There are no cities in Antarctica, but Elon "reddit" Musk says there will be millions of people on mars in decades.
Is he insane or a con artist?
Most southerly city: en.wikipedia.org
Millions of reddit neckbeards could die on Mars by the 2060s: news.nationalgeographic.com
Other urls found in this thread:
youtube.com
en.wikipedia.org
twitter.com
>Millions of reddit neckbeards could die on Mars by the 2060s
Who gives a fuck, I just wanna see shit happen, you feel me?
...
Ah yes, the average rebbitior's defense tactic, call others redditors so you won't be found out. How quaint.
Large scale development of Antarctica is prohibited by treaty, someone fucking around with it too much would cause WW3
Also for three months a year Antarctica receives zero sunlight so it relies on massive inputs of fossil fuels, in that respect it's worse than Mars.
>in that respect it's worse than Mars.
But only in that respect.
Think about:
>Basically no atmosphere
>Toxic shit everywhere
>High levels of radiation
>Low gravity
>No oxygen
>Pretty fucking cold
>Very, very far away
>Completely sterile
Nah, Antarctica is pretty much a fertile paradise compared to Mars. People who advertise "colonizing" mars simply have no clue what they are talking about, and so is Musk. He's just trying his best to be exactly the insane visionary that investors are paying him to be.
>basically no atmosphere
>pretty fucking cold
These two together are a benefit - a thick, cold atmosphere sucks the heat out of everything more quickly
>very far away
America was three months of travel away when it was founded, Australia even more than that. Again, that's the point - earth kind of blows when you can reach any location on the surface within 24 hours
>toxic shit everywhere
I'm legitimately curious what you're referring to with this one?
>America was three months of travel away when it was founded, Australia even more than that. Again, that's the point - earth kind of blows when you can reach any location on the surface within 24 hours
I'm not sure what you want to say, really. Mars is months away, so in case anything goes wrong, chances are every one is dead by the time help arrives.
>I'm legitimately curious what you're referring to with this one?
Perchlorates in the martian soil. Highly toxic.
>These two together are a benefit - a thick, cold atmosphere sucks the heat out of everything more quickly
Granted, stuff on mars will be neatly isolated.
Still, mars is absolutely hostile to life, much more than any place on earth's surface really.
>America
>Australia
When Europeans Reached America they found endless plains, Lush Tropical Islands and sprawling deciduous forests, it already posessed everything needed to sustain enormous amounts of life aswell as an abundance of rare resources (gold, silver, tropical woods, furs)
Australia was a Penal colony, it was also almost unpopulated and its coasts were covered in grasslands, the oceans around it were also filled with life.
Mars is in no way comparable to this.
>it's worse than Mars.
Lol. You could just send a tanker in with the materials and build a nuclear reactor. It would be millions of times cheaper than doing the same thing on Mars.
It's time for you to go back 2 reddit.
the technology of today is in no way comparable to the technology of 500 years ago
yea i just watched some video with him doing a speech, i mean, he's pretty good at propaganda, he could be a really good force in the world. This doesn't change mars and colonising it being literally useless and us continuing to ignore actual objectives and issues for our species. But nah: "wew we iz gona be interplanetary species, MAKE HUMANITY GREAT AGAIN!" that's as far as leddit's and the hypetrain participant's actual reasoning goes.
I also want to see millions of redditors die
That's not really a fair criticism of Musk. He's doing a lot of work to solve the energy crisis by getting us off oil.
>he could be a really good force in the world
I didn't actually critise Musk at all, I stated what he is and that he could be something good for our world.
Musk isn't doing shit except hyping projects up to ledditors, normies and investors. So that they don't go bankrupt and/or irrelevant. That's his role, but he's not doing any work to solve a supposed energy crisis, or any STEM work at all. He is contributing to facilitating other people to work on alternative energy, this doesn't mean such alternatives are actually better and it certainly doesn't mean they can be attributed to Musk.
>CEOs don't matter
Wow, an actual Occupy Wall Street faggot. I thought you fags were extinct on Veeky Forums.
a disgusting tactic if you ask me senpai
Musk isn't an inventor, he's a businessman.
Found the redditor
Yeah. So what?
>video with him doing a speech, he's pretty good at propaganda
He literally stutters on every other word
Mass colonization of Antarctica does a whole lot of nothing. There's little to no net benefit from doing it.
