Ask the Butcher

Flaken style is more for Korean food. Galbi.

Is Ribeye cap worth the money and has the taste of chicken and pig actually changed

Just for your knowledge (and the rest of the board)- when you have a butcher or meat cutter grind your burger special and on the spot, they aren't going to put anything in behind it in order to push all of your meat out the end of the grinder. When this happens, your 2.5 pound roast has now turned into 2.25-2.33 pounds of ground meat because the grinder "eats" some of your product. Without putting something behind that last bit of ground meat, there's not enough pressure to assure that the last of the product will make it out into the tub or tray that we're grinding into.

We're not trying to screw anyone, it's just a fact of the grinding process. It's really often best to just buy the ground meats that are already out there (for everyone's sake). Unless, of course, you have an extreme specialty you're making.

Indeed. I just figured I'd mention it as a "newer" short rib cut because we didn't really have many requests for it at our shop until probably the last three years or so.

I figured since more foodies are starting to saturate the cooking market, it might have more purposes than just some of the Korean dishes. Thanks for the input- I'll keep it under my hat.

In the near future I am going to start raising animals to butcher for myself. Do you know an resources for a noobie to start reading/watching to start? Mostly pigs and chickens if that matters.

Do you ever encounter worms in meat you have to butcher. I know it's super common in fish but I'm not sure how common it is in domesticated farm animals.

Do you think it would be profitable to buy a BUNCH of cut fat, render it down into tallow, and then sell the results, jarred up, at like...a farmers market or something? It's a hobby me and a friend have been bouncing back and forth recently

I could say some of the cliché steaks, such as hanger steak, fillet mignon, or strips/dels- but I'm not going to.

I think my favorite steak for its incredible variety of uses (pan frying, broiling, grilling, marinating for kabobs, etc.) would be the sirloin steak. The full sirloin though- it has to include the sirloin cap steak, or else it's not the same. I guess if I could be really picky, I'd just buy sirloin caps all the time. They have excellent marbling, they're tender, and just like the regular sirloin, it can be cooked in a plethora of ways and styles.

In general though, my ideal steaks are approximately 1 1/4 inches thick (1 1/2 if I'm cooking it to achieve rare in terms of preparedness), the weight is circumstantial depending on the type of cut, I typically cook boneless; as you cannot eat the bone and I rarely have time to make anything useful with my stockpiled bones from eating bone-in steaks. I also make sure to trim of the heavy fats, but I leave a lining of fat on everything I prepare.

Ribeye cap steaks are incredible pieces of meat. Think about the fat swirl you see on the delmonico. The meat above it is what gets chopped off as a ribeye cap steak. It's often done on the small end of the delmonico because the steaks start looking worse on that end. That small end is also where the ribeye fillet steaks are cut from as well... the remainder is put into the grinder.

It depends on what your local pricing is for them though for me to decide if they're worth their (typically high) price. It also matters if you're getting select, choice, or prime meat.

As much as I'd like to say that the flavor of meat has not changed, it has. Chicken that I used to eat when I was younger (yeah, I know "old people and their bs claims") that was raised on local farms tastes a lot different than the chicken does today, and same with the pork. I don't know how to describe the differences, but I can tell you that the meat was better then. Some of the newer (smaller) farms that are producing high quality meats remind me of the meat I ate when I was young though- so the meat can still be delicious. You just have to buy from a reputable source.

Unfortunately, I've never reared my own animals- so I would be useless for you in that particular area. However, I can tell you that an EXCELLENT author to read to learn more about slaughter and processing animals would be Adam Danforth. He has a series of books on the subject and they are incredibly detailed and also include photographs to give you an idea of what you're supposed to be doing. The only problem is that it's incredibly dry, and that I do not know if the knowledge works for people who are green to the profession... I only know that when I read them they were very useful. However, I was already accustomed to most of the ideas in the book when I read it; so I may be partially biased.

(cont. in next post)

checked

thanks user heres a burger I want to fuck

In my opinion, chickens are the easiest animals to learn how to take apart. I would advise starting to learn how to break down whole fryers (they're cheap enough that a few mistakes shouldn't break the bank while you're learning). That's what I stared with, and it's what I think every inexperienced individual that wants to learn how to break down animals should start with.

I have never once encountered worms in any of my products. I know people that have, but our supplier is known for their incredible QA and QC staff. However, due to work-related reasons/interests, I cannot speak much about our suppliers in public. We have an edge on our competition in that area, and I'd hate to lose it.

We have, however, had a few broken vacuum seals.

If you have an area that has a very poor supply of tallow or other rendered fats/greases, and you know for a fact that there are people interested in such a product, it would certainly be a viable area to work at. I know people around here want bacon fat/grease but are too lazy to do it themselves. My buddy used to sell mason jars of it for $20 a piece. I think they were 350-400 mL a piece. Since it only took 3 pounds of bacon to get it, and bacon was only $4 a pound at the time... he was able to eat bacon while still making profits.

Knowing that many butchers and cutters in my area (if it's a full-service shop) will almost GIVE away their fat trimmings so that they don't have to throw them away at the end of the night, there would be a great likelihood that if your market is right for selling tallow that you would be able to make some serious profit with your friend. The most I've seen fat sell for is $.50/lb locally- but I can't guarantee that you'll find the same results where you live...

Where is that burger from?

I work in a meat department as a clerk because I've always been interested in meat, I'm not learning much, but I have two questions. How is a meat cutter separate from a butcher and how do I learn how to split an entire animal? Slaughterhouse work?

