Is there any real basis for being a vegan?

Is there any real basis for being a vegan?

I mean is there a practical way to get all the proper amino acids and proteins etc. from a completely herbivorous diet?

Other urls found in this thread:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essential_amino_acid
nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1966/2
chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-best.html
chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-are-as.html
nutritiondata.self.com/facts/poultry-products/696/2
nutritiondata.self.com/facts/legumes-and-legume-products/4408/2
youtube.com/watch?v=FX58PyQwrcI
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

You could probably check it on your own if you really wanted to know the answer.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essential_amino_acid

>I mean is there a way to get all the proper amino acids and proteins etc. from a completely herbivorous diet?
Yes, absolutely

>is there a practical way
No, not really. I mean you COULD go out of your way to breathe only from scuba tanks whose contents were collected in Cambodia, but...Why would you when the alternative (Just, y'know, breathing like humans normally do) is not only moral and ethical, but less costly and more effective?

No. Only if you apply the same ethnical standards to animals that you have for humans. This is something most vegans seem to randomly do.

You are an omnivore and shouldnt ignore your nature

Some people just like to be cunts. Is there any real basis for being a person that uses his phone in the theatre?

>moral and ethical
That's very relative, but this is Veeky Forums so I don't really wanna start a debate about the moral aspect.
>less costly
I doubt it
>more effective
Maybe, but it does have some other avantages, like getting your reference daily intake of proteins without exceeding that of saturated fatty acids.

> eating animals are the same as not eating animals
meathead grasping at straws

>eating animals are the same as not eating animals
what the fuck are you even trying to imply? I never said any of this

>some people just like to be cunts
Yeah like you guys aren't.
I don't give a fuck about animals and it was indeed amusing at first, but now I'm pretty tired of the constant vegan bashing. On the other hand I've literally never been annoyed by a vegan without asking for it first.

Vegans are against the slaughter of animals for the purpose of getting meat for your burgers, Benefiting from animals without harming them is not something vegans oppose.

>a vile

vial

Vegans are against the usage of ANY animal products in ANYTHING. Try to motte and bailey less.

K

the milk, it kills a cow
the egger, it kills a chicken

In French we'd say something like "vegetalian" to call someone who just doesn't eat animal products but still uses them for other purposes. Isn't there a similar word in English?

>Is there any real basis for being a vegan?
The only basis I agree with is the environmental one. A vegan diet has a much smaller carbon footprint than one with meat.

thats wrong. you confuse vegans with vegetarians

it is literally degenerate to not eat meat.

>Poisonous snake

Fucking hell

good point

adjective poi·son·ous \ˈpȯiz-nəs, ˈpȯi-zən-əs\

Definition of poisonous
: causing sickness or death by entering or touching the body : containing poison
: capable of putting poison into another animal's body by biting it
: very harmful or unpleasant

The actual obvious point you missed is that most vegans openly value their lives over that of an animal and wouldn't hesitate to break their vegan lifestyle in that situation just like you would slay your pet if you needed to. Thing is, most of the time they don't need to and therefore do their best to limit any kind of unnecessary suffering.
Your picture is assuming veganism is a strict religion with strict dogmas. It isn't.

Yeah apparently I was confusing those.

thanks :^)

Why do people have vegan mentality ? What do they think they are achieving by leaving the animals untouched in their own habitat ?

Snakes are venomous not poisonous.

No shit. I'm pretty sure the picture is hyperbolic on purpose just to show how hypocritical vegans are. I'm sure most of them already use a lot of "animal products" without even knowing it.
Vegans also seem to assume that they are the authority when it comes to define what "unnecessary suffering" means.

nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1966/2

look at that, a fucking ORANGE has a complete amino acid profile just like every other fruit and vegetable

btw you only need 8 anyway and you can synthesize the other 12

ive been a vegan for a year and havent lost any muscle or gains but my erection quality and pooping quality is better.

ill be vegan for life, meat is disgusting anyway.

just my 2 cents

>Is there any real basis for being a vegan?
No.
>chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-best.html
>chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-are-as.html

enjoy your low testosterone levels and inefficient meme diet
You literally fell for a meme
>I've been a vegan for a year and havent lost any muscle or gains but my erection quality and pooping quality is better.
Bullshit shilling at best that you can't attribute to your meme diet in any shape or form. And whatever gains you have will always be inferior to meat eaters. Veganism/vegetarianism has no scientific basis and has been repeatedly debunked
>meat is disgusting anyway.
More bullshit. And meats not disgusting, your just a pussy..

vegetarian

You cant debunk a superior moral choice.

