Who here is honestly not that worried about Tether? I’ve seen 728847 threads in the last 24 hours crying out how this is going to crash the crypto world. Here’s what I see:

1. There’s about $2 billion in Tethers that have been printed. From their wallet list it looks like about $1.5 billion of that is sitting in exchange wallets waiting to be traded, but again not in regular hodlers wallets. So truly about $500 mil seems to be exposed to risk.

2. According to CMC there’s about $3 billion in 24 hour volume which leads me to believe its mostly used for short term trades and not being held as a store of value for the most part.

3. Let’s say I tried to redeem Tether for USD and I get denied. I’m fucked right? Well no, I can actually just trade it back on the exchange for BTC/ETH/LTC, send it to Gemini/Coinbase/etc. and trade the coins for actual USD which is deposited in my bank account.

4. Let’s say everyone realizes it’s vapor all at once rendering it untradeable. This would be bad, yes, however again about $500 million in value would disappear. It would suck for those people, and I feel for them, but hardly a market changer considering Tether accounts for 0.003% of the crypto market. I mean Christ not even a day ago everyone was posting “HODL” when the market dropped $200 BILLION almost over night but Tether will be the downfall of us all?

5. Looking at the Top 50, I cant exchange or use most of these for anything of value. There’s a ton of multi-billion dollar vapors going up in market cap (looking at you TRON) which produce nothing but buzzwords on a white paper and no one says a damn thing about it but everyone grabs the pitchforks when Tether won’t show their damn bank statements to the internet?

Maybe I’m crazy but this seems to being blown way out of proportion. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong.

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>I feel for them, but hardly a market changer considering Tether accounts for 0.003% of the crypto market. I mean Christ not even a day ago everyone was posting “HODL” when the market dropped $200 BILLION almost over night but Tether will be the downfall of us all?

youre a retard. a literal brainlet. marketcap is a meme. there are only a couple real billions in this market invested. if tether goes down this market is fucked for minimum 2 years.

>when tether goes down

the worst part is it'll hurt the whole market. at least bitconnect kept to themselves.

Thanks just sold 100k.

>Let’s say I tried to redeem Tether for USD and I get denied. I’m fucked right? Well no, I can actually just trade it back on the exchange for BTC/ETH/LTC, send it to Gemini/Coinbase/etc. and trade the coins for actual USD which is deposited in my bank account.
This is where you went wrong. If you're one of the first people to get denied, or if Tether is clever about it, you might be lucky. But once people start getting denied, Tether will collapse in value and you'll lose tons of money like this.

Exactly, people are just ok with every new shitty every ERC20 token that appears out there creating value out of nowhere just because of the shadow of a project, but magically this can't be the case for thether, it needs to be backed by something or whatever to cost un dollar.

Guys, like everything, Tether costs what people pay for thether, nothing else.

Best case scenario: Tether gets shut down by the US govt for trying to make their own USD to get around regulations. Crypto collapses

Worst case scenario: Tether exit scams. Crypto collapses

Honestly I like these odds. Just bought 100k myself.

I almost sleep perfectly with my tether bags.

>marketcap is a meme

So are you implying there is more than $2 billion in Tether

Let's assume that bitfinex isn't abusing their position on tether, lets assume that even if we did run an audit, everything would be fine. There's still the issue that US citizens shouldnt even have any tether, and despite this US based exchanges as well as exchanges that do business in US have tether pairs.

It would be well-within the SEC's jurisdiction to ask all exchanges that do business in the US to delist all tether pairs, and once that happens you can just say good-bye to the entirety of the crypto market.

not worries, it's giving USD major notoriety as a sort of world and crypto hedge, and it stays pegged so it's not an investment. USA / FEDs gotta love the free advertisement

Well that was my next point. Even if it all goes down I think the market exposure is vastly overstated

>you can say good-bye to the entirety of the crypto market

How so? I can buy any coin perfectly fine without the use of Tether

The Tether crash will scare away normies. Crypto won't recover for another decade.

So question. Is this all a huge problem that didn't even exist a year ago simply because tether didn't exist at that time.