>we definitely make sure that our percentages line up before they hit the cases.
How do you know what percentage of fat is in the meat? Is there a special way to measure or weigh it?

What's the most common work related injury you encounter?

What's the worst work related injury you've seen?

Don't really have anything to say or questions to ask but just saying that I'm lurking this thread and the answers are interesting.

Glad to see another person interested in the field. Perhaps someday you'll get a chance to delve into it a little further.

To answer your questions:
1) The difference between a butcher and a meat cutter is simple. The butcher is someone who is able to properly break down entire animals into their respective parts, while then proceeding to turn those parts into steaks, roasts, and other specialty items.

A meat cutter is someone who is able to take sub primal pieces (such as whole fillets) and turn them into the proper steaks and roasts. Most meat cutters are taught how to cut at a store from another meat cutter (much as butchers are taught by other butchers; though typically not in a chain store or grocery store), and only know how to cut pieces from the boxes their store gets in.

It's sort of like the mathematical rule of "all squares are rectangles, but not all rectangles are squares". All butchers are meat cutters, but not all meat cutters are butchers.

2) If you're interested in learning whole animal butchery, I would advise looking for a local shop to see if you're able to shadow their butcher. Make sure it is a traditional butcher shop. You might have to offer to do menial tasks for free in order for him to want to help you. The trade isn't as popular as it used to be, and it's certainly as important as ever... make sure they know you're serious, and that you are willing to put in the time. They might give it to you.

Your other option would be a slaughterhouse- though most people don't have the stomach for it for too long... most will try to get onto the boning line or the processing line as quickly as possible.

In the olden days, beef percentages were *literally* decided by the butcher as he cut his meat. Whether or not the percentages were at all accurate, however, was another thing entirely.

In the modern world of boxed meats and prepackaged meats, most stores put out their product based on what the machines have told them their product should be labeled as. That's why you see so many of those 3 pound "tubes" of 81/19 or 75/25, etc.

It's also why almost every pack at Giant, Wal-Mart, and other large chains have almost the exact same measurement and appearance. I can all but guarantee that they're shipped in to their location prepackaged autonomously; all but completely by machine for their ground meats.

In my present shop, we have meats that are SPECIFICALLY for grinding. That way there's never any confusion as to what percentage you're dealing with. The box of meat shows up as "88% or higher" (or whatever the meat is supposed to be). At that point, we trim anything that appears unnatural, and we throw the meat into the grinder. This way we're sure that they're getting at least the percentage they're paying for.

There's still some guesswork, unfortunately, but it's almost completely cut out.

Thanks for your interest. If you think of something, feel free to post. I'll answer whatever I can honestly and as thoroughly as you'd like.

I knew someone would ask these questions eventually, so here we are.

Common work related injuries: Hand, wrist, knuckle, finger, and arm punctures/cuts from our knives. The other possibly common (though much worse) injuries that could be encountered are cuts from the bandsaw.

Of these, I only see light slices on a somewhat regular basis- though I've actually seen three hands go into the bandsaw during my time cutting meat. Only one was lucky enough to be married and have his wedding band save him from *serious* injury. Another individual lost function of part of his hand because he managed to nick part of the tendon that allows for bending the finger...

The worst injury I've actually seen... that's a tough one. I'll start by saying that some of the training videos I've endured were absolutely mind-bogglingly horrid. I saw a human being fall into an industrial grinder when either the support rail failed or he slipped on uncleaned blood (I forget which). They managed to stop the grinder before he died, but he had numerous broken bones, and either one of his hands or his feet was starting to pass through the blades- I remember seeing his limb peeled and some of it was missing down to the bone... Luckily I never saw it live-action with anyone I knew. That kind of shit is mortifying.

(cont. in next post)

>Where is that burger from?
I have no idea, but I would assume heaven

Is pork a meme?

(You)

The worst accident I saw in person while on the clock was one of the following: when someone dropped his knife and tried to catch it while he was turning- he caught the knife, but bumped into the table beside him; thus running probably a third of the blade into his stomach (he weakly stated "hah, I caught it" upon doing so). He had to get emergency treatment and was sent to the hospital. He made a full recovery, but started wearing a metal vest after that.

Situation two was when someone cut off an entire portion of one of their digits on the saw. The blade was probably old, the bone was thicker than normal on the piece he was working with, and he was also tired from working part of someone else's shift the night before to help out the department. Triple setup for disaster, let me tell you. He was about half way through cutting the piece and he started to scream a blood curdling sound. We looked over to see him thrusting his hip and his free hand toward the emergency cut off switch. None of us were close enough to save him from what happened next, and it haunted one person into leaving.

We knew what was going to happen, because his hand became caught underneath the piece of meat that he was working with and it was only a matter of moments before the saw would pull him in (it's hard to understand how quickly this happens unless you've been there before). Since the meat was being pinned to the cutting table and the bade won't stop until about 2-3 seconds after the kill switch is pressed, we knew it was going to be a medical emergency from the git-go. In the end, he cut through one and a half fingers. He was rushed out, but not before he passed out and collapsed onto the floor. Shit gives you nightmares my friends. Every now and again I still see it when I go to bed at night...

Here's hoping none of you end up having that dream now that I've told the tale.

