/med/ thread

Studying applied pharmacy in 2nd semester, love the subjects but sadly the university is shit. Thinking about just going for a regular pharma degree now, too bad my grades were to shit to do this in the first place.

Them loans dude.
pa school is much shorter school much shorter loans and still makes good money. not to mention they work less.
I'm enjoying med school though

I got my undergrad in Microbiology. Never really seriously considered medicine before and preferred lab work but now I'm thinking of going back to school for something medical for the job opportunities.

What are my options with a shitty GPA? I know MD and PA are probably out of the question, but any other good careers that aren't hard to get accepted into?

>science

top kek stamps collecting isn't science

gogle does a better job than MDs

What's your GPA?

My undergrad GPA was 3.2, so I did a one year post-baccalaureate program and got straight A's, bringing my cumulative GPA up to a 3.4 This was good enough to get into several US MD schools. I scored in the 94th %ile on the MCAT and had solid extracurricular activities too. Also my undergrad was a Top 30.

...

To get into second year here, you need to average ~87.5+. After 1 semester, I'm sitting on an 81

>wanting to brute force memorize knowledge for the next 8 years of your life in med school
>wanting to spend absurd amounts of money getting a medical education designed to get you to drop out
>wanting to abandon intellectual pursuits of physical sciences to adhere to the cultural standard of what society deems successful
>doing all this for wealth and influence
>doing all this to realize you probably wont be as wealthy as you thought you would
>working 60+ hours in a place where the ill and dying congregate
>being responsible for the death of patients and breaking the news to family

but hey, you get to drive home in that nice BMW right? sounds like a pretty shit deal imho.

>BMW
LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

NIGGA I HAVE TWO PORSCHES

European dentist here. I've posted here before.

I've seen the schedules of both MDs and DMDs and I wouldn't trade my current lifestyle for the world. 40 hours a week currently and on a vacation atm...

Start studying now

I'm in Optometry school right now. Eyeballs are pretty cool

Dentists on average make half of what even the least specialized doctors make. i'd gladly work an extra 10 hours per week for double the salary.

MS3 reporting in

>glorious MS4 in 6 weeks
>glorious match day in 10 months

Med school fucking sucks and I cant wait to get my degree, a job, and some fucking respect.

The only thing that has shown to be the best predictor of your usmle step 1 is pre-clinical grades and # of questions done.

So
>study your ass off get high As in all classes
>memorize all of first aid, pathoma and uworld when the time comes

Got me a 263

>designed to get you to drop out

Med Schools do their damndest to ensure high retention rates.

>abandoning intellectual pursuits of physical sciences

Tons of physicians are actively involved in research, everything from fundamental moleccular mechanisms to gene discovery and computational genomics.

>working 60+ hours where the dying and dead congregate
Not every clinical practice centers around immediately life threatening conditions.

Is your entire understanding of medicine based off of Scrubs?

What part of "european" you do not understand?

European pharmacy student 4th semester reporting in.

Be me never having any trouble in school/uni and and almost always being the best. Being at the end of 3rd semester. Not really having visited lectures, because I can learn that on my own much faster like I always have. Actually getting highly coveted internship in local hospital pharmacy during exam phase. Thinking everything is still easy. Starting part time job, because need some money for "free time".

Later realizing its not that easy. Getting on my limits the first time ever. Completely freak out. Fail one stupid exam cause not enough time and not used to having stress. Having to repeat this exam, in consequence having one semester not doing anything but preparing this exam.

What do during this time to prepare later career to kinda even out my arrogance induced fail? Also general advice appreciated.

Veterinarian here.. Anyone wants to take a look at my research request for a PhD? Can't tell if it really shitty or not, its from field of pharmacology.

>Who here is studying to be a doctor

>Europ.
>final year, done in three months.
It's overhyped as shit and it's an emotional rollercoaster of stress, emotions and general unpleasantries. You're sold an image of prestige and high level competence, what the actual reality is that you're figurately stuck with your elbow up a persons anus and have no idea what you're trying to find.

The pay is good, yes you can learn most of it from practical work experience, but the fucking mental suffering and extreme stress you have wade through is likely to leave you with PTSD(literally speaking, this is not a figure of speech but literally you can get fucked over big time due to extreme spikes of stress and "medical isolation"), classmates committing suicide isn't a very enchanting experience, and they're doing it because the education.

