First time on Veeky Forums thought I would post this here.
TL;DR: I did a ton of good work for my company, way above my cost, but no recognition for it. Wat do?
Business Productivity Complaint Thread
First time on Veeky Forums thought I would post this here.
I spent a week revamping the company's entire systems. Their filing, archiving, their company documents, staff documents, mailing systems, etc.
Basically the company was using Word sheets for everything, for accounting, shift management, mailing lists, costing sheets, cashbooks, etc. Everything was done by hand, or edited in manually to Word documents and possibly as much as a hundred hours every week were spent by staff manually doing stuff that could be completely auto filled.
I proposed, a couple of weeks ago, to revamp their whole system so it's all done in Excel and autocompletes most of their stuff, cutting hundreds of hours per month worth of high-paid managerial hours, so they can be spent doing more useful things.
I worked around 30 hours this week (£234) and in that time I completely rebuilt their entire company's workflow, I hand-designed innovative systems that I didn't even think were possible in excel at first, but I did it. The staff that use the stuff have all seen big increases in productivity, and I made several of the Directors' jobs a lot easier, since they used to have to do mailing lists, shift rotas, accounting, cashbooks, training renewals, by hand. I likely saved the company tens of thousands in value for the system itself, and thousands per month in wage efficiencies. But I got absolutely no recognition for it, and they don't even seem to comprehend what I've done and how fundamentally difficult, and productive it was. I asked for a more full-time job, I was declined, I asked for more responsibility in the company, I was declined, I asked for a wage rise, I was declined.
I originally joined the company on minimum wage to improve a couple of documents for them, do some daily invoice payments, and do proofreading and editing work for their documents and company presentations. I've worked there for about 4 months part-time. (less than 40 hours a month.)
I feel like shit. All that work wont even cover rent
And for a little context. The company is run by several extremely talented directors; however, their talent is in their decades of experience as high-quality managers and workers in this particular industry. However, they have almost no business acumen. They seem completely unaware of how to increase productivity and expand, all they know how to do is cut costs, and it's hurting the company.
They've been running for about 3 years and by now they should have maybe 5 or 6 "units" of what they do. However, they have 1, which is currently losing a battle for planning permission and is under threat of being shut down, and 1 more that has just been approved but will take up to 4 months to set up.
Their potential for profit margins are huge, but they are being squandered in my eyes. The workflow issues was one of the core issues, but there are others where tens of thousands more can be saved each month. But at this point I’m not even sure if I should point them out and offer my time because that's not included in my "job," neither was this revamp, but I saw an opportunity to vastly increase business efficiency and hopefully put me on the path to promotion. No such luck.
Are there actually any business owners/directors/managers on biz? This is my first time coming here. Wat do
Is this a false flag? Why would you reward a slave who works hard?
Because that "slave" has a lot more potential and if I dont get rewarded for my efforts im going to go somewhere else. This company as a lot of potential though so I would LIKE to stay here.
Move on, find a new job. The only thing that matters when you are working for someone is their perception of you. Everything else do not matter.
Here's a redpill blog: michaelochurch.wordpress.com
Get your boss to like you. He will promote whoever he likes the most anyways, but by being productive you will give him an excuse to promote you.
I'm leaving for the same reason fed up with it. I'll go find an 80 percent pay increase.
I understand that, but liek I said in
The company has a LOT of potential. And I'm talking 50% profit margins, and a wide open market to expand into.
I'm dealing with people who have a lot of experience WORKING in their industry, but none at running a business, the directors seem to be enjoying "high paying jobs" rather than trying to build a company right now. I want to change that.
Also, It's technically a "family" company and I'm in the family, I'm just not generally associated with the industry itself or have experience in it... I am however by far the most experienced in IT and logistical planning/forecasting.
I can see myself in a director position in just a few years if I play my cards right... but how do I play my cards, that's the question?
I'm great at working numbers and plans, but I'm shit at interpersonal shit.
after skimming through your posts I get the impression that you'd have to continue what you're doing for some time, could be several months or a few years, to realize any benefits.
