Math grad student AMA. end of semester free time hollaaaaaaaaaaa (until monday at 8am)

Could you sketch out how you got into grad school? Specifically, anything special you did outside of standard course-passing?

Secondary question: do you have a favourite (math) book? What is it?

How can you not find it as entertaining when you haven't seen it? Please do not respond.

I did very well in coursework as an undergrad and got in touch with professors often. Taking practically every class I could from the math and physics departments didn't hurt. I also worked at my university tutoring math for a couple years as well. If I were applying to a top 10 then I'd want REUs, research experience with professors, classes that are in line with the work you want to do, and so on. We can talk about this more if you give some more information and goals.

>Secondary question: do you have a favourite (math) book? What is it?
One book, oh man. Oh man. Baby rudin The content is whatever, it's just a concise undergrad analysis book. My experience with it was great, though (it was my first "math" book in undergrad).

shiiiiiiit grammer police got me. Hadn't* sorry officer.

They do that in my uni. In the first year of grad school, they forced us to take varied classes during the first semester (commutative algebra, intro to stochastic processes, functional analysis, differential geometry) before we could start specializing.
During the second semester, we had a wider range of classes, both pure (riemann surfaces, riemannian geometry, algebraic geometry, algebraic number theory, logic) and applied (PDE, probability, statistics)

I ask because I'd like to continue studying math past my undergraduate. I'm fairly confident ability-wise, and my grades are good, but I'm an autist and I do jack shit outside of class.

Really I guess I'm looking for advice on making connections with my math department.
I never have any reason to contact any of them and I can't imagine showing up at office hours just to suck dick would be very effective.

Yes there's a bunch! See It's a good idea to at least taste all areas, in my opinion. The above user's uni is great for forcing that. I thought I was going to be a pure guy until I did a bunch of dynamical systems, PDE, and applied work in physics.

I SAID not to respond. Please do not respond.

I feel you, I was there not long ago. I'd STRONGLY recommend going to talk to your professors during their office hours. Check out their specialties and see if any line up with what you're interested in. Ask if there's any work you can do for him research-wise. Some people you ask will be dicks. Others would LOVE to help you out. Trust me. I got my ass saved more than once by just saying hey and doing well in their classes.

If I get a recommendation letter from a guy with his own wikiepedia article how much does that help me with grad school aps?

Make up a question if you have to, I do this all the time and it helps out tons.

You can do research with whomever you want in the department. The exact print on your diploma having the word "applied" or not will make no difference to anyone.

Is his name Veeky Forums?

This question threw me off. In sweden, the term "grad school" is not used but I have figured it corresponds to a attending a university where you study for a Master's Degree, right? If so, why would you _not_ get into grad school? Are only a handful of people selected for grad school?

Sorry in advance for huge offtopic.

Most math PhD programs in America are likely to accept less than 10% of applicants.

I conclude that grad school refer to the place where solely PhDs study? Again sorry for offtopic.

grad school applies to both masters and phd

Graduate school refers to both masters and PhD levels. Anything past your graduation from university (i.e. undergrad) is graduate.

While they're not all as competitive as this user said many of them, even the masters degrees, are quite competitive to get in. They won't just take everyone who wants to go, especially at more notable universities.

>free time
>not working 52 weeks a year regardless of academic schedule
try a real PhD program

That sounds exactly like what I want to do. Could you tell me which school this is?

I worked this week and I'll be working Monday at 8am. Thanks pal.

I'm curious as well. It sounds nice ^_^.

Tell me how to get an industry job with a math degree.

If you really want to get into graduate school for mathematics, it is highly recommended that you get some undergraduate research experience. It is important that you know what math research is like, as you might not like it. My recommendation to build relations with your professors is to email them or go to office hours, mentioning that you want to talk about graduate school. Some of them may help you, and some others may not. Also, I don't know how far you are, but you should have taken at least one of abstract algebra, analysis or topology before even considering grad school.

The content of the letter is more important, unless the writer is someone on the level of Paul Erdos.

There are a huge number of schools that allow students to do that, such as Berkeley and UCLA. My recommendation is to talk to your professors for school advice. They might know something.

