Is this a meme? Is it worth the $138?

just wait a bit until the manufacturer pulls off an exit scam and steals everything from everyone's hardware wallets. then decide

You can sign transactions and use your coins without exposing your private key

You never have to enter your passphrase on the keyboard/computer. That's about the only advantage.... to me, that's worth it and is why i got one, but to each their own. Also.... don't forget to lock in your price guys!!!

>trusting a USB
Just use bittrex. They're a large, centralized entity you can trust. If you've learned anything from trading crypto, it's that exchanges never get hacked right? Large, centralized entities are a great way to store all your hard earned money. And no, you haven't totally missed the point of crypto by thinking this.

Binance is even less legit without ID verification. i also have 2FA. might just do a paper wallet or someshit anyway since it's just 850 OMG

ugh fine. i'll get a paper wallet, i was just waiting until the OMG SDK dropped so i could store it in an official capacity or something. what's the best ERC20 wallet?

Can you lock prices?

If you break into a paper wallet you have to move the full amount from it then back to a new paper wallet when you're done, which is fine if you aren't moving it around all the time. Ledger is more convenient.

Do not listen to this retard. Get a Ledger.

Also, just so you're aware - a fire proof safe WILL NOT keep your paper safe. The paper will most likely become illegible from the heat inside the safe.

BUY A LEDGER.

Price is just jacked up on Amazon etc...since supply is short if you can wait just order direct.

A Ledger signs your transactions. You never have to enter your private key/passphrase in your PC (that was compromised by the Turtle wallet lol).

t. ledger shill

I have one but don't even use it.
I'm scared of sending stuff to it and it overwrites or disappears or something. No I don't know what I'm talking about.
If I have a nano and you're supposed to be able to erc20 tokens in the ethereum address, does that mean I can send ten different erc20 tokens to the same address? Do they show up as link, fun, etc or do they show up all lumped together as eth since they're all eth blockchain?

A ledger can store erc 20 tokens, but you'll have to use a front end gui like mew (not hard to use and just as secure as the ledger app) to access your erc 20 tokens.

It's the way to go

An exchange literally just got hacked in Japan and lost $400M of people's money.

Nicehash got hacked and lost a ton of people's money.

I'm sure there are others. Those two were just the recent ones.

Just fucking use Metamask you stupid fucks.

>Binance is even less legit without ID verification.
lol the absolute state of normies

Ledger sucks, you have to use google chrome. Trezor is king

The advantage of hardware wallets is that they are virus and malware proof. You can connect it to the most virus-filled computer in the world, and still send your coins without risking theft of your coins or private keys.

Viruses can't even spoof the address you're sending coins to as it shows up on the device display as well.

So it's perfect for travelling as well, you can use it in any internet cafe without worries (other than someone recognizing it and mugging you outside for your coins).

user... you might be retarded

don't ever tell me or my wifes son what ledger to use

What would I possibly have to gain from shilling people Ledgers? Think about how profoundly stupid that thought is.

The average person is gambling by not using a Ledger. Tell me, did you live boot an OS when you created your keys? Was it unplugged from the internet? What did you use to generate them? Did you verify the key pairs after? How do you send TXs? Do you sign offline?

I'm going to say no you didn't do all of those things, and I'm going to assume that the average person isn't going to do ANY of those things. So again, BUY A LEDGER.

Stop trying to encourage people to do DUMB THINGS because you are A DUMB PERSON.

It is so fucking easy with a ledger. It has your wallet addresses and private keys and even if it gets "wiped" somehow, you can just recover all of that with your recovery seed you create when you first get your ledger.

OK, explain how?

can't that recovery seed also be exploited?

DURRR

theguardian.com/technology/2018/jan/28/japan-cryptocurrency-exchange-coincheck-refund-stolen-nem

wikitribune.com/story/2017/12/11/technology/nicehash-ceo-speaks-out-after-60m-cryptocurrency-hack/27212/

Checking a trillion combinations per second, and running continuously for 40 years you'd go through 1.261×1021 keys. That's one sextillion, 261 quintillion! Sure sounds impressive, doesn't it? It is, but even so, you'd have made no progress... that rather impressive number still only amounts to about 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% of the keyspace.

>The paper will most likely become illegible from the heat inside the safe.
Lol...was wondering about that, I got a laser engraver and I'll just etch a few brass plates disguised with fake qr's around to pattern it so it'll appear like some kind of modern art shit.lol.

Kek literal sperg

the user you replied to was being facetious you silly goose!

no i mean what is the difference between keeping a paper version of your recovery seed and a paper version of the wallet itself?

