Should I pursue a master's in English (to be followed by a Ph.D., of course) after I've finished my bachelor's...

yep, definitely undergrads

I was going to teach (Secondary), but I dropped out of the Education program. The undergrad has been incredibly easy.

I don't know what I'm going to do with it, to be honest. My plan is to go on to more education (whatever that turns out to be).

If that happens, so be it. At least I'm pursuing what I enjoy.

>How difficult is it to break into academia?
very hard
>What about getting hired at a community college?
pretty hard but not out of the question. pay is shit.
>do a "practical" master's (an MBA, for example, which you can do without having taken business courses at the undergraduate level)?
you're not getting into an mba desu.

>you're not getting into an mba desu.

I actually can. If I devote the rest of my elective hours to business/economics/finance, I could do it. My school offers a one-year-long MBA (online). The only prereq is a bachelor's.

Also:

>very hard

It's based on connections, though, isn't it? Not merit. Most of my professors aren't really . . . top notch, let's say. Then again, I'm not at an "elite" school.

online MBAs arent worth very much. MBAs are like law school - if you're not getting it from a top ~20 school it's kinda shit and not worth the tuition. and those kinds of schools are very pedigree based in terms of admissions.
its a blend of both. connections help a lot. hence why it's hard.

Well, thanks for the information, even though it causes me to doubt two paths that I thought might be desirable. Haha.

humanities academia is a bleak prospect, any good prof who doesnt want you to suffer should make that abundantly clear to you
if you're actually sure what that entails (like, really sure, not a vague idea of what it means but the gory details) and still want to go for it good luck.

Well, the master's/Ph.D. programs are geared toward pedagogy and academic presentation, right? Admittedly, I don't know a lot. But I know that you have to do a lot of stuff aside from just studying literature. And, in many cases, you have to work as a professor for several years before you make (or are considered for) tenure.

Am I missing anything?

>pedagogy
not really, no. pedagogy tends to be separate programs and most high tier humanities programs, while ostensibly purporting to have a pedagogical element to it, is just like any other research university's graduate department - it's a paper mill
>academic presentation
yep
>a lot of stuff aside from just studying literature
and even when you're studying literature, there's a HUGE element of reading secondary and tertiary sources that aren't the primary text, and also a lot of critical theory.
>work as a professor for several years
for people who dont get a nice tenure track appointment straight out of grad school (aka, 98%+ of people) it's usually a mix of adjunct professorships, writing tutorships, or leaving academia altogether. the first two pay (far) less than minimum wage and there's no guarantee that you'll break free from it, no matter how long you spend in that position.

pic related is job placements at yale. note a few things:
1. these are just the people who got placed. there are many who don't, even from elite institutions
2. note the prevalence of VAPs - essentially very lowly paid adjunct professorships teaching introductory writing/composition courses and basic stuff that may or may not fall in line with your research interests
3. note the prevalence of people teaching at high schools or doing writing tutorships

woops. pic related

here's harvard.

just remember if you're not at HYPS/oxbridge/berkeley/stanford/equivalent, it's gonna be way way worse. there's a step function dropoff.

you will regret it

Honestly you should just ask Reddit actual professors post on Reddit

Thanks for the help. Even though this is discouraging, it may prevent me from committing to a futile career path.

Yeah, I'll look at other sources and (eventually) talk to some of my professors. My decision obviously won't be based on Veeky Forums's advice alone.

>the gory details

Go on..

See:

Humanities academia is fucked in the ass. If you're any kind of normal person, I would only go if you (a) love the subject more than you love life itself, (b) spend your final year getting the inside scoop on what it actually looks like, including talking to a lot of professors and ideally grad students, and (c) you get into a top tier program, seriously top tier, that actually has a chance of landing you a tenure track position.

If you are a very abnormal person, there is maybe an argument for going if you meet (a) and (b) but not (c). Like, if you genuinely don't want to live a good life at all, and all you want to do is study your subject for another 5-10 years. And you don't care that you're going to spend those 5-10 years writing about a topic so niche that it probably won't even be "English," it'll be "knowing every single fact about some knock-off of Emily Dickens who isn't even that interesting but there wasn't a recent book on her so that's the book you ended up writing."

I'd still be in academia and go for the PhD even if I hadn't satisfied (c). I'd go do it at a total piece of shit university just for the hell of it, so I can technically have a PhD. But that's because I am a dysfunctional retard with no interest in having money or living well or having a conventionally successful existence and social status. I'd only still do it in the sense that even if I couldn't get a PhD, I'd just get a job as a security guard and still write my gay little books and articles, because I don't know anything else.

