Who /noma/ here? I love watching this shit, it's my dream to sell incredibly overpriced food to rich snobs.
>tfw nordic chef at pretentious as fuck restaurant
>tfw rich people pretend I'm the shit because my reputation says I am
>tfw I make them cook their own fucking eggs
>tfw I put a damn rock on a plate with frozen seawater and raw shrimp
>tfw I spiral cut some fucking potato chips
>tfw I sell this to them at 500% markup
delete this.
>tfw I just found some old carrots outside
>they're all black and shit
>tfw I can sell this for maximum profit because they cost me nothing
>tfw food snobs defend this.
>tfw some branches fell down because it was windy
>tfw I go pick them up and tie them to some asparagus I stole from my neighbors garden
>tfw I just grill the whole fucking thing
>tfw my signature dish is an asparagus tied to a branch
That guy is considered to be one of the best chefs in the world. You do understand that at a certain level the concept counts as much as the food. Like with Ferran Adria or even Dan Barber. Their food is not only great but it resets your expectations about what dining out is supposed to be. If you don't dine out often you might not appreciate that. Because you don't have a context for it. And context is everything at this level of dining.
Think about it like this: John Coltrane didn't play pretty music all that much. Some of his stuff was downright difficult to listen to. But in context his music was a breakthrough in the jazz form. Someone not familiar with that form might not "get it" at all. Picasso didn't paint pretty pictures. Some of his work is difficult as well. But in context you can see what a genius he was. Noma is kind of like that for fine dining.
No you're just a fag. Nice trips though.
Picasso was a hack. He didn't paint 'pretty' pictures because wasn't able to.
go back to your McChicken threads you dumbass losers
I think you simply don't value the creative process. Anyone can learn French technique, classic recipes and with a little work and access to good ingredients can turn out amazingly delicious food. Anyone can learn Italian grandma cooking and do pretty much the same, again if they have access to good ingredients. But that's not what this guy is doing. His thought process really kinda is like and which is a crazy starting point for a high end restaurant. Being able to make delicious food from that approach requires not just skill, but inspiration - on top of being a chef the guy the guy is being an artist. And for most people getting too much of an artistic approach in the kitchen does not benefit the food. This guy can totally think like an artist and turn out great food.
Not all that many people like that out there.
>because wasn't able to.
In fact his early works are really 'classic', he was a good painter, but he decide to go against the mainstream and the classical techniques
Not everyone can successfully market overpriced twigs tied to food to pretentious rich people. I agree, it's genius.
This. His work started out classical, then changed as he played around with different modern conceptual ideas. Then he took it further in works like Guernica where he uses concept derived style to make a powerful comment on the horrors of the events of his time, and by extension war in general. Thaty puts him way beyond any "concept for its own sake" kind of artist.
Today some high end chefs work with philosophies and concepts they way 20th Century painters did. And the best of them are turning out work that's just as revolutionary.
>Dismisses something he doesn't "get" as valueless and pretentious because he doesn't want to acknowledge conceptual works.
I bet you think travel and reading fiction are also pretentious. And drinking wine is for girls.
If you want to see the power of marketing just look at the soda bottles and fast food wrappers in your garbage can.
>naming your restaurant "noma"
well that was stupid
> I bet you think travel and reading fiction are also pretentious. And drinking wine is for girls.
All your random scribble paintings and twigs tied to food you pretend to enjoy certainly are.
And I don't drink soda or eat fast food except Chinese like once a year. That wouldn't make you any less of a pretentious hipster though.
I private chef on the side for these people in my town.
It is highway robbery.
What makes you think people enjoy this sort of food out of pretense rather than the fact it honestly looks and tastes good? Clearly, if the food didn't taste good he'd instantly be labeled a hack and the business would crash and burn.
Honest question.
>rather than the fact it honestly looks and tastes good?
Because it doesn't.
> Clearly, if the food didn't taste good he'd instantly be labeled a hack and the business would crash and burn.
Clearly not.
It's simply marketing your name, overpricing what you sell, and telling people they're too stupid to understand if they think it's shit. Then rich people buy it and can feel smug that they "know" the deliciousness of twigs tied to food.
Lol :3
The Emperors new cuisine.
Noma has some creative dishes that are definitely original, but the crazy prices are what annoys me. Same concept as an artist throwing together a painting in five minutes and selling it for ten thousand bucks. Is it worth paying loads of money solely to partake in someones creative mind?
>Because it doesn't.
You've eaten there?
>>It's simply marketing your name...
While I understand that such a thing could be theoretically possible, why do you think that's what's happening in this case? Do you honestly think the food doesn't taste very good and that there's some big conspiracy to pay off reviewers & whatnot?