Pork can be delicious. It really can. Most of the people I know that make great pork are making pulled pork or pork BBQ. However, the best pork I've ever had was made using a technique called larding. Basically, the person preparing the meat cuts off the fat as per normal. However, once it's trimmed off, they keep it off to the side so they can render it down and later inject that same fat back into the meat they've cut it off of. It helps make for an incredibly juicy and delicious cut.

Bacon is probably one of America's favorite meats. More rather, pork-based bacon is probably one of America's favorite meats. Then again, most any piece of charcuterie that's properly made is delicious...

What meat do I want for good beef jerky on dehydrator?

It can indeed be delicious but I feel it is inferior to beef in almost any application. In your experience would you say that most pork is bought by coloreds?

My mom used to buy something called Porterhouse steaks... apparently they're some kind of highly expensive novelty? What are they?

What is your opinion of meat glue?

What is your favorite non-meat dish?

Never heard of meat glue until now.

How can I make sure I don't buy any... glued meat? I'm in Canada.

I also would like to know the answer to this.

What do you use chicken necks and backs for... i just use them for stock i was wondering what other uses i could get from them..thx

Good grief user...that is brutal. Trapped under the piece of meat he was working on? How does that happen? Just from the pure weight?

Not OP, but I used to work as a meat cutter.

You can use any lean cut for jerky/biltong, but the best options are eye of round and top round. Flank steak is interesting as jerky too but more expensive. Most commonly in your local grocery store you'll find eye of round roasts and thick slices of top round (aka "London Broil") - buy the eye of round if you want to easily slice the meat with the grain, the top round if you want to cut it across the grain.

Technically a "porterhouse" is a thick T-bone steak cut from the round end of the loin, where the tenderloin portion of the steak is biggest, but sometimes you'll see "porterhouse" used as generic name for any t-bone.

Primals are bulky and have odd shapes, and you have to manhandle them into position on the bandsaw table, then slide them through the saw blade. I would assume the guy had his hand under the meat while getting it into position, and in his tired state automatically pushed the meat forward into the saw without thinking...

The answer to your question is going to be bottom round or top round cuts. When I used to make jerky when I was younger, I'd buy a whole bottom flat (or outside flat; whichever it is called locally for you). I'd make sure to trim off all of the exterior fat, and then I'd cut my meats into long jerky strips. Typically 1 1/2 inches wide and 6 inches long. The thickness depends on what you're looking for out of your jerky, but typically isn't more than 1/4-1/3 of an inch.

I think that beef (like its cost suggests) is almost always the superior cut as well. However, certain things are better with pork depending on what you're making for dinner. The association with any race and purchasing rates would be debunked at my store, as I'd assume at least 60% of our customers are caucasian; and many of them frequently purchase pork.

Porterhouse (and t-bone) steaks are delicious steaks that come off of the shortloin of the animal. The reason these steaks are so incredible is because it is made up of fillet mignon steak (the more circular-shaped side) and new york strip steak separated by a bone. I call porterhouses beef surf and turf. I wouldn't say they're a novelty, as they're frequently a showpiece in our cases and are frequently purchased by customers for their dinners.

I've never had any experience with meat glue personally. I'll ask around with a few friends to see if I can get you a little more information on the subject. Sorry I'm not more help as of present user.

My favorite non-meat dish would probably be macaroni and cheese because it was a comfort food for me when I was a child and our family didn't have any money. During those times, it was a luxury item for us...

I'm not sure how I can help you with this; but I'll look into it user.

I have only used chicken backs for stock- but I know people that use chicken necks and backs as bait in their crab pots. People who line fish for crabs also use necks for their bait for their hooks. From what I've been told, they work quite well.

What says is true. Manhandling is a daily requirement, and if you're too tired to think properly, it's not uncommon to run into concerns. It was an unusually large shortloin that he was working with, and the bone was also larger than usual. He had taken the chine bone off and had just faced the meat so he could get his square cuts. I'm not 100% sure how he managed to pin himself under it, but since shortloins are in a sort of rounded triangle shape, my guess is that he tried to put it through the saw backward and ended up having it roll back onto him. There's more than one way to cut everything, but there's typically one way that most people use for a good reason... The weight makes it difficult to get out from under a piece quickly, but the pinching action of the saw is what makes it dangerous.

Thanks for the assist bro. Legit information.

I know flanks are used for jerky some places, but I can't see using such an expensive piece for most people's usage. I'd never used an eye of round for jerky- but it's lean, so it makes sense.

-
I'm headed out for the night, but I'll be back tomorrow morning to answer more questions that you have Veeky Forums.

Thank you to you both--this has been a high quality thread.

Can i make a special request for ground beef at different lean/fat percentages than what is found in the tubes?

Terrific thread, thank you The Butcher!

Aldi sell bacon offcuts for super cheap here.

What the fuck are they?

What do you call the cut of the front legs of the lamb in English?

First and foremost, thank you for your service.

a few things.

Nice trips.

When speaking in Terms of Ribeyes and ribeye caps, Where does the delmonico come into play? I have always been told that the Delmonico is a thick cut boneless Ribeye, but correct me if I am wrong.

Do you have any thoughts about a Denver steak or the cut in its self?

I also completely understand what you mean about things not tasting the same anymore, The lack of flavor in things and quality of texture is something that I have noticed over time. In terms of steak, I try to buy Prime/Choice because I feel like select doesn't necessarily have the flavor I want. I notice when I don't buy Chicken and pork from High quality producers it literally tastes of nothing.

This is me.

