Coinbase Will Report To IRS

only poor people evade taxes, and because Veeky Forums is vastly composed of poor people, you'll get a lot of hateful (you)s with this

Thats an interesting point. I think theyll make an example out of someone(s), think of the widely publicized cases of movie studios/record companies suing all hell out of a few individuals who illegally downloaded movies and music.

Do i report taxes even if i never cash out just hold?

If you just keep hodling and wait for mass adoption within the next 10 years you dont have to pay any taxes at all.

In theory I agree, but I don't think it will work that way in practice. If they treat it like the stock market, even crypto-to-crypto will count as "gains" if the value you sold at is more than the value you bought at.

This will also create problems for people who are crazy enough to trade on margin, since they are more likely to have these gains.

Of course, if these people were keeping good records, they could also deduct their losses, but what are the chances that they kept good records?

For now, I think they can, because there still isn't a closed system where you can operate all crypto.

If you could buy and sell goods without anyone in the supply chain ever having to covert to dollars, you might be on to something. But for now that's not the case. And those who have to deal in dollars to restock their shelves, ect will be the choke point.

Wrong, US taxes on crypto-to-crypto exchanges. Meaning if you traded ETH to get your LINK, that's a taxable event. Guess what, if you sent crypto from coinbase to binance, that's taxable.

this is what boot-lickers actually believe

>believe

You retard the IRS itself announced this.

All these anons thinking the IRS cares about their 500$ gains

/thread absolute worse case scenario for chump change is taxed as income tax.

>he thinks the IRS can somehow figure out your trade of x shit coin for y shitcoin in dollars and account for the arbitrage across different exchanges and minute to minute price fluctations

Hopefully, the first people they go after will put up a huge fight and make it a nationwide conversation.

>using non anonymous exchanges

Honestly though, the IRS doesn't give a fuck. It's not on them to prove it, it's on you. The default position of the IRS is you owe fucking everything to them, basically.

You mean other than that whole immutable ledger thing?

meh, as a yuropoor i think the noose will tighten around us soon enough. if you're lucky enough to live in switzerland or belarus good for you, but plenty of other european countries have capital gains taxation that makes the IRS look like a party of libertarians
on the bright side EU moves so slow we will hopefully have a) pos/sharding/raiden for low cost txs competitive with centralized exchanges b) high volume decentralized exchanges and c) large Dai adoption, or of any other mathematically secure stablecoin

yea that means the service charge of transferring is a loss. therefor lowering my AGI.

this

>using exchanges with your identity to trade
>cashing out over 5 figures to your bank account
if you are this stupid you deserve to get caught by the IRS. It's so easy to avoid taxes with crypto.

>muh crypto to crypto taxation!!!
As if this shit will ever be enforced, yeah here you go guys here’s my 15,000 page tax form, have fun with it

how so

The IRS would only look at that if the totals you report don't match the totals they already receive from the exchanges.

By poor people you mean millionaires and mega corporations?

avoidance =/= evasion

obviously it's not for 2017 yet because taxes aren't due until April

Same here. Its so ridiculous to have these hearing before the SEC if they wont even treat crypto like a security, tax wise, right??

But it will apply. They will look at 2017 transactions as reported by coinbase, and compare them to the transactions reported by the individuals on their taxes.

And as soon as they don't match, they will use that as the excuse to audit the last 3 years.

IRS and SEC do not need to treat cryptos the same. the IRS is happy treating it as a capital asset and that doesn't determine how the SEC treats it or will treat it. I would say tax fraud or not reporting gains is probably a bigger risk than reporting you bought ICOs or something though. IRS most likely won't even check for anything like that (unless you made millions), they just want to get paid.

I wonder how public opinion will take it. There was pity for the small guy then but one thing is the RIAA and another the IRS.

If you started buying and holding In January, you owe at the end of 2018. If you bought last year and still hold this year, you owe last year in April and at the end of this year you owe. Or you don't report. They just won't stop until the control everything aspect of this world and society. Tax you on the hair you're losing. It's a fucking joke.

>irs will ruin cyrpto and we will be forever poor

They will make an example of someone calling them a te*****st and cr***al and suggesting it was attempted to be lau****ed through the da*k w** for maximum impact. They will demonise the holders if they are unable to control it and you think its bad exchanges dropping you in the shit wait until the burgers themselves do it to you

"Land of the Free"

oh look, its the daily nocoiner FUD thread on the only thing left for them to fud, taxes. Lets see which one of the newfags fall for it

You do realize the IRS sends you a random large fine and then tell you to prove you don't owe that right? They don't need to figure out that shit, YOU do. here's a $100k fine, want it lowered? Prove you don't owe $100k then.

