuck future do you think there is if crypto pops?

9/10 FUD. nice reddit spacing

What's the utility of crypto if everything else is fake? Crypto demands a highly advanced civilisation with incredibly fast communications, and constant reduction in technology costs (storage, bandwidth). If everything collapses crypto won't survive.

you can "borrow" coins from an exchange? either you are an idiot or 99% of people don't know about this

Krakens leveraged trading is literally taking from their own coin reserves. Bitfinex has a market for funding. What are you not getting?

Because bank runs.

Go look up fractional reserve banking.

How do you think shorting works? Go on an exchange where you can do margin trading, anything you can borrow you can short. Look up "margin trading crypto". btw don't do any margin trading because you clearly don't know the first thing about it.

Apple is bringing back those billions to the us and BUYING BACK THEIR STOCK with it LMAO

Crypto like btc is just gold that is easily accessible. Sure there are some like cash, some like stocks, but it's a finite asset that cannot be faked.

That means when it all comes down, we can still fucking barter without bullets.

But he is an experienced options trader. We are clearly talking to a self made millionaire right now.

Do a bank run when there's no bank and processing times take weeks

Alrighty then son

Apple is buying its own stock to boost internal returns because there's not much else to do with the pile of money they're sitting on. Not sure what this has to do with your narrative.

...

Wtf are you talking about? If it all comes crashing down mining isn't profitable. Even a small increase in the cost of electricity makes mining unprofitable. If you have gold in your safe it will still be there after a collapse. The bitcoin/whatevercoin networks will be so degraded they won't work anymore.

I think he is trying to argue that when the bubble pops in the works global economy that bitcoin will make it through the collapse. As in every node and miner will somehow continue as before in a collapsed economy.

None of this will prevent Kraken from going belly up if everyone decides to cash out at the same time. MtGox had a waiting list of TWO YEARS when it was found to be insolvent. If anything processing times this long world raise more questions for me than it would answer. Crypto is currency, it's liquidity should be immediate.

Why would kraken go belly up if people withdraw tethers? They don't deposit tether as USD. They deposit them as tether and let you trade them on an open market. Ofc if kraken had no customers it wouldn't be a viable business anymore but I don't get why you would try to point that out?

Dear Lord

Electricity won't go anywhere. It won't be blood in the streets overnight dipshits

But we are in for global regime changes over the next decade, and central bank failures

The grid isn't gonna fall apart lmao

Again, nice reddit spacing defeatist
>Even a small increase in the cost of electricity makes mining unprofitable
>mining difficulty doesn't decrease

Wash traders will come in to buy up tether you twit. You dont have to worry about "everyone selling all at once"

discord gg/3fW7bzr

Mining won't be profitable because you can't measure it in fiat anymore, is that your position lmao

I'm assuming a worst case scenario where people lose confidence in tether and wants to get rid of it.

Calm down there pup. I option trade stocks. I use binance and kukoin. You can't option trade there. Case solved. If ur that desperate for an argument you might be due for a fap session

I cant see that happening. Tether is far too useful and profitable

Durr hurr my magic internet money will hit the moon when my internet, mobile, and electricity costs quintuple.

You just had multiple explanations of how shorting works in multiple exchanges and you still don't get it. You are a literal nigger tier retard.

Because Kraken trades tether like any other currency, if it loses to much value and Kraken is sitting on a pile of it unable to unload it into the market and Tether cannot honor it's claim of having every tether with a dollar, it's game over. I'm only bringing this up because people think Kraken os a viable exit strategy in case anything happens to Tether; it isn't. Kraken depends on people having faith in our much like everyone else.

>Didn't see the wash trading on Kraken
good luck bro.

How will they price kw/h absent fiat?

I just explained to you that arb bots wouldnt let that happen. Do you realize how profitable it is for them?

Kraken don't stockpile usdt. A usdt deposit on kraken is separate from a USD deposit. If the price tanks its the customers who hold the market risk not kraken. This is different on exchanges like bitfinex who accept usdt as USD. Bitfinex is insolvent if tether is fake.

Mfw when a guy spends 3 hours in a breadline then asks me if I accept magic internet money that takes a week to clear.