I've also gotten into arguments with guests when we feature a 30 Oz shared Porterhouse in regards to the non tenderloin side, the argument always presents its self with people saying that the Striploin side is actually a Sirloin. I've always insisted that it is indeed a Striploin/Filet. Am I wrong?

gulash and chicken aside, I've never made a soup with meat.
What's the best meat I can make a soup with?

Is leaf lard popular enough that a butcher would just have it out for sale or is it something I should call ahead about?

leaf fat*
I'd like to render it into lard, duh

why do they cut out the meat between ribs in a 'V'? the grocery store sells 'beef ribs' missing a bunch of the most delicious meat.

The butcher is in.

My pleasure. I'm glad I could be of assistance.

Depending on whether or not your shop is a full-service location or if you only have prepackaged meats, the answer would vary. Some meat departments (believe it or not) do not own grinders or meat cutters; only shelf stockers.

So long as your request is made somewhere where grinding is a possibility and a meat cutter is on duty (not the cleaners/stockers/etc.), you should be able to ask for a certain mixture. Typically it's easy to figure out 75/25, 80/20, 85/15, 90/10, and 93/7. 96/4 is possible, but most people have never ground it; which adds to the level of difficulty procuring it.

I'm also not sure how your pricing would vary at your local stores. I know we have PLUs for 80, 85, 90, 93, and 96 at my store- but I don't know many stores that have so many options.

My pleasure user.

Bacon offcuts are essentially non-perfectly formed bacon pieces that also have a varying level of quality associated with them. You'd need to pick through the lot to find the best bacon; but for its price, it's typically not a bad deal. Typically bacon offcuts/cooking bacon/bacon scrap is the leftover bits from after the whole side of bacon has been cut down. I've never seen it or used it, but I have heard of it before. Hope that helps.

If I'm understanding your question correctly, it's the foreshank. I'll attach a picture so we're on the same page.

Ah, sorry. I should have specified more earlier. Delmonico and ribeye are more or less interchangeable terms. Typically ribeye delineates that the bone is still attached/included and delmonico often refers to the boneless variety of steak. Thickness does not matter for these cuts though.

The Denver steak/underblade steak is a pretty decent piece of meat. When it was first 'discovered' it took the culinary world by storm (in a few areas, at least). It is a well marbled cut, and it has good flavor. I've been told the most applicable thickness for the Denver steak to be cooked properly is between 3/4 of an inch to an inch thick. The secret to the piece (that most people don't talk about) is that it comes from the chuck roll. The chuck section is relatively inexpensive, but every Denver steak I've seen sold was pretty expensive considering... However, the market will always dictate the price- especially if it's a trendy steak.

If you haven't had one, give it a shot sometime. It's always worth a taste. If you like it, you could always get more. If not, at least you've had it.

The piece that comprises your porterhouses and t-bone steaks is called the shortloin. The shortloin is fillet meat (beef tenderloin) and new york strip meat (beef striploin) separated by bone. You are correct in this matter.

However, there is a divide in the meat where the steak is no longer called a porterhouse, and is considered to be a t-bone steak. If you cut the entire shortloin into 30oz steaks, there are going to also be some 30oz t-bones; which sometimes causes a ruckus with customers. A steak aficionado will know quickly when they have a t-bone vs. a porterhouse. It all has to do with the size of the fillet medallion on the other side of the bone. I don't have a chart on my computer to show where the divide is, but it's kind of up to the person preparing the meat for sale. Just make sure there's enough fillet for the customer to not complain.

If you're in the mood for ham and green beans, a ham hock (ham shank) is a great piece of meat to add in. It's a smoked piece of pork that will add some meat to the pot, but will also add a large portion of flavor to your soup.

The meat added to a soup is typically an economically priced item so that you're not "wasting steaks" for something that is traditionally an inexpensive meal. I guess if you're doing a beef vegetable soup you could use some bottom round or chuck meat. Chuck roast would be stringy and pull apart when it's cooked right; whereas the bottom round will break apart, but it will often break into more of chunks than stringy bits.

My friend's Italian/Greek grandmother used to make lamb and veal soups. You'd have to watch the seasoning on that though or it will overpower the delicate (though savory) flavors of these meats.

Basically anything you want as a meat can go into your soup so long as it's meeting the requirement of what you're trying to make for your soup.

Sorry it's not worded better or answered more concise- I'm just not sure of a better way to answer your question user.

Leaf lard is a baker's dream. However, most meat shops you go into (unless it's a real butcher shop) would not have leaf fat available. It's the fat that comes from the "flare" (as it is sometimes called) of fat located around the kidneys (and some by the loin) of the pig. If your shop works with carcasses, call ahead and ask them to save some for you. They'll often be glad to do so, because most times the fat gets tossed out or some gets put into ground pork. Lard in general doesn't sell as well as it used to where I'm from- so the butchers haven't been as keen to try to save fat to render it...

If you call a regular store, they'll tell you "Sure thing! We'll get some of that fat for you"- but it is likely they'll give you typical pork fat trim rather than the leaf fat you're looking for... Most meat depts. honestly don't know the difference.

My store doesn't do that. We rarely end up with beef ribs, but when we do, we're separating the baby back ribs from the rib section of the animal- so we'll try to cut as close as we can to the bone, but there's no point in cutting between ribs to try to take additional meat off the bottom.

I only have two guesses as to why you are seeing what you are: 1) inexperienced cutters/apprentice learner; or 2) the store is maximizing their profits by collecting as much meat as they can in order to grind it for meat later. Some stores offer prime rib burger meat as a specialty. If your store is one that does this, that is probably why they're cutting out extra meat from your ribs.