I don't want to tell you too much because I need you to be an example for us so we can see how badly IRS fucks tax-dodgers.

you do realize that this would only give them more job security, right?

Why can’t I just transfer everything into Monero, then say I mined it on an old computer back in the day? Can they prove otherwise?

...

How you gonna cash out then? What's the point of your gains if it's all just numbers in a computer screen?

The IRS will probably randomly pick a couple people out of those 13 thousand to audit and that will be it. They literally don't have the manpower to do anything more than that.

They don't need the manpower. Everything is done by computer now.

They could simply send out audits on EVERYONE. Then use the replies to do personal audits.

Are you serious? Sending BTC from coinbase to another exchange is a taxable event?

Only if you don't report it.

If you're doing things above board, capital gains are only on gains, and only when there is a transaction or cashing out. So, if you bought 100k btc @ .01, you're sitting on a pile of cash now but it's not taxable until you start to draw it out.

BUT... if you DON'T declare it, all they see is the money going out of the exchange. Without proof from you that it went into another exchange, they assume you cashed out and the entire amount is taxable.

what are some anonymous exchanges where i can buy Bitcoin or Ethereum for fiat? not local bitcoins pls..

I'm a brainlet...how would I report sending btc from conibase to binance?

You have to call 911 and tell them you need to report to an officer that you have moved coins from coinbase to binance. Failure to do that will have you arrested for not being a cuck.

Why don't Coinbase just incorporate taxation within their system when you want to withdraw, this will ease everyone's mind and be a lot more efficient.

Its not going to be possible to do it properly for everyone. The first indication we need to be watching for is when people change the coins to get around tax law. Pivacy coins begin getting an edge on the market or we see new forms of tax havens form up.

I ask this question every thread.
I live in Canada, does this mean I'm safe?

>implying I have gains

>not simply buying the IRS

I thought you guys were rich

We can manipulate public opinion by turning this into a conversation of taxation of ALL digital goods. We can begin a meme campaign to do this and make the argument that

If the IRS can make the argument that crypto to crypto trades are taxable as USD trades then how long until they come for your video games and social media?

That right their would stir the pot. WAY TOO MANY PEOPLE think this is just about crypto but its really about the IRS moving in on the internet as a whole.

For those of you that don't plan on reporting gains to IRS, how do you plan on cashing out? Or do you guys intend to just not report gains on crypto to crypto trades and just pay taxes on what you cash out?

All we need is a few people who will be willing to go through the legal trouble and donate tons of money to them so they have basically unlimited money. And just drag the shit out.

They threw Wesley Snipes in jail for trying to scam the IRS out of taxes. If a well-known Hollywood actor isn't safe, little old user isn't;

JUST report my shit shit up

Pay taxes on what you cash out for now then slowly begin taking advantage of goods and services you can directly pay for without cashing out.

Free food, games and whatever else. You never need to spend your crypto on something big. use it for the small stuff and you save your USD for the big stuff.

Only 13 000
Stop creating panic u idiot.
Coinbase won in court!
u think the banks will just give up??
Stop helping them idiot!!!!

>They don't need the manpower. Everything is done by computer now.

It has to all be verified to make sure there are no mistakes or that the info is accurate. Also if enough people turn it into a public shitstorm it would be overwhelming to them.

that's called tax evasion. have fun getting raped in jail

Read what they actually imprisoned Wesley Snipes for.

No it doesn't. The computer does the math, and if the computer says it doesn't balance, they act like it doesn't.

I ran into this problem one time with my business.

...Paid my 941 (payroll) taxes.
.. get a notice that I didn't pay, pay now or we lock your bank accounts.
... so I pay again, knowing it's a double payment
... get notice with check saying you overpaid, here's the money back
... deposit the check in the bank.
... get notice... why did you cash the check, you owed us money, now we are going to fine you.

It took almost a year for me to get one office to the other office and to finally understand that I didn't owe anything.

>tfw Ausfag and the Australian Taxation Office views only Bitcoin as currency because shitcoins have literally no real world buying power and can't be counted as a currency

This is the only way taxation can work. If they don't do this then we are genuinely looking at the final days of taxation.

And guess what, it marks a huge amount of automation for the IRS as well. Why have X number of employees if its all automated anyway?

Because he tried the soverign citizen bit to not pay income taxes.

Which is roughly the same as this. Crypto hounds claiming they don't have to pay taxes because they're too clever to be caught by people who do this for a living.