If I had a time machine I'd probably go back and go for some 3-year trade specialization instead, cheaper and better starting income, which given debts and work opportunities would mean I could earn more money over the following 20-year period than I would as a MD.

I'm studying biotech
Does it count? It feels more like an applied chemistry degree than anything.

>Do all that shit to become a doctor
>Get replaced by a robot after 30 years

JUST

sorry but what's PA?

Physician assistant.

Essentially youre a permanent resident. You get to do many doctorly things like write orders, prescribe medications, help out in surgeries, do minor procedures, etc, but you will always have to run your plan by and get approval from the attending (boss) physician. Just like a resident does, except theres no hope for you to ever be able to practice totally autonomously.

The upside is its only 2 yrs of school and you can get to work pretty much straight away at a pretty decent salary. I think a lot of surgical PAs make ~100k.

Downside is theres no way to specialize, and you basically do the same shit your entire career. Salary also doesnt advance much past what you start at I believe.

In chicago at least, its surprisingly a female dominated field. All qt3.14 blondes and brunettes that get hired by male surgeons to be eye candy.

What are your plans when you get automated out of a job?

In an alternate universe, where I didn't come from a broken home, knew how to study and work hard, I would've loved to had been a PA.

Present day reality me: majoring in a social science with a 2.9 GPA. Do they have PA schools in the Caribbean?

what are some solid extra activities that med schools look for?

Ayyy are you a cute girl? Or gay? Hmu.

Biomedical Science grad student here. Does that count?

be a nurse

If you have money those pay to be a doctor for 2 weeks in a foreign country trips for college kids are great. med schools admissions people love those for some reason. SUCH SERVICE. SO HUMAN. when in fact any moron with 2 grand can go do it.

Awesome score!

>when the time comes

Are you a believer in doing dedicated study only during the block allotted after year 2 or is it better to start as early as possible? I feel like the "six weeks is plenty of time to prepare" thing is just a meme spouted by gunners to make sure that others don't achieve their potential.

I guess the counterargument would be that it would be a waste to do UWorld too far out from the exam date.

What was your study timeline like?

I am currently a high school science teacher looking into optometry school. Any advice? I only have one prerequisite course (microbiology) left that I need to take, and then I will take the OAT.

six weeks full time prep will get you an average score.

I started prepping 6 months before. We had 3 week blocks so starting in january I would study for step for 2.5weeks then 2-3 days before lecture exam would cram whatever was on it.

kept that up until march, then I just went full boards until start of june and my exam

We still had lecture exams and a series of NBME subject exams but stopped studying specifically for them

I think I was studying like 10-12hrs a day for six months. Shit was insane.

Thanks, man. I hope to follow in your footsteps.

What are you specializing in btw? I imagine you could get into any residency in the country with a 263.

t. Butthurt medical rejects

>automation
You realise most studies put allied health professionals as least likely to be automated in the next 20-30 years right?

However a physics grads main employment source is getting rapidly automated, what with the invention of self service machines at MC Donald's

Ooo what kind user?

Good for you user. It's sad people doesn't give a shit about human sense organs even though we depend on them and constructed this whole society based on them.

all physics grads rapidly BTFO with great gusto

That's great but it still isn't science or math

Depends where,
I am biotech too, but it's more like engineering here.

>what with the invention of self service at McDonalds

FNP/ACNP and a lot of none of
>Essentially youre a permanent resident. You get to do many doctorly things like write orders, prescribe medications, help out in surgeries, do minor procedures, etc, but you will always have to run your plan by and get approval from the attending (boss) physician. Just like a resident does, except theres no hope for you to ever be able to practice totally autonomously.
this wih something called a life that not a single MD/DO I have met actually has, oh and if you are a hustler,
>surgical PAs make ~100
that's your starting salary with RVUs pushing that to mid-200s. Not even joking.

But hey, autonomy and a huge difference in knowledge. It's really just up to you.

Doesn´t "Medicine based on evidence" follow the scientific method?