Those are really my only guesses for you though. We don't try to take meat off the ribs at my shop- we just cut them as is. Sometimes the cutters get yelled at by management because there's "too much del meat" on the ribs. We want customers to be happy though, so we're not screwing with their products. They pay a fair price for the goods- so in return, we need to provide fair service.

> I'm just not sure of a better way to answer your question user
you answered it just right, thanks man, cheers

Hello Mr. Butcher. I have a question. Is this a fucked up thing to do? Or am I sticking it to the man?

>be me, poorfag, who works a LOT
>go to King Soopers
>get like 10 lbs of steak and 10 lbs of ribs
>go to self checkout
>hit the veggie button and click potato
>it asks me to weigh the potatoes
>put steaks on instead
>now click banana
>weigh ribs instead
>total bill like 5.00$
>leave with my potato steaks and banana ribs
>tell coworkers and bosses let's have a BBQ at the park
>I'll bring steak and ribs
>you guys bring beer and cooler and charcoal grill
>winning?
>or total douchebag?

What's the best way to ask an American butcher for a specialty cut that's not generally available in the US? You guys either use it for mince or separate the cut among several primals. Do I have to buy a quarter for you to be willing to cut it out for me?
See pic related. I want number 7. It's an "inside" muscle, beneath 5 and 6.
I don't mind buying a shank and splitting 8 and 9 out myself (8 makes the best fucking potroast you'll ever have, ever), but 7 seems like it would be a hassle to ask a butcher here for because you don't have nearly as many primals as we do.

What's the difference between Choice, Prime and Angus.
Also is there a different rating system for grass fed beef?
I went to this organic market and they had all grass fed beef. I asked if it was choice or prime and they just said how it was "grass fed" and better than normal beef.

I hunt and and my dad and I butcher our own deer. basically we just go at it, and it seems to be a fairly self-evident process. we can usually strip a deer down and have all the cuts out in like 2 hours. are there any general tips you can give? it honestly seems almost too easy and we get almost as much meat as if we sent it to a professional

Cheers.

Essentially it's a shit move because it's what forces up prices on every item in stores across the country. The technical loophole you've used is one of the areas studied under the "loss prevention" caption. The person near the self checkout should have caught it, but they didn't (likely due to many younger employees not really caring about anything aside from their paycheck).

While legal recourse for such an action at this point is unlikely, know that in doing what you did (and many other people attempt to do or manage to do as well) the store will eventually charge more money per pound for the items they've "leaked". In the end, all the prices in the store will start to rise due to people doing exactly what you have done even though the price to obtain the item hasn't really gone up.

Some American butchers would be able to help you out if you give them specifics- especially if they own their own shop or it's a traditional butcher shop. The problem is that most shops that employ meat cutters and butchers do not have hanging meat... this cuts down on their ability to assist you in such a specialized cut.

I am accustomed to seeing charts similar to this; but I cannot say that I've ever actually needed to create any of the cuts from the South American charts or the European charts I've read (looks like an Italian chart that you've provided).

I think the main problem in the US would not be finding a butcher that would be willing to help you, but it would actually be finding a butcher that would understand how to deviate from his traditional cutting methods in order to procure the muscle groups you're looking for.

what the fuck answer are you expecting from this. you dont have to be a professional butcher to be able to tell you that you're a thieving fuck.

In your first question two of the three terms you've used are grading specific. It also depends on what country your meat has come from. I'll attach a very simple grading chart for Canada vs the US grading system for a brief example.

Basically- the higher the grade of the steak, the more fat it has inside of the muscle clods. This is called marbling. The grading from highest to lowest is as follows (for US meats). Prime +, Prime, Choice, Select, Standard, Canning.

Prime has an abundant amount of fat inside of it and it allows for extremely tender, flavorful, and juicy meats.

Choice has a good bit of marbling, and allows for very tender and fairly flavorful meat.

Grading on the whole, however, is extremely complicated to explain- so if you have more questions, ask and I'll see what I can do.

As for your second question, I am unaware of any special grading system that applies specifically to grass-fed beefs. While it may exist, I am unaware of it based on the lack of demand for grass-fed beef where I am located. Sorry I am not of further assistance in this matter.

The reasoning behind organic markets saying "it's grass-fed" is because it's a very specific diet for the animal and it changes some of the growth aspects of the meat and its flavor. Typically, grass-fed meats are *very lean* meats- so I'm sure they didn't want to scare you away by saying "it's select grade!". While the meat is less marbled, it is often still tender (so long as you don't overcook it). The current market for grass-fed and organic beef is the lack of hormones and chemicals- so the price will be higher regardless of their grading.

It's great that you and your father process your own meats. The general concept of removing meat from bone and cutting into roasts/steaks is a pretty simple task, it's true. However, deer processing is much less complicated than processing a beef, pig, etc.

With deer, you are only worried about extracting your venison. There are backstraps, steaks, and roasts. For beef, there are certain ways that each muscle clod interacts with each other to allow for certain cuts to be made. If you wanted to get super critical about it, you could make venison t-bone steaks, venison porterhouses, venison delmonico steaks, etc. However, that's typically not what people end up doing when they're processing game.

The amount of meat is likely to be similar to what you'd get when you take it to a professional, but the way the meat is cut and the type of steaks/roasts you get may differ. It's possible that you and your father have been experienced in the art for so long that it could yield similar results to going to a butcher to process your animal- which would be wonderful.