Really the best reason for vegetarian-or-veganism is that you don't have to rear animals farting up a methane storm or consuming tons of space.

If we would eat insects that would make sense because you get lots of protein per area of farming, whereas a cow needs massive area To produce each kilogram of meat. We don't *need* meat anymore because we've finally produced crops nutritious enough to live healthily on plant matter alone.

if it is easier for you to stay fit and dont like meat anyway, thats fine. But some vegans feel the need to be huge cunts about it and think they are morally superior

> is there a practical way to get all the proper amino acids and proteins etc. from a completely herbivorous diet?

It's a completely legitimate lifestyle. In the US approx 1% (~3.3 million) of people are vegan (Wiki states 2% self ID as such but IMO everyone is breakin for donuts if they live somewhere there isn't a vegan bakery). So the numbers seem to suggest that it's do able (indeed it's growing), and adjustments are relatively sustainable.

That's the answer, simply put for a simply worded query. But there's more to it, obviously. So once you put aside that the diet is sustainable and practical, the real answer about the nature of veganism in society lies on the intersect of socioeconomics and culture.

>OP Image
>But some vegans feel the need to be huge cunts about it and think they are morally superior

An asshole is an asshole, and asshole vegans would be asshole accountants if that's what got their mojo going. At some point you gotta realize that if some one is being really shitty, it might not have all to do with their lifestyle if their are thousands more ascribed that aren't militant.

I also, however, decry this notion that it's only or specifically vegans. As far the image in OP, it's like, veganism is by definition an exclusionary diet. You have to define those boundaries when they come up, and if you are a human being with normie friends and junk you're constantly a squeaky wheel because you don't want to eat at texas roadhouse or sonny's or whatever. You can't fault some one for being noisy because they have to specify their diet at all those moments.

Those are all fair points and all but I said only some vegans are that way and I think the asshole approach is not really helpful. Of course there are assholes are everywhere but that doesnt mean other people have to accept the way how they are assholes.

Also, if you genuinely believe that what other people are doing is morally wrong and terrible, are you really an asshole for stopping them? I think some of them just have a faulty understanding of how conscious works and just want to stop the "animal holocaust"

wow you can think! would you like to take a magical journey to whom made that picture and tell him it is vial?

I cook meat for people at social gatherings, just choose not to eat at. never been a cunt to anyone, if they ask why I dont eat meat i just say i prefer not to.

t-levels are fine dude, had em checked. erection quality better too despite being almost 30. better now at 28 than they were throughout early 20s when I ate meat daily and drank fucktons of milk and ate other dairy.

meat is disgusting, think of how many times you eat meat with no seasonings. you would never do it. it will always be seasoned with sugar, salt, fruits or veggies. meat needs vegan food to make it palatable. weird....

I think vegans would be fine with using snake venom and most vegan would probably have eggs anyway

yes there is, it makes unintresting stupid people think they are special

Yeah, vegetarian. The sane cousin of vegans.

Ecology, health, religion, general welfare, saving money... And above all, empathy. No one's asking you to show some, but at least keep this shit out of Veeky Forums, boards like Veeky Forums are probably more appropriate for that.

>how hypocritical vegans are
So meat eaters that care about animals aren't? I don't quite see how disrespecting your beliefs without knowing it is hypocritical though, you tell me. And does the fact you'd kill your pet dog in a situation of distress even though you love him means you're being hypocritical as well, or you just don't know what "hypocritical" really means and use it in any situation? Cause I'm pretty sure 2/3 of the planet is, by your standards.
>Vegans also seem to assume that they are the authority when it comes to define what "unnecessary suffering" means.
So what does it mean to you?

Vegetarians do eat eggs and dairies though, don't they?

> ecology
so the other predators eat the cows rather than us ?

> health
meat has protein, iron and many other stuff that your body requires...

> religion
...

> general welfare
eating animals are tasty and selling animals brings profit

> saving money
people who want that can do it already

> empathy
they empathize the lions that chew the cows to pieces alive ?

Every reputable nutriologist will just tell you to avoid certain foods but eat them every other time except if you are already a fat fuck with diabeetus

>I havent done research beforehand and just wanted to reply

Yeah. Vegans don't eat animal products but still use animal products in day to day life. I don't know of an English word for someone who doesn't use any animal products.
No, a vegan is someone who doesn't eat animal products - that's it! They might hate animals and want to kill them all, and see them as so disgusting that they refuse to eat them. Such a person would still be a vegan, because being a vegan has nothing to do with philosophy (of course, most vegans are idiots and don't realise this).

