Went to a farmers market. When the hell did they become so expensive?

While the current versions of GMO crops probably don't have negative health impacts, in and of themselves, they DO permit growers to use more insidious and harmful herbicides and pesticides on them, which most certainly DO have serious cosequences to ones health.

>Still fucking dumb that any consumer would care about it
Not really. If you're shopping at the farmer's market it's because you're looking for an alternative to the standard issue stuff at the supermarket. Fresher food might be part of your motivation, but for many it's also the idea of directly being able to support a small organic farm. They're willing to pay a premium for food that reflects their ideals of what farms ought to be. Nothing wrong with spending your money on that if that's what's important to you.
>I really hate anyone who this packaging is effectively marketing to
Why would you even give a shit? I don't understand.

>they DO permit growers to use more insidious and harmful herbicides and pesticides on them,
Thats actually not true
They allow the use of artificial pesticide sand herbicides but there is no evidence nor any reason to believe that artificial ones are worse for us than the 'natural' ones used otherwise (which is one of the main reasons organic food is bullshit)

Also, GMOs have dramatically reduced the use of pesticides thanks to engineering Bt protein into it which eliminates the need for most pesticides

Also, there is no evidence that the amount of pesticides used on food that are consumed have any effect on the human population (though there is some evidence for effects on farm workers breathing the shit)

insects/maggots. thats actually better feed for them than grains, eggs taste better too and its their natural diet, free roaming(i.e outside and not in a barn) hens will eat a lot of bugs and will dig though cow pats/droppings for them too

You can support a small farm without succumbing to the natural food lobby's dumb anti-science pandering

Chickens will eat each other sometimes.

youtube.com/watch?v=c_IoNQHMFLk

youtube.com/watch?v=sH4bi60alZU

why the fuck are american eggs all exactly the same colour and size

>anti-science pandering
For many people there's nothing anti-science about it - it's a matter of philosophy. I'm a trained scientist, and I avoid GMO products. Not because I think they're bad for me, but because I think it's absurd that BigAgra got so fucking chummy with the government that they got legislation passed to make a genome able to be patented. That and basing out entire agriculture system on monoculture are two gigantic pieces of stupid that I want as little part of as possible.

Shopping at alternative places like farmer's markets allows me to sidestep that system to a much greater degree than I can at the supermarket. But I do this not out of some kind of fear that genetically modified food is bead for me. I do it because I dislike the system and am happy to support alternatives to it. Purely philosophical motivation.

Seems like a rather misguided philosophy

These people are actively trying to trick people into thinking dramatically beneficial technology, and various mundane chemicals such as gluten, MSG etc are harmful. They are intentionally misguiding people so they can sell their product for more, thats pretty fucking evil and should be illegal

You can support your local producers without anti-science pandering though

Because we have standards.
That's why we ruled the World for a hundred years and everyone else drinks coke and eats mcdonalds.
You know you jelly you smell foreign bastards.
j/k

They use artificial chemicals on non-GMO crops too, but for example, GMO soybeans and corn tolerate Monsanto's Roundup that kills everything that hasn't had the genetic modification. By definition, more toxic; by definition, more harmful to life; by definition more insidious.

Denying science as if it's faith based might play well to the ignorant right base, but it won't sell to the educated.

I take it for granted that anyone trying to sell you something or in a position of power is lying at least some of the time. There's no way to live in the modern world and not be lied to all the damned time.

But my field of study was Environmental Sciences, so I know exactly how wasteful, polluting and ugly (in terms of both politics and practice) our agricultural system is. As a result I'm very happy to support alternatives to it, even if it means paying a premium to do so. I'm privileged to be in such a position.

This

But the non-GMO label is useful to me. It offers a level of assurance that the companies responsible for agricultural policies I strongly disagree with aren't making much if any of a profit from my buying that product.

Again, I choose to avoid GMO products out of philosophical disagreement with policies of how the technology is applied, not the technology itself.

>Denying science as if it's faith based might play well to the ignorant right base, but it won't sell to the educated.
oh the irony...

Six dollars?!?

Outrageous. A dozen top notch eggs ought to cost no more than $3.00. I get them for two bucks a pop.

Chickens will eat anything. They are fucking raptors.

Every once in a while my girls and roosters would follow me around the back of the property and they would occasionally get a mouse. One will get it and try to run away with it so they can eat as much as possible, but the run off gives it away that they got a treat. They would all storm the hen that grabbed it and rip it apart and fight for the pieces. Every once in a while they would uncover a nest with baby mice or bunnies and have a feast.

Even saw them going after a black snake once.