Or you could leave on the best terms possible and get a good reference that confirms a bunch of grandiose sounding bullshit on a resume and make 2x as much within a couple of months.
I answer directly to the board of Directors, they have a voting system for company decision. I only just got my idea approved because they all have 20+ years experience doing everything the same way with paper and manually, rather than with IT.
I don't have a manager or boss I can make like me, I have to deal with a board.
>Or you could leave on the best terms possible and get a good reference that confirms a bunch of grandiose sounding bullshit on a resume and make 2x as much within a couple of months.
this is what I was thinking.
Either that or if I actually put in my resignation some of the directors will realize that by losing a 7.80 min wage worker, their workload is going to vastly increase, and actually decide to give me a decent raise. But that one is risky AF.
I basically took one of the director's jobs. He used to do all the wages, invoices, and reports. Now I spent a couple hours a day doing what he used to do, so he's free to do other Director shit.
Negotiate for higher salary/title BEFORE you do all the revamping next time. Always be ready to walk away for something better elsewhere.
I did this at my job and got fired over bullshit politics and a retarded CEO. rip.
How exactly do I go about that? I've always been under the impression that you get raises or promoted by demonstrating your work and value and have it impact finances/morale enough to get noticed.
I have at least another two direct courses of action I have planned for the company to increase profits and expand faster, but as I mentioned, I'm thinking about keeping these to myself now.
Do I just go to them and say "look, I have more ways to increase productivity, but I'm going to need a pay increase first."
Because since this week's implementation went so well, and staff reported workflow efficiencies across the board, I took it upon myself to contact a director and basically say I would love to have more responsibility in the company so I can do more to increase productivity. He declined and said that basically things were going fine as they are, then I mentioned how long I've been on minimum wage for 4 months and consistently done well-reviewed work, and asked if I could have a pay rise to 10 per hour. This was also declines until "I got more experience."
Like... I just saved the company thousands per month, how much experience do you want for an increase from minimum fucking wage?
About how much is the company worth? If you know it could be more profitable then it would definitely be worthwhile to attempt a leveraged buyout. In the mean time, politics should be your game. Talk to some of the board members off to the side and tell them about an issue that you know you could fix. Make it very clear that you can fix a major problem, but don't just go rushing to fix it right away. Instead, make excuses like "it's not part of my job description, so you might want to find someone who's job is to take care of that." You basically just want to get them to approach you to fix an issue that they know is a big deal. Do the best you can at your job, and not one bit of work more than that - unless it's clear you're going to get some windfalls for doing something else. The fact that they don't know anything about business means you should be able to play them like an instrument.
get accustomed to it.
you should have written proposal of 2-3 pages saying exactly what you would have done if given the opportunity, and offered it for a flat fee of lets say 5000 for the sake of discussion.
The thing to keep in mind here is that if they said no, you'd only be out for the proposal but they'd understand your value/ambition and everything you would want to do now (get a raise or a better paying job) would be 1000 times easier.
If you're going to continue to work at minimum wage please invest the time into forming your own company and coming up with a strategy for your work that goes above your current position.
Ha sux 4 you
I get paid to watch Netflix all day
It’s all about smooshing your boss. Be his best buddy ever
>make excuses like "it's not part of my job description, so you might want to find someone who's job is to take care of that."
I like it
As for company value, it's not public, so has a nominal share value. Most recent value was a share aquisition from an ex director which was approv 300 per share, giving the company a nominal share value of like 30k.
I'm all up in the finances though, so I know all their numbers. They had a net income of approx 2.4m pounds last year, with operating costs of around 1.5m 400k went to dividends, the rest was writedowns put into assets, plus some legal costs.
They're mismanaging their money though, probably 400k is wasted right now, and that dividends payout is way too high. They should be investing it back into the company.
>invest the time into forming your own company and coming up with a strategy for your work that goes above your current position.