My wife is lactose intolerant and allergic to egg, and doesn't generally like the texture of meat. She's nearly a vegan, despite having no real problem with slaughtering animals. She doesn't sometimes eat meat, though. And a lot of fish.
The point is that if she disliked meat even more, and disliked fish also, she'd be a vegan for completely non-philosophical reasons, just like the animal hater I presented earlier.

>to whom made that picture

muh feelings

Can you?
Yes

Practical?
No

Animal protein truly has every essential amino acid in abundance, they are a high quality protein source for a reason

Every plant source has a negligible amount of some amino acid, some algae or lentil might be considered a complete source of protein, but their amino acid profile is very unbalanced and tends to have a weak link.

Animal products are the biggest reason we're able to prosper, such cheap and ample supply of fats and protein and completely versatile in use, go make some fried eggs and then make a meringue to top your yogurt parfait.

Using you website, an orange has 84.6mg of Lysine

Chicken breast has 1501mg
nutritiondata.self.com/facts/poultry-products/696/2

What is comparable is eating an entire block of tofu
nutritiondata.self.com/facts/legumes-and-legume-products/4408/2

Unless vegans are eating nothing but tofu and quinoa, they are eating more calories to meet their protein needs than what someone eating a balanced diet would eat

I am not going to even touch the logic behind comparing an orange to an organism that had a lifetime of cells systematically create a network of dense protein

>Bacon needs seasoning
>Burgers need seasoning
>Salmon needs seasoning
Whoa animal meats have their own fat that already gives them flavor

Really make you think....

in all fairness people use salt in most cases as a reflex. we used to store food by drenching it in salt so it would last longer. most people put salt on their food before even tasting it. and you do it too when preparing meat for your social gatherings.

also you're being a real cunt about how I season my food. think of how many times you ate a potato without seasoning.

vegetables are not VEGAN FOOD they are food.

Being a vegan is generally very bad for your health even when you're taking the proper supplements.

>dat pic
is it trying to make a point? does it not understand we have an emotional conection to our pets (we also legaly own them)

>you love him means you're being hypocritical as well
no. because I'm not a vegan who acts morally superior all the time and I dont have problems with animal products otherwise

>dogs are the same as cattle
found the chinese

Dogs have a special place among humankind. They were with us from the beginning. They're the only species we domesticated before the neolithic.

You're a moron.

OP don't listen to these idiots, 99% of people here are meat-eaters so of course they will try to push their ill-conceived agenda. Fuck meat and fuck meat eaters.

Here, see this video.

youtube.com/watch?v=FX58PyQwrcI

yeah, yeah
all the vegans on the internet always tell you how they dont need supplements at all and that their food is so much better

>Fuck meat and fuck meat eaters
just means
>fuck all the domesticated animals and fuck humanity

not a ill-conceived agenda at all, hypocrit

No, fuck you. Go and visit a slaughterhouse. Do it right fucking now. Then go and buy some meat and try and enjoy it. Sick fucker, calling me a hypocrite. You're the one that's totally blind to the reality of what you put on your dish. You should feel ashamed, but since you're in the majority it's easy to diss everyone that opposes you.

So again, go and fuck yourself.

yeah, one of my buddies is a butcher. Watched many times. Cant say it is pleasant, but why should that stop my eating habits as an omnivore.

You are a typical vegan here. Assuming people just dont know what they put on their plate, being condescending and trying to shame people and overall being very "morally superior"

>Cant say it is pleasant, but why should that stop my eating habits as an omnivore.
Good question. Think it through yourself.

>You are a typical vegan here. Assuming people just dont know what they put on their plate, being condescending and trying to shame people and overall being very "morally superior"
I'm not morally superior to anyone. But I choose to act on my morals, unlike you that just ackonwledge their existence. I've been vegetarian for 13 years, vegan for 5. All your vegan myths are fairy tales you tell to yourselves so you can feel good about eating rotting flesh pumped with antibiotics. You're doing yourself an insane amount of damage, but whatever, meat is good, right? Your grandma said so, must be true. If you can't change your habits purely because you believe you will otherwise get a disease, become weak, or whatever the fuck it is you think veganism does to you, it just shows your own inability to research. You can be a perfectly healthy vegan, and it's not even hard. And you'd be doing yourself and our so called civilization a great favor.