There is no point arguing
It's the fox and grapes problem

"Huurr medicine isn't real science I could do it if I wanted too but I just don't want to"

But I wanted to know the "clever" answer of the "most intelligent" of Veeky Forums that only know to live scorning what they don´t do

I'm studying to do the GAMSAT for graduate medicine, I already have a finance degree.
I used to read the same complaints on finance boards as in this board when studying finance.

i.e-
It's not worth it
Too difficult
Not enough pay
Automation
etc

I entered the field of finance and found that it was easy, and the pay was decent.
The only thing that pissed me off was the asshole people. I was granted nothing but money for my troubles.

I have decided to become a doctor because I have an unfulfilled god complex, I want to help people
and feel that if people are going to piss me off regardless I may as well be rewarded with more than money.

I would really like to know if these complaints are factual or just standard frustration as with any career.

Yes doctors work long hours, yes they get paid a fair bit but is the career truly as unreasonable as some say?

If you want to avoid stress go do a menial job for shit pay. I'm choosing to do medicine because:
- I like people regardless of their bullshit
- I want to help them
- Existence is so much more than just money, and medicine allows me to engage with reality in a much deeper
way than any other job

I am genuinely intrigued in peoples true motivation in doing medicine. Was it because your family wanted you to or etc,
because if you were genuinely passionate about the job why complain so much?
The jobs I have done in the past I would have happily done them for free, and in many cases I have.

This rant was obviously not written to cause offence, yes I am arrogant but I don't want to come off as insincere
Please let me know what you think.

What do you say when the medschool interviewer asks: "why do you want to become a doctor?"

>inb4 "hurr durr I want to help people"

It's more complicated than that. Didn't want to go into detail because I rambled enough.

Eastern Euro student to become dentist in a month here.
I have a question for you.
Do you guys take foreign students with low to none experience on paid internship(just to pay bills for food at least) and are willing to dedicate to the job?
I got an offer from someone on Veeky Forums but I don't know first thing about how this things should happen.

Medicine is not a science and had never been falsely claimed as one until the 21st Century.

Medicine is no scientific than psychology or scientology.

There is no falsificationism or positivism.
It's just a bunch of hypothetical circle jerks.

The few cures found were by Phds in Biology, Virology, etc.

If medicine were really a science, then all practitioners should also have Phds in Chemistry and Biology.

> I want to help them
But they don't want to be helped and you will learn this on your first day actively working with people.
Unless its a life or death and i mean literally the people and on the verge of dying they will give you the middle finger.
There is really really small number of people that actually respect doctors and understand that they are the ones asking for help and should leave the matters in our hands.
>I am genuinely intrigued in peoples true motivation in doing medicine.
I had no idea what i wanted and just made the decision because my father already has his own office so i figured its a way to start something easier.
I was wrong for number of reasons that I wont go into and I regret my decisions.
>because if you were genuinely passionate about the job why complain so much?
Your patients are crazy,your colleagues are crazy and whats more important they have bigger egos that music stars.

2.8, also I went to a mediocre state school. What is a post-baccalaureate program? Is it hard to get into? I'm not sure if my original university offers that kind of thing. I thought about bringing my grades up by doing a masters program but I doubt I'd be accepted to that with my GPA either.

Pretty shit grapes desu, who wants to be overworked and produce no/limited original research

>wanting to help people
>loving the science and understanding of the human body
>healing people

Thanks for the reply. I understand that people don't want to be helped but I find surgery too fascinating to resist.
The good thing is that in the UK the government lets you do degrees that benefit the NHS, for free, so even if I don't like it I wouldn't really have lost anything apart from a bit of time.
I feel like dissecting cadavers would be worth the stress of getting onto a medical degree.

3rd year medical student here
most of my close (cousins ect) family are dr's (14) so that gave me a lot of interest from a young age.
My grandfather was a dr in the army and removed a live rpg from a soldier's chest cavity - winning a Southern Cross medal. Very inspiring story for a little boy
I started off for the interest in the human body and the money, but
As i have started working with people it became about helping them and healing them
also research is fucking amazing

>I feel like dissecting cadavers would be worth the stress
Get ready for the smell
Oh the smell

also buthurt surgeons that will shit on you every opportunity they have,which in all right they can do but its really not necessary and I don't know why they are so amused by it.