The restaurant business is hard. People try things, and fail, to an absurd degree.
The high end restaurant business is entertaining. It's no different than dropping a bunch of money to fly to some exotic locale, or spending big money on tickets on a concert, broadway show, or tickets to the super bowl.
>pretentious hipster
I get it if fine dining isn't your thing. Most of us can't afford it very often, if at all. That doesn't change the fact that it exists, and at some times in some places someone basically turns the idea of what it can be upside down. 2003 Copenhagen it was Noma, 2005 NYC it was Monofuku, that same year in Chicago it was Alinea. I totally get it if expensive concept driven places aren't your jam. But this shit is news from a decade ago, back when people still used the word "hipster". Like it or not these places have been influential.
I'd argue that's more places like the 21 Club or Cipriani restaurants - where the food is very much secondary to the fact that it's the right place for the rich to be and be seen.
>Is it worth paying loads of money solely to partake in someones creative mind?
This is why art, fine dining, theater and top tier live music are expensive. Because for someone to execute the highest level of creativity they have to devote their lives to it. It is their day job. They have to spend all the time everybody else spends at work not just doing their thing, but coming up with ideas about how to do it in a way no one else has yet. Without a steep cost of entry they wouldn't be able to fund what they do.
They've actually changed the concept at Noma quite a bit and remodeled the restaurant (pic related). The courses are deconstructed and left in their natural habitat. This puts the task of foraging on the guests and really makes you think about what goes into each dish. It was really a spectacular experience.
>The courses are deconstructed
genius artists
> Do you honestly think the food doesn't taste very good and that there's some big conspiracy to pay off reviewers & whatnot?
It's a social thing. Being the one to say the emperor has no clothes might not be the best way to fit in with your peers.
There is a social thing to it, but I think you're overestimating it. Think about Dominique Ansel's cronut.It was the food craze of the season a while back, with lines around the block to get one. And yes, people lined up because they wanted to be part of that craze. But that doesn't change the fact that a cronut, while perhaps a little silly is also absolutely fucking delicious. Non-delicious food trends don't come from chefs. They come from health crazes.
>But this shit is news from a decade ago, back when people still used the word "hipster".
A decade ago they rarely used hipster, now they use it more since that attitude and culture has replaced emo as the go-to alternative culture.
Are you kidding? Back in 2003 when everyone in Williamsburg was dressing like the Strokes what did they call them? Hipsters. Today it's a term suburban and rural kids use to describe anything from the city they think looks funny.
Hipsters existing before doesn't change that their garbage gained more popularity around 2012-2015.
I have no idea what you're talking about, but I have no problem with city kids with a little extra money in their pockets supporting creative people who do slightly kooky shit. Where the fuck else is the interesting stuff going to come from?
Actually there's a lot to this. But in addition to not wanting to be the first to say it's overpriced shit, is not wanting to admit you've really got taken by an overpriced image centered con. It's self fulfilling.
>It's expensive and all my rich friends go there, it must be great. This tastes like a reindeer shit in a pine needle bough. But it's pretty and there are 3 incredibly rare wild berries sprinkled on top, so I guess I'm in heaven. Why am I hungrier than shit when I just paid $1500 for dinner?
New interesting shit comes from people trying new things and refining it into something at least half-decent before presenting it to people. Not people whipping up some random retarded shit and saying you have to appreciate it even if it can be confused for the contents of your trash.
who /Ostoriafrancescana/ here. Renzepi got cucked by the Italian Stallion Massimo
Rene's food looks outstanding, and his form is top notch. but his food lacks soul. Id say Adria had this problem too. but at least some of his stuff was traditional tapas inspired. Im sure Denmark has an outstanding food culture. but other chefs are picking up his ideas and running with it in a way thats far more personal. Massimo deserves that top spot. his food is literal Italian futurism.
>new shit
>creative because I'm bored, but muh, an "artiste." I'm like Dahli's theory of the cannabalism of the aesthetic
>nouveau riche. Don't know shit about food, but like image. Trophy wife said this is the place.
>hmm, reindeer shit on a stick of wild pine boughs with a sprinkling of 3 berries.
>$1500 sounds about right.
>New interesting shit comes from people trying new things and refining it into something at least half-decent before presenting it to people.
I would think the chef of what was considered the world's best restaurant for a number of years qualifies as that.
>Not people whipping up some random retarded shit and saying you have to appreciate it even if it can be confused for the contents of your trash.
This sounds more like sour grapes than a legit criticism to me. It sounds like: "People pay absurd amounts of money for something they claim is amazing but looks silly to me. I can't accept the idea that I'll never be able to afford it to see for myself so I have to cut it down as some kind of con for rich people".
