Is western culture (not civilization) dead?

I don't see how eschewing superficial aspects of society, which only serve to embitter or grind you down, means you cannot embrace society and be a productive member.

You don't have to Keep Up With the Kardashians, obsess over what the vocal minority says, etc. This is simply unhealthy pathological behavior. Although I think mediocre and unambitious people like to partake in this behavior as a means to justify their lack of effort in life: "why try or do anything of value, society is shit and the world is a terrible place". Meanwhile, if you spent less time online or watching T.V., and more time connecting with your fellow man IRL and stepping outside the finite and frivolous inner bubble of millennial society, you would see the beauty and greatness of our civilization.

pics of your mom faggot

I think you are underestimating the degree to which many people feel alienated from society. It isn't an issue of stupid TV shows.

People feel alienated because they were indoctrinated by their well-meaning parents to believe they are Beautiful, Wonderful, Special, and Perfect. They are consequently hyper-sensitive, cannot fathom the concept of compromise, and are essentially pathologically self-entitled and self-absorbed. Combined with our safety net society, these people are basically in a perpetual state of neoteny and do not realize that life outside of our civilization is unforgiving and does not spoon feed or hold your hand.

We have unforeseen access to an incredible wealth of data, have unrivalled health care, hygiene, food and water quality, etc. Everything is setup for you to succeed, so long as you have a bit of a fighting spirit, survival instinct, and an edge.

Instead of simply rolling over and becoming bitter and depressed, the social irritation should provide a good form of antagonism that encourages competitiveness, healthy aggression, and the desire to strive for something better.

Why do people expect to be catered to? We have all these great benefits of society, including many stresses that encourage adaptation and strength.

Because they likely perceive that there isn't any point putting in the effort anymore.

That's a cop out. How does someone in their early 20s know that there is no point in putting in the effort anymore?

Western Civilisation was dead and buried by 1945. The 20th century is better understood as a wacky technocapital driven sci fi adventure rather than a continuation of 'western civilisation', whatever that means

>tfw you realize that it was the Boomers' plan all along to eventually die off and leave nothing but a society full of apathetic depressives behind to deal with their mess.

I think it's arguable that it died with World War I.

Jokes on them. I'm too depressed to deal with any of it.

>Is western culture (not civilization) dead?
Uh, no. You're living it.

Doesn’t this guy pull a massive cop-out and say any civilization which doesn’t follow his rules is “ahistorical.”

Being a zombie doesn't count as "living"

We also have the threat of nuclear holocausts and global warming.

And it’s worth noting that these could be related, at best, to mass plagues. No one can individually fight either.

>what is film, jazz, and rock music

Degeneration and the physical manifestation of Modernity.

Awful.

This It's almost like degenerative cultural aspects of America skyrocketed in popularity in correlation with giving rights to particular demographic groups.

Existential threats from war and environmental destruction/degradation have always existed. People who focus on the statistically negligible scenarios you mentioned should spend more time actively fighting against preventable things that WILL kill them or make their lives not worth living, e.g.: hypertension, obesity, heart disease, various cancers linked to lifestyle, diabetes, substance abuse, etc.

How many people do you know of who died during childbirth or from things such as tuberculosis, polio, smallpox, diphtheria, tetanus, yellow fever, measles, starvation, drinking polluted water, etc.?

People have this over-dramatic tendency to think everything is dire nowadays and wax nostalgia about the past. This is by no means a new phenomenon: all previous generations thought the next generation was "going to hell".

I am a cynical person yet I can't fall into this trap. I am too rational and logical, not to mention I am a biologist and a naturalist, so I actually have an understanding of how life actually is outside of our safety net society.

All of this "man up" crap doesn't mean anything to people who have been raised in a society in which masculinity and self-reliance have been completely demonized.

You cannot disengage from that non-sense is the problem. Social media shit storms is now leading to new laws being created.

Your ability to be left alone only goes as far as others wanting to leave you alone. That is no longer possible.

So much in this thread.

baby, you could say that we're living in the corpse of a civilization as much as we were in the 1700s, still clinging to their own perception of what 'western' thought should be
you know it's just some amalgamation of greek and christian thought and religion, generally be people without belief in their faith but still a product of it's cultural dominance
got the new 'modern classics' like hemingway camus orwell etc
what to you distinguishes the modern fetishization of 'classical culture' any more than that of our ancestors, whom we now believe to have lived as contemporaries to some of 'the classics'
I think it's just terribly difficult to recognize your position in history as you're still an active participant - history seems like 'history', when it's really still playing out all around you
neeeeeeeeed

there are places in the world you can live like its 1500s 1600s 1800s 1900s 2020s 800s and if there arent there should be, is the argument?

the argument and dissatisfaction from some people is that life and the world in parts and places and positions falls short of its seeming majestic and mystical and infinitely spectacular potential, people complain that it seems difficult for the ways of the world to be organized into an objectively better fashion, or subjectively, and maybe its not enough for the individual to just change and focus on themselves, for some reason

