Hart's New Testament translation

nvm I just read the description and it could be printed on a fedora.

>David Bentley Hart undertook this new translation of the New Testament in the spirit of “etsi doctrina non daretur,” “as if doctrine is not given.” Reproducing the texts’ often fragmentary formulations without augmentation or correction, he has produced a pitilessly literal translation, one that captures the texts’ impenetrability and unfinished quality while awakening readers to an uncanniness that often lies hidden beneath doctrinal layers.

>The early Christians’ sometimes raw, astonished, and halting prose challenges the idea that the New Testament affirms the kind of people we are. Hart reminds us that they were a company of extremists, radical in their rejection of the values and priorities of society not only at its most degenerate, but often at its most reasonable and decent. “To live as the New Testament language requires,” he writes, “Christians would have to become strangers and sojourners on the earth, to have here no enduring city, to belong to a Kingdom truly not of this world. And we surely cannot do that, can we?”

I’ve read it OP, I’m a DBH fanboy. It is actually very exellent, the gospels become a lot more interesting, Matthew and Mark in particular because he follows the costant and random switching from past to present tense and vice versa that gives a closer approximation to the weirdness of the original, almost at times like a drunk guy telling a story around a fire. He’s got a decent amount of explanatory notes for some of the more obscure or strange passages and words as well.
I’ve read both the reviews you’ve posted and I’d say the praise is accurte for it.

My only problem with it is that he pretty much claims to be free from ideological influence, which I don’t buy.

>t. retarded fundie
You do know that David Bentley Hart is an Orthodox Christian theologian, right? Probably not.

>orthodox
I am assuming you are misusing that term on purpose referring to the byzantine church.

That is very nice. Now if only I could get my hand on it...
I am using the term in a purely denominative manner. As to my views, I doubt any of the self-entitled "Apostolic and Orthodox" denominations are either Apostolic or truly Orthodox. Which is why I am interested in the origin of Christianity (and an accurate as possible view of it) in the first place.

Got any more dumb questions? If not, I suggest you crawl back to 8ch's /christian/ board.

Looking at a preview on google books it still falls short and there are probably several attempts like it already. Seems like another translator trying to cash in on the Bible industry.
studybible.info/version/LITV
studybible.info/version/CLV

>I am assuming you are misusing that term on purpose referring to the byzantine church.

Get a load of this homo

I think you are missing the point when you look for "original" or "accurate" as the bible itself is a living document; subject to revision in various ways according to the various churches. God is still very much in the world.

Anyone have a pdf link to this?

This, we need gay marraige for priests now!

He’s mentioned a few times that he actually wanted to translate Quintus of Smyrna’s Post Homerica but this is the translation Yale offered him

>idiotic platitudes
If that is so, why read any scriptures at all? Why are you even on .lit/? Go read about God in the wind or the swaying of the trees of some shit.

I've just thought of something. Does google books preview always show you the same pages? If not, we could coordinate and grab the whole book in chunks from google books.

>why read scripture at all
As i said, you can look at scriptures within historical development and as guided by God but there is no scriptural basis for the Scriptures.
>gay marriage for priests
Again if this is done it will just be a development of human culture. God cares for each of his creations and does not condemn the repentant believer. If we single out sodomy we easily forget our own minute by minute litany of sin.

No scriptural basis for the Scriptures being infallible* is what i meant to say.

>If we single out sodomy we easily forget our own minute by minute litany of sin.

But if we don't call attention to any sin we ignore every sin. Give me a break.
Homosexuality may be the extended extreme of the vanity and self service we all engage in but why should any person condemn themselves if we can not condemn the worst

You're the only one here who brought up scriptural inerrancy.
You should kill yourself by the way.

>Secular study of religion, what's the worse that could happen they said

It's ~$23 on amazon. Surely you could save up that much in a few weeks or months? Like the other user said, if you're that strapped for cash you probably ought to get your life in order.

