Electricity>speed of light

>not giving references for the letters used
you get the idea or you are completely retarded, in fact the waves do advance trough space and so do electrons.
1. Why ound speed? What is the name of this property and when and how was it discovered? Also it probably was me if you read this yesterday, but got no answers kek.

2. I know this already. I know newton's work

>Electricity -- the electromotive force -- goes through wires a bit slower than light
cool finally somebody answers the question. But how do you calculate this?

i guess you mean c/n
speed of light/index of refraction
It makes litttle sense since we are not talking about photons but electrons and light cant get trough copper, so how ould you knwon its refraction index?

>you get the idea or you are completely retarded, in fact the waves do advance trough space and so do electrons.

Really? Cause I was under the impression that electrons magically appear out of nowhere and are a completely arbitrary concept because some moron with an electromagnet and oil drops "proved" it had "mass".
How can a "wave" advance when it is not even a thing? Do you think a "wave is a thing? Why?

I assume you're looking for drift velocity. It's rather long, but if you give me a minute, I'll write something up.

Push is transmitted through solids (and liquids and gasses) by one molecule bumping into the next one. Strictly speaking, one electron cloud being repelled by the adjacent one. The momentum goes along, atom by atom, like Newton's Cradle.
That's what sound it, a traveling pressure wave. It HAS to be slower than light because it's that electrical repulsion (which is just the trading of virtual photons) which carries it.

The first solid calculation of the speed of sound in air was made by Newton. His result was a few percent lower than the measured value. This difference was questioned. Now, you have to understand that Newton did not take criticism well. He was touchy and still smarting from accusations that he'd accounted to the behavior of gravity by hadn't explained what gravity was or how it was transmitted. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypotheses_non_fingo
He made up (fudged, in modern parlance) reasons why his number wasn't quite right and had to be adjusted. One had to do with the finite size of atoms and I forget the other. But it was wrong.
Speed of sound in gasses is the root-mean-speed at which the molecules move. That's a function of temperature and molecular weight. Hot air transmits sound faster. It's also faster in hydrogen and helium (which is why divers sound squeaky when breathing helium-oxygen). A sound wave is carrying energy. It represents a localized heating of the air. The molecules move a little faster. If the sound is very LOUD, there's so much energy that the faster-moving ones pile up against the slower ones in front and that's a shock wave.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drift_velocity
How to compute it.
pfnicholls.com/physics/current.html

>Generator harvests energy from moon orbit, slows the moon down, it destroys the whole apparatus

>Typed up a whole explanation.
>Hit f5.
>"Oh. Or I could have just done that."

Thanks for the explanations bro. But i still dont quite get how solids can transmit movement at most at the speed of sound... anyways

true. Maybe the stick could have some amortiguation to prevent this right? kek

pic related is what i meant to ask.
I asume it is sound velocity now i read your explanation

Again, it doesn't quite work like that. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drift_velocity

"Therefore in [copper] wire the electrons are flowing at the rate of23μm/s. At 60 Hz alternating current, this means that within half a cycle the electrons drift less than 0.2 μm. In other words, electrons flowing across the contact point in a switch will never actually leave the switch."

look what i found in some brainlet forum.
>in general, in the conductors, you find velocities of around 50% and 99% c
So you are not geting my question right probably

Bro it does. You are just not geting the question. I dont wait that * wire leght to turn the lights on...
see

>waves don't exist because a force isn't a material object
You're lucky I don't have any wojaks on my phone

>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velocity_factor
This is the speed of the actual signal.

Holy fuck, reminds me of like 2012 when these "troll face" memes were new.

>As the Earth slows down, angular momentum is transferred to the Moon and it's receding from Earth 2 or 3 centimeters a year
Wait, how does Earth spinning less allow the Moon to move away from Earth? How is momentum transferred through a vacuum when gravity should be a constant pull at set distances.

Basically. Because the Earth spins faster than the moon orbits, the Near side of the Earth tries to pull the moon along with it as it rotates. Newton's Third Law means the moon counters with a drag on the Earth's spin. This transaction of energy takes rotational momentum from the Earth and gives orbital momentum to the Moon.

This increased orbital momentum increases the Moon's orbital velocity, which "throws" the moon further from the Earth before Earth's gravity can redirect the velocity back towards Earth. This stretches the moon's orbit, which in turn makes it drift further from Earth.

The bulge of water isn't right under the Moon. So the moon is exerting a torque on the Earth.
curious.astro.cornell.edu/about-us/37-our-solar-system/the-moon/the-moon-and-the-earth/111-is-the-moon-moving-away-from-the-earth-when-was-this-discovered-intermediate

It's not necessary to have oceans. There are also tides in solid ground. The continents go up a down a little each day. It works in the other direction too. The Earth raises tides in the Moon. Because the Earth is much more massive, the Moon's rotation is braked much more. (Also, the Moon being much smaller, it had less rotational energy to lose.)
farside.ph.utexas.edu/teaching/celestial/Celestialhtml/node54.html
shows that the Moon became "locked" onto Earth long ago, so we only see one face.

Okay
So next question, will it reach an equilibrium eventually where the moon will just oscillate back and forth.. or is there a day where the Moon will leave Earth gravity well?

>thinking anything is a "material object" when on the micro-scale everything is compromised of motion and has no physicality.
>You're lucky I don't have any wojaks on my phone
>phoneposter

Yeah I guess that makes me pretty lucky.

thanks i think this is better
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_electricity
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propagation_delay

Current in a wire does not move at the speed of sound. says that the electrons move slower than a snail. Obviously, you can tug on a wire and haul something towards you without noticing the time-lag. Speed of sound in copper is about 3800 meters/second.
The "drift velocity" is slow but the electromotive force runs at near the speed of light and that's why you're not aware of any delay.
The tiny back-and-forth in is for alternating current. Under the impetus of DC, the electrons will get to the other side of the room -- eventually.