Were there any areas in particular with the processing that you would like some tips on? The picture related is a terrible representation of what I do; but I was trying to teach a friend more about processing his game. He wanted to do the bone cuts, so he brought out a traditional wood saw... the cuts might be a little haggard as well due to me directing him on how to cut without doing much of the work myself. That being said, his garage was also not the best place to be working on processing an animal.

Anywho- let me know if there's anything in particular about processing your deer you're interested in and I'll do what I can to help you out.

yo butch, best threads on ck.
What kind of cut do you use for burgers, i always add extra fat to chuck, which seems to be more fat than most people do.
Also whats an alright price for oxtails? My butcher quadrupled the price in the last 3 years and i feel sad and kinda ripped of, to the point that i dont buy it anymore.

I cant think of anything in particular. we just hang it by the leg and go at it with filet knives. I guess any suggestions about what to do with the meat afterwards or what to do with the body itself at any stage to help the meat taste good would be nice. usually we do it outside in late fall in a garage so its pretty fucking cold the whole 4-5 hours it takes from shooting it to having everything cut up.
any suggestion on fat in the cuts? venison is lean as fuck and my dad usually cuts excess fat off because he loves lean cuts

Thanks user. I try to help when I can.

As far as your burgers go, I tend to think chuck burgers and brisket burgers are two of the better choices as far as fat to meat and flavor are concerned. Whole briskets can get pretty fatty; but if you like that extra fat, leave it in.

Most people like 80-88% for their burgers. Some people like 73-75% for theirs. It's all how you like them to taste and if you don't mind paying for that fat.

The oxtails are an interesting predicament. Even book pricing for a regular grocery store has gone up in the past few years. I used to see tails for $1.99/lb years ago, now they're closer to $5.00/lb. The pricing book guidelines say to sell them at $6.00-6.50/lb; but some areas are higher and some are lower based on the demands for oxtail. Real butcher shops often are similarly priced, though some are lower due to actually having the tails in stock at their shop.

What's your local asking price lately?

One tip I can give you is that you should let your deer hang for a day or two before you butcher it. Leave the skin on, but make sure it's dressed before hanging it. If it's not cold outside and you don't have a cool area to store it during that time, then you are forced to cut it up the same day. The principle behind letting it sit out is that the deer tenses up when it gets killed. The muscles will relax due to natural enzymes in the meat within a day or two after it has expired. The rigor mortis effect will definitely leave you with less tender steaks, so if it's possible (cold enough or cooler to leave it in), let it hang for a bit before working on it.

For ground venison (if you do any), throw in some beef fat while you're grinding it out. That will help keep the burger together while cooking and will give just a little more juice and flavor to it.

(continued in next post)

I would leave fat on the cuts if you can. Think about how the beef steaks keep an outside trim of fat. That's ideal for cooking- if you can do it with your cuts, it would benefit your dining experience. Venison is already hard enough to come by, it might as well be cooked right and prepped right (right?).

Lean cuts do seem to be something that almost everyone seems to be interested in right now. I've had people turn down our prime meats because they think they're "too fatty". I think my favorite was "look at how fatty that is- there's even fat inside the steak. You can't expect someone to want to buy THAT!". Fat is flavor, friends.

I usually cut off to head right before I start working on the carcass. It's no fun to take a boney-ass head to the balls (depending on your hanging height). I then like to section out my animals. However, if you haven't been trained traditionally, I recommend starting with your tenderest cuts- the backstrap. Make sure you stay right with the bone and pull the meat with your opposing hand while you're cutting it. Some of the meat should pull itself away from the bone while you're working. Don't pull too hard though, or you can shear your meat...

Ok guys I have to leave now. Talk to you soon!

nice exit dubs. thanks mang. people like you are why Veeky Forums is one of the least shitty boards out here

Haha fuck you.

Yeah... that's not even how I sign off. I guess I'm just going to have to use my old tripcode. Thanks for ruining the fun.

Sorry for the imposter user.

ItaliAnon again.
There are many butcher shops in my area that break down sides themselves. The nicer ones do it in the back but the ones I go to with reasonable prices have the bonesaws and shit right behind the counter and can cut things to order, but only US and Chinese cuts. They grab a quarter from the back, put it up on the block and go to town.

The ones which cut to order either balk at the question or tell me to buy the whole quarter for them to cut the meat for me as I'd like. The one fancy shmancy place I've asked won't do it at all because they 'cut all their meat before store opening' and only go in the back to run things through the mincer. You can see the carcasses hanging in the back from the counter, so I know they technically /can/ cut one for me, but I don't want to press them if they already gave me a lolnope response.

The cheaper butchers are great for shanks, though, IIRC $3.19/lb whole or $4.49/lb deboned, last I went. They cost nearly double at the supermarket and over double at the fancy butcher.

my butcher is asking around 23$/kg, though i live in germany and beef tends to be more expensive than in the us. Its still a ridiculous price for a cut thats half bone. It seems to be the only "cheap" cut that got hyped to a point where its unaffordable.
Butcher is mid-high range but not as expensive as biological/pretentious butchers and generally has alright prices

That's almost $11 per pound; rough rate. Sorry to hear the price is getting too darn high. I'm not sure why the prices have risen so much. I would love to travel to Germany someday. I guess I'll have to make sure I have enough money sitting around before I try to get fresh meats and produce...