They are omnivores.

They will eat anything and everything they can.

Yes, sir. Do you want fries with your communism?

I want a democracy with something that resembles a free market operating, not the oligarchy and corporate welfare system we've got now.

>oh the irony...

Whenever someone says that, it means they're too stupid to come up with an ironic retort.

Please go shill for Monsanto on Breitbart where they might appreciate it.

Animal cells are not plant cells.

Nobody complains about 'insidious and harmful' soap or antibiotics. Same mecchanism.

Your retort was just an insult.

Oh, the irony!

>Liberals will actually pay 500% more for the same exact product if you put anti-science stickers on the box

For the mouthbreathers who will inevitably challege this post:

youtu.be/c_IoNQHMFLk

>"range land enviroment"
>100% vegetarian diet

It doesnt work that way. Chickens eat anything, and EVERYTHING they can get ahold of. Bugs, dead animals, dead chickens, everything.

If your chickens are outside, they are not eating a 100% vegetable diet.

Also when most farms say "freerange eggs", or "land range", the chickens are actually just let out into a tiny mud filled pen on the side of a huge barn. They arent actually let out to run around in a large field to be "free range".

>go to local farmers market
>table always there selling fruit pies
>pies are $17 each

>shill for Monsanto on Breitbart where they might appreciate it.
Would they. Monsanto is a great example of a corporation shaping government policy, and profiting from serious government subsidies. And they're a monolopy for all practical purposes. Kind of the opposite of free market capitalism.

>It offers a level of assurance that the companies responsible for agricultural policies I strongly disagree with aren't making much if any of a profit from my buying that product.
But this isn't true because Monsanto probably supplies their seed regardless, and many other companies besides Monsanto are developing modern crops

please keep in mind that the chemical pathways in plants that roundup affects are not present in mammals. Toxic is a very broad term and having plant toxicity does not imply it is harmful to animals

A small muddy pen is pretty 'free range' compared to battery hen conditions. That shit is pretty cruel & free range eggs do taste markedly better.

>youtu.be/c_IoNQHMFLk
I buy decent fruit & veg absolute bottom dollar at a dirty chinese supermarket, but come on, if that video was some farmers market shills doing the same thing in reverse it would be obvious unscientific bullshit, and as is, it's obvious unscientific bullshit.

>Denying science as if it's faith based
Thats exactly what the left does with topics like GMOS, Vaccines, general chemophobia, astrology, 'natural' vs artificial, alternative medicine etc

All absolute bullshit where the topics are completely settled from a fact based perspective but you guys fall back to conspiracy theories and faith instead of reason and logic

>Again, I choose to avoid GMO products out of philosophical disagreement with policies of how the technology is applied,
I mean there are some problems with intellectual property law, but to be opposed to being able to have any IP control over novel transgenes is just silly, why would you possibly be opposed to this?

GM corn and soy are the biggest crops we grow. Our agricultural system are is based on this shit. If you don't like that you can support the alternatives, like I do.

>And they're a monolopy for all practical purposes
No they aren't. This is an absurd claim to make, there are a;l sorts of companies in that business. Monsanto wasn't even that big of a company (last week they were bought by a much larger German company)

they are fucking birds, they don't know the difference

>$63 billion company
>not that big

>Usually it's an upscale crowd
If you live in the city I guess.
I haven't been to the one here in quite awhile because it slowly stopped being a "farmers market" and started becoming a "let me sell you my cheap hippie etsy shit for $300", but when it was you could just get shitloads of local produce for cheap

I mean its not some mom and pop business, but from the perspective of the US government it is rather small. All the conspiracy shit implying that they bought off the government is just ridiculous

and it has a handful of similar sized and larger competitors, so its not like they are this dominant market force as you people always suggest

what the hell do you mean 'you people'?

anti science conspiracy theorists

Watch the documentary, "The World According to Monsanto," and you'll realize pretty quickly how much that corporation has the interest of humanity at it's core.

Unless, of course, you've been shilled by the corporate meme on the right.

The fun thing is they don't have to have the interest of humanity at heart to benefit humanity. Developing new, better things and them selling them to people who want them is what capitalism is all about and it has been pretty fucking great for all of us over the last 100 years

Please also keep in kind that people only buy stuff if they consider it worth the cost, its not like in some centrally planned system where the government just picks what seed you must grow, farmers choose what they want to grow, if they want to buy outdated crops, they can

WV here, eggs are $1 for 12 large grade A, sometimes on sale for 50 cents, kind of rare though.
Farm eggs, like those, are $2 a dozen from chicken owners and $1.80 in the store.
Probably the best option for eating cheap. Rice and beans fucking blow more than once a month, eggs get tiring but at 25 cents a meal you can't argue.

