Electroconvulsive Therapy

In the real world I would never have enough time which just adds to the pressure of how bad I already feel.

I know it was a retarded choice but how come I got fucked up so much worse than other people did in the thousands of papers published on ECT?

U should chill, I had pretty bad tbi and now I am doing ok. Takes time to recover. GO at ur own pace

dude, fuck off, he was very unlucky. plenty of people are satisfied with ect depending how its done.

whats ADs

that sounds really fucking awful. but my attitude towards that kind of thing is wait it out and see if anything changes. perhaps you'll discover something new that you didn't have before. wait at least a year or two before you start seriously considering suicide

I'm already ending 21 and my medical and academic records and permanently fucked from this point forward. I fear death too much and that is probably my real problem.

same.
i know what you mean.
im at the edge.
i cant remember things, i cant keep in mind what im going to do, i cant think, i cant keep track of time at all, just runs away, i cant make any decisions. at all. my dreams of academia are dead in the water.

>people are satisfied with ect

You know what people are also satisfied with ? Homeopathy. Just because people are satisfied dumbasses doesn't legitimize the practice.

>why did I have the adverse version of the side effect?
The reason that ect is controversial is because of the possiblity of extremely adverse effects. This is literally listed on the fucking wiki article, and is engrained in all the over the top pop culture references to it that have been created.

If you wonder why all the papers were wrong the answer is that psychology isn't a real science, it is social science. Most of the results are fudged bullshit. look up the current reproduction controversy tearing apart the APA.

scientists tend to view life very objectively, don't you realize you can literally do whatever you want?

ECT is a relic of the age when people with an incomplete understanding of neuroscience and electricity thought the human brain would be so simple that you could zap it with some current in order to "reset" it.

It's a permanent reminder of "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing"

ECT obviously didn't help you. You still sound like a faggot.

Guess Mike Pence was wrong.

I went through ECT a few years ago and after 37 sessions refused the final 3 of the 40 total due to similar concerns with cognition, memory, nominal aphasia (forgetting certain words temporarily). That being said I now feel I was overreacting when I stopped treatment. The memories that I lost of the time around the treatment have essentially returned and although some memories from the few years preceding the treatment are gone this is more likely due to the fact that memory deficits are a common problem with major depression.

All that being said the year following ECT treatment i returned to university and am doing well. My point is that although the effects of ECT are disconcerting it is still, statistically, the most effective treatment for major depression that there is and that you, as has been said above, need to give your body and mind time to recover.

Finally you should be speaking to a doctor about these issues and not asking Veeky Forums.

dont be silly. ect is considered relatively efficacious and its thought we know about the neural mechanism behind it.

can you fuck off. replication isnt just in psychology.

this is a thread about some guys problems, its not about you trying to delegitimise psychology so please try to stay relevant or fuck off.

says someone who probably doesnt even read psychology literature let alone about ect.

What electrode placement did they use for you, user? Mine was bitemporal, so now I can take a razor through my forehead and not feel much pain because of the fried cranial nerves. It's now also harder to focus my vision and I keep having tension/pressure sensations in my head. Did you notice that too?

*bifrontal

shit i wish they actually gave me bitemporal.

i dont think either have been shown to be consistently better than the other. especially not in terms of side effects. u were just unlucky.

So hey guys they're actually offering me more ECT now to treat my depression. I can start next week and do 6-12 more sessions.

Is there any chance it could paradoxically undo all the damage previously done to my brain?

i dont think so. youll have to do other stuff and/or get drugs. are you depressed right now?

Yeah just make yourself fully mentally retarded, that will probably cure your depression. You won't be unhappy when you can't remember where you shit last.

I'm interested if this actually holds any validity.

>ECT = Brain Damage

I stayed in the hospital a long while on a psych ward.
All the people who went for ECT had short term memory problems that eventually went away

Come on gentlemen I need to hear some words!

fuck magnets bitch

Enjoy your 21st century lobotomy op

>pharmacy school

you're depressed because you feel the need to make X amount of dollars per year or whatever social status that goes along with that. I bet you grew up upper middle class.

I know because I was once in your shoes. Suicidal ideation and all.

I cured my depression by going my own way and telling my family to go fuck themselves. I haven't even spoken to them in years and it feels great.

what do you do now? homeless NEET?

This is what I always have nightmares about.

Even though it has been three months do you think my brain will recover soon?

cingulectomies are becoming a valid treatment these days desu,.

Fasting helps recycle shitty cells out of your body, im not sure how this works in the brain, but I assume it would have the same affect as the brain is mostly lipids. Its hard to say though, I did a lot of nBOME and LSD about a year ago and certain texture still make me hallucinate. The brains a tricky thing, you could always do some crazy nature shit with your life like hike across the country or swim to the carribian. Its basically like suicide but if you succeed youre a legend.

science pls? citations?

bipolar fag here

I spent six weeks in an inpatient psychiatric unit back in Jan 2015 and they kept on trying to get me to consent to it

thank god I didn't

Also, if TMS is a thing why don't they phase out ECT?