>weapon against federal reserve

Yeah, this will turn out awesome for the people wielding this weapon!

tether is definitely fake. There's no way they are storing the dollars to back it up if you consider its current market cap and the rate at which they print tether.

Even if it was a fractional reserve they'd still be fucked because there's no deposit insurance or regulatory oversight to prevent becoming insolvent on a bank run.

I agree with you I'm saying kraken isn't exposed to that market risk. Their depositors are. Kraken doesn't recognise tether deposits as USD like other exchanges. It recognises them as tether.

Can someone give me a good reason why I shouldn't short tether with a couple grand on Kraken and wait for the inevitable

I wasn't disagreeing with you either, I was just reaffirming the idea that tether is a scam.

> unironically comparing iFinex with the US Federal Government

that happens a lot on this board.

"If the FED can print money why can't crypto exchanges?"

I'm not sure I understand the middle step. Can you explain that?

To me, the scam is simply: Print Tether & sell it to morons for real (fiat) currency. Never have to buy it back or redeem it. Pure profit. If that supports crypto prices along the way, so be it.

Once people acknowledge that it has no backing, the next sucker.. er 'investor' won't want to take it in exchange for his crypto.
the emperor has no clothes.

Even worse, almost every major exchange deals in tether instead of USD to bypass money laundering laws and other regulations. Crypto is largely illiquid and transitioning into literal monopoly money with the backing of this retarded tether meme. The market went to complete shit when the pumping started. Now it's pretty much gambling where you are looking at 1000% gains one day and a 404 everything gone sorry the next day.

They don't allow real audits though, despite suffering criticism because of that.

And in that case, why even buy bonds with half the money? Fuck it. Party Time!

>Even if it was a fractional reserve they'd still be fucked because there's no deposit insurance or regulatory oversight to prevent becoming insolvent on a bank run.
But since they have not duty to redeem them, why would they even bother maintaining a fractional reserve?

The reserve funds should be held in escrow by a reputable institution in a way that anyone is able to see the balance at any time on a webpage

That is not the biggest problem with tether. New tether is also coming into existence through Bitfinex using its own assets to buy it, meaning it might be slowly turning the account balances of its customers from USD into USDT silently. And both companies are owned by the same group, this is really fucked up.

bitfinex doesnt hold any usd, they list their pairs as usd but it is really usdt

It's interesting to speculate about the ultimate end of all this though. I wonder if anyone will ever do any actual jail time, for instance?

Does anyone even know how much 'real' (fiat) money is actually invested in the entire crypto domain so far?

so they can maintain confidence in their business and continue being profitable.

Because the peg makes people feel more secure even if it's meaningless in the end. Tether is currently being used as a hedge against devaluation.

>should be

kek

They did have something like this until their US banking support fell out. It started out as a seemingly legitimate startup with what I guess were good intentions. After the banking fell out they went completely apeshit. For example they literally reversed the China fud at 3500USD and they will reverse this crash too. I wouldn't be surprised if we start seeing 500 mil pumps soon.

People look at BTC valution and think the 12k stands for dollars, but that's not true. There's a whole bunch of air priced in with pumps coming in to break the trends at the most convenient times.

Yeah, and they're hooked up with some shady shithole bank in Poland or somewhere since they got dumped by their other banks.

Yeah, but absent any actual proof (audit), they can claim anything they want anyway. Or is there some layer of oversight here that I'm not aware of?

>Does anyone even know how much 'real' (fiat) money is actually invested in the entire crypto domain so far?

It doesn't matter, because the bubble has created a media frenzy, which has lured a lot of dumb money in with the promise of an exponential growth. Once the conveniently timed pumps go away, the house of cards will fall and the true price will be revealed. A lot of money will disappear from the market cap and from people's accounts who are using exchanges.

>he want tether to end

Now that you hear about crypto on the TV business channels, it's surprising (sad?) that none of the would be journalists even bother to mention this.

And this is what most people fail to realize.

I have a question tho

why doesnt the printing of new tether devalue the existing tether? its always 1$, doesnt this undermine supply and demand laws?