Let's be real

why would money ever ever ever be in a bubble?

first we need to discover who satoshi is. satoshi is the person who invented bitcoin. therefore to learn who is satoshi we must simply learn who invented bitcoin

fuck off fag

(((They))) will try, (((they))) won't succeed

and if we could only figure out who invented bitcoin then we would know who Satoshi was, he invented bitcoin.

The main use case for crypto is the "uberization" of businesses, tractors, buses, cars, all kind of machinery, hard drives, processors, everything you can think of can be rented using smart contracts. This means the capital goods, the goods being used in production are used much more efficiently, they don't sit idle.

Now what is it that makes a bubble pop? A bubble pops when overoptimism makes us start many different projects, but one day we realize that we don't have the capital goods needed to undertake all those projects at once, so we are forced to pick some and let the other die. This is what makes the bubble pop.

But what happens when capital goods are used much more efficiently and we can go much longer without needing to pick one project over the others? Bubbles keep growing, crypto will create bubbles that we can't even imagine nowadays, whoever tells you that crypto is a bubble about to pop doesn't have a clue about how big an actual crypto bubble can get.

So what are we going to do when the governments of the world realize that you cant ban it or tax it? Will they just go into some kind of full meltdown panic mode?

It'd be absolutely retarded to ban it, but they'll find a way to consistently tax it and sniff out evaders eventually. The one thing the government doesn't fuck around about is money.

So everybody needs to hold crypto so it can be a bubble. When people like you are saying that it's not a bubble it is.

>When people like you are saying that it's not a bubble it is
logic

Frankly, I wouldn't have bought BTC if it would've been illegal. I didn't buy from localbitcoins because it would've involved dealing with an actual human being which I dislike.

Ashamed to admit it but it's true.

>It'd be absolutely retarded to ban it, but they'll find a way to consistently tax it and sniff out evaders eventually. The one thing the government doesn't fuck around about is money.

They wont be able to do it. Sorry man, I know a lot of you people were born before the internet. But shits changing. I am 110% sure that taxing crypto is going to be an endless shit show where the only people who are punished are the ones who try to be honest.

You cant tax crypto. We are going to have to start seriously having the conversation that taxes are not going to be possible in the coming years.

Why the fuck do you pajeets thing regulation = ban? Cryptos NEED regulation, the ICOs make no fucking sense.

>You cant tax crypto.
In what sense? Unless you're doing all your trading in non-cooperative foreign or black market exchanges, you'll be found out. Even then, those exchanges will be forced to comply eventually once mass regulation begins in earnest. I'm sure people will still find some offshore account-esque loophole to avoid taxes, but that's absolutely not going to be the majority of the average people trading.

>you'll be found out.

Sure if nothing changes about the tech from here on out. In the future? Nope. Technology is a constantly changing an evolving beast. If you approach this from a "nothing will ever change" perspective then you already lost.

We wont be using exchanges forever. We wont be using banks forever either. An increasing number of people will be able to be paid directly in crypto.

> I'm sure people will still find some offshore account-esque loophole to avoid taxes, but that's absolutely not going to be the majority of the average people trading.

Its going to be a lot more complex than this. Its going to be like dealing with hackers. Its a going to be a constant struggle that never ends and as the technology continues to grow it will be harder and harder to track anything. Every coin on the top 10 of coin market cap will have new security functionality in 5 years.

I know it sounds crazy, but we need to start having the conversation about taxation getting automated out entirely in the coming years.

>taxation getting automated out entirely in the coming years.
Damn if only there was some sort of platform that makes this a possibility... it could track all crypto AND fiat transactions on the blockchain in real time... something like... something like Request Network?

It needs to be taxed when converted to legal tender to prevent money laundering and enable government oversight.

seeing every single transaction is nice and all but attaching identity to those transactions is the bottleneck. On top of that being able to know what wallets transacted with what wallets as well. There will also be huge demand for decentralized exchanges as well as new ways to get crypto without having to directly utilize USD entirely.

Anyone who thinks this is going to play out in favor of the government then you have no clue how the flow of technology works.

I see Zero chance long term that this kind of tech can be controlled. I give it two more evolution before we are looking at full complete blockage of any kind of taxation.

unironically? left wing death squads

Even death squads are powerless. It would be like using a screen door to block a flood of water.

If there's no one paying TAX then the goverment doesn't have any money for improving and maintaining the country, your life will be a living hell.

'Cause I'm the taxman, yeah I'm the taxman

arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/02/coinbase-we-will-send-data-on-13000-users-to-irs/

How fucked are you when the IRS come calling?