On the other hand, we stand to gain quite a lot from successfully colonizing another world. It would force us to develop and iterate our space habitat technology until creating space habs is as routine as building cars. It also gives us a place to launch further space missions from that has much more reasonable level of gravity, yet is still earthlike enough for humans to live at for long periods of time.
Lastly, if said colony can become self-sustaining it gives a nice exit for those of us who'd rather not deal with the petty bickering and inane politics of Earth. I don't care if life on Mars is 20x harder than it is on Earth, there's something gratifying about knowing that you're millions of miles away from all the fights over shit that never has and never will matter, nationalistic dickwaving, etc.
Why the Antarctic? If a large meteor hits the Earth you're equally screwed.
Literally the only reason for a mars colony is the back up humanity.
Otherwise we could just have an outpost, just like on Antarctica.
he is an attention seeker.
he would say everythink for attention.
>Is he insane or a con artist?
Why do you assume they're mutually exclusive?
>Is he insane or a con artist?
He's just the Vince McMahon of government tech. He's a promoter. The difference is that McMahon built a successful company and Musk still hasn't made a dime. His various projects have been kept afloat by billions of dollars from the US gov.
I'd rather see the money go directly to NASA rather than this reach around jerk off shit with Musk. He's just the figurehead of a quasi-governmental investment group.
>there's something gratifying about knowing that you're millions of miles away from all the fights over shit that never has and never will matter, nationalistic dickwaving, etc.
sadly, that seems to be natural to human relations, and the only way to change it is trough social studies and art, because they know how to control humanities feelings
when you send a lot of stupid scientist to mars who think that war comes from lack of resources, theyll be in the same situation in a matter of years
the XX century has proven that science does nothing to reduce conflicts and human suffering
today theres much more technology and resources avaivable than ever but more people living miserably
so we don't live in a computer??
I personally think a lot of the issue is the immense amount of baggage humanity has picked up during its history on Earth. A clean slate won't eliminate all of our problems but it will most certainly reduce them.
Even if a large meteor hits the earth, it'll STILL be FAR easier to survive on earth than it will be on mars. A large meteor hitting earth doesn't exactly mean that all life will be wiped from existence in an instant.
>earth kind of blows when you can reach any location on the surface within 24 hours
what?
That's not quite right. SpaceX and Tesla are making money, but that cash is getting poured right back into the company because in his eyes, neither company is where its needs to be in terms of manufacturing capability and products offered. Cash stockpiling will come only after that point is reached.
He's saying Earth is a lot less interesting now that you can travel anywhere on its surface somewhat quickly. It has no mysterious far-off lands or frontiers any more. What's over that hill on the horizon is no longer a mystery and everything is in reach. Nearly all that can be seen has been seen.
Ah yes, the average rebbitior's defense tactic, call others redditors so you won't be found out. How quaint.
Neither does Mars, its completely mapped. Earth does have those frontiers, both under antartica and under the ocean.
While we are on the subject of musks memes
is it possible or feasible in any way that each house in the world, or at least each city can depend on centralized off grid solar power
so that we dont depend of gigantic cable infrastructures?
is there any way this is as cost effective as what we have now? or a bit close?
It would be extremely expensive
You're taking it too literally. There's lots we don't know about Mars, and we know even less about how attempts at human civilization on its surface will play out.
As noted in other posts, Antarctica offers little, making it something of a hollow frontier. The bottoms of the oceans offer more, but in some ways are more unfriendly to mass inhabitation than even Mars is.
Yes, it's possible. More challenging in northern latitudes, but there you can lean on other forms of power (geothermal, hydro).
Only in the early stages. If you really are replacing the entire country's infrastructure, you're talking about massive scales – the kind that dramatically reduces cost. The price per panel would be in a nosedive throughout the entire process and by the end they'd be dirt cheap.
but if you create a panel that doesnt require mantainance or very little then you sovled it
no matter how much it cost once you do it its solved forever in that area
>they'd be dirt cheap.
how cheap, is there a study?
there has to be a limit to how much economies of scales can help
>Antarctica offers little
To foolish normies who can't appreciate the physical world in the first place sure. Antartica is one of the most interesting places in the world. If they get bored of that "big dumb block of ice" they'll just as quickly get bored of "that big dumb ball of iron".