>watch tv
>black women on cnn says 'white people have no culture'
>everyone laughs
>even the other white people due to ""white guilt"""
>I can't say anything in defense because if I do I get called a bigot racist nazi and loose my job/livlihood
>modern architecture looks like nihilistic garbage compared to the greatness it used to be in the west
>music, movies, and art are all the lowest possible forms of quality and doesn't do anything to elevate our existence or give us meaning
>in fact we culture has become so secular we deny the very existence of meaning
>millions of third world shitskins are pouring into the west as we speak
>people work jobs they absolutely hate just for the sake of acquiring more material gains just to impress people they don't even like

Nah man the west is fine

globalist fearing /pol/acks are one step away from understanding why people support marxism, it's a shame really

>white people have no culture'
This is hilarious, not acknowledging the past 500 years of European culture actually takes an impressive level of historical ignorance

>you know it's just some amalgamation of greek and christian thought and religion, generally be people without belief in their faith but still a product of it's cultural dominance
Not true by the way.

Western culture = Uniquely "germanic" weltanschauung.

'germanic' culture was a bunch of fucking 'wuz kings' who got railed by the romans so hard
then they fell for the christ meme well past the rest of the west realizing that the enlightenment was the real deal and monarchs were for fags
thennnnnn they fell for the nationalism meme that the rest of europe was using as an excuse to justify imperialism and got themselves murdered and cucked from both sides

germans will go down as competent failures and you're delusional if you think they're 'the real west' or some shit

I want to agree with this but I never see anyone refute stuff like that point for point. In my mind what he wrote all stands...

I only use "germanic" as short hand for it, it's relation to past organisms is basically irrelevant to it's development in Spengler's conception of culture.

Classical = proportion
Oriental = unknowns
"Germanic" = infinities

Euler's identity would be the most succint summary of the "germanic" soul.

Nihilism is the logical conclusion of western culture, the difference between infinity and zero is a matter of semantics.

Germans are good but ultimately simple minded volk. They make good soldiers, good employees etc they just were not blessed with brains

>jazz
Circle jerking the music genre

frankfurt school argues that capitalism leads to a global consumerism and isolation, people are as valuable as their labor and the markets have no means to measure 'human dignity' or 'cultural heritage' so really don't give a fuck about it
In the same way SJWs cry about their cultures being appropriated for cheap consumerism you'll see equal numbers of conservatives crying about things like 'xmas' and efforts to make general-audiance advertiser friendly PC shit
both are the result of market forces, and these markets are reinforced by law (obligation to shareholder profits) even if no individual has the outcome as it's personal goal

'>people work jobs they absolutely hate just for the sake of acquiring more material gains just to impress people they don't even like' is like babies first glimpse of class consciousness, but he probably won't extend the destruction of cultures beyond his own fear of losing >western culture

Some of what your saying rings true regarding the nueroticism of upper middle class whites, but that fact remains we do not live in a time of high socio-economic mobility; education is harder to acess and more expensive the white working class is actually downwardly mobile. The Manhattan Press' line that these same people are 'priveleged' is surely some self-conscious plot to incite an ethno-nationalist revolution.

There are signs that the populist right is beginning to see the free market as its enemy (the 'globalists')...its still in an incipient and incoherent form but it must go somewhere; I just don't see how the politcal class can spin this fervor into a new foreign war or something. The anasthesia of the politcal culture however is the utter lack of any sort of intelectual or ideological base - half of the people think pink haired SJW's and international bankers are somehow the same thing and the other half are staring at their oewn navels

ITT: incels pretending to be le smarty

>tfw volcel

All incels are volcels user.

Yes, but they're not generally self-aware enough to realize it.

Hear hear. Can you explain to me your reasons? Are they religious?

Yes. I'm Catholic, and pretty devout. Saving myself for marriage, assuming I get there.

not enuogh

t. Noone contributing Nothing

people who blame globalists (aka capitalists in the modern world) will have trouble admitting that the free market fucking them while they decry all Marxists is a bit of a laugh
I am grateful that my demographic is unlikely to be the target of their misdirected anger tho

but both capitalists and Marxists are the enemy. They are derived essentially from the same moral base.

Tep kok, what a fucking cretin

Letting non-property owners vote was a mistake.

You're framing the SJWs objection to cultural appropriation from a Marxist perspective, completely ignoring the racial one.

Blaming a single group of people, aka 'globalists' or 'jews', is a cop out. I don't want to play the blame game and have the defeatist attitude that goes along with it. They are perhaps apart of a greater web of influences, influences that we don't fully understand. I would rather look within myself in order to conquer these burdens. I was simply just pointing out some problems of modernity.

What's western culture? Progressivism and liberalism? Lmao.