It would likely eventually reach equilibrium. When that happens, the Earth would also become tidally locked to the moon, so the same side of the Earth always faces the same side of the moon. Tidal forces would restore any perturbations (such as from large asteroid impacts or earthquakes) to maintain this equilibrium, it would be the most stable state for the Earth-Moon system. The moon is unlikely to get far enough away that Jupiter (the only likely candidate really) would knock the moon out into a heliocentric orbit.

However, the time scale for this is so long that it is likely the sun will expand and kill the Earth and Moon before the equilibrium is reached

Because there's only a finite amount of angular momentum in the Earth-Moon system, the process will slow and stop when the Earth also has one face permanently turned towards the Moon.
Pluto and Charon are already in this state.
There is not enough energy to cast the Moon loose entirely.

Once Earth and Moon are both locked, that's not the end of the story. The Sun also raises tides. That interaction will begin stealing angular momentum from the Earth-Moon system and the Moon will start to come closer again. Eventually, it will come inside the Roche Limit and disintegrate.
But that is a VERY long way in the future. The Sun may expand and engulf both bodies before then.

Neat.
Hope it comes to a stop over the western hemisphere.

Speed of sound in solids depends on the ratio of the density of the material and it's "stiffness"

potto.org/gasDynamics/node73.html

Stiffness is defined using Young's Modulus
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young's_modulus
The percentage a material deforms when load is applied. "Soft" materials, like rubber, have low Young's Moduli. Slap a sheet of sponge rubber and you can see the wave ripple outwards. A Slinky is even softer, in the sense that it deforms a great deal under minor forces. Sound still goes though the steel at a very high speed, but you can see the oscillations of the coils just crawling along.

A) No telling where the "Western Hemisphere" was be at that distant date. If you mean "North and South America", remember that the continents move. The Atlantic is widening, California is headed for Alaska, and Nevada may eventually abut Japan.

B) Another effect of the receding Moon is that its apparent size will steadily shrink. Eventually, it will appear smaller than the Sun and there will be no more awesome total eclipses.

so actually it can be up to 12ooo km/h. Cool, i knew that it travels faster on solids. Now this question is finally solved i guess.
Still faggots cant tell me how to calculate %c a copper wire has in >runs at near the speed of light
finally you understand my question, but not answer. My question is why is it "almost" speed of ligh and NOT 100%c. How to calculate the margin that will be lost?

>Electricity>speed of light
wut

fucking retard

ok i was wrong but it is almost the same so you are bigger faggots

That was covered in in the calculating velocity factor section.

wait actually this makes a lot of sense now, but what is the wavelenght of electricity?
according to this it could travel even 4 times faster than light
refractiveindex.info/?shelf=main&book=Cu&page=Johnson

>almost the same
10^2 magnitude difference

>nothing is a thing
t retard

vf=1/(k^0.5)
calculating k for copper....
>Metals have infinite permittivity as they completely negate the electric field inside their bulk. I.e. infinite resistance to setting up of field and hence infinite permittivity. But this case is more valid for perfect conductors as realistic conductors would have defects and impurities.
so the vf is 0? lol

At 60hz the wavelength is 5000km.
At 100000hz wavelength is 3km.

Nope
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drift_velocity

>10^2 magnitude difference
wrong

Thank, Trumpdaddy

so what is the VF at 60hz for copper?
REEEE read my question better...it takes nearly 0 second per meter. Do you wait houre until your lights are on? NO.

Because the speed of light is lower within solids. You (or someone) asked how you know the index of refraction when a material isn't transparent.

Maxwell didn't measure the speed of light. He knew the magnetic permeability of free space, and the electrical permittivity of free space. Combining them gave him a velocity for freely propagating waves in a vacuum. See illustration.
But those quantities can also be measured in non-vacuums. In air, in water, in opaque materials. In solids, the values vary with frequency, so different frequencies of light have slightly different velocities.
This can be checked by using radiation which copper and steel ARE transparent to. Like X-rays. They're refracted, just as they should be.

>Nope
according to everybody on google, yes it is infinite so you are not answering...

A refractive index less than 1 does not violate Relativity. It's the phase-velocity.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refractive_index
A continuous, never changing, wave cannot transmit information. You have to modulate it. Any change you make only travels at the group velocity.
physics.gmu.edu/~dmaria/590 Web Page/public_html/qm_topics/phase_vel/phase.html

I see. Do you know coppers refraction index? I found this online (pic rel)
YES, THAT WAS MY HOLE POINT. It does not violate relativity, ¿can you turn on a ligt in mars faster than the light will get there from earth?

*whole point
IT was, you can "transmit electrons" faster than light but it is not the electron, that nly travels like a snail, right?

refractiveindex.info/?shelf=3d&book=metals&page=copper

but you said the wavelenght is kilometers, so it is not shown there...

The electron travels like a snail.
The electromotive force (EMF) which urges the electrons into motion travels at lightspeed or slower. You can't "transmit electrons" or anything else FTL.

>This one thing is almost as fast as the fastes thing that can possibly exist
>This on thing is faster than the fastest ting that can possibly exist

I don't think they are the bigger faggots by questioning your claim, user

This tells you both speed and refractive index.

i was atually right, do YOU ae a faggot. The electron go slow, but the whole thing moves faster than light 4 times

If you mean the point where the line dips to around 0.25, that's the phase-velocity.
See It's no more FTL motion than standing on Earth and sweeping a flashlight beam across the face of the Moon means the "spot" is going from Copernicus to Plato faster-than-light.