>your life will be a living hell.
I live in a multi-culti/racial hell hole, I am already am. There was a shooting at my school (one of the most diverse in the country) and I was actually excited because I thought I would finally get to die.

We won't need a government one day. Block chain and link can literally replace and change democracy.
>Tfw politicians didn't think automation would affect them

Not really, because we don't need the government or big banks when we have crypto. Crypto can be used to pay for infrastructure as well as a standing army.

who is going to pay for that? Are you going to? No its the government with tax money. No tax no country

Not if you couple cryptocurrencies with fiat. Let's be honest, the Lightning Network was a step in this direction. Nodes are now centralized and banks now have access to liquidity and transaction records. Exchanges also are now required to have your personal information before you can cash out and withdraw your money.

You still can't buy goods and services with crypto and if they did, manufacturer's/consumers must now convert that crypto into fiat if they want to participate in the day-to-day economy. They still have to pay their employees with cash. Bitcoin's use with big corporations is that they can now transfer wealth with little cost from country to country. In international transactions bitcoin is literally cheaper compared to wire transfers from banks which take a percentage of the total dollars you've transferred from bank to bank.

Satoshi envisioned bitcoin with the anarchist principle in mind but bankers, corporations and politicians have unfortunately twisted this creation for their own benefit. What's ironic about this is that bitcoin was created to free us from governmental and institutional interference. The road to hell is paved with good intentions

>>You still can't buy goods and services with crypto
You can, some retailers in Japan allow Bitcoin payments along with some in Hong Kong and other parts.

A few electronics and entertainment shops in the UK accept them as well, as does Sharps Pixley, one of London's premier gold and silver bullion merchants.

Still doesn't change the fact that these retailers/businesses still have to convert crypto back into fiat. Crypto as it stands today is unusable for day-to-day transactions. It has high fees and low transactions speeds for it to be viable. The only reason that comes to mind that these businesses accept crypto is they are in it for the speculative ride too. Once regulations kick in, businesses will be required to disclose their earnings from crypto and they will probably use the Lightning Network to great effect in order to audit you. Bitcoin I feel has been twisted into something that even allows government to pry into the eyes of every transaction available. There is no escaping the clutches of the taxman and the government this time. Again what's ironic about this is that bitcoin was created to free us from governmental and institutional interference but now is twisted to even allow government even greater control over us, which wasn't even possible with fiat. The road to hell is paved with good intentions

Point still stands that certain retailers accept bitcoin.
>Crypto as it stands today is unusable for day-to-day transactions
If this was totally true then retailers wouldn't accept Bitcoin at all.
>The only reason that comes to mind that these businesses accept crypto is they are in it for the speculative ride too
So are most investors
>Once regulations kick in, businesses will be required to disclose their earnings from crypto and they will probably use the Lightning Network to great effect in order to audit you
No one knows the future

Yet again these are just your opinions that you're speculating on not facts. If you don't like Bitcoin then no one is stopping you from purchasing it.

We're talking in terms of how government regulations will pursue policy in regards bitcoin. If you're too autistic not to see the writing on the wall, then that's your problem. I have nothing against bitcoin or crypto in general but clearly this has been hijacked by bankers and governments for far something worse. This ain't tinfoil nuttery either.

youtube.com/watch?v=UYHFrf5ci_g

If you're happy with your gains with bitcoin that's fine but you can't just ignore why suddenly governments want to adopt this when this was created to free us from government in the first place.

a few ways off the top of my head:

>EU operated exchanges comply with AML/KYC
>Mining hardware registration and regulation at point of sale
>ICO compliance within EU borders

get out of here with those fucking meme brackets

>clearly this has been hijacked by bankers and governments for far something worse
>but you can't just ignore why suddenly governments want to adopt this when this was created to free us from government in the first place
Yet again, speculation, you can't jump to conclusions like this, you'll just spread possible false information. If all it takes is a single video to convince you to believe something so easily then you're naive and is quick to jump to conclusion without logically thinking about whats happening, there's no solid evidence for you claims, just speculation.

>lightning network
>governments being positive with bitcoin is plastered all over the news
>speculation
You're clearly trolling at this point. Whatever floats your boat.