There's one thing I don't get. Why don't these exchanges remove tether and implement real USD like coinbase? Why is coinbase the CHOSEN ONE EXCHANGE that is allowed to trade in fiat pairs, while all other exchanges must use tether?


It did, but it wasn't printing 400mill in 4 days this time last year.

You're going to see the equivalent of 1.5 billion USD just vanish from a highly inflated marketcap with low volume. Believe me it's gonna be violent.

>I'm a retard who thinks 700 billion $$ has actually been invested in this market
>I'm a retard who thinks 200 billion was cashed out in last dip.
Please OP for the Love of God don't tell me you actually believe market cap is real.
You fucking newfag

can someone ban these bots holy fuck

they only do it because idiots from media outlets come here for quick dabs and see this FUD bot spamming the shit out of Veeky Forums

stfu fag

But the $200 billion dollars vanishing in the market over the last few days was no big deal? I just don’t think I see your point. Tether is a small blip in the market when you look at the big picture. And don’t get me wrong, Tether does help with liquidity but it’s not a necessity for a liquid market. Just look at exchanges that don’t use it and you’ll see there’s still plenty of liquidity

You are so fucking stupid you deserve to lose your money.

What evidence do you have that there is more than $2 billion in Tether? You seriously believe that the vast majority of the market is totally vapor?

You don't seem to understand how market cap works.

There never was $200B in actual cash that vanished, cryptos just lost $200B of valuation which is completely different thing from the actual amount of cash invested in cryptos.

Mcap = last price x #coins
Total mcap = mcaps^ of all coins together

Just because you can sell 1 bit for $11400 does not mean you can sell them all for that, ergo, that much $$$ is not in the system. It's an illusion.

So the market exposure is A LOT more than you think, because Tether actually IS treated as if you could sell every single Tether for 1USD.


"Friedman LLP continues to work diligently toward a full balance sheet audit as of September 30, 2017. We understand that the public is anxiously awaiting the completion of this process, but it cannot be rushed and we are not Friedman’s only customer. Moreover, the amount of due diligence that is being performed by Friedman is substantial. We (and Friedman LLP) are committed to this process in our quest to deliver on a new standard of transparency in our industry. In the meantime, we wish to once more state, very clearly, that Tether Limited does, in fact, carry USD bank balances in the amounts stated here at banks at which we have accounts. Any suggestion to the contrary is uninformed and baseless."


what is the difference between tether and random x shitcoin that has no value whatsoever as well?

best case scenario:
everyone realizes tether is fucking stupid
mad rush to exit USDT positions
BTC spikes as a result

BTC holders and BTC/USD traders make massive gains. Tethercucks get rekt forever when nobody is willing to buy their stupid tokens


people not realizing tether saved BTC crash below 5000$ - in case you wonder who tried to crash the market, its wallstreet/american banks trying to buy low btcs.

crypto is unregulated market. american banks short water in africa to make profit. you really believe they are not in here already? (haha loL)

Nobody fucking cares about burgers and your burger commission

on a side note:

tether currently has a value of ~2 bil $. you really really REALLY think finex didnt receive deposits worth 2 bil $? wake up 500$ hustlers. finex is regulating the market with tether. they stop it from blowing up to the moon and from crashing to the bottom - both absolutely positive when it comes to fight american bans/institutions.

because regs. bitfinex did trade real usd but they weren't allowed to at some point because of some reg. its a lot of hurdles to trade real usd for crypto. thus usdt

exactly. tether has saved crypto's ass numerous times

They become subject to US banking law for dollar based accounts. Tether is a way to bypass those regulations.

Even if finex was actually a good actor and doing everything 100% right (not fucking likely), US citizens are still forbidden from holding tether, and despite this exchanges that do business with US citizens are more than happy to provide markets for it. You really think the hammer of the SEC won't come down as wall street gets more into crypto? You really think big name firms are OK with even the possibility of finex manipulation?

I dont and I know america will step above every law in the world when it comes to their own interests. they have always been doing it and always will do, due to military power and manipulative influence into the western world.

doesnt change what I stated above.