I wish I could, but I'm a poor ass ex-neet. I have next to no capital myself (due to working minimum wage) and for this particular industry I have ZERO experience at all. I don't even enjoy this type of industry, I purely see potential in their business model. I don't have the experience, personality or skills to operate this kind of company myself and likely never will. The directors are all highly experienced veterans with connections in the industry which are a complete requirement for operating.
If I were to set up a business, it couldn't bein this industry. I'm interested in helping run finances and improving the business model because it has so much damn potential.
you are quite hopeless
sad truth of an autist who loves numbers and efficiency, but has no IRL skills
Oh and for context, I'm not downplaying my own skills and strengths. It's a fact that I couldn't run this kind of company.
It's not the kind of company just anyone with money can do, there's a lot of red tape, requirements and pre-required credentials and experience before you can even begin to enter this industry. If it were some marketing company, or a company that actually sells products, then sure, I'd take your advice more to heart and possibly look for avenues to open my own company. But it's none of those.
Do up a quick spreadsheet showing the cost savings of what you have done.
Do up a spreadsheet of estimated (very conservative) of the cost savings you can provide with another revamp.
Give them both spreadsheets, one after the other.
Tell them you will undertake this task to save them x amount, but you want it in a contract that if those savings are materialized (make sure to provide a metric for measurement), you get X.
Do you have any money/credit? Do you have any close friends on the board or elsewhere in the company? (or at least with money?) You really need to do everything in your power to snag this from them. I didn't notice your post saying you only got minimum wage, so your best bet might just be getting a massive promotion/salary, but if you could get like 240k together to attempt a leveraged buyout it would be great.
>but I'm shit at interpersonal shit.
This is where you need to improve.
>politics should be your game
>how much experience do you want for an increase from minimum fucking wage
Also, as a rule of thumb, wage increases are an annual thing, and most employers don't want to hear a word about it until you've been with the company for at least a year, even if you've proven yourself in the first couple of months.
This is a great idea and I second it. But I would keep it in your back pocket till at LEAST the 6 month mark, or more likely the full year, so you have something to push with when negotiating your new position and wages, while remembering that walking away from the deal should always be on the table.
I think the main take-away that I'm getting here is that:
>1.) You're not doing a good job greasing the wheels.
>2.) You want things to happen too quickly.
On the second point, you need to build the relationship with the company over time. Unless you are an absolute prodigy and they recognize that, you're not going to see any significant change in your status over the first 6-12 months. Now is the time to spend networking so you can make progress when you're better established, which leads into my next point:
Grease the damn wheels my boy! You need to work on those skills. I am shit at what I do, honestly. But what I'm really good at, is social engineering. That's how I've gotten so much farther than others who are more qualified than myself. You need to take what is good and likeable about your personality and leverage that to gain favor with others. I recommend keeping your mouth shut and observing carefully at first.
Figure out the social dynamics of the place you work. Who has power? Who doesn't like who? Who can make your job easier, and who can make it harder? Who are the dominant people and who are the submissive people? Where do you fit into the pecking order? and on and on...
I have a great tip for anyone reading.
Honesty pays dividends.
Want to extract information from someone? Give them some information about yourself. The idea here, is to imply or make it seem like you're sharing something personal or exclusive information. Doesn't have to be important to you, they just have to think that it is. Once you do that they will open up and let you in on their world. You need to show people that they can trust you with confidential information. If you can buddy up to the right people you can get all sorts of useful information you're not supposed to have.
I've gotten my bosses to share things with me that could cost them their jobs.
Social engineering is very important, get good at it. Watch other people interact. Try to pick up on the subtext of their conversations. Try to noticed all the little details of interaction and take time after the fact to analyze it after the fact so you can get a better understanding on the way people work.
Directors are family. Two directors were already canned in a very expensive legal case over them being greedy and wasting company funds. Even if gathering that kinda money was anywhere in the realm of possibility, I wouldn't buyout my own family. Besides, they are why the company is successful, their extensive experience in the industry. I can't say much more about it, but their names cary a lot of weight.
Thanks for your post, it was very insightful, but there still seems to be a few misconceptions in the thread about my position in the company, I'll asnwer a few of your points.