My point is you can choose to avoid buying products from companies you do not like. I don't like McDonald's, so I don't buy McDonald's. I don't like Nestle, and Coca-Cola so I tend to avoid their products. I don't like Monsanto, but avoiding their products takes more effort. Farmer's markets selling stuff labeled organic and non-GMO are places where avoiding Monsanto products is easier.

>My point is you can choose to avoid buying products from companies you do not like.
I understand, and this fact is a good thing
I am just saying your reasons for disliking this company are misguided conspiracy theories

Also you are wrong to think that organic seeds do not also come from Monsanto, so you really are not accomplishing what you believe to be accomplishing. Pretty sure they have a similar marketshare of the organic market as they do of the normal market

>misguided conspiracy theories
The fracas surrounding their failed introduction of GMO seeds to England led to lots of hate that lingers to this day. Some of it is earned, some is timfoil hat shit. My point is that I'm very much against two ideas Monsanto has come to stand for: monoculture based around corn and patenting the genetic code of an organism. Couple that with their past sins (saccharin, artificial vanilla flavor, agent orange) and their chummy relationship with the policy makers in government and I'm happy to avoid their products whenever possible.

Seriously, what the hell has science ever done for me except take jobs away and give them to the chinese, or the chinese robots?

>The fracas surrounding their failed introduction of GMO seeds to England
What did they do wrong? Sounds like they just got fucked unfairly
>patenting the genetic code of an organism
Why is this bad?
>saccharin, artificial vanilla flavor
um, whats wrong with these?
> chummy relationship with the policy makers
No different than any company of their size must be in our overregulated economy

There is no logical reason to be against the patenting of novel genetic codes, this stance in and of itself is anti-science conspiracy theory shit and shows a lack of understanding of how this stuff even works

>patenting the genetic code of an organism
Bad idea. It's not a piece of code. Fuck with it if you like, but being able to claim ownership of it is absurd.
>what's wrong with saccharin and artificial vanilla flavor?
These things only exist to degrade food.
>our overregulated economy
These guys got an absurd bit of legislation passed for them so they can own the genetic code of the seeds they sell. Sounds more like the table is tilted in their favor, not heavily regulated against them.
Like I said, it's not a piece of code. By all means profit from fucking with it, but claiming ownership of an organism's fucking genetics is absurd. Do you own your genetics? No you don't, and that's something completely unique to you. How the fuck can a company claim to own the genetics of another living thing? This was a bad decision in US law.

>Bad idea. It's not a piece of code
It is literally just a piece of code, thats exactly what it fucking is
>These things only exist to degrade food.
Dude, this stance is basically just 'muh feelings' you don't like them for entirely illogical reasons, and its just opinion based
>These guys got an absurd bit of legislation passed for them so they can own the genetic code of the seeds they sell
No, this is a common sense application of previously existing IP laws, not some sweetheart deal they got that only or especially helps them

im actually impressed you could sell eggs for only 6 bucks. when i imagine the costs of producing eggs, i think of having to buy chickens, having to feed them, having to clean up their pen, having to wash and store the eggs....it's a lot of work simply to have them ready to sell. you could go through all that work yourself, or you could buy them for 6 dollars or cheaper.

>Like I said, it's not a piece of code. By all means profit from fucking with it, but claiming ownership of an organism's fucking genetics is absurd. Do you own your genetics? No you don't, and that's something completely unique to you. How the fuck can a company claim to own the genetics of another living thing? This was a bad decision in US law.
I don't think you have a firm grasp on genetics or intellectual property law.. On what grounds are you opposed to it beside you just don't like how the idea sounds? They are spending money developing novel geen combinations to make better crops and then spending a fucking absurd amount of money testing thme because of how ridiculously strong the regulations on the industry are. If they cannot even make money on their own research they wouldn't do the research, we see the same issue with drug development

Its not like the genes of some plant are some sacred thing that must be protected, its just a bit of code, no different than a computer program

Didn't they do testing to show they had higher average blood pressure, cholesterol, "stress" (however that's measured) or was that cows?

This.
Even if they did, why should we care?

Also: ITT commie faggots who don't understand patent law.

They may have, but plants have stress responses too, that doesn't mean it is something anyone should give a shit about

>avoiding their products requires more effort

You think? After all, Monsanto has spent millions lobbying our illustrious Congress to make sure they strike down any law that forces food producers to identify their product as containing GMO's. Corn syrup? Ubiquitous in any processed product in the amerifag food supply and is 100% GMO. Are you aware of that in labeling? Of course not.