In Antarctica you're still on the same planet as niggers
>you're still on the same planet as niggers
implying a mars mission would not be forced to be "le ebin multicultural swj peace symbol" by nasa to apeal to public audiences
it will have a nigger, it will hava a mudslime it will have a russkie.
>implying niggers other than the very few smart ones who act like white people anyway can get to Antartica
Mars arguably offers a lot more in the way of science. If manufacturing capabilities can be developed there we could be launching spacecraft 3x as large as what we launch here easily, making missions to the asteroid belt, gas giants, and even the Oort cloud much, much more feasible and within our reach. Even discounting manned missions, we could be sending huge no-compromises probes out instead of having to endlessly cut corners and make everything as tiny as possible.
For real though, global median IQ is projected to drop to 84 near the end of this century as Africa's population balloons to four billion.
Musk is South African, do you think he has illusions about it? Even a cold, arid, irradiated dome on Mars is going to be preferable to the Earth we're about to get.
>global median IQ is projected to drop to 84 near the end of this century as Africa's population balloons to four billion.
is that because african race is worst or because africa is undeveloped as shit?
Africans in Brazil, the US, Britain, Sweden, etc. are all pretty garbage too.
Fuck, there's even a miniature laboratory called the island of Hispaniola where you can accurately determine exactly how shitty any given square kilometer is just by how African the DNA admixture of its inhabitants are.
>If manufacturing capabilities can be developed there we could be launching spacecraft 3x as large as what we launch here easily
And we could do it on the Moon with even bigger craft. I'm not arguing we shouldn't go to Mars, just that if people think Antartica is boring they'll find Mars just as boring because they can't appreciate what they have now. Its like feminists who want more women in the game industry but can't name any of the women already in it who contribute a lot.
Africans aren't in any postion of power though. Even Obama doesn't give a shit about them and he is one.
brazil isnt a shithole too?
also, surviving racism is a very natural explanation, also the fact that they have the heritage of having been opressed for thousands of years.
you dont just educate a whole cultural group with 20 years of civil rights.
have a society with equal access of rights for everyone for a couple thousand years and then we can talk about proof for difference in intelligence between the races
>Even a cold, arid, irradiated dome on Mars
The radiation problem on Mars is consistently overblown. Surface levels are higher than Earth's, but still quite low. If your dome was multi-paned with the right gasses filling the panes and/or sleeping quarters had extra shielding the extra radiation exposure would be negligible.
The problem with the Moon is that it's almost as hard to get there as it is to get to Mars, but it's vastly harder for humans to live on, and any mentionable manufacturing capabilities are going to require a considerable permanent human presence.
> heritage of having been opressed for thousands of years
>have a society with equal access of rights for everyone for a couple thousand years
Jesus Christ man
>A clean slate won't eliminate all of our problems but it will most certainly reduce them.
This
It will give us a chance to build something nicer on a different planet learning what we have from shit that's happened in our past on Earth, however conflict will still arise over prety much anything and any conflict could blow up into an armed conflict no matter what. The great thing about our species is that know when to quit, or at least hold off the hostilities until both sides have rebuilt. (*i.e. truces, pacts, treaties, & cease fires*) War is pretty much an inevitability wherever you go.
There are certain things, like you could start from scratch with zero homelessness, illiteracy, malnutrition or a general tendency to break and steal shit when you don't get your way
>it'll STILL be FAR easier to survive on earth than it will be on mars.
And it will keep being that way as long as we don't make Mars colony self sustainable, but we have to MAKE them first. If we never go to mars, it will never be easy to live there. Who'd have thought?
I made this video to explain all of the elon musk hype
youtube.com
its just circlejerky 'we can do anything wow science is so amazing' for the sake of publicity and hype
Can't you just except the fact that all of Earth's major races have all evolved a bit differently? Also this
>also the fact that they have the heritage of having been oppressed for thousands of years
Is fucking retarded. Oppressed by who? Fucking every race on the PLANET has a history of some pretty harsh oppression, the only small groups of people that haven't live in almost perfect isolation form the rest of the world. Africans were oppressed by other Africans long before Europeans decided to start buying slaves. It was Africans who introduced them to the market of African slaves. I think the real culture of ghetto mentality and street garbage comes from the slaves that were raised in shit, and then there emancipated children just carried on acting that way because it was hard to integrate them into society. Especially since their former masters still saw them as retarded beast of burden.