Everyone knows tether is printed out of thin air, and its not 1-to-1 backed by USD (as claimed)

I don't think this will be a problem until some outside financial crisis (like 2008 housing) causes people to rush back to traditional assets, like cash and gold. There has to be a huge event that causes a rush on cashing out tether.

Let's say I create ERC20 shitcoin called Pajeetcoin. I create 1 billion of them and then sell 1 Pajeetcoin to you for $1. Now the market cap of Pajeetcoin is 1 billion, even though there is only $1 invested in it. This is how market cap is an illusion, who knows how much actual money is invested in the crypto market. Probably 10 billion or less. Tether accounts for way more of the crypto market than you think, wouldn't be surprised if it were 10-20%.

And price = Mcap/circ supply. If I did pay $11400 for a particular coin than that means I am increasing the market cap by $11400 and decreasing the supply by $1. The point being that there was $11400 put into the market. If not fiat and tether only has $2bn, than what?

Not worried at all.

>decreasing the supply by $1
Meant to say 1

no, not everybody knows. in fact nobody really knows except finex.

its possible, finex has a plus of several billion dollars and even invests their own rewards(fees) into tether to keep the market alive and running in order to keep getting paid in fees.

afterall, its 2 billion $ = nothing....


I don't give a single fuck about tether.

You know why? Because Binance trades USDT. The CEO of binance is probably the most well spoken genius in crypto. If he's not worried then I'm not either

>market goes down
>suddently tether gets printed on a daily basis

That works fine, as long as you're relying on it being one great big ponzi. Otherwise, it's impossible to sell every coin for it's mcap-derived price; ergo, there's not that much money in the market.

finex is literally earning 2-3 mil$ every day in fees.
they might have real USD reservce of 5 bil $ and just print tether whenever its necessary.

you little faggots know nothing, get back to your 100$ trades.

you're retarded, can't wait for you to get JUSTed user

No of course you can’t sell every one for that price because as soon as you sell one at that price, market cap decreases, and supply increases which decreases the price. The point is every step of the way people put X amount of money leading all the way up to a price of $11400 but once someone buys for 11400 that means there’s 11400 more in the market, period. The next guy will have to pay more because there’s a lower supply and that’s how we got here

I don’t hold any tether so idgaf. Just don’t see what everyone’s getting so insane over

Even though it would take them nearly 7 years @ that rate (spoiler: hasn't been this crazy for 7 years) without expenditures or tax to build up a that reserve...

??? are you challenged in your head?

fees are one small source of income. their biggest is FIAT deposits (€/$)...


To the point of the volume, even though "X" amount of Tethers are issued to exchanges, it's not like exchanges will stop traders from locking in to USDT so there is more being held on exchanges than is actually in circulation. That's not a terrible thing unless Tether goes tits up completely. I don't think Tether will be THE catalyst for a 50% - 70% crash but it will certainly play a role.
Just like we saw the recent crash shook out BCC scam, a bigger crash could collapse Tether completely.

But that was part of my point if most of it is being held exchange side and has not yet been traded for something of value to a hodler, if it disappears one day only the people holding at the time would be affected which doesn’t seem like a majority

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>their biggest is FIAT deposits (€/$)...

That's not their money you stupid fuck.

debatable how much. they own and sell coins.
+ listing fees
+ coin donatios for listing
+ daily trade fees

finex is rich as fuck with unknown amount of $ reserve. just stop the fud already... its getting boring and its useless.

we should be thankful they defended the market against manipulation from the fucking greedy bastard americans.

Why should i be worried? I don't hold Tether.

I hope Tether goes bust. It will make the crypto prices explode when people realize they sold their real crypto for fake money.

this. they are the highest volume exchange and have been around long enough to make a shitload off fees

>unknown amount of $ reserve
>just stop the fud already

tether is a fucking scam.

gtfo pajeet

...holy shit man

Didn’t even see this one but no that’s not correct. Mcap is price x coins OUTSTANDING ie actually being held by coin holders. If you sold one coin out of 1 billion for $1 and there’s only one person holding the coin than the market cap is $1.