Recommending undergraduate math research is very iffy. I certainly wouldn't say it's _highly_ recommended.

A tiny amount of undergrads (maybe Cambridge and the like notwithstanding) have enough knowledge to even read research-level mathematics, let alone to start doing it.
Trying to get a prof to let you help with research when you just finished with your measure and integration course is a waste of time for both of you.

Mathematics is a different discipline than the sciences here, because there are few to no lower-skill things you can do around the lab to help out and get comfortable in there.

I have a pure math background starting my math PhD this fall. You're right that it is very hard to start math research as an undergrad, but I wouldn't say it is impossible, as there are many REUs in math. That said, I didn't get into one, so I did undergrad research with my advisor.

I didn't say they were impossible. They certainly aren't, but the majority of people aren't educated enough to make anything useful of them at that age. Unless you're either extraordinarily bright or have very favourable circumstances any undergrad research you can do will probably be very trivial or very boring.

What did you research with an advisor?

I totally get where you're coming from - most undergrads aren't going to be doing cutting edge pure math. This is not to be confused with undergrads not being able to use their knowledge to work on new problems (i.e. REU level work) and pick up a lot of new math along the way. Just my 2 cents, but I totally get your point.

REUs are so bluepilled it's unbelievable.

I have talked to many professors and they told me undergraduate research is not expected and even if you did it, it won't have anything to do with your dissertation most likely so it does not indicate much if you don't have any research experience.

The projects or the people involved?
Bluepilled intrinsically or by external opinion?
Submission rejected for lack of rigor.

Is it ever smart to do a masters in math before persuing a phd? I changed to math as a junior(I just finished my junior year) and although I'll be graduating on time, I'll be graduating without any research in math and my math courses aren't exactly impressive. It's not even that I'm not capable of more; I just didn't gain an interest in math until the end of my sophomore year. I was trying to decide if having a masters would allow me to attend a better graduate school or if it would just waste 2 years of my life.

(Part 1/2)

I see this has devolved into a lot of "how do I get into grad school".

I think the main thing to keep in mind, and the most important thing, is # of applicants># of spots. That's it. There's nothing more to it than that.

The question isn't "am I worthy enough to do a PhD" because if you aren't literally retarded and you can work hard, you can do a PhD. The question is "why would the school admit me over the other people?". And this is where bullshit comes in. "Oh you need to do this or that, make sure your GPA is so high and blah blah blah". The truth is much scarier. It's mostly random. If you have above a 3.0, and a degree in math from a real university, you made the first cut. After that, higher grades, GRE, letters of rec, experience, etc. can help set you apart. But the truth is that literal human beings are looking at applications. There is no formula, there is no recipe. It is just a feeling they get about you. And at the end of the day they have to cut SOMEONE (more like most people). The scary truth is that this is almost random. Of course better grades trump lesser grades, but is a 3.8 really that much different than a 3.9? A 3.8 is probably better than a 3.3. But is this indicative of higher aptitude for research? Does it even matter? It provides a way to cut off people.

Remember, human beings are looking at applications. So don't go around spouting off "___ is important" because to some people it isn't. Each year a handful of professors look at grad apps. Each year that handful might be different. One year you might get someone who thinks GPA is dumb. The next you can get someone who thinks GPA is the most important part. You don't know who is reading your applications. Also remember academic politics exist too. You can get screwed or benefit from that.

(Part 2/2)

So arguing about what is important is a waste of time. Not only can you not reach a conclusion, but this is not a helpful mindset. You're going to get the grades, scores, etc. you get. You're going to work so hard, and there is an element of chance to grades etc. The only thing that you have control over is how you sell yourself. This is a helpful mindset. You need to convince the school you can do research. Talk about your strengths, qualify your weaknesses. Paint an honest, good picture of yourself. All a program wants to know is if you can do research.

In a few years it'll all be over and if you keep your expectations reasonable, you'll be on your way to grad school. If you have a PhD in math from a non shit tier school, you'll most likely get a good job. At my university last year, 29 out of 30 math PhDs had jobs right after graduating (22 were in academia, 7 industry), the last person couldn't be contacted or didn't have a job. In the past 3 years only 4 people were "unknown".