>making money
they're making millions on the billions that have been invested. that's not a profit.
They can't do anything but reinvest the money they make. That's not smart business, they don't have a choice. Their only hope is that they make some breakthroughs in the future that allow them to recoup their investments and then finally make a profit.
I don't see the issue as long as they can keep the boat floating long enough to reach their goals.
And really, how else is a startup supposed to compete with deeply entrenched megacorps like GM and Boeing? If Tesla and SpaceX took the tiny incremental safe approach to business, they wouldn't have a business because there'd be no reason to buy their products. The only way they have even a shadow of a chance is by having huge, ambitious goals and forgoing any kind of profit for the first couple of decades of existence.
read this
have a society with equal access of rights for everyone for a couple thousand years and then we can talk about proof for difference in intelligence between the races
use logic
then stop being 15yo
then you can talk to adults
That reminds me
Did Boeing and Lockheed Martin always used to be full of inept money incinerating shitcunts?
I feel like at some point they had to have been at least marginally productive companies to get in the position they are now but now they are 300% cancer
Like if SpaceX can give disappointing results for a billion dollars, Lockheed can give no results whatsoever for a trillion dollars.
boeing and lockheed were given blank checks because they had to solve crucial problems for the american military
it was something like " as long as we are ahead of the soveits in airplanes and missile technology (oh and also win the space race) you can have as much money as you want"
nowadays the ussr is gone, but the nidustrial military complex is deeply ingrained into the american goverment, you cant have an american goverment without those corrupts baby kilelers
I don't have any particular issue with it either. I just think it's important to countersignal the jerking that goes on around Musk. I'm not accusing anyone here of treating him this way, but I often see him portrayed to rubes as some kind of scientific genius when he's really just a good businessman who made some good moves during the tech boom and dot-com bubble.
I also get rustled when I see the media report on his companies as if they're private endeavors when most of his funding comes from the government.
I'm also unconvinced that Tesla is worth the money. I don't think it should receive the funding it does.
A better argument could be made for SpaceX.
But again, I'd rather the money just go to NASA.
It's also a symptom of how they do things. They manufacture very little themselves, instead gluing together pieces manufactured by an endless network of subcontractors. Incomprehensible amounts of cash disappears in this network to no good end, bloating costs far beyond what they should be.
And worse, because they've been doing it this way for so long there's no way they can bring it all in-house to cut costs without first spending colossal amounts of money building the necessary infrastructure.
thats how you do things when money is no issue. they are stuck in the short term mentality. if you tell them to rid a house of ants they set it on fire, technically mission accomplished
its what they did with the moon missions.
-Hey, we need to wint hat moon race no matter what!
-Ok, give us 10000 times the budget than the soviets.
-Done
american defense contractors are like a robot who takes orders too literally, you have to be careful what you say to them
It's pretty easy to prove.
For a long time, lower class people of white European ancestry achieved very little scientifically, culturally, etc. The odd exception.
As these people became more emancipated, from serf to going to the same universities as anyone else. This changed, it's not equal, but it's getting there.
The point is there is no significant genetic variation between the white European classes. (Back in the day the upper classes sure claimed their was though), yet whole swathes were considered intellectually inferior.
But we also have a more diverse comparison - post colonial Africa vs Asia
For fuck's sake British influence in China and in South Africa ended in practically the same year, look how different the intervening 20 years have been. Was it because the Chinese were treated more fairly and equitably by Europe? L o fucking l
>British influence in China and in South Africa
Haha no. People of British and Dutch descent stayed on as the ruling classes in SA until the 1990s.
Britain never even really colonised China. Just administered a few treaty ports.
>the 1990s
As in the same time the British government departed Hong Kong?
Has SpaceX not been more efficient than NASA?
We are on the verge of a bizarre year when SpaceX can send astronauts to the ISS and NASA can't
That's a little hard to judge when NASA doesn't really make spacecraft. They've also got to contend with dumb-as-stump politicians meddling where they shouldn't.
NASA could make more efficient use of their funds but to do so would require a level of autonomy much higher than what they have.
Does Elon Musk trigger Veeky Forums because he proves that normie attributes like drive and ambition are necessary to accomplish anything?