Why do right-wingers believe they can overcome modernity with esoteric garbage?
Socioeconomic conditions are, crazily enough, not solvable with fabricated cultural myths. It's the same old fascist bullshit that only an idiot can believe in. I hope you get killed by a tranny communist.

Because they are IRL losers and esotericism gives them a sense of unwarranted importance.

>'white people have no culture

This is somewhat true, in a sense, because "white" culture, western culture, has become the dominant culture of the world. All other cultures are only subcultures within it now.

>modern architecture looks like nihilistic garbage compared to the greatness it used to be in the west

Good modern architecture is as beautiful if not more beautiful than the architecture which came before it. You realize we have chosen to only preserve the most glorious instances of architecture from the past, right? Most of the other shit was torn down. Your reverence for past architecture is also due to a sort of chronological primitivistism (idealizing and fetishizing the past.)

>music, movies, and art are all the lowest possible forms of quality
> doesn't do anything to elevate our existence or give us meaning

So was most art and music throughout history. Do you think the lute playing in your average tavern in 1089 A.D was always a masterpiece? There are scores of folk which survive from various time periods which are just jottings by people with no renown. They always sound terrible. It is only the heights of art which we preserve. There's a reason why so few Ancient Greek writings survive. Only the best were copied enough to make it through the ages.

Are socioeconomic conditions the biggest problem facing human nature? Giving a shitty person who doesn't have their life in order a million dollars still makes them a shitty person. Money or social status doesn't automatically make a person better or more ideal

>Are socioeconomic conditions the biggest problem facing human nature?
Yes.

Try being a peasant a couple hundred years ago.
>Muh western culture.

Try being a fucking worker/peasant 100 years ago.

If you give a meth addict murderer a $100k will that improve his nature? Will he automatically become something generative and productive for society?

If you oversimplify a problem does that mean it's not a problem?

Well, he's right. If you believe sprinkling money on something will magically transform it, then you're hopelessly naive.

Okay so what other soley social or economic help could we give said man to in order to turn him into the best possible version of himself?

I'm not saying money/rehab centers/employment opportunities wouldn't help. But not all problems of the world are outward. Some can only be solved inward.

Holy shit, are you retarded?

If you think that's what is meant by a solution to socio-economic problems then you're no less naive.

Can't solve shit if there ain't no money Bubba. But you wouldn't know that you sheltered suburban fuck. Suck a dick.

You could spend the money on prison for him and changing the socio-economic factors that would create more people like him.

Incidentally, meth addicted murderers aren't really a major issue facing humans today compared to our tendency to start wars and destroy the environment for reasons of our own nature, so it's kind of irrelevant to bring them up in the first place.

Well, it's the socialist/marxist solution.

Jesus Christ user, you have no idea whatsoever what you're on about.

>mfw this idiot

The fact that you see socioeconomic conditions as "giving people money" is very telling. How about a discussion on the social degradation caused by unregulated markets, corporations becoming more powerful than any states, and widespread unemployment by youths in the post-industrial west?

The major problems of today are indeed socioeconomic, you simply have no conception of what that means, because you are drowned in the current economic paradigm where "prosperity is created by unrestrained private actors" posits a divine truth. Abandon the liberal meme and unironically read Marx and marxists.

>Wealth redistribution
>not socialist.

Capitalism is also a system of wealth distribution. That doesn't mean people pay criminals not to be criminals.

That's not wealth redistribution. That never happened on a grand scale. You absolute twat

I think you're confusing me with the other guy.

I think you're just plain confused.

Private property was redistributed in the USSR, though, right? That's what caused the Ukrainian famine to happen, after all.

The US is the one with the meth problem.

The "Marxist solution" has nothing to do with reforming capitalism with liberal welfare programs. The Marxist solution is a violent appropriation of industry and the processes of production, so that markets cease to exist and producing goods is carried out on a planned and coordinated basis. There are various models as how this is carried out, but that requires literacy in political economy.

And I'm not
you retard

There is no free market currently. That's why the right is becoming increasingly anti-status quo.

Keep your central planning marxist hands off my freedom.

Then don't jump into a conversation with him like you are.

Markets would just spring up anyway. A person could decide to build his own chair and then sell it to someone anyway. I don't see how this is much different to what's happened in the west with supermarkets.
>There are various models as how this is carried out, but that requires literacy in political economy.
And those models have all failed.

I will respond to whomever I wish, you dumb nigger.

Lolbertarians are endlessly funny. Just now that outside the US you're a laughing stock.

Then you're a retard with no theory of mind

How do I not have a theory of mind, whatever that is; is it because I disagree? Regardless, I reject the Marxist solution as I find it disgusting. I want the local populace to create their goods and be self-sufficient.

Do you have ADHD? You're just saying all sorts of random irrelevant shit

No, I'm not. You're apparently just illiterate and anally blasted.

k