Okay Veeky Forums, I have fallen for this meme way too hard. Is there any way to debunk the Simulation Hypothesis other than just to stop believing in it?
Brief Rundown: - One of these propositions is true >the human species is very likely to go extinct before reaching a “posthuman” stage >any posthuman civilization is extremely unlikely to run a significant number of simulations of their evolutionary history (or variations thereof) >we are almost certainly living in a computer simulation.
It follows that the belief that there is a significant chance that we will one day become posthumans who run ancestor-simulations is false, unless we are currently living in a simulation.
1. Intelligent life in the universe never reaches the stage of technological advancement necessary to run simulations.
2. Intelligent life chooses not to run simulations for ethical reasons
I think it's 1. Intelligent life always self destructs or fails to escape before a meteor wipes them out or hits the reset button.
Carter Nguyen
Interest bump. Does this not assume a specific logistical capacity to make simulations (i.e. not one but countless simulations) and a limited number of real-world living species? What if of 100,000 living civilizations only 2 can make simulations and then they can only logistically run, say, 1,000 simulations (or don't need to run more,) doesn't that tilt the odds toward reality?
Either way, it's fun food for thought but unfalsifiable speculation as far as I can tell.
Oliver Smith
>hits the reset button Get out of my head
Evan Sanchez
>Is there any way to debunk the Simulation Hypothesis Of course not.
Charles Nelson
"Using standard candles with known intrinsic brightness, the expansion of the universe has been measured using redshift to derive Hubble's Constant: H0 = 67.15 ± 1.2 (km/s)/Mpc. For every million parsecs of distance from the observer, the rate of expansion increases by about 67 kilometers per second"
> Using standard candles
Ian Reyes
if you wanna believe something, believe in our lord and saviour jesus christ
Brandon Bailey
...
Logan Phillips
>Simulation Argument
delet this
Christopher Nguyen
*a noodly appendage blocks your path*
William Lopez
>One of these propositions is true Well sure if you assume your conclusion then its obvious. The sticking point is actually showing that that's the case, which involves a large number of huge metaphysical assumptions. Going "there are many worlds, most of which are simulations so if you pick one at random its likely to be a simulation, ergo we are are a simulation" is comically simplistic.
David Morales
Until you prove it, it's just some stupid "woah dude" shit like all those other meme pop-sci hypotheses Like dude, what if we're really holograms in a simulation in a multiverse of possibilities in the mind of god on top of a turtle duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuude
Xavier Garcia
>the human species is very likely to go extinct before reaching a “posthuman” stage Not really. "Posthuman" is a brainlet meme, but brainlet subspecies will go extinct indeed. >any posthuman civilization is extremely unlikely to run a significant number of simulations of their evolutionary history (or variations thereof) Yes, it doesn't seem feasible to run such simulations. >we are almost certainly living in a computer simulation. No, infeasible.
Ryan Sullivan
So the claim is that there is a base reality and we're not exposed to it, because it's far more likely that someone is simulating our reality. Well how can you claim to know anything of a base reality to which you're not exposed?! It's circular logic and allows any conclusion to be true. Just as well, you could say, without evidence, it's far more likely that you've been reincarnated because the vast majority of organisms are not on their first life.
Dylan Johnson
Or simply that running conscious, experience filled simulations is not possible.
Carson Campbell
The simulation hypothesis is the 'intelligent design' of the millenial generation.
Luckily Karl Popper established falsifiability as one of many criteria that every scientific theory is held against.
The simulation hypothesis is not falsifiable and hence not scientific.
Into the trash it goes.
Blake Taylor
I don't even understand why people like this "simulation" crap so much. In philosophy, this is essentially called "Solipsism" and is regarded as an absolute irrelevant waste of time since the ancient fucking greeks. Why ? Because it is at the same time unfalsifiable and unprovable.It is the ultimative, most inconsequential, of all possible hypotheses. Wether it is true or not can not possibly change anything. At this point, every little neuron in your brain should just cry "Occams Razor" and throw it away, but it doesn't. Thats what's interesting about this xD Finally at least some of the more clever people have stopped believing in god (which , as well, is such an inconsequential entity) but for some obscure reason started believing in another proposition that is as stupid as the god thing and essentially defeated by all the same arguments. But i suppose transhumanism shows it's christian roots there.
Ethan Diaz
*le tips*
John Sullivan
>Is there any way to debunk the Simulation Hypothesis other than just to stop believing in it? Sure. There is one major issue excluded from the argument which is about as likely to happen as "regular traditional AI" is - the fact that the AI will most likely lead its existence with reducing entropy as its primary goal, and that the most optimal route for the longest possible time is to scuttle its matter inside a black hole and therefor ward that matter (and any other it devours) from the unstoppable heat death and decay of the outside world
Owen Jones
>If I reclassify my existence as a simulation without assuming this changes a single thing metaphysically this makes it less "real" What a stupid conclusion. Shit like this is why scientists should still consider philosophy an important part of their education.
For all intents and purposes, we are in a simulation. There is no proof in science btw. Just overwhelming evidence and support. >life begins >no observational past other than your own >facts and beliefs are handed to you that were discovered prior to your existence. >the closest thing we have to death is temporary stasis/sleep where our consciousness doesn't exist >pain is merely simulated and enough pain induction causes death (health bar depletion) >Afterlife speculated but never confirmed. Entities operate in accordance to Yolo the Mighty, regardless. >luck skill differs from person to person >future vastly obscure in the beginning and slowly becomes less obscure and more predictable as you develop your character
Laws of physics waste computational resources at the drop of a hat. The opposite of what we would expect if we live in a computer simulation. It is not a proof, but it is a good reason to believe we dont.
Lincoln Long
>pixels are discrete and so are photons ergo simulation Except this is based on the completely made-up assumption that for some reason continuous physical quantities are "more natural" than discrete ones, that they better represent the base reality, so photons not being continuous is a mark against us being the base reality. This assumption is based on nothing.
Ethan King
Could nothing be discrete rather than continuous in base reality, hence reality?
Dylan Anderson
We have no idea what the "computers" (if they are computers at all) that are creating the simulation are like. They could work completely different than computers inside the simulation.
Eli Ramirez
Sounds more like an argument for subjective idealism than simulation theory.
Jaxson Cruz
To be aware of oneself in a simulation is impossible using any rigorous context.
If nothingness itself is continuous then there is continuously nothing. If nothingness itself is discrete then there is sporadically nothing and perhaps reality exists and is a product of the "gaps" between discrete nonons.
Adam Martin
Right, you might want to stop with the LSD. To even begin attempting to treat the "nothingness" between realities as discrete or continuous you would an even greater amount of huge baseless metaphysical assumptions.
Nathan Hernandez
> an even greater amount of huge baseless metaphysical assumptions