Anyhoo having a legit mental illness is an all around death sentence and I genuinely believe we and society as a whole would be far better off if they just gassed us all en masse.

why people always say 'don't kill yourself'? It's his live, if he wanna quit, he should

>if TMS is a thing why don't they phase out ECT
because its not been substantiated enough. thats what they say anyway. not enough evidence, information about long term effects. im sure they dont know too much about ect though. you can by TDS kits online though and some people do it on themselves. people dont recommend it but considering people do ect, it cant be that bad

>I genuinely believe we and society as a whole would be far better off if they just gassed us all en masse.

word, brother.

amen.

would you euthanise yourself though? why? why not? you can do it in like holland or belgium forgot which if you have depression.

OP here.

Can someone fill me in on the details of how screwed I am based on this article? The damn thing is too hard for me to read now: nature.com/npp/journal/v32/n1/full/1301180a.html

I'd love to help you but I have ADHD so I didn't read further that two sentences.

back to fapping I guess

>pussing out

ECT for depression is like fixing a detuned piano with a sledgehammer.

My schizophrenic/bipolar 16 year old brother got ECT for it and he says it has helped his symptoms.

He also reported a day after the shocks he feels like all his cognitve functions except memory was improved greatly. Could be because schizophrenia causes more deficits than depression. Or maybe ur just a pussy

I would probably be happy if I could forget everyone I knew from before 1 year ago.

Org Chem major with an addiction to diagnostic Medicine with a focus on Psychiatry and Neurology here (it's what I'm going into after I finish my BSc). If you want me to parse through any journals and summarize the data and findings for you, I can do so.

On the article linked, it mainly assessed memory as a metric of cognitive ability, rather than broader tests to analyze problem-solving capacity, IQ, etc. Their findings were that ECT correlates to retrograde memory loss, which is quite well known, I think.

The most relevant and salient passage for you, I think, is found in the discussion:

"The demonstration of differences in the long-term cognitive outcomes as a function of hospital setting and treatment technique supports the conclusion that some forms of ECT have persistent long-term effects on cognitive performance. However, the findings do not indicate that the treatments with more benign outcomes are free of long-term effects. It is noteworthy, for example, that most cognitive parameters were substantially improved at 6-month follow-up relative to pre-ECT baseline, presumably because of the negative impact of the depressed state on baseline performance."

In summary: even though poor cognitive function occurs after ECT, it has usually improved by six months after treatment. Besides this, cognitive function is usually better than it was pre-treatment anyway, but they had insufficient data to compare it to the pre-morbid (pre-depression) level.

Later on, they mention that high premorbid IQs correlate to better outcomes, which is good news for you if you were in college with a realistic chance of entering Pharmacy school prior to your illness.

For advice on your present predicament, why don't you ask your doctor for modafinil, atomoxetine or other drugs that improve alertness and working memory? You will recover eventually in all likelihood, but if you need to become functional in the interim there are plenty of chemical ways to cheat.

You're 21 years old? Because if that is the case, you will probably recover from any brain damage you've sustained shortly. Still sucks, but you'll definitely never get better if you kill yourself.

>stellar quality post that Veeky Forums should collectively strive to make

Love ya brother.

> *anti-alzheimer drugs

Quality post for sure.

Definitely give it some time and seek systemic treatment in the interim. There's nothing wrong with taking a prescribed amphetamine daily, that's what they're designed for.

Are you still feeling depressed? There's a novel treatment surfacing right now involving a low-dose Ketamine infusion -- and data suggests that it has an *immediate* benefit on treatment resistant depression patients. Don't lose faith in neuroscience/psychiatry. A lot of anons on here like to say that it's all pseudo-science/BS, but treatments such as ECT and the ketamine infusion, for instance, are founded rigorously in neurochemistry. It's a tough field because brains are so variable among patients leading to inconsistent success in drugs and other regimens. Stay in touch with your psychiatrist and don't hesitate to seek other professional opinions. Like all of medicine, physicians have philosophies about treatment and you need to find someone with an ideology that works for you.

Hahahahahahahaha How The Fuck Is Depression Real Hahahaha Nigga Just Ride Your Bicycle Like Nigga Play Some Vidya Haha

>not a doctor
>stop taking your meds user :^)
wew kill yourself

I warmly welcome you aboard the FUGGER EXPRESS.

>ride never ends

N I C E T R I P S !