If you're like me, maybe you could consider going to a mid-ranked school, and you might even end up somewhere "OK" way down the line. But more likely you'll end up being an adjunct teaching slave or lecturer with no job security, travelling wherever the job market needs you, being looked on as second-class garbage by real academics, paid peanuts with no benefits, not being able to raise a family or do anything, and eventually bottoming out and getting something you could have gotten with an MA or even BA anyway. That's what happens to MOST PhDs at mediocre schools. Even a few from top tier schools still fall through the cracks and end up that way. It's not a good market or job unless you absolutely love the shit and want to do nothing else, OR you're just brilliant/well-positioned enough to treat it like shittier law school, where only the top 5 are worth attending.

I do love the subject and wouldn't mind studying an obscure topic that no one but me cares about. Also, like you, I don't care about conventional success (in the sense of having a lot of money) or social status.

The difference is, I'd like to have some stability for the purpose of getting married and supporting a family (because I want to and because of my religious beliefs, which stress the importance of family life/"traditional" values).

Slightly unrelated, but I was a NEET for 4.5 – 5 years. I'd rather not go back to the intense isolation that I experienced then, which is a strong possibility according to your formulation of a non-elite academic's prospects.

So yeah, I don't know. I actually found your post to be strangely inspiring (pursue your passion — the consequences be damned), but I probably can't/won't make that sort of leap into an ascetic form of academic life.

>I'd like to have some stability for the purpose of getting married and supporting a family
humanities academia is not for you, period.

>don't know what to major in
>don't find joy in STEM/am a brainlet
>no work skills
>no one can even hope to do anything without a degree
>humanities is a dying field anyways
What brand of bleach should I drink?

Honest advice here: become a high school teacher and work through a couple of shit jobs until you can find a position teaching older students. Depending on where you live, teaching juniors and seniors in advanced classes is actually preferable to teaching college students.
That's just my opinion, but I thought it was worth considering. Of course, the Pd.D is more prestigious, but it's a lot of debt/money/time for very little prestige.

Do you know what kind of qualifications it would take to land a position at a place like Boston Latin School or similar public school for smart rich kids?

But you'd probably still need an MA to teach at an elite secondary school.

Plenty of filler subjects to study. XY management, communication, social studies, etc.

Practice asking folks, "Paper or plastic?"

I don't need to practice such a simple remark.

Lawfag here, don't really recommend it but I have to admit it's not the worst path to take. Don't bother unless you can get into a good school though (either T14 or a regional powerhouse).

Go for it.

Stop falling for this fucking meme people

Its easy man just write a bunch of thesis about the patriarchy

Anyone knows what it's like to study at Western Sydney? Any other good Aussie unis are welcome. I'm there's some Melbournefags.

bump

Do what you want man. I know some people in the process of getting English PhDs, so I guess I can chime in here. One thing to be aware of is the fact that the supply of English PhDs far exceeds the demand (as far as teaching positions go) by about 20x. Also, lots of people want to become teachers until they actually have a go at it and realize they fucking hate it. It's also a lot of debt to take on unless you are going on a scholarship or something. Not trying to scare you out of it, just a few practical concerns to be aware of. The flipside is that you get to continue your education well into your 30s while your friends stagnate intellectually at dead end jobs that make them contemplate suicide (speaking from experience).

>I'm a straight white male, by the way. I'm also in my mid-twenties — I started late.
This is not a big deal, but if your ideological views don't conform to those of a typical English department (Marxist, feminist, etc.) you will probably hate it.

lmao are you fucking kidding me?

What do you mean meme? Getting a law degree doesn't necessarily require you to become an attorney.
Also if you decided to become an attorney you will, provided you have a brain, be far more wealthy than most people.

>the supply of English PhDs far exceeds the demand (as far as teaching positions go) by about 20x
i knew this would be the case
but i wish it wasn't

i mean weren't.
is it at least not retarded to get an english degree senpaitachi + what can one do with one

P A G E 1 0 S A V E R A V E

weeklystandard.com/so-youre-getting-a-ph.d./article/1059359

read this and cry

bump

This is not a good attitude to have unless you have a way to not put yourself into tens of thousands of dollars into debt.

This is the best part of the article

i cant believe americans get mba's and mfa's, they dont exist in my country and are considered a scam.

Lawyer here. It’s horrific. Constant stress, long hours. Only do Law if you have no other hobbies or dreams and are already in a committed relationship.

You learn a trade. They are shitty jobs but suprisely pay well.

can't go wrong with good old Clorox
unless you have some sentimental connection to another brand

impressive.

It’s not that hard. I’ve never been near Ivy League and make 190k a year as a professor/chair

Lol, my professor is on here. I should ask him more about this.