$20 is enough for me to pay my internet and electricity bills for two months. I should greatly prefer to pirate it.

>Pirating the word of God
user...

Where do you live, Somalia?

Romania.

So Euro Somalia?
Did Bernie lie to us all?

>mfw I hear Americans talking about how poor they are compared to Europe

>The Icelandic Jew their way to victory in the Cod Wars and are the richest cunts in Europe.

Day of the Net when?

It gets even worse when you factor in that most of the wealth in places like Italy and Sweden are down to the ridiculously expensive housing.

Can we please get this thread back on topic? I wish I'd never have divulged my location now.

Hart is a first class heretic, I would certainly not recommend him.

That could mean he was not vested in it as others would be.

Yes goy the never before translated tense shifts, fluid narrative, and vocabulary are all waiting for you for just $22.99

Idk live in self deception if you must. The existential crisis comes when you do not look away from your own sinful nature. Unless you are able to do this then your judgement is in itself a vanity.

Have you looked at someone you are not married to with lust? If so you are guilty of adultery. Have you been angry with your neighbor? If so you are guilty of murder. It is only by grace that we are saved from death. Any idea of self-sufficiency is the fullness of hypocrisy.

I wouldn't be surprised, American Orthodox Christians aren't interested in Bible translations, they use the KJV and the use of other translations is borderline heretical, even the ultra-modernist churches only use the old RSV.

Well I will say that while the KJV isn't an absolutely awful translation, the idea that things can't ever be improved is preposterous.

Orthodoxy has always placed a large value on aesthetics and modern translations are anything but classically beautiful.

But do you not see that this very equation is predicated on the condemption of the murderers and adulterers. If we don't regard them as sinners then how can we regard ourselves as such?

To be fair, The Orthodox Study Bible uses an original translation of The Septuagint for the old testament and NKJV for the new.

I don't know how much anyone values appearances or looks but objectively the main and highest priority of any translation should usually be accuracy.

The KJV is neither classical nor beautiful in many sections. I firmly assert the NIV in particular conveys the ACTUAL classical beauty far better.

Like Brett Hart?

Not the guy you're talking to, but most Christian denominations will reply to that by invoking vague notions about spiritual accuracy based on the correct observation that the meaning of the text is more important than the literal wording. You can see implicit examples of that in this thread alone.

King James was bisexual and the KJV is an Anglican translation.

>he follows the costant and random switching from past to present tense and vice versa
Is that unusual for Greek literature?
It's common for Japanese stuff, but it usually isn't reproduced in English translation.

>Again if this is done it will just be a development of human culture. God cares for each of his creations and does not condemn the repentant believer. If we single out sodomy we easily forget our own minute by minute litany of sin.
Nigga what the fuck are you smoking. You can't hyper-focus on one sin, but that doesn't mean that you should stop condemning sins because you sin yourself!
Of course you do! You're a human being!
Mt 19:26 "And Jesus beholding, said to them: With men this is impossible: but with God all things are possible."

That's why real Gs use the Douay-Rheims.

1 Samuel 13:1 Douey-Rheims
>Saul was a child of one year when he began to reign, and he reigned two years over Israel.
LOL

I already have a copy of the KJV and I don't think I'm gonna buy David Hart's "lol Christians are stupid" translation.

Just google David Bentley Hart, he's an Orthodox Christian theologian.

pastebin izM4Cccb

U R WELCOME.

Many thanks user.

Hart is a heretic by their standards, he is a universalist who even thinks dogs go to Haven.

Lattimore's New Testament is very good.

I would trust one student with a pre-med degree to treat me from today more than 50 medieval doctors with years of training in phrenology, herbology, and leeching.