And you're welcome to hold that opinion. Just be aware it sounds defensive. Like someone who has never tasted good Russian caviar claiming all fish eggs are disgusting. Or someone who has never had a good bottle of wine going on about how wine is a massive scam. Like I said it's a kind of sour grapes. It sounds like a resentment that good things exist that aren't available to you And that's just not a legit way to criticize something.
Whatever man, enjoy your pine branches.
Fuck no, man. I live in NYC. That shit is already dated. Like you can get it at Grand Central Terminal kind of dated.
I have a whole bunch outside my window if you guys are ever running low.
Noma is a not a restaurant for getting great food. It's a place to go for an experience.
Prove me wrong.
/end of thread
jesus fucking christ...that's a pretty earring
If I want an experience I'll go down to the fucking bowling alley with some liquor hidden in my shirt. Save myself the money and pretentiousness.
And the reindeer shit with 3 berries for $1500. If that's the height of "where it's at," then it's pretty easy to see why most aren't there. It takes a special kind of stupid to get conned like that.
We're already on to the next things. That's part of why it's not just a matter of having an interesting idea, but having it at the right moment. Restaurants aren't like paintings or recording. There are no Van Gogh or Jeff Buckley level chefs. You either get it right at the right moment or no one remembers you.
it really is, do you think its a real ruby?
>I will never be able to afford something so it must be a con.
And that's why your a white trash simpleton who will never have an opinion worth anything
>the barrio is not a place for great food. It's a place to go for the experience.
In point if fact, the barrio is a place to go for food, which is much more relevant than sniffing a reindeer's ass sprinkled with pine bough smoked lingonberries harvested by indigenous nordic inuits off the coast of icelandia.
Grow up. What part of the customer base haven't you realized is driven by a trophy wife, nouveau riche based "whose here? Oh, there's Smork Flipfuck from that reality show. I told you this was the place!"
Artist? Give me a fuckng break you wannabee celebrity chef.
> recurring trips
That really fined my dining.
why do they have napkins on their heads?
I like how quality posts like this go completely over the heads of Veeky Forums.
Fucking swine.
While there is certainly a lot to critisize about "high end" stuff like noma, all I read here so far boils down to
>I can't afford it, so it must be shit
>It contains pine needles, so it must be shit
>trophy wives
Grow up you fucktards.
> he doesn't dine with a napkin on his head
pleb.
this is a better comment on this thread than
this bullshit. why not just revive the tradition of the edible doormouse? at least that won't kill off a species.
All I read in this post:
>I assume anyone that criticizes "highend" dining is poor and could never afford it based on no evidence whatsoever.
>trophy wives don't dictate image building methods for their husbands
>2 bites of pine needles sprinkled with reindeer urine and turds, coupled with a rare, 3 lingonberry reduction of whale sperm priced at $1500, counts as art equivalent to Picasso or Charlie Parker.
You unutterable idiot. You have to be a cook somewhere.
Veeky Forums is 5% some of the most intense good discussion. 95% retards eating chili out of a can jerking it to MAGA anime.
Ck should rise above. people need to stop acting like analyzing, and discussing art or philosophy is pretentious. your shitty hotdogs are not worth the time to talk about. make some good food to start. then start expanding. Ive been seeing more and more top class chef discussion lately.
Id like to explore more about the impact of some of these chefs. Rene has gotten the world into foraging which is respectable. Dan barber for all his good intentions cant influence people enough to change their ways. Whatever keeps people away from "Tasty Gifs" and involves them into real cooking, and real creativity.
>Ck should rise above
nope. the point of this place is that we have people who think not eating tater tots is pretentious posting side by side with some folks who live in major cities and eat out at great restaurants, along with a few serious home cooks among the sea of college students and neets trying to figure it out. because their family lives didn't equip them for the situations in which they find themselves. At the end of the day everything beyond the fast food threads is at least a little useful to some people. Which is good for Veeky Forums.
Picasso was more than able to paint realistically, he just chose not to most of the time
to hid from god
en.wikipedia.org
>Rene has gotten the world into foraging which is respectable.
Michel Bras done it 20 years earlier
Euell Gibbons got people involved in foraging back in the 60's and 70's, you idiots. I forage. But I'm also the user that posted the ridicule of your bowing to a con man profiteering off of the nouveau riche and then placed on the level of Joyce, Picasso or Charlie Parker as "artiste du cuisine."
What nauseating presumption. Go fry up some rabbit bacon and sprinkle it with rotten quail eggs the mother abandoned, you sorry ass fry cooks.