If big chemical is so proud of it, why are they scared to let people choose?

You shills for big chemical need to get another tactic.

designated egg storing shelf in fridge

The decision to apply IP law to genetic code was a leap. The case can be (and was indeed) made that it was a logical leap, but it was one hell of a leap, regardless, and I remain of the opinion it should not have been made.

And of course part of my dislike for the company is going to be opinion based. Like McDonald's and Coca-Cola what they do does not make the world a better place in my view. That's why they have to spend so much money on feel good marketing. Because what they really do is just generate a fuckton of pollution while selling products that lower our standards.

Birds are naturally high-strung creatures, that's their survival mechanism, man.

Wat the fuck are you talking about? Congress just passed a terrible law requiring GM foods to be labelled, a slap in the face of all people who hold science above feelings. (though better than letting each of the states make up their own shitty laws on the topic)

Also before this law there was no legal definition of GM crops, this wasn't Monsanto passing some law, just the fact that no law had ever needed to define them as they are functionally identical to other crops as far as human health is concerned, it had nothing to even do with Monsanto and their lobbying efforts

Forced labeling of GMOs is unnecessary and harmful. Its just a marketing tactic by the organic lobby trying to trick people into think GM crops are bad, because you uneducated luddites are sure as fuck going to assume something is bad if your food has a warning label calling it out

petty sure that decision was up to the court system rather than any legislation, regardless I don't understand why anyone would be opposed to it

>Corn syrup?
Exactly. It doesn't matter whether or not GMO HFCS is safe. What matters is it's so fucking cheap that there's a fuckton of it is so much of our food. That's what I'm pissed off about. They've lowered our standards to expect sweet shit to be dirt cheap, and everything to be sweet. Then we wonder why the poor people this shit gets marketed to end up obese.

>Non-soy eggs
Didn't know you can modify an egg to have soy.
Soy based humans....just a thought

probably because poor people are dumb, thats why they are poor

If you can patent a codex, then you can patent genetic code.

Based on current patent law this should only be for new genetics, nothing that currently exists.

Why don't you want these companies to be able to patent their invention? (ones that happen to be extremely expensive to test as they are FDA regulated)

That's a very Victorian fallacy. Poor people are ignorant because there isn't much profit in educating them.

Pretty much this. Hipsters see's all those buzz words and they'll pay a premium for every one

lol, we spend an insane amount of money trying to educate them

This. The day I found out pyrethrin are organic pesticides I knew organic produce was 100% bullshit.

Not much at all compared with the amount spent on selling them garbage.

The thing about being not dumb is that you can process information better, so no matter how much shit is thrown at you, you know its shit

Poor people eat shit food because they are dumb and lazy, thats pretty much the only way to be poor in modern America, you can be lazy or you can be dumb and still be ok, but when you are both you are possibly gonna be poor

Corporations aren't responsible for education and the government isn't responsible for marketing tho, but I get what you mean. It's easy to be overwhelmed if one is not so bright or wasn't warned about the world by their parents.

That's pretty metal.

>only way to be poor in modern America

Wrong. Go back to Breitbart and your circle-jerk, alt-right memes. Nobody here is interested in your corporate-fascist spoo.

life isn't that hard

>poultry
>vegetarian diet

fucking lol

>great for all of us
maybe in your priveledged little suburb, but globally capitalism has not helped the majority of humans to prosper.

...

There's no meat in that.

chicken mcnuggets are made with 100% all white meat chicken breast, you fucking tinfoil hatter.

Says the coddled little republikid whose mommy and daddy paid all his shit.

Now imagine you were born in the ghetto or the trailer park instead of the mansion. Kill yourself, my man.

Ronald, is that you?

The small farms you are supporting think you are a mindless rube. I've met several small organic farmers and as far as they are concerned the whole thing is just a scam to make more money off their little plot. Most of them won't even eat the produce from their own farm, they prefer the produce form the grocery store.

Pure ass bullshit, you corporate shill.

No, he's telling the truth.

A lot of the small farms aren't even following real organic procedures, and are just lying.

What, do you think that the random asshole who runs the farmer's market is going to go and inspect them? Yeah, no. They're just an overglorified upscale flea market owner. Nobody tests these things.

The biggest rubes are the ACTUAL organic and free range farmers. They're mostly taking a loss when selling their produce, since they experience so many crop losses.

>naturally grown
yeah its an egg, how do you unnaturally grow an egg