It would require closing off the EU's internet traffic to something more similar to what the Norks have. The EU is ran by Communists so don't be suprised if they actually do it.

they can ban it easily but they won't because there is no reason to. governments aren't the big evil boogeyman you think it is and the west is still pro free market

So give the anarchocapitalists what they want. All services are actually paid for, subscription not paid service not rendered. This fixes the problem of theft by the state for subpar service, as well as freeloader problem.
Nobody will subscribe to an entity that can't provide a service worth paying for. And if government can't provide a service worth paying for it will be usurped by entities that can.

>You guys better get your act together or else we will do it for you
t. no government ever
they're bluffing

>people sitting on millions of dollars and life changing gains are going to let some dickhead in a suit say "nah"
this will only get worse

How is it even remotely difficult to tax crypto? Simply force exchanges to report transactions, like Coinbase is doing with the US IRS. That money has to go somewhere. The second it touches a bank, government has a report on it just like gambling winnings/capital gains reporting. Already thinking of ways for the fiat you converted it into not touching a worldwide bank? You better pray you dont get caught. You are now in the realm of the mob and drug dealers laundering money

You regulate people, not things. This is less about control over a thing, then about a tool they can use to selectively harass people.

All they have to do is regulate fiat gateways
You can have all your free math after that

>will regulate = will ban

hmm, really fires my neurons...

just exist outside the system as much as possible like i plan to do, sure i'll be declaring taxes on big cash outs to buy a house, but anything beyond that i won't be declaring let's just hope they can't audit very well :')

>Anyone who thinks this is going to play out in favor of the government then you have no clue how the flow of technology works.

And you have a very naive outlook on what governments worldwide are able/willing to do to ensure tax income keeps coming. One of the very first US government departments to exist was the Department of the Treasury. If a government can not reliably tax something, they will make that thing illegal and turn it over to blackmarkets

you can trade crypto for cash, you know.....

Show me a way to do that without an exchange or brokerage, and I will show you a big blinking target for the Department of Treasury

governments are made up of people
human beings
they are subjects of the people
modern society forgets that
you will soon see the "true" power of government when it is stepping on millions of peoples toes just for the sake of being able to leech their cut
Now that people are actually invested
They will realise that the government is essentially robbing everyone
That many of these taxes are designed to lace politician and industry pockets, not to help with infrastructure or in general the society that it is taxing
fuck them in their stupid monkey asses

lmfao. You are more delusional than a /k/omando. Mary Jo living in a trailer in Alabama doesnt gaf about crypto. Hell, she probably doesnt own a computer. She doesnt pay federal taxes either. The entire bottom 48% of the country simply doesnt give a shit about you because they dont pay federal taxes to begin with.

>when being out in public is a big blinking target for the Department of Treasury
lol

Oh I know because I live in one of this countries where you do that because there are no legal exchanges

ITT: people who are too busy flinging shit at each other to read what the EU actually said.

>only a few of the better off Americans owned stocks of internet companies in the late 90's, so it wasn't a bubble

And how will you trade currency then? Through an app? An app that is owned by a company that must comply with reporting standards? Seriously, think about what you are saying. All money in one way or another, touches an end node.

There is nothing revolutionary here. We are "debating" how tax collection has occurred since the beginning of time. The only 2 things in life that are guaranteed are death and taxes

>show me
Daily reminder that while its fun to wave your dick at government brainlets, anyone that is spoonfeeding techniques on a public site targeted by feds is also a brainlet

t. some government stooge
Noone gives a fuck about your jurisdiction, tax queer
The only reason you fuckers have existed with impunity is because the majority of tards are content with wagecucking as if its the only option
The problem now however is you have millions of people sitting on gains that they dont feel should be taxed justifiably
Remember end the fed?
Can you imagine the amount of momentum and support when there are people sitting on millions that might get cancelled out by tax queerdom?
Tax is about to go through MASSIVE reform
Society is moving away from their enforceable jurisdiction
And if they get spiteful
Then the government made of human beings will be shown to be what it is
A group of human beings, fragile as any other
see

This. And with the Lightning Network being implemented, it makes auditing that much easier. There's no "freedom from banks and governments" here. Anarchists are just delusional. We can be happy with all our gains so far that we've made with our bitcoins but that won't change a damn thing that they have tightened the grip more on us.

t. either r/buttcoin or IRS

only people that has identified on an exchange / have been pulling anything out into a bank account are stupid enough to be liable for falling under jurisdiction

you
lose
kek

>thinks centralized technology = decentralized technology
poor poor brainlets.....

probably through decentralized exchanges like CryptoBridge and BarterDEX like I'm already doing

>I've made a billion dollars!!!!
>better live like a rat and a hobo, MUH EVIL GUBMINT might be out to get me
r/buttcoin are the saltiest bunch on earth for not getting in but you take this anarchist and/or moon crap to a whole new level.

