Veeky Forums, why do I find almost all Christian apologetics completely perfect and sensible until they start to distinguish theism from Christanity?
They always end up perfectly explaining to me why a personal necessary being that supports existence must exist, and then they always do some weird Bayesian analysis on the life of Jesus that contradicts all my intuitions about what is possible due to cult mentality.
I guess I'm a mere theist? Can anyone convince me to be anything more than a theist?
why does believing in god make you feel bad? religion isn't supposed to replace science.
believing in god relies on you having faith, especially in what has been reported to you. I'm not christian, but did all those people invent all those miracles? Of course not.
Cooper Wood
this. religion threads go to
Lincoln Davis
>why does believing in god make you feel bad? It doesn't. I'm just in an odd situation where all of the philosophers I agree with the most are Christians. In my view, they have life almost completely figured out but they have a blind spot about the specifics of the Christian religion.
William Lane Craig is a great example. I can't help but love the guy because he says stuff about atheism that I"m always thinking. But then I remember he thinks that miracles occurred in Palestine based on some crazy argument like "well how else can you explain people being willing to die for their beliefs?" He totally loses me.
Christian Wilson
I really don't see why it wouldn't make sense. It's the same in islam. How the fuck would an illiterate peasant would be able to write something like the quran when no one can even write anything similar? Why the fuck would people follow him, or say he's the best man in the world or whatever you can think of? Or win unwinable battles etc. Anyway as I said it's a matter of faith. If you believe historians, you can also believe in whatever you feel you believe. Maybe people dismiss the evidence, but I find it compelling.
Connor Richardson
>How the fuck would an illiterate peasant would be able to write something like the quran when no one can even write anything similar? What are you on about? Not only does that not make much sense (very weird people's writing style is always unable to be imitated), but you're offering arguments for Christianity and Islam without believing in either!
Either things are true or they're not. I don't exist in a fog of vagueness. If nihilism is true I will happily kill myself. I'm honest.
Ethan Gomez
>Veeky Forums, why do I find almost all Christian apologetics completely perfect and sensible until they start to distinguish theism from Christanity? This is a good question. Why would anyone find such ridiculous arguments convincing? The world may never know.
Bentley Ross
I'm a Muslim, I'm not Christian. It's not only about writing style, it's about content. Doesn't matter, I'm just saying it's perfectly reasonable to believe it.
Thomas Lee
Oh okay. Well that makes a bit more sense, but you're in the unfortunate position that Christian apologetics makes 1000 times more sense to me than Muslim apologetics, and I've seen the best of both.
But in the end, neither of them stand up to the basic sanity check of "do really weird things happen in history without supernatural involvement"? Um yeah, obviously they do. I can think of things happening right now that might seem supernatural in the future if only some of our historical documents survive.
Kevin Bailey
Well, I do grant that some common Christian arguments for a mere god are much, much better than when they try to argue for the Christian god. I think it's all trash, but you are right that it's a different level of trash.
>Can anyone convince me to be anything more than a theist?
If you someone to encourage you to motivated reasoning, I'd suggest another board. Veeky Forums is the last place where you should expect to find that. Science is about finding motivated reasoning, and squashing it.
Suicidal fighters have been well known since antiquity to be worth many times their number in military strength and ruin the moral and disturb professional soldiers. Fanaticism is not an act of God.
Grayson Perez
>Science is about finding motivated reasoning, and squashing it.
Tell that to all the doctors trying cure diseases of their family members..
Sebastian Martinez
Aren't you just being biased against considering people saw miracles? Even the Jews acknowledged people saw miracles being performed but demised it as work of demons in the Talmud. If Christians were just spinning tales to trick Jews into apostasy, don't you think they would much rather called them hoaxes like they did in the past when pagans tried to do the same shit and were debunked? The only explanation is that these sightings were too well attested and too numerous to be demised outright and had to be refuted on grounds of their source and cause.
Noah Lopez
>Why the fuck would people follow him,
They didn't. Muhammad was a total failure for his first 13 years of preaching in Mecca, gaining less than one follower a month. Then the Meccians ran him out of town because he kept talking smack behind closed doors of how he will soon rule over them with an iron fist. It was the Medians out of complete stupidity that made him their ruler since the Arabs/polytheists have been quarreling with Jews/monotheists there and he was an Arab/monotheist that could hopefully soothe both sides. Instead he became a bandit king attracting members with spoils of war from raiding trade caravans to Mecca and later conquering territory.
>or say he's the best man in the world
That's said about every military dictator. Just see Kim Jong-il and Kim Jong-un in Korea.
Joshua Stewart
That's not motivated reasoning, you idiot. "Motivated reasoning" is a technical term of art. Look it up.
Nathaniel White
> the resident retard of Veeky Forums strikes again dance for me monkey boy
Dylan Thomas
>koufar gonna koufr
your "history" is biased and wrong.
Camden Peterson
What if Jesus was just an ordinary alien?
Landon Diaz
>Christ rose from a public tomb publicly If your going be a stealth fedora at least get the scripture right.
Cameron Evans
according to ancient astronaut theorists...
Samuel Mitchell
It's based on Islamic sources and correct
David Moore
>biased and wrong
And what do you propose happened?
Cooper Long
> cartoons are evidence lol
Asher Jones
>getting triggered by a cartoon
Hunter Russell
idc he's not me I don't propose anything, I'm not going to try to convert you because I couldn't give two shits about what happens to you after you die. I know what I believe, I don't care about what you believe.
Levi Smith
Jesus was the worlds first celebrity magician. He had 12 followers to set miracles up for him
Jeremiah Diaz
>full-blown denial
is it irrational to pretend you're rational if you're actually irrational?
Joshua Green
This. Fooling the general public has been easy since the beginning of society.
>anyone who disagrees with me is in denial Anyone who disagrees with me is in denial. Wow, that was easy. I should try your level of debate more often.