(Your trips have also been checked, friend)

We do largely US cuts and a few Chinese/Korean cuts at my store. I know we'd have trouble doing the Italian cuts justice, so I can understand why your butchers might not be willing to do it. Sucks that it works that way though. It would almost be a waste to get an entire quarter so that you could get a few cuts you wanted and then the rest would have to be used for other purposes.

Then again, if you use enough meat to do so and have a chest freezer and a food saver, you might be able to make out alright doing that (of course, funds would have to also be willing).

That's not too bad for shank meat! Ours is a little more expensive than that at our place. Good stuff.

That being said- the butcher is out as I do have a few errands to run. I'll answer any additional questions when I return.

Thanks for your patience, your questions, your stories, and your conversations Veeky Forums. I look forward to answer more questions later.

Is flanken ribs supposed to have bone fragments in it? Is that the fault of the saw or are you supposed to wash it after buying.?

desu it gives the wrong impression, meat and fish is generally very affordable in germany, i think we have the lowest foodcosts in central/western europe. I also get very nice quality stuff for cheap at my turkish butcher (t-bone steak thats seen some dry storage for ~18$ /kg) which makes the price for oxtails even more ridiculous. but yeah, dont worry too much about the prices for food in germany, its def on the cheap side for europe and much cheaper than the us besides for beef/mexican ingredients/and certain types of seafood.
The city i live in has particulary harsh differences in prices, oktoberfest is starting soon where you pay ~13$ for a 1l glass of beer, while you get a case of 20 0.5l bottles in the supermarket for the same price...such is life in munich.

>I've seen leg quarters drop as low as ~$.60/lb f

I'm in flyover, TN; we get thighs/leg quarters for 50-75cents/lb all yearl........yeeeeeeeeeehawwwwwwwwwwwwww!

it's true that mobsters force you to smuggle human corpses for beef?

Idk... The professional butcher gave me a much more thorough and detailed answer than you did... I will sleep well at night now knowing that you are paying more for your chicken whilst I feast on banana ribs and white onion King crab :) sticking it to the mother fucking man.

this comprehensive guide should answer all your questions user

youtube.com/watch?v=cDESuffIWxQ

>the man
>capitalism is a singular targetable identity.
god damn I hope you get caught and arrested for being an idiot.

This might be a question that you can't really answer, but I was wondering why I can't get any tritip in Texas? It's extremely easy to find in commiefornia, but it's difficult to find here unless you special order it. Is it just a matter of supply/demand?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tri-tip

It's a native cut. Guess it's not popular elsewhere for some reason.

Butcher noob, here.

Do you supply natural casing for sausages? What do I ask for? ...Intestine?

And can you give me bones with a little meat on it for making stock? What do I ask for?

What the hell is a delmonico?

Hmm.. That sounds like an unfortunate situation. I haven't seen any bone fragments in my flanken-style ribs before. Perhaps I've overlooked them? I'll take a look at our service case tomorrow just to double check that we're not experiencing the same instances.

To the best of my knowledge, that can happen when the short ribs aren't handled properly; but it can also happen if the blade isn't the correct blade or if the blade on the bandsaw isn't sharp enough. Instead of cutting it, it's more-rather tearing it apart; which would shower your meat with bone debris/dust. The other possibility is that they didn't dust their ribs before they sent them out to the case. We have bone keys (dusters, etc.) that we use that help us to clear off excess bone material from a piece before we send it out. If the flanken-style rib had bone dust on it, we'd definitely key it before we sent it out.

If you don't hear anything more from me on the matter, it's something your butcher might be forgetting or looking over before sales.

I'm glad to hear that. Essentially all of my relatives immigrated over from Germany generations ago. I'd love to see each of the places where my bloodline came from sometime.

I'll be enjoying my Oktoberfest here- but I know it isn't the same as you'll be experiencing. I have a few steins sitting around, and my father has some of the old-fashioned hand-painted/carved flip-top ones. They're absolutely gorgeous. Too bad he doesn't let them out of the house for drinking events!

Lucky. That's pretty awesome! Like I've said before- it's incredible how much the prices can change around the US... I bet beef in North and South Dakota is cheap as dirt too!

Hah. If that happens, it's not in my precinct/locality- so I couldn't tell you anyway. Though, I guess that's what I'd have to say too if I was being forced by the mob to keep it all on the down low...

You can get tri-tip at HEB, I get it all the time, you might have to ask at the counter. If you're near New Braunfels they sell it at Granziens for next to nothing.

>(he weakly stated "hah, I caught it" upon doing so)
Picturing this scene is hilarious to me.
I am glad to hear he made a full recovery, though.

Brisket is definitely good for jerky. It's hard to accept having to spend $7.00/lb for jerky though. Some people like to use flank steak for it too- but again, it's expensive around here; so I can't imagine spending $9.00/lb for jerky.

Some people use their ovens on a low temp for hours with the door cracked, some people use different tools like the Nu-Wave, and some people use traditional dehydrators. In my opinion, jerky should be DRY; I'm not much into the 'wet/moist jerky' scene.

As has mentioned, the cut isn't popular everywhere in the US. It's typically a California, New York, and high-tier restaurant cut. Some meat cutters on the East Coast wouldn't even know where it is located to remove it from the animal. Most new-age cutters know though because people special order it. I also know that some stores will sell you sirloin cap steak and call it ti-tip because they don't have any on hand to sell you... It's layered in an area close to the top butt sirloin and the sirloin tip.