Wow, that's some impressive butthurt
Blue Hill and Noma have caused me to rethink my cooking and my approach to meal selection
Sometimes ideas need a revival, and if nouveau rich profiteering is the driving force, so be it
>tfw rich as fuck now
>tfw getting bored
>tfw cucks say I'm redefining cooking
>tfw go to the zoo, see monkeys eat ants on a stick
>idea.png.jpg
>tfw gonna charge $30 for this
Only $30'?
Black Friday was last week, my nigga!
>Dan barber for all his good intentions cant influence people enough to change their ways.
Maybe, maybe not. This is pretty outrageous copy from Eater: eater.com
Like it or not novelty counts. It's barely weirder than BK chicken fries or a Taco Bell quesarito. This shit happens at every level.
Bet you fuckers think that putting any other cheese than kraft on burgers is the height of innovation.
Needs twigs and rocks
Shoo underage b&
In my twenties.
different types of restaurants derive their value from different things. at a diner you are paying for food that is hot, fresh, traditional and generous. when you go to noma you paying for food that is unusual, scarce and has lots of variety. assuming you have the money i think most people can learn to enjoy both.
...
I don't get why everybody is saying it's expensive as shit, it really isn't
,I checked once and we could get a full course meal for around 150 bucks each.
Granted, your average student can't afford it but if you really like this stuff it really isn't outta this world
Getting a table within a reasonable amount of time, that's another problem
sometimes i put white cheese on my burgers
how much is it for a meal for two??
I just looked this shit up and the tasting menu plus wine pairing really isn't that ridiculously priced as a one off I would definitely give it a go.
Or you could just go forage your own pine trees, rocks, and ants.
I don't think it's really fair to compare food to art. There is definitely a creative element to food, but its primary purpose is to nourish. Art is not functional, it is wholly creative. I understand where OP is coming from with the apparent resentment of the chef who is bastardizing the base purpose of food. It is just a completely different thing, though, it is meant more to be entertaining ("creative") than nourishing. I think it's kind of silly but to each their own. It seems like we are reaching a point where everything of perceived value has to be entertaining or engaging and I am wondering if that is the direction more fine dining will take, or it is just an elitist trend.
>it is meant more to be entertaining ("creative") than nourishing.
i doubt that's unheard of in restaurants but i think most fine dining places know you can't get away with leaving diners hungry. i think if you put all the ingredients that go into a tasting menu in one basket it would look like a pretty fucking huge meal by most people's standards.
in fact as i have the fat duck cookbook i might delve into it and do the math.
What I mean to say is that there is a balance between entertainment value received from a meal and the nourishment received, and the balance is tilted toward the entertainment side in this case. There is nothing inherently wrong with that of course but I think it can turn people off, like OP
This really made me think
Yeah it's pretentious and expensive but you'll never forge the experience
>forge
typo - I meant forget
...
i'll never forget 9/11 but that doesn't mean i want it to happen again
...
$150
You'll never forget the experience.
...
...
...
>I don't think it's really fair to compare food to art.
Comparing food to art doesn't make so much sense when it comes to home cooking. But restaurants are not just food. They're entertainment. Even at the low end. The Big Mac attempts to wow you with it salty, greasy blast of two cheeseburgers, special sauce and unique architecture. It's purpose is not nourishment, but indulgence and novelty, because it tastes unilike something you could even make in a home kitchen. That's some modernist shit right there. And the fries that come with it are another luxury few would bother to make at home. One could make the case that a Bic Mac with fries and a coke are as much a piece of pop art as as a '57 Chevy, a Fender Stratocaster, a Rock-Ola jukebox or a poodle skirt. These things all served utilitarian purposes as well, but they were imbued with a style representative of the aesthetics and aspirations of the people who created them. They became iconic for their style as much as how well the fulfilled their purposes. They were not just a meal, a car, a guitar, a music system or a garment. They were pop art symbols representing specific visions of modernity that were exciting to people at the time. And over time became classics of a sort.
When you get to the high end of restaurant food the aesthetics get more extreme. Because it's harder to impress people who dine out often and are used to the food always being good. You have to take it over the top to make these people go "oooh, ah!". It becomes a bit of theater. It becomes a kind of art.
How much did it cost?
Beef tartare with ants
Fennel main battle tanks
>>tfw I sell this to them at 500% markup
Probably closer to 100000% markup, but then that's true for most high price dining. You don't pay for the ingredients.
Good one user
You guys are waist deep in the kool-aid to be buying this.
Kool Aid itself is pretty absurd if you think about it. But a better comparison in this case might be a Coke Freestyle machine.
Underrated post
...
...