This.
They actually damage the credibility of the permanence of the religious message when moderns release self-cannabalizing versions like this.
>Oh the highly qualified and influential version we all know in love lacks accuracy and scholarship and, what a coinkydink, I'm here to remedy that!
Fucking daily reminder that academics are worthless sacks of shit who contribute nothing of value and whose only way of sustaining a living is to repetitively destroy and restructure the same works over and over again.
What a sickly, diseased little group.

Our theological education has for the most part deteriorated and medieval remedies were often highly effective.

...

I would say general knowledge of the bible has decreased with time..how many people can casually read Milton in the current year?

>Jesus addresses Mary, his mother, as “madam,”
>Hart is more immigration-conscious

See

>student with a pre-med degree to treat me from today more than 50 medieval doctors with years of training in phrenology, herbology, and leeching.

What's the difference? "student with a pre-med degree" are likely to treat you with wives' tales since pre-med is fucking non-medical.

If they have a First Aid merit badge, they've got more qualifications than anyone who would try to balance my humors.

More than in medieval times due to drastic increase in literacy rate.

>New Testament

Hart isn't just a crypto-protestant he's actually a extremely mediocre academic and theologian, this translation is his magnum opus, which is pitiful for somebody whose been in the game for somebody who has been in the game as long as him.

Pro-tip: Notre Dame is infamous for producing very few notable theologians or philosophers of note despite it being a major focus of the university.

Notre Dame hasn't been a Catholic university for too long, no wonder. They did adopt MacIntyre, but that was when he was already established as the leading thomist.

>Holy Scripture
>New translation
>To any language
No, Luther and it's derivatives and King James.

Call me when he'll get excommunicated. Until then, you're taking gibberish. Hart actually specialises in patristics. To say he is espousing heresy is beyond retarded.
I doubt any of you two know anything about Christianity.

Ah, so all the rage seems to be coming from Catholic heretics.

>belong to a Church who literally, beyond a shadow of doubt forged the Creed in order to assert political superiority
>have the gall to talk about "heresies"
Roman Catholics truly are the worst type of Christians.

Are you saying he isn't a universalist and that universalism isn't heresy for the Orthodox? I'm familiar enough with his writings to know his specialisation doesn't mean much.

>excommunications
>being publicly announced
>2017
Fuck off roleplayer.

Reminder that Hart's got into a argument with a random internet blogger and lost so hard he censored first things and threatened the editor.

Haha please go into more detail about this

>To say he is espousing heresy is beyond retarded

Actually he has literally been condemned alongside Bulgakov for Sophianism.

orthodoxwiki.org/Sophianism

We can never have a thread about any Christian writing without /christian/ coming in to ruin everything with their retardation, can we? Can't you faggots just stay on your site?

It has actually happened mulitple times, when Fr. Kimel made a post about universalism David Hart got into a argument in the comments with archpriest Whiteford who destroyed him, Kimel responded by deleting shits tons of comments critical of Hart.

>David Bentley Hart is an Orthodox Christian theologian
>he's an Orthodox Christian theologian

More properly called "former Orthodox Christian" these days, though he still claims it.

Amen.

>Call me when he'll get excommunicated. Until then, you're taking gibberish.

Excommunication doesn't make someone a heretic. Heretics get excommunicated. Excommunication doesn't even imply that someone has ceased being Orthodox (it isn't the same as being anathematised, as it's often seen in the west).

Well, someone was kind enough to post an epub of the book so I'm outta here. You fags can continue your pointless discussion about heresies and whatever else it is you're discussing that has nothing to do with whether this translation has any merit or not. Pardon the run-on sentence.

>heresies [have] nothing to do with whether this translation has any merit or not.

>about heresies and whatever else it is you're discussing that has nothing to do with whether this translation has any merit or not

Apart from it absolutely does, his translation of Luke 23:31 is completely fucking wrong because he didn't take into account any exegesis.

When has he espoused sophianism? I’ve never seen it mentioned before

Pompous Aquinas-reading deus-vult holier-than-thou conservative Veeky Forums larpers say stuff like this with no regard for literacy