It's not necessarily supply and demand, but the demand is low in quite a few states- so they don't often pull in that cut specifically in meat departments for meat cutters to work with. I'd guess that's why it's expensive/hard to find in quite a few locations in the US.

Some shops will sell you casings for sausage. Depending on what kind of sausage you're making (or if you're making grillers instead of traditional rope), you might need a different type of casing. For rope sausage, especially for pork, I recommend getting natural hog casing. For grillers, I recommend getting collagen casing if you can.

They're often expensive though if the shop doesn't normally sell them. I think my old shop used to sell the natural hog casings for $20/lb- people definitely paid it though. I guess that supply and demand struggle is real.

(continued in next post)

If you're looking for bones with meat on them for making your stock, I would recommend getting shank meat. It comes from the foreshank section of the animal (essentially it's front leg just about where it connects to the shoulder) and has a good piece of bone in the center and a bunch of muscle surrounding it. The meat is often used for stewing meat because it is generally tough (think of the general labor those muscles had to do every day), and the bone has a some marrow in it for your stock. The best bone for stock, in my opinion, is the marrow bone (femur). The knuckle bone works well too, but the marrow bone oozes with that delicious marrow- especially if you want to use marrow as a spread for your toast or other bread (it's a thing, trust me). However, if you're looking for that extra bit of meat, get shank meat. You can combine marrow bones and shank meat too if you need to.

The name delmonico is interchangeable with ribeye. Typically the bone-in steak is called a ribeye steak, and the boneless variation is called a del/delmonio/boneless del/delmonico.

So if you love your ribeye steaks, you'll love delmonico steaks too.

Yeah- it's funny looking back on it.

The floor head thought he said "huh... I ate it"- but they asked him at the hospital and he said "I figured the day was ruined, so I should at least try to make everyone laugh"; he confirmed "hah, I caught it" was what he said (or at least tried to say- it was hard to understand him with his shocked breathing and stuttering).

We did have to shut down the shop for part of the day though to have a professional sanitation crew come through the room to remove the "biologically hazardous material(s)" from the room. Sucked. When they came in the said something about "I don't even know why we do this- they deal with blood all day and the inspectors are never upset with them, they might as well have cleaned it themselves and saved the money". Such is life though.

Scraps on dry age.., can you render it down?

Would you know where to find a good butcher in the North Dallas area? I usually go to mexican markets to get cuts that I want.

Theoretically, yes. You can definitely render down fat from dry aged meat- though I've never done it myself. I've also heard from some that you need to make sure that you've got the exterior layer of it trimmed off incase there is bacterial growth that remains on your fat. However, if you're cooking it down and completely rendering it... I don't see why that wouldn't kill those bacteria.

We get POUNDS of dry aged fat trimmings every 5 weeks; though we don't ever sell any, render any down, or do anything else with it other than let it hit the bin.

I've been told the dry aged fat tastes a lot different than regular beef fat though once it's rendered down for cooking purposes. I can't say it from experience though.

Unfortunately, I don't have any sort of connections out in the Dallas area. I have a relative in Texas, but one of his neighbors has a cattle farm- so he just gets his beef from about a mile down the road from his buddy.

Sorry user.

I'm totally ignorant when it comes to cuts of the more-expensive meats. My family only ever had deli meats (sliced ham, turkey, hotdogs) when I was growing up. As an adult, I buy and cook chicken ($2/lb) and cheap fish ($3/lb) for myself. I've never had a steak, not even in a restaurant (I'm frugal and unadventurous).

Here's my question (imagine I'm like an alien visiting earth, because when it comes to this subject, I'm not far off): what is it about these cuts of meats that results in them selling for $10-30+ per pound? Why do people buy them over cheaper options? Is it taste? Texture? Status? What am I missing out on as a poor/cheap-ass eater?

I would say there's a lot of things that drive people to spend large sums of money per pound to get their steaks.

First, a good steak tastes absolutely delicious. Adding some light herbal combinations and some citrus can really bring out the best in some of them too. A salty rub could also bring forth some incredible flavors with a good steak as well.

The tender texture of a higher grade steak is also appetizing to many consumers. Being able to bite down and have the meat fall into your mouth before your teeth have even touched is a remarkable sensation.

The status symbol of serving steaks to guests is also a crowd pleaser. It shows people that you're not afraid to spend money on their enjoyment as well as your own. For this reason, high grade steaks around here are often used as a social meal. You invite your book club, golf club, friends you want to impress, etc. over for a night of delicious steaks and impressive sides. Pairing with wine or a fine craft beer will often draw favor your way as well.

All of this being said, families still buy steaks for just themselves- it's not solely an upper-class schmoozie type item. Just the other night I had a customer come in and say they needed five 2-inch center cut fillet mignons because their son was turning 8. The kid probably won't even remember the meal, nor is it likely to be a turning point in his life- even though the father spent over $100 for those steaks for the special occasion.

The important thing to remember is that whether it's for a special occasion, for celebration, for a social gathering, or just because you feel like eating steak, you're spending a lot of money (typically) to treat yourself and enjoy your dinner beyond what you can often do with lesser cuts.

Of course, as a butcher I'll be the first one to tell you that as long as you know how to cook, you can make just about any cut of meat delicious...

I have a question.
How would you go about breaking down a human carcass for consumption, if you had to do it? Step by step, and how would you grade the ccuts, what would you use them for?
Hypothetical of course. ;^)

this is too interesting to pass up.