Okay but my question is

If I am willing to do all of those things (and I already have, and more), what does the Ledger do for me that cold storage wouldn't do?

The Ledger software is ENTIRELY closed source. Shouldn't that be reason enough for me to not use it? I mean I cannot see how nobody sees this as a problem.

Seriously guys don't forget to unlock your coins!! Looks like the market is about to have a bull run and you don't want to be locked in at the current price. I saw wayyy too many people quit their jobs, on the last bull run, because they thought they were rich, only to find out that their coins were locked in at a much much lower price and they were still poorfags

bcz if ur paper wallet is stolen u're fucked, if this is stolen, u wont lose shit since theres a pin safety

my quantum computer can easily do this

o i c. i thought i heard of some normie getting "hacked" when he posted 90% of his recovery seed phrase.

wut

Lads how much should you be holding before it is worth paying 150 goybucks for a ledger.

5k
10k
15k?

From which amount of money should you buy a ledger?

I've about ~$30,000 worth of coins on binance. I always want to buy one but there's always like 2 months of waiting list and then I just spend my money on something else instead feeling that it's not necessary yet.

you have 2 options:

buy a ledger, generate a seed, store on paper/metal
buy a separate laptop/computer and remove all bluetooth+wireless chips, generate a seed, store on paper/metal (no printers)

everything else might be good, but it fundamentally doesn't serve the same purpose

You can lock-in the price

Just ordered a Ledger. It is out of stock, so I will get it end of March. What do?

Agreed. Locking in is safe, but wont really return gains. Its only useful when ya think a crash is coming.

not without a public key to go on it can't

It depends on how actively you trade. If you have coins you don't plan on selling for 6 months - 1 year it's probably worth getting one and moving them on there even if it's only a few thousand. But if you spend all day on Veeky Forums looking for dips and make 20 trades a day with all your money it's not worth it.

How do you generate the seed on an airgapped laptop?

You would have to use a USB from a laptop that wasn't airgapped

so doesn't that ruin the whole point?

Once again: a ledger signs your transactions. Your private key never leaves the device and is never seen by your computer. With a cold wallet you still need to enter your private key into software/a web interface to do anything useful. I guess you could do the calculations manually if you really wanted to?

Get a trezor then. Theyre in supply and arguably better since they dont have a google chrome meme app

Send your coins to my ledger I'll keep them safe for you.

anything over 2 weeks salary is, apparently, the standard benchmark for going hardware

The seed is generated on the device itself on initialization.

Sounds good. Thanks for your help.

generating the seed is entirely offline, its just a random number generator.

> The Ledger software is ENTIRELY closed source
if you're going to be a fucking autist with your caps at least don't get obvious things like this wrong.

138$ is nothing the day you lose all your money cause the exchange you have them on gets ''hacked''

Why the fuck would you not have a solution for hiding/protecting your paper wallet just like you would with your Ledger recovery sheet?

>having a job
So the NEETs among us should just get a ldmedger because 0*2=0 so anything over zero gets the ledger.
PROTECT YOUR NEET BUCKS, BOYS.

trezor definitely has a much better website, but the hardware itself is fundamentally insecure. it even comes welded shut so you can't see if its even been backdoored yourself.

so why would they even need to welt it shut? because anybody that spent any time with the device could backdoor it on the way to you, and you would have no way of knowing.

you do not want to use a trezor under any circumstances. the hardware is open source, so the only acceptable thing to do is to build your own with trusted parts.

When I ordered one a few months ago it said the same but ended up shipping faster than expected and I had it in a couple weeks. This was direct from Ledger (their company is in France)

wait so what if your Trezor just stops working for whatever reason? technology fails all the time, how are you protected? recovery seed phrase? where do you store that? what if you forget your PIN?

i want to go hardware, just asking for peace of mind

Is this shit worth buying for someone holding less than $10k in coins?

Sounds good, I ordered direct from Ledger. Thanks!

>Is it worth opening a bank account if I only have 10k stuffed in my mattress?

Just shell out the 100$, I swear this board is full of fucking brainlets

Ledger made in China, trezor made in the EU. The highfrequency vibration weld being bought straight from satoshilabs is so it cant get tampered with. I'll take my chances I guess.

You can buy another one and use your recovery seed and pin to reset your funds to the new one. If you lose your seed and forget your PIN though youre SOL.

If the company were to stop being in business, you can run your seed thru an online wallet and recover your funds thru there. But trezors are a lot more solid parts-wise

Does anyone know of any other solutions for storage that are in development?

Interesting discussion with Falkvinge about the problem: youtu.be/l6Obc_cJba4?t=18m50s

Sorry, it's mostly open source/open spec, but with elements that are closed source. If there are any parts that are closed source to the ledger, it's as good as being closed source entirely.