I currently work a part time job making less than $10k per year on general income. Assuming I make, say, $100k on crypto and report it would I be taxed on my long-term capital gains due to my lower tax bracket?

These arguments are old and outdated.

The problem is, the vast majority of crypto owners are not going to pay taxes or even report they have crypto. The only people who are going to be punished are the ones being honest about it. Which means next year there will be even fewer people who stick their necks out.

Its over, we are in a checkmate situation for taxation. I am going to love to hear the insanely low number of people who report crypto taxes come April.

Most people have a coinbase or gdax account that is verified...surely the IRS will know we have crypto then.

LINK will handle all crypto taxation

People who this rely too much on the myth that they and their transactions are anonymous.

They wont be able to see it. That's the problem. There is literally nothing the IRS can do.

I would direct your attention to Room 641a. Anonymity is a myth

>No it doesn't.

Yes it does, we wont have a fucking all seeing all knowing AI. A person has to look at everything to make sure it lines up. And crypto is going to be an ever changing technology.

The key thing you need to be paying attention to is that this technology is going to be constantly changing. Stop fucking assuming this is how it will be forever. The moment devs learn the rules then we will see new coins and tech emerge that go around the tax law.

Everyone single one of you who thinks the IRS will be fine are not thinking about what happens next. What happens next is privacy tech becomes baseline for nearly all coins. And every dev explores ways to get around taxes either through obfuscation or by simply finding a special case they didn't think about yet.

Wow, only 13000 users? I assumed anyone who invested over 10k was getting a phat 1099 in the mail. Now it's sounding like you need even more than that, maybe 20 or 50k?

Sure, again you people are treating the tech like its static forever and will never change. Its never the case with tech. In 5 years all top 10 coins on CMC will have privacy and tax avoidness methods as a default.

That's when the IRS is unable to keep up. Its the same thing with the NSA. They collect too much data and have no real way to go through it all.

Haven’t seen this one before, I lost it, ty user

Any crypto with an immutable public ledger gives them an automatic paper trail to follow.

This, i laugh my ass off every time i see these threads
Man the fuck up guys

This, irs doesn't care even if you were selling drugs, they just want to be paid

Same reason my brokerage account doesn’t. It’s not on them to make sure I pay taxes.

All of them will. Not only that but ways to mine coins using staking systems will allow developers to pay users to use their product without having to go through a standard fiat gatway.

So the first generation of crypto was based around coinbase and directly buying stuff. Once we begin seeing services pop up that are built around coins that anyone can use it will cause major problems because gateways to obtain said coins no longer exist for those users.

I predict it will be gaming that sets this forward but it will be social media as well. Look at Steemit for example. You can make an account and begin mining steem without having your identity attached to the account. My arguments are that the tech is going to be a constantly changing thing. Way too many people here assume this is it, nothing left to see here folks.

Taxation is going to be impossible in the coming years. Its obvious when you look at the tech and think about DAPPS, privacy tech, DEXs conversion techniques.

Not cashing out
Wil only cash out my initial investment
'I didn't gain shit IRS cucks, see this is exactly how much i put in'
Leave profits on exchanges to make more shekels
Slowly funnel profits out and maybe pay 5% tax on them, they'll be happy.

What if crypto tanks?

Can’t you just put your money in Monero shift it around a bit and report capital losses In order to get a massive refund. That is if you are employed.

I only made losses on Coinbase, but I did make gains on several other exchanges. I'll only report my losses on Coinbase to save myself some money

Here we go again... Monopoly money is not real money, it’s the same reason you don’t have to pay taxes when you trade your little pokemon cards. You could have invested into a 401k like us sane, rational people but you insist on putting money(real money) into something that is worthless. How many times do we have to say this YOU CAN’T MAKE A LIVING LIKE THIS! This delusion is sickening, it is truly sickening... If you wanted a good return for your money why not invest like Warren Buffet and buy Coca Cola shares, oh who am I kidding of course you won’t. You “people” are not more than pot smoking gamblers and it is millenials like yourselves who love to blame people who are older and wiser than you for your poor life choices. When you see successful, normal folks walking around you laugh and scoff, not realizing your own parents were wishing they put your sorry ass up for adoption before it was too late, but now it is. Maybe one day you so called “investors” will pull yourselves up by the bootstraps, make something of the pathetic thing you call a life and join us in the land of the living and not be trying to get rich quick by trading your invisible chucke cheese tokens, but sadly I do not see this happening any time soon. Good luck out there buddy, you’re gonna need it.

RIP me

You guys think privacy coins are going to run as we get closer to April?

It works the other way to. How can they PROVE that I didn't lose money on every trade?