>but I'm shit at interpersonal shit.
I do need to improve here, as people have pointed out. But I don't actually work at an office. I basically work from home and communicate directly with the directors. I have full access to the admin email group, which not even other managers do.
>You need to take what is good and likeable about your personality and leverage that to gain favor with others.
Very good advice. Keep in midn though, I don't deal with anyone in the company, except a couple of directors and an accountant, at a personal level. I attend meetings with the directors to the accountant/book-keeper, and I help survey aquisitions of property and assets.
>Figure out the social dynamics of the place you work. Who has power? Who doesn't like who? Who can make your job easier, and who can make it harder?
I only have direct contact with the Directors.
>I think the main take-away that I'm getting here is that:
>1.) You're not doing a good job greasing the wheels.
>2.) You want things to happen too quickly.
I also agree, although the company is expanding at an exceptionally sluggish rate and my whole point is I want to see this change.
>This is a great idea and I second it.
And I third it. Excellent idea, and it's also what I'm exceptionally good at.
The directors are all family.
Family changes things a bit. Depending on how close they are with you, you should be busting your ass not for the money but because you ALREADY HAVE AN IN.
Seriously punk, you're going to be a director for this company someday if you stick around, and provided they don't crash and burn.
You have it set already, even if you don't bust your ass. But you should, because you're basically working for yourself to an extent.
Any Family members you interact with, don't worry too much about gaining favor unless you're less than neutral in their eyes. Family members will take pride in someone of the same blood busting ass, and they'll notice the hard work you're putting in (OVER TIME!).
Non-family member directors should be your focus, and it should be kept light when you have opportunities. Don't force interaction where it isn't welcome, but if you have a spontaneous thought durring an appropriate lul in conversation with one of them let it flow and see where it takes you. Keep it appropriate, and take small liberties and gauge their response to it. If they start talking non-business with you unprompted, you're in, and you can start to leverage your positions casually in the flow of conversation and they will be taken with more weight. You should be aiming for 1 on 1 interactions - the manageability of social dynamics grows exponentially with the number of people participating - I tend to withdrawal more and more the larger the group becomes because it essentially becomes a high risk/reward scenario with standing out in crowds.
Yes, this is autism applied to social dynamics. Awe in wonder at the spectacularly ironic contradiction of it.
Before I go, I'll leave you with this:
Given your unique position in the company, there is "no playing your cards right" you already hold a winning hand. At this point you can only play them wrong, so don't do that.
Being pushy, overly eager, and acting like you're smarter than your superiors (making them feel stupid), are all ways to play your cards wrong. So try to apply a light touch when you make suggestions - because suggestions are sometimes taken as:
>I know more about how to run this company than you do.
Which, incidentally is exactly what you sound like you've been saying throughout this thread.
>because you ALREADY HAVE AN IN.
>Seriously punk, you're going to be a director for this company someday if you stick around, and provided they don't crash and burn.
This has been exactly my gameplan. But until then I'd prefer not being poor as fuck and working on minimum wage. I'm doing work that execs do and making decisions that directors should do, but I'm getting a burger flipper's wage.
>Yes, this is autism applied to social dynamics. Awe in wonder at the spectacularly ironic contradiction of it.
I am in awe
Thanks for the advice, I'll keep it in mind.
They're family? Fuck that changes things. Now you need to start telling all of your other family members about the "completely free work you did that saved uncle joe's company hundreds of thousands." It WILL get brought up at some point. At worse it will remind them or inform them of the work you did, at best it will guilt-trip them into promoting you. This feeds into the plan of getting them to approach you to fix problems for them, but now it has the added potential of making them look like jackasses to the entire family.
Is also right about waiting at least a year before asking for a promotion. All of his advice is good, but it's too morally upright for my tastes. You need to paint yourself as the most productive worker in the company, one who goes out of the way just to help the company. While also putting pressure on the directors from other methods, particularly family and profit incentive. After about a year you'll be completely ready to walk into their office and get promoted.