>decentralized exchange
>fiat
topkek. if you can't convert to fiat then you basically own nothing

>better live like a rat and a hobo, MUH EVIL GUBMINT might be out to get me
Are you honestly suggesting that governments are not invested in tax profits to the point of having an armed department that goes out and kills people over it?
Ok, we get it, you're a tax cuck, the problem for people like you however is the original intention of cryptos was to divorce money from third party influence and power, meaning leeches like most tax departments
>crying that people believe in the fundamentals

see

which decentralized exchange has fiat?

There are already marketplaces that sell exclusively for crypto. There have already been sales for property, cars, high worth items where the transaction was exclusively through crypto.

the world economy is evolving, we dont use clay tablets with symbols on them anymore, but he principle is the same. Now technology has enabled the common man to take back some power and sovereignty, by giving the choice to participate in tax via the nature of the medium VS having no choice in the matter

t. impartial observer with no financial investment

cash, as in, in person

also, to answer your question, Bisq

>probably through decentralized exchanges like CryptoBridge and BarterDEX like I'm already doing

Want to make a wager on how long it is until they are either forced to comply with reporting requirements, or shut down by world government?

Are you really this stupid? Do you have no reading comprehension? Top kek.

>the original intention of cryptos was to divorce money from third party influence and power, meaning leeches like most tax departments
Guess what, crypto has already been hijacked. This is why there is talk of "regulation" and "adoption" now by governments. The implementation of the Lightning Network was the first step towards this, next was governments all around the world finally talking about regulation and adoption in order to facilitate more control. We're all talking the same thing but your autistic fuck brain immediately became hostile because I said one negative thing about bitcoin.

>cashing out in person
bahahahaah enjoy cashing out the 2k your grandma gave you for your birthday faggot.

Call me again when you can cash out 200k in person

>trying to ban math
fucking brainlets jesus

I'm this guy, please kill yourself

>hehe guys, CP are just pixels on a screen, you can't just ban pixels!!! xDD

Like it hasnt happened in the past. You are aware people go to jail for not reporting personal gifts right?

yeah I am not gonna read your 10 page autismo chat

>math = CP
fucking brainlets jesus

so you're saying they already banned math before, unbanned it, then they're going to try to ban it again??

>pic related is for you

>so you're saying they already banned math before

Yes, a great many times. Its fairly easy to ban software of any kind if there is a "need" to do so and a proven "harm" to someone.

it'd probably hurt your feelings anyway

EU will not ban crypto. Period. They will regulate it, yes.

Have you faggots even read the official press release from the EU? Don't just believe whatever bullshit the mainstream media is telling you. Read this:

>europa.eu/rapid/press-release_SPEECH-18-1242_en.htm

If they ban crypto, it will be their loss. US, Japan, S Korea are all embracing crypto. Only foolish nations will ban crypto and they will be left behind.

Also, ECB or whatever the fuck it is has agreed to allow BTC futures in the EU. That's one solid proof that they are accepting crypto.

You'll lose house and go to jail

>Guess what, crypto has already been hijacked. This is why there is talk of "regulation" and "adoption" now by governments.
KEK
total newfag likely from r/buttcoin seeing as you're attempting to seed fear where there is no cause

they have been squaking about regulation for YEARS user
if they had the ability
they would have shut this down AGES ago
Bureaucracy is simply incapable of keeping up with technology

tell me
how is piracy treated today?
do the majority of people downloading via torrents get done by authority, or is it so pervasive through society that law has to play catch up, and adapt to match society, not vice versa

Stop being a little bitch, tax authority only has as much power as you give it, and that includes identity verification ANYWHERE

now excuse me while I grab a bite to eat

>websites are just math so they can't be banned!!!

are you honestly that dumb or are you just larping?

yeah? what about cryptography? lolol

...you realize non-backdoored Cryptography is a midterm election away from also being outlawed in the US right? Horrible fucking example

You do realise laws are just rules, right?

it's funny all regulators are silent when price plummets but whenever bitcoin rises all shills and regulators panicks missing the train

Yea, and you follow them or people with guns take everything you have away and put you inside a cage until you die

it's like you think making math illegal makes it disappear?

How do they find out if the rules have been broken when the technology is being developed on a daily basis on an international level, with the main point being to get away from government eyes and authority to begin with?

This is a battle of people that value freedom over daddy government, always has been.

also, see