So really, don't stress over admissions. If you aren't retarded you'll be fine. It's just rolling the dice. People at MIT are on average better than people at your local state college. But this is on average. Sometimes it's just luck. There are people from MIT that go on to win Field's medals and people that go on to be homeless.

>not real math

undergrad autist detected.

What is your opinion on speedsolving cross-on-left?

fuck off

The decision process for applicants. Can't blame them though, they get more funding for picking women and blacks,pakis and poo in loos.

So? You can do long term research at your own university, which is better anyways.

This is the most accurate post I've ever seen regarding graduate school on Veeky Forums, to the point where I may copy and paste it every time somebody brings this stuff up.

Hey im food sci. What specifically ate you modeling?

Also another question, and ive actually seen a couple threads about it but havent gad time to look into it. Anyway, how can i prepare in the summer for Differential Equations in the Fall? Assume ive forgotten everything about integrals amd derivatives

Fucking nigger Swedes needa get the fuck out of here.

whats the cutoff point between practical math and autism math?

Is it worth it to get a degree online in math?

For MS/equivalent job requirement (maybe funded by employer): yes.

To impress the gullible: yes.

To do research, to sling data, to hedge: probably not.

I would definitely have a working knowledge of calculus and knowing basics of linear algebra will go a long way as well (they'll probably teach you "just enough linear algebra" in your course, superposition and eigenvalues/eigenvectors). Knowing a little bit of physics is great, too! There will be a lot of examples in your course that are physics problems (pendulums, damped oscillators, circuits, and so on), so it'll help to know a little bit about these things. Don't stress too much- enjoy your summer ^_^.

Excellent post! user is on point.

What does worth it mean to you? Personally, I find learning to better communicate with others, work with others, and present information extremely important. There is a social aspect of doing math (and most things in life..); so, I find online work to be ridiculous. Again, it depends on you and your goals. What are you looking to do?

I'd at least like to get a BS. That's 4 years right? So with that I could get a job, or (hopefully) become a professor/researcher and continue education.

i did an REU and one of the 8 people was not white

Hi, I'm a retard. I am currently deciding between math, chemistry, or computer science (maybe electrical engineering) as a major.

I enjoy each, but think math offers the greatest intellectual challenge. However, I think I'd enjoy the work environment provided by chemistry (dank labs) and computer science (my couch lol) a little more.

Whats your day to day life like, at work? Are there any freelance options for a math graduate? How easy is to find a job?

I also know that both chemistry and computer science have trouble with jobs now. Chemistry is over saturated, and CS is being outsourced, while electrical engineers are slow growing and age discriminating, as well as being relatively saturated.

tell me what to do, oh wise one.

Math guy here. Just have a bachelors degree though.

>math offers the greatest intellectual challenge

Here is your first mistake. This is a true statement, but you should not choose your degree on what would be more challenging? You study what you like.

Even if you are a 500 IQ genius, but you want to study poetry, you go get your BA in poetry.

Don't treat a university degree as a dick measurement, please. We already have enough of those guys here.

>Whats your day to day life like, at work?

Like many other mathematicians at my academic level I am working in software. Day to day is pretty simple, I get in and turn on my work laptop. I check my company email where an automated system sends me the tasks assigned to me and then I start programming. From time to time I communicate and report my progress but I work 100% alone on my projects.

On what my projects are, I get assigned plenty of different stuff but the most common task I do is create user applications for finance companies with the purpose of doing quick real time computations and then displaying those results for the user, while also providing channels of communication, like direct inserts into SQL databases or automatically written emails with the data that are sent directly from the program.

I think this industry is big for mathematicians.

> Are there any freelance options for a math graduate?

The only is teaching but that eats your soul.

>How easy is to find a job?

It depends on how good and out there you are. In my case, I had this job even before I graduated university, as I was an active solo developer and I sent plenty of resumes over the summer to different companies, showing off my past work and also citing my specialization as 'Computational Mathematics', which I'm sure catched some eyes.