>muh feelings

>everything is a meme
Enjoy being young, it won't last forever

>keeping your muscle and gains
on that diet you were never big to begin with.

which is fine, I don't expect most Veeky Forumsentists to be hueg but don't argue with anecdotes.

also this

Yes, because it's been scientifically proven that being a vegan gives you superpowers.
Hitler rose to power as a vegan.
Most serial killers are vegan.
PETA has become a power cult and most of them are vegans.

There is a common misconception that vegans become weak, but in reality, while they lose muscle mass, their brain stops maintaining the part of the brain that has to do with human empathy towards other humans [due to a lack in Omega 3 fatty acids and GABA and Glutamine].
This turns vegans into sociopaths.
But their new diet is often high in mutagens such as caffeine and veggies/fruits that contain natural carcinogens [making raw vegans even more prone to mutation/sociopathy because boiling would otherwise break down the chemical compositions].

Interesting that when you google "mutagen" a picture of veggies and fruits pops up.
Hmmmm....

>Good question. Think it through yourself.
I did. although it was a rhetoric question

>I'm not morally superior to anyone
...
>don't listen to these idiots
>ill-conceived agenda
>Fuck meat and fuck meat eaters
>Sick fucker
>You're the one that's totally blind to the reality of what you put on your dish
>You should feel ashamed
>go and fuck yourself
>But I choose to act on my morals
>it just shows your own inability to research

No, it seems like you are just insufferable and think people who dont share your picky eating habits just need to wake up and that they are only doing this because they are stupid and/or morally inferior to you.
thats not how it is. You are not the only one who chooses to act on his morals. Other people just have other morals

>veganism is doing our civilisation a favor
except we wouldnt have a civilisation if people didnt eat some juicy meat

If humans were not omnivores then they wouldn't be, but throughout all of human history, on all continents, they have been.

But facts don't appeal to stupid people, so fuck you for being a pathological doxic.

>You're doing yourself an insane amount of damage
No, not eating the diet you evolved to eat is causing you damage.
The [math]typical[/math] omnivore might not have that diet, but absolutely no vegan does.

You know what? I am morally superior to you. You're an moron. That makes me the smart one. Enjoy your rotten food.

what meme? are you lost?

...

I'm not that user, but you are quite literally an undeveloped human that is a walking, talking stereotype.
Google these please:
1.) Doxa
2.) List of logical fallacies
3.) List of cognitive biases
4.) Personality disorders
All 4 apply to you.

That aside, here is a the counter argument:
We are factually omnivores, and there is nothing wrong with being an animal on earth that evolved to eat other animals.
Eating is not an ethical question, torture is, and they're not the same.
0% of the animals we eat are self-aware and therefore do not suffer emotionally.
What you think you're seeing have been scientifically been proven to be auto-nerve responses to physical pain [for themselves] and exploitation loss [of members of their own species].

classic vegan argumentation there.
Stick your fingers in your ears and yell "la la la I'm better than everybody else! I can be a huge cunt to all the people, because I'm the smart one! la la la"

good points, my emotionally well balanced friend

You can go ahead and google "superiority complex", you dumb-ass piece of shit.

>We are factually omnivores, and there is nothing wrong with being an animal on earth that evolved to eat other animals.
Sure, I mean mass processing of animals has been around for millions of years.

>Eating is not an ethical question, torture is, and they're not the same.
I don't even know what your point is with this.

>0% of the animals we eat are self-aware and therefore do not suffer emotionally.
If you told that to my face I would literally bring my dogs to chew on you. I mean really. What the fuck is your problem? Ever looked a dog in the eyes? You see no emotion there? No intelligence? How about the fact that pigs are incredibly intelligent and can even solve simple puzzles? They're not self aware? Are you fucking kidding me? Are you self aware, you pathetic little worm?

>What you think you're seeing have been scientifically been proven to be auto-nerve responses to physical pain [for themselves] and exploitation loss [of members of their own species].
Yeah, same as when I beat the living shit out of you with my fists. Just neuro responses. Fucking dumbass.

Go and suck on a horse's dick.

there are also enough ways to acquire meat without supporting "factory farms".

Cows can have a nice, safe cow life that ends with a painless death, so there isnt necessarily torture involved either way

Sorry, I dont love animals as much as you do.

And again, very good point. Really showed your emotional maturity

Go home onision, you don't belong here.

In case it's not blatantly fucking obvious, I don't want to argue with you. You already showed your lack of intelligence in your previous posts, so just shove it.