A post bacc is just more undergrad coursework. A masters is OK, but it doesnt get included into your premed cumulative GPA, only undergrad coursework does. My "post-bacc" was literally just a second bachelor's that I simply didn't finish. I just enrolled at my local state college for a second bachelor degree, took a bunch of classes to get A's to pad my GPA, and then left. Inquire at your local state school; im sure they'd let you enroll for a second bachelor. My advice: try your best to bring your cumulative undergrad GPA up to at least a 3.0. That is the absolute floor. Under that and you will get autorejected by screeners. Then you have to absolutely balls to the wall hard on the MCAT, I'm talking 95th %ile+...This, plus some solid extracurriculars and applying very broadly (~30 schools) will probably get you in somewhere. Also look into D.O. programs; they allow you to become a fully licensed US physician but are significantly easier to get into.

I'd love to study any form of medicine but I live in the US and have no money for more schooling. I have a BS in biology and decent enough grades but I have no desire to take out massive loans. Plus I need to work to maintain my current lifestyle and I don't see how I can work part-time and handle the rigors of further schooling, I barely made it out of undergrad that way.

this gives me hope, what kind of research are you doing?

>>>care.diabetesjournals.org/content/17/2/152.abstract
Daily reminder that physicians are dumb fucks who bruteforced their ways into education but wouldn't be able to understand hs tier mat

I was just about to make a thread for this. Just looking for information and suggestions.

Sometimes I'll get a thought/urge to do the most inappropriate thing possible at that time. Whether it be strangling the kitten in my arms, spitting in someone's face, or exposing myself and then 'touching them with it'. It hasn't been happening as often, thank God. That is except for the kitten strangling that happens 3/5 times I hold her.

Also, whenever in a quiet classroom or talking to someone I don't know but would like to, I begin to shake. I understand that this is nervousness, but I was just wondering why it came out of nowhere like this.

Fucking savage.

>Caduceus
>medicine

Hmm, many people actually have these thoughts - there's a French term for it that slips my mind at the moment - but most people don't actually act upon them. I'd like to say that you just have underdeveloped control/motor skills, but I'm an armchair doctor so take my word with a grain of salt. Do you have any other symptoms?

I have to agree with the motor skills, I forgot that recently I've felt as if I forgot how to walk. I thought it was all in my head at first but then someone asked why I was walking like that, I just said that my leg hurt.

But your head doesn't hurt at all? I mean, if you're acutely aware of these symptoms, it could be a form of self-fulfilling hypochondria. Also, have you had any sort of head trauma at all recently?

Maybe you should just see a neurologist; it might be helpful

No pain at all, no trauma; other than the motor skills and thoughts I'm very healthy.

The hypochondria is very likely because I never face these problems at home where I have nothing to worry about. If it gets too bad I'll see a neurologist, thanks

>tfw dicked around in undergrad and went to class sparingly
>tfw get shitty 3.2 overall gpa

I still want to get into an MD school Veeky Forums, but I don't know if a post bacc program is sufficient enough to make up for my shit gpa. I am aiming for a high MCAT obviously and doing alot of medical volunteer/work at the moment. Any advice?

SeeSame exact predicament. 3.2 is ABSOLUTELY workable. Take 1 year of postbacc but make damn sure you get STRAIGHT A's, No A minuses, just a 4.0. If you can bring your GPA up to a 3.4 plus score 90th %ile+ on the MCAT plus apply broadly (~30 schools), you WILL get into an MD program.

I did this exact thing, and I got tons of interviews and acceptances. I even got accepted to a Top 10, but I chose a lower ranked school because it was significantly cheaper, and I didn't want to be away from my family.

What about a 3.39?

Is a post-bac better than just getting an MS in something you'd like to do research in?

Well, to be totally honest with you, my cumulative GPA did end up being exactly 3.39. I shit you not. I just said 3.4 in this thread because it was more convenient.

I had to get 11 straight A's to get from a 3.21 to a 3.39.

As for postbacc vs masters, SeeOnly the postbacc will boost your cumulative GPA. The Masters GPA is considered completely separate.

Personally, I would advise the post-bacc. Of course I'm biased because it totally worked for me. But also consider that a post-bacc is significantly cheaper. My whole postbacc year cost about $9K with in-state tuition at my local state college...a masters would have been like $50K.