>tell me what to do, oh wise one.

Choose what you like more and what you absolutely see yourself enjoying doing.

>computer science have trouble with jobs now

Are you in the UK? I've heard it's not great there, but that couldn't be further from the truth if you're in North America.

Although if you're into math, I'd advise a CS/Math double major over just CS or just math, as there's a lot of crossover between the fields, depending on what areas of math you're into.

>muh anecdote

I like learning math but I don't like using it. Should I kill myself?

Muh evidence.
From a recent mathjobs posting (8755):
Pure Mathematics, Applied Mathematics, Statistics, SEEKING FEMALE ACADEMICS!
and
"...only consider applications from suitably qualified female candidates for these three positions."

Is your name not Bruce?

In mathematics, to learn is to do.
Example. "I learn about probability." --> "I do stochastic analysis."

Example. "I learn cool things about holes." --> "I work in persistent topology of data." Or other hole-related things, one supposes.

I advise not killing yourself.

>SEEKING FEMALE ACADEMICS!

Does anyone else think that this sounds creepy as fuck?

In other context, one would think that the person making the advert was a creepy serial rapist or some shit.

Like, at my university (no dorms) there is a poster from guy who is advertising that he has a room and wants to share and shit. And right below that it says "ONLY GIRLS".

That shit is creepy as fuck. Any girl would see that sign and think the guy is trying to drug them in their sleep to rape them and shit.

Why is this not the same with jobs? Why is someone who says "females only" in a job posting seen as a progressive male feminist or some shit. THEY SHOULD BE SEEN AS POTENTIAL RAPISTS.

I mean that I don't like doing what I've already learned

Are you sure it's a guy? I see "girls only" or "girls preferred" on posts looking for roommates, but those people are always female themselves. Likewise I see "males preferred" on posts of guys looking for roommates.

...it would be creepy as fuck if it was actually a guy, though.

>Like many other mathematicians at my academic level I am working in software. Day to day is pretty simple, I get in and turn on my work laptop. I check my company email where an automated system sends me the tasks assigned to me and then I start programming.
Wow, applied "mathematicians" really think what they do is anything like what real mathematicians do. That's a bit sad.

I think I was pretty honest in the fact that my day to day is simply programming. I never said that I go to the office and prove theorems and shit. I know the difference, more than you apparently.

Still, my academic education is in mathematics so that is what I am.

And my job involves a lot of math because I was hired specifically to work with a lot of number processing and while this may not be "academia" math, it is math. I enjoy it and get paid for it, probably as much as all the postdocs in academia or even more.

Now I wanna hear what you do, because I get the feeling that you are a freshman "pure" math major who is failing calc I but believes himself to be the second coming of Terence Tao, because otherwise you'd know that software is one of the biggest industries for BSc mathematicians.

Where instead of derivations for formulas, a random theorem is stated and then given a proof

>Like many other mathematicians at my academic level I'm
>I know the difference

>Now I wanna hear what you do
I'm a lowly PhD student.

I dunno. Group theory is useful as fuck if you want to quickly and simply come up with estimates of molecular spectra.

Basic group theory is useful basically everywhere.

What do you think I mean by "at my academic level".

I already said it but I will say it again, my academic education is in mathematics, not computer science, not software engineering, not anything else, my degree says mathematics.

I will call myself a mathematician as many times as I want.

>I'm a lowly PhD student.

Well, good for you, that goes beyond my initial expectations of you.

Still, just like you criticised how silly it is for people like me to call themselves a mathematician, I could criticize you over falling for the academia meme and elaborate all night. But I don't give a shit.

You and I are the same, we are both mathematicians who just happen to be applying their math in a different setting.

hi guys I expected a 404 and here we are! I wanted to say thanks to those who chimed in and gave some great information. Life and academia are intimidating; but, it's nice to talk to those who have been through what you're experiencing! Keep it up, all positive, all positive!

I absolutely agree with most points in . Please don't go into an area because you find it challenging, do it because it's fun and fascinating. To contrast user's post to the question
>Whats your day to day life like, at work?
Right now I'm doing research independently and talk to my boss once a week to see how things are moving along. I like to work in coffee shops a lot and other public places- ideas seem to flow more naturally when outside of my own apartment. I'd like some more math guys to answer this question because it varies SO much from person to person.