I would like to see NASA given a much larger budget and greater autonomy that would allow them to take on these challenges.
This stuff should either be done in-house or they shouldn't be taking our money for it at all.
I don't like the current endless kaleidoscopic fractal jerk of government-affiliated contractors and subcontractors.
Literally a car salesman
>I'm not sure what you want to say, really. Mars is months away, so in case anything goes wrong, chances are every one is dead by the time help arrives.
The point was that the same was true of all voyages we have undertaken.
So, you're willing to give up conspicuous consumption? The present economic architecture is the procuring of natural resources, converting them into products for consumers, and processing them into trash. High turnover rate. The casually discussed solution to depletion concerns are to mine asteroids with technical handwaving.
Tabula rasa. You have to purge this malignancy or society will never live within the bounds of the petri dish.
Those are all symptomatic of deeper seeded human inconsistencies.
No, it's a self sustaining engine of status lust and corresponding counterbalance of hate.
That and Mars is a colossally stupid idea.
Just like Europe huh? The marxists sit 20 miles off nigger coast and wait there picking them up
>the marxists
What marxists? Why are they bringing black people specifically into Antartica? And why wouldn't they just able to take them to Mars?
he thinks marxism is what the liberal media wants him to think and not some god tier philosophical-economical theory that would require him to read 1000 books to even start to comprehend it
I think he means IF Antarctica became colonized and prosperous.
"Coast guards" bring back the refugees to the EU, even if the refugee's boat sinks 20 miles away from the coast of Morocco and 600 miles away from the coast of Italy.
people don't want to go to mars because it's a nice place to live you fucking moron.
congrats on missing the entire point
>There are no cities in Antarctica
en.wikipedia.org
city != research station
you're going to have to do better than that
there's literally nothing to do in antarctica
that's the defensive reason. other reason is to show that we can, to slowly establish refueling station for planet hopping, resource mining and such.
the death of our sun in some billion years will get you on mars too.
If we are ever going to become an alpha species in our galaxy and leave this solar system, going to mars when we are able to is a MUST. There is no progress otherwise.
It's that or stay on earth like beta cucks that are no better than niggers.
development beyond temporary science outposts are not allowed on Antarctica.
If I could find a geothermal power acceptable sight on Antarctica. I would build an underground cavern city like i'm a Drow.
For you
It's pretty simple, space is just more exciting. If the only issue were colonization we have plenty of vacant places here on earth that are much more favorable than Mars and the moon. eg: the deserts, the tundras, under the ocean
What would building cities on Mars change other than the fact that there are apparently no cities on Mars?
As soon as it's physically possible to live on Mars, people are going to do so. It sounds crazy to say there will be millions in a decade, but then look at the vast flow of millions of Europeans to America during the 19th and 20th centuries.
Take a bunch of the world's fittest, smartest, wealthiest people and force them to actually work to survive instead of reveling in luxury.
In other words Earth would get glassed by the Martian Empire within two decades.
>>Lastly, if said colony can become self-sustaining it gives a nice exit for those of us who'd rather not deal with the petty bickering and inane politics of Earth.
You'd rather trade it for petty bickering and inane politics on Mars? Seems like a lateral move. I'm just saying, unless there is gender equality on Mars, you'll have feminists. Same for Racism, Classism etc. The issues you're trying to leave behind on Earth? You're carrying them to Mars. You, personally, are doing that.
>zero homelessness
Until you run out of spare rooms in the habs.
>no malnutrition
If nanofabs become a thing, sure.
>general tendency to break and steal shit when you don't get your way
No children at all ever or heavy screening into which adults can join?
I really love the expanses take on this.
In leviathan wakes, the pop of earth is about 30 bill, but the majority of them are on welfare. While mars has a pop of 5 billion but every one of them has to work there asses off to survive.
Result: Mars is more powerful than Earth despite the fact it's grossly outnumbered.
>No children at all ever
I'm referring to "children" of a metaphorical variety. Some little cunt may well throw his iPad on the ground because his mommy didn't get him the newest app but that's not the kind of Child that demonstrates how upset they are by burning down a city block, smashing and turning over a bunch of cars, stealing a bunch of televisions and sneakers and then shooting at police officers.
boy, i don't like your tone.
>Classism
Literally what.
Class exploitation is a material process you dolt
"They don't like me because I make less money" is fucking nothing