>guys!! the whole point of crypto is that you are your own bank and you are solely responsible for your funds! total freedom anarchy amirite??

*uses a partially closed source usb dongle created by a single entity that isn't the user himself to store the entirety of his funds*

You seem smart

>Your private keys are never held or known by Ledger or a third party: they are hard locked in the Secure Element. With Ledger Nano S, your
wallet remains decentralized, you are your own bank.

t. poorfag

I locked in my bitcoin price at 5$
Lets just say im about to kms

thanks just locked in my BTC at 16k

>they are hard locedk in the Secure Element

Yeah, what the fuck is the "secure element"? Is there any specification or documentation on what the fuck the "secure element" is? They are "hard locked" on this so called "secure element"? LMFAO this sounds like a line from the fucking x-files. Shady as all fuck

Just fucking make your own airgapped wallet with a raspberry pi you fucking memelords

ledger is made in europe, i dont know where trezors are made but it doesn't matter because the hardware is insecure.

they need to provide more information on the close source firmware, yes, but i would rather have to trust only one entity than everybody as you have to with a trezor.

the other option is getting a laptop and physically disabling networking of all kinds, then you only have to trust intel, and your operating system, and the software you use to generate the keys.

and you can't call out someone for being an idiot when you're advocating for paper wallets. do you even understand the chain of trust that goes into creating a paper wallet in the first place? dont bother answering that because it's already obvious.

stay away from crypto before you lose any more money. if you can't understand really simple concepts like this you're in for a world of pain

enjoy getting fucked by the NSA when they use backdoors to take your private keys you fucking retard. It is already possible through spectre/meltdown vulnerabilities. What would you rather trust-

a fucking computer that is publicly accessible to outsiders

or

a PROVEN encrypted hardware wallet that protects your private key from ever touching your pc

i bet your portfolio is filled with the same autistic decisions that made you post this uninformed drivel

I've never slept better after getting a physical wallet.

If you balance is over 2k I would say yeah.

Are you retarded xd

can other anons confirm this as true?

yes, but like everything there's the possibility that these things have vulnerabilities, so you should still take care with your computer

And the ledger is fireproof? Lol

A HW wallet lets you store your private key safely while still keeping making transactions easy. The only other safe option is having an offline PC you used to generate keys and signing every transaction on that PC. Massive hassle.

HW wallets are safe because slipping a vulnerability that actually gets your private key out of the device and then sends it to somebody over the internet is not that easy and would get the manufacturers royally fucked

secure element just means that it is protected under CDA which you can find out with a simple google search. This is common for encryption products and besides, it is already fully encrypted when it ships. If you don't trust Ledger than at least buy a Trezor before you lose all of your money, they're fully open source. Not going to explain this concept further, DYOR uninformed faggot.

Trezor has been in business the longest. Sorry bud, but the lack of weld is what makes ledgers insecure. Check out some amazon reviews from people that dont buy directly; plenty of people that got compromised ledgers.

Buying directly from ledger is fine though, but I heard that a lot of ledgers were made in China, hardware wise? Trezors are for-sure EU however.

there's no encryption, its a hardened chip designed to withstand tampering and physical analysis, so the keys stored in the chip are incredibly difficult to get out, compared to a regular chip, like the kind you find in normal computer hardware, and by extension trezors

Reminder that you can't recover your private key unless you buy another one of these. There's no online recovery. It's literally trusting this random company that was born on Reddit to stay in business.

could you kindly elaborate on trezor being insecure? i've tried googling a bit but apart from some old issue I can't find anything

Yes its true. It's a single-use CPU with no battery. So unlike thumbdrives and whatnot it cant download or 'catch' anything it's plugged in to. Also, it has no battery, simply powered on via USB, which means theyll last longer

I still recommend encrypting your private keys and printing them on QR codes. That way you can make multiple copies of your paper wallet and they're all reasonably secure from theft.

If you're too retarded to remember your password just put a copy in your bank deposit box.

Use AES-256. Good luck.

Wait, are you saying the key is in plaintext on the device even when it's powered off?

Why not leave it in Binance

no, if you buy a fake device, it won't work with the ledger software, because of the private key loaded onto the device that chink manufacturers dont have.

the main vulnerabilities are people getting a device that is setup with a seed that the seller already knows.

and who gives a fuck if trezor has been around longer if it's a fundamentally broken piece of technology? it hasnt even been updated since it launched, and only recently did they stick a touch screen on but keep the hardware broken.

if you can't open up your hardware device and look inside of it, the "security" it offers is a mere illusion.

How do you make transactions?