>Sure, I mean mass processing of animals has been around for millions of years.
1.) False equivocation fallacy
2.) Moving the goalpost fallacy
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded

>I don't even know what your point is with this.
1.) Personal incredulity fallacy
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded

>rage bullshit that isn't an argument
1.) Proof by verbosity is a fallacy
2.) Appeal to intimidation is a fallacy
3.) Appeal to to emotion is a fallacy
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded

>Yeah, same as when I beat the living shit out of you with my fists. Just neuro responses. Fucking dumbass.
1.) Same as above
2.) Shifting burden of proof
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded

How come you didn't look up
>list of logical fallacies
Like I asked you to.
It takes 10 seconds and quadruples you IQ, guaranteed.

Then why are you replying to him?

Circlejerk some more, dumbass.

I guess I'm bored.

>there are also enough ways to acquire meat without supporting "factory farms".
1.) Auto-conflation fallacy
2.) False equivocation fallacy
I never spoke of factory farming.
Therefore: Argument is illogical; discarded

Epistemology isn't a circle jerk.
It's:
Empricism + Lack of Logical Fallacies + Deduction = Factual Statement

Are you one of those idiots that keep spamming appeals to authority while confusing sophism with epistemology because you're not intelligent enough to understand demarcation?

How often do I have to correct people like you?
Not Epistemology:
>Sophism
>Extended Existential
>Postmodernism
>Critical Theory

Epistemology:
>Empricism
>Deduction
>Induction
>Fallacy Checking
>Positivism and Falsificationism

Do you get the difference?
Do you have the adequate intelligence for decoration and correction?
Hello?
We're speaking SCIENCE here.
Science IS empiricism.

*demarcation and correction?

You use fallacies and claim to be intelligent?
If you use fallacies, then by the very definition of intelligence, you're what doctors would diagnose as a Moron, and that's an actual medical term.

>Gee doc, I don't know how reality works
>Aren't all my thoughts auto-correct?
>What do you mean I have to "prove" my beliefs?

>lack of intelligence in your previous posts
Where exactly?
You just dont want to argue because you cant. You have no point to make other than
pathetic

Listen. You just said that animals have no self-awareness. Whatever you say from that moment onward is irrelevant because I already consider you a total fucking dimwit.

>Calling Phd classes a circlejerk
>Calling weeding out bullshit a circlejerk
Deduction is the opposite of a circle jerk.
How do you not know that?

I claim to be more intelligent than you. That is all. Sorry it hurts your ego I guess.

>I never spoke of factory farming.
are you autistic or cant you read?
I clearly just added something to your post. I was agreeing with you

And how was my argument illogical?

>I already consider
No one care about that.
We care if you can prove your stance.
And you can't.
Therefore all of your arguments are illogical.
It's clear you don't understand the scientific method, nor the Gettier Problem, which is why you are clearly doxic [mindless drone that uses flawed anchoring heuristics].

I also find your lack of adult and scientific vocabulary mildly disturbing, if not amusing.

I can prove my stance. Just allow me to punch you a few times in person. You'll see how your neurons being activated feel like. Do we have a deal?

most of them dont have self-awareness. Are you going to deny scientific facts now, or are you showing us a study/test that clearly indicates that cows are self aware?

How about if I kick you in the balls instead? You don't seem to have any self awareness either. Let's apply your own principle and make it a test.

You don't even understand what deduction is.
How can you claim to be more intelligent than I?
I have no problem with people being intellectually superior to myself, but they would have to at least know the following to be my equal:
>Epistemology
>Scientific Method
>Logical Fallacies
>Cognitive Biases
>Induction and Deduction
>Coherency and Consistency
>The Burden of Proof
>The Problem of Induction
>Common Misconceptions and Doxa
At the very, very, very least.
You just pull shit out of your ass and attack people, as if ad hominem fallacies and personal incredulity fallacies meant anything other than pure "circlejerk" material as you call it.
And then you engage in crystal clear psychological projections by claiming everyone else is less intelligent than you while you don't even understand any of the above.
How scared and sad you must be.
Do yourself a favor and learn what empiricism is.

>hurr durr u dumb
absolutely convincing

You do realize animal brains have been scientifically proven to be exceptionally different from human brains in regards to functioning, right?

I know logic, I studied it. This is not a logics problem. This is a "what life is about" kind of shit. Go and get a puppy, or something. Maybe you'll develop some empathy for animals that way.

Humans are indeed a self aware species. Good, you are starting to learn.
Other apes and some dolphins are too. It is debatable with some very clever birds.

But cows are dumb as shit. They dont understand the world around them, nor are they aware of themselves. Their brain just isnt capable of that. It doesnt have to be.

Sure. Now go and fuck yourself. Preferably with street light pole.