Definitely not! You can develop tools for others to use. We all have our preferences and you can absolutely be useful. What do you like subject wise?

It's cool to give your two cents but let's be friendly please. Thanks :)

Totally depends! I will say that everything I have learned has been used by some field, at some point. I select my coursework with applying the knowledge in my field, so I am perhaps not the person to ask. I've definitely seen gnarly math in physics. Maybe someone else can give their two cents?

You're not a mathematician. Not even an applied mathematician; I misread your earlier post. Just because you got a degree in math does not make you a mathematician. Shit, I'm basically not a mathematician, not until I'm actually doing research on a more full-time basis.

>please.
No thanks :-) Go cry a river :-)

I guess you are right. If I'm not being paid to prove theorems then I am not by profession a mathematician.

Still, I'm not going to take 'Computational Mathematician' off my resume any time soon.

I guess I'll have to wipe my tears with money.

How did you get through rudin? I am stuck on the problems near the end (usually exercise 14-21) of each section, which are the most challenging and unproductive in my opinion.

Any advice for getting stuck on a difficult math problem.

Take a break and then re-read all the relevant theory until something clicks.

How much actual mathematics do you do?

Should I try Maths college?

I never studied for Maths, never payed attention to classes, and always got shit grades, but I'm very confident I have a skill with finding out patterns. Back in higschool, in the rare ocasions that I'd be paying attention to class, I'd always get some cool insights, spot patterns, imagine possibilities, shapes, numbers. Often was the first to ever find a way to solve a harder problem, and teachers would compliment me for being smart (and despise me for being a waste of talent).

It's like some sort of autism.

Recently my interest has peaked somehow.

Should I go for it?

How can I start over?

Give me your honest opinion.

>he forgot to quote someone

Maybe he's asking OP

It's weird to ask a grad student in math how much "actual mathematics" does he do.

I mean... what else would OP do other than math? He has math up the ass.

Definitely what said. Make sure you're eating enough and hydrated (seriously). It's easy to get carried away and forget to eat and drink. I noticed this all the time when tutoring- kids would come in and sit in one spot and not move for 5 hours with no breaks or food. Don't recommend it!

It definitely depends what you mean by actual mathematics. I'm not sitting around all day playing with epsilons though :)

>Should I go for it?
If you want to. Do what you love, this is important. The only way you'll find out is by going for it.

>How can I start over?
You'll need to work (hard). I don't care how bright you are. Start over by taking initiative and learning everything you can. Be honest with yourself in what you understand and do not understand. Get your hands dirty and jam it out, prove some theorems, read some literature, try and quantify things in your everyday life in terms of the math you're learning, etc etc. Interest and a willingness to work hard are TOTALLY different. At the moment I am interested in tea; but, I'm definitely not interested enough to move to china and learn from the masters.

So I was someone who never gave a shit in high school, went to CEGEP for less than a month before dropping out because it was practically just more high school (was in a social sciences program), and I have since gone to an adult high school (it's as bad as you think) to get prereqs for Uni (math, physics, chem). So I've already applied as a mature student to my local uni in Mechanical and Civil engineering, anyways my questions are:
>how bad is the jump going to be from barely doing any homework the the course load of uni?

>Should I just not expect to get in because my other high school marks are garbage and just take the CEGEP sciences pre-uni course (equivalent to grade 12-13)

I suppose I should've clarified more, as my interest and passion in math is absolutely not solely based on intellectual challenge, just that this does separate it from the other fields I'm particularly passionate about and interested in. I'd love to work towards solving big or small problems in math, and I've heard you don't have to be a prodigy to contribute something. And working in an an intellectually challenging field is engaging fun - maybe that's what I should've said rather than "intellectually challenging".

Thank you for the detailed work report though, the way I look at it now is my choice comes down to three primary factors, assuming interest is equal: pay, work environment and job security.