>ECT
idiot

>My working memory is bad, I can't think of coherent thoughts in my head for conversations, it's difficult for me to drive a car now that my attention and processing speed are shit, hand writing has gotten worse, typing is slow and difficult, developed more useless compulsive behaviors, don't have the motivation to do even simple stuff like cooking a meal from scratch, and it takes me like three times longer to solve problems or equations I used to do.

i literally just posted this on Veeky Forums, it might be relevant to you:

convince your doc that you have treatment resistant disorder (this might take a long time - he will rather turn you into a lab rat for various anti depressants first), then get yourself that sweet, sweet ritalin. just don't give up hope.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treatment-resistant_depression#Adding_medication
>Stimulants such as amphetamines and methylphenidate (i.e. ritalin) have also been tested with positive results but have a high potential for abuse. However, stimulants have been shown to be effective for the unyielding depressed combined lacking addictive personality traits or heart problems.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2738590/

also look out for this one
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esketamine
it will hit the market soon.

NDRI > shit > poison > SSRI

norepinephrin will make you alert, dopamin will make you motivated. NDRI's will increase both of these in your brain. methylphenidate is an NDRI.

NSI189

op back again.

>feeling even more agonizing regret and guilt at the moment with the story below

I just went on a night-time drive in heavy traffic and it was fucking hell. All the oncoming traffic beams and street lights was distorting my vision significantly. Whenever I looked away after encountering some light I would keep seeing traces of it in my vision. My eyes kept getting strained and tense and my face and region around my eyebrows felt heavy. Never had problems with light sensitivity or facial tension before ECT. Coupled with my shit visual processing speed and reaction time I felt like a dead man driving despite being a perfect driver just 6 months ago.

Worst of all I had 30mg dextroamp today and I felt decent before starting to perform demanding tasks. Then I just felt numb and lobotomized with this empty stare on my face literally like a fucking vegetable.

Any med-anons care to speculate as to why this is happening? Could it be some cranial nerve dysfunction or seizure threshold malfunction following the ECT? Any potential remedies for this physical portion of clusterfuck symptoms?

I would honeslty stop the dex and just wait. D-amphetamine has been shown to have long term neurotoxic potential, the same thing, regardless of what side effects you experience now, has not been found true for ect. In fact it is the opposite. At the very least lower your dose. 30 mg dexedrine was a medium recreational dose when I was using amphetamine, it is to high to take daily and I would recommend lowering it.

You could give noopept a try. It improved my memory.

LSD... seriously... try it.

are you just shoving shit out of your ass asshole? it's the levorotary stereoisomer of methamphetamine that's neurotoxic you absolute retard that's why we switched from it

D-amp is neurotoxic too, but only in really high doses (as in, above 100 mg).

>The first bad thing you did when asserting the ways to treat your depression was taking ADs, that shit really does not work long time and you should quit it as soon as possible, most of the time it makes things worst, disrupting the chemical balance in the brain.

You have no clue what you're talking about.

It's true though. ADs are supposed to help you get back on track. You are not supposed to take ADs for years. At some point it's time to phase it out.

maybe true for some, but
not necessarily.
Would you recommend taking away a crutch from a one-legged person, claiming it should have grown back it's leg by now?

it is basically introducing a lot of noise into the signal patterns of your neural net to hopefully change those old bad patterns.

But it's a total crapshoot since you don't know what the changed patterns will look like and you are damage to the underlying structure (your cells) in the process.

this whole thing should probably only be the very very last resort.

i read that a likely mechanism is that the electrocurrents stmiulate neurogenesis in the hippocampus. a mechanism linked to antidepressant affects of ssri's and exercise.

>Posting a rare pepe for good luck.

You do not know what your talking about, cunt. d-amphetamine is much more neurotoxic because d-amph is elevates dopamine in the brain and prevents the reuptake of the dopamine, resulting in auto-oxidation forming 6-hydroxydopamine which is a neurotoxin. Also amphetamine depletes endogenous antioxidants which results in all around oxidative stress from the pro oxidant metabolites of amphetamine. Glutamate excitoxicity is another mechanism of amph neurotoxicity. l-amph is more of a cns stimulant, resulting in a lot of peripheral physical stimulation, and not a whole lot of mental stimulation. Hence why they used to use l-methamphetamine for cold treatments, because the l isomer is pretty much abuse prove and not neurotoxic. So no I am not talking out of my ass amd I am also not going to bother with this thread anymore even though I personal experience with my brother getting ect treatments for schizophrenia when he was 16 because you have proven to be an absolute cunt when I am just trying to give help.

There is no definitive threshold for neurotoxicity and it hasn't been shown to not be neurotoxic in humans at theuraputic doses chronically. Even if not neurotoxic at theraputic doses, it still has been shown to downregulate dopamine long term in theraputic patients. But ya for primate studies, typically the doses to model neurotoxicity are above 100 mg.