If you sold 500 million of those coins and there are still people out there willing to pay $1 for it despite the fair market price being $.50 than there would be a lot of incentive to sell and a high demand to buy. This will allow people to buy the coin up until the market cap is actually $1bn and the fair market price is $1

Has tether fucked us?

No one cared a few days ago, now it's all anyone talks about - all because they kept printing like nobody would notice.

I've got friends who I got into Crypto now thinking about getting out just because of what they keep reading about Tether printing money.

I guess thats the key difference between my thinking and yours. I just don't believe they have an untouched, reserve room holding about a billion dollars. Esp considering what they started at, and what they've printed over the past 4 months.
I hope you're right. It would make the crypto market much more resilient if tether didn't implode.

>No one cared a few days ago








All of the articles certainly make valid points. Yes, the relationship between Bitfitnex and Tether is suspect. And yes, Tethers solvency is suspect itself. But market ending? I doubt it.

>I just don't believe they have an untouched, reserve room holding about a billion dollars. Esp considering what they started at, and what they've printed over the past 4 months.

This. I challenge these morons to name any other start-up that attains this amount of cash on hand in a year

What if bitfinex is actually backing their tether 1-1 with real dollars they make with trading fees, and they are just hoarding them until it dips and then going all in?

It seems like this is a likely scenario because bitfinex makes like 80 mill a day from fees and they injected only about 200 mill at that last dip.

Re #3: Sure, you could try to buy crypto for usdt at that pointf, but what value do you think people would assign to it? Why not 0?

op youre a brainlet. please stop posting.

with 100m tethers you can pump the market by 10s billions and the fact you dont get this thru ur thick brainlet head is pissing me off

the marketcap of crypto is not real. if 1.6b REAL money exits out of peoples pockets its game over for a very long time

I doubt they have that much as well but the point too is most of this actually hasn’t been released into normal circulation or possibly it has but appears to be used more for short term trades. If they are releasing into circulation without proper reserves, then they are violating the terms of Tether. But again it only looks like $500 mil is in non-exchange accounts so that seems like a little more realistic from a reserve scenario considering how much the exchanges make.

This might make coinbase the only safe one of the lot. Unfortunately, when confidence dissapears the whole game is up... and for everyone.

Right which leads to point #4

If $100 mil in Tether is equal to $100mil USD how could it put $10bn in the market?

Anyone know anything about (((Friedman))) LLP?

I recall the venerable Arthur Anderson closed after Enron. Just sayin'... Money can buy opinions.

>BTC spikes as a result
I've considered that too. Here's the problem with that: btc spikes *in tethers*, not in usd. IOW, btc doesn't spike, it's usdt that has collapsed.

That's true. It has. And if that's as far as you want to see into it, knock yourself out and be glad about it.

>bots create these threads
>they have some of the most reasonable discussion on the board this week

If thats the case then why no audit?

You have a bar of gold valued at $100. But you worry that the value of gold will go down in the short term, so you want to retain the value.

I have a dairy farm. I offer you 100 cow pats for the gold, under the condition that I will sell it back to you for 100 cow pats in the future.

My cows keep shitting so an extra 5000000 cow pats become available. Everybody wants to trade their gold for cow pats, and they do so. When the value of gold increases again, I sell the gold I have for cow pats at the current price. I don't make anything from this, I just feel good knowing that loads of people didn't lose out.

>we should be thankful they defended the market against manipulation

there is an audit. it just turns out it's really, really hard to check a bank account to see how much money is in it

Also: nytimes.com/2017/11/21/technology/bitcoin-bitfinex-tether.html

i have 10 apples

brainlet faggot op buys 1 apple for 100$

marketcap of apple market now: 1000$
money invested: 100$

couple buzzwords for u to remember and study: volume, orderbook

I pointed this out to another poster but Mcap is price x coins OUTSTANDING or held by actual coin holders.

In your scenario the market cap is $100 because there’s one apple purchased so only one outstanding. $100 (price) x 1 apple outstanding = $100 Mcap. If you sold all 10 apples it would then be $1000 assuming the price remained the same.