I'm extremely interested in freelancing, so maybe computer science is in my best interest. This might be outside your scope, but how does the workload of a CS major compare to an EE student? /sci exaggerates and says an EE can get all the jobs a CS major can, but I wonder how true that statement really is.

>choose what you like more
I will have to think long and hard here. Thanks for the good response user.

US. Maybe I've been listening to Veeky Forums too much. Math / CS sounds really cool, I'm very interested in doing a double major (I get free flights as long as I'm a student).

>research independent, work at coffee shops
That's interesting. And the research is paid?

>how bad is the jump going to be from barely doing any homework the the course load of uni?
totally depends on you. If you're interested in the subjects then it's not "bad" at all. If you hate all of it, yes it'll be a nightmare. If you've got kids and a full time job, then adjustment will probably be difficult.

>Should I just not expect to get in because my other high school marks are garbage and just take the CEGEP sciences pre-uni course (equivalent to grade 12-13)
unfortunately I do not have a crystall ball to tell you that one ^_^

> /sci exaggerates and says an EE can get all the jobs a CS major can, but I wonder how true that statement really is.

They're referring only to if the person studying EE also studies CS in their free time on top of doing their EE degree, but that's true for a lot of things, since engineering is an accredited degree that lets you do your FE and PE tests to become a licensed engineer, which is important if you're going to be working in safety-critical areas like flight control software, or if you're a civil engineer. It's not as important for EE compared to civil.

> Maybe I've been listening to Veeky Forums too much.

You probably have been. CS degrees have some of the highest wages and highest job growth for undergraduate degrees in the US. EE has similar wages, but the job growth is almost non-existent.

>Math / CS sounds really cool, I'm very interested in doing a double major (I get free flights as long as I'm a student).

I would definitely recommend it if you like areas of math like combinatorics, graph theory, category theory, and such. If you're mostly into pure real analysis/topology then the overlap won't be as big. What kind of math do you like?

>how does the workload of a CS major compare to an EE student?

Depends a lot on the university. EE is probably going to be more work, but not necessarily harder work.

> If you've got kids and a full time job
No, I'm 21, no kids, still live at my parents place.

Just starting late I guess

Yeah, during the summer I am paid for X amount of hours per week. Realistically I do much more than X hours of work though (my decision). I'm interested in the problem and I'd like to get this project complete by the end of summer.

>so, I find online work to be ridiculous
>likes the people he went to school with
>like commuting to class
>likes his professors
what alternate reality are you living in OP

headed to bed, team. thanks to those asking & answering questions. I'll check back tomorrow to get back to those I've missed (quite a few actually..) and things that can be expanded upon, if we're not 404d.

>math offers the greatest intellectual challenge
>don't choose a career because challenging
have you ever had an unchallenging career user. ignoring the prestige aspect of it, which doesn't exist except on Veeky Forums, sometimes doing really hard stuff is fun? more fun than really nothard stuff?

Are you going to do to college, which involves most of the time a slight economic risk and 100% of the time a huge 4 year investment... just to have fun?

No, you can read your analysis books at home on your own and do the hard problems to entertain yourself.

But whatever you choose for a career should ideally be your passion.

I agree that doing complex work is better than doing simple work not only because complex works literally always equals higher pay (except in academia), but also because you become more engaged in whatever you do. However, this should not be the reason you go to college and make a huge life decision.

I already gave the example of the 500 IQ genius who can probably do triple integrals on his mind, but if he is passion is some stupid shit like poetry or philosophy then he will be better off doing his poetry.

>complex work should not be the reason you go to college and make a huge life decision
>complex work lets you become more engaged
isn't it better to be engaged in your work? avoiding unchallenging work seems good enough reason to go to college to me. they keep telling me "also, money" but i don't believe them.

>the example of the 500 IQ genius who can probably do triple integrals on his mind
lol so can i and i'm nowhere near that smart.
this insistence that people have passions is v strange to me. i always figured it was something you had to lie about for you college application in order to pass that specific hurdle.

no. people have passions. you will hopefully find out yours, in time. it's something you develop and usually not love at first sight

seems that being good at something would be a prerequisite to developing an interest in it.