They also have this thing called "special masters program" (SMP)..which is basically just a masters specifically tailored for getting into med school. Some of them are even affiliated directly with med schools, and the top % of the class gets an automatic interview or even acceptance at the med school...However if you go the SMP route and then fail to get in, the actual SMP Masters is basically worthless on its own. And again, you can expect to pay like $50K for it.

So yeah, given your GPA, I'd go for a post-bacc...Also, make sure that your postbacc is composed ENTIRELY of BCPM classes (bio, chem, physics, math). That way they also boost your science GPA, which is calculated separately.

Ahh I didn't catch that post of yours OP.

Thanks for the advice. I am quite sad, that AMCA doesn't do grade replacement or else my gpa would be slightly better. Oh well.

How did you explain to your interviewers about your low undergrad GPA? I know I have a chance but mental hurdle with the GPA thing annoys me.

>tfw Canadian
>3.8something GPA
>will probably not even get interviews

Why the fuck is it so hard to get into Canadian med schools?

Yeah man, I know the low GPA mental hurdle all too well. It's an emotional roller coaster for us nontraditional applicants, but you just gotta keep your eyes on the light at the end of the tunnel, even if it looks like just a tiny speck at the moment.

As for how I explained it to my interviewers, I focused on my extenuating circumstances. I'm a first generation college student, so it was sort of a cultural shock for me stepping foot on a college campus and being way less prepared compared to my peers from more privileged backgrounds. That said, I didn't use it as an excuse for a pity party. If you do have an extenuating circumstance like this, just explain it plainly for what it is without making it seem like a pity party...ultimately, I also owned up to the fact that I had poor time management as an underclassmen...but then I pointed to my significant upward trend, especially the year of straight A's and concluded that I had figured out how to work at my potential. Your need to point out how your experience showed resilience and adaptability ultimately.

You get used to it after 3-4 sessions, I was always respectful, the people who donated their bodies gave us the most valuable teaching tool for anatomy out there.
The smell isn't that bad, its formaldehyde. Not the most pleasant but won't make you heave.

And I disagree, most surgeons are bro-tier. I'd watch out more for the autismo internist beta attending who got bullied in highschool and now shits on anyone with any social skills

Why does formaldehyde make me hungry for meat?

>this is what the average person thinks

UFAP + Brosencephalon

Carib med school

>Brosencephalon

I was thinking of making my own set of flash cards based on First Aid. Is this a waste of time?

How far out from the exam date do you recommend starting?

Use Bro's for the STEP. Just use his if your basing your flash cards off of FA, you'd be wasting your precious non-existent time making something that's already been done for you. If you go over something in class, go over his deck on that topic (for example you learn cardio pathology in class; go though Bro's cardio deck)

However, if you need to, make your own cards from your professor's powerpoints for your exams.

But seriously, UFAP should be priority.

Just my 2 cents

Forgot to mention, start UFAP as soon as posible just like said.

Fuck dude, UWorld even has an app for your phone so you can do questions on the bus or on your walk between classes.

Thanks for the advice, man. I'm matriculating this August. I guess I'll try to make a first pass through FA even before orientation...My classmates will hate me if they find out. I'm shamelessly aspiring to be a gunner lol

Anyone have any good books about Medicine to read?

I am about done reading"One Doctor" by Brendan Reilly and it's quite an entertaining read. The patients that he introduces in the book and how he relates them to pertinent medical problems in the U.S are fascinating. This book also confirmed my suspicion that I wouldn't be able to handle the shitstorm that occurs in the E.R.

SMPs are actually my interest, short of that I'd just try to get a second BS. I think I could actually get a BS chem from my Uni in only 15 more credits.

I'm looking at an SMP in human genetics though, one at Tulane. How "useful" the degree is on it's own is my interest though. I am extremely interested in specializing in medical genetics, or being a research-physician in genetics. If an SMP MS helps with that is my interest.

>tfw cramming all the test material a few days before the test
Every fucking time.

Whose dick and how much of it do I need to suck to get into neuro-research?

what a fucking joke

how are you allowed to do this?

>brb taking a post bac year taking bullshit classes to bring my gpa up
>brb applying for math phd

oh wait they actually pull your transcripts and look at your math class grades

are you telling me they actually just glance at your gpa and dont strictly look at only the courses they require?

is this why there are so many stupid doctors?

No need to be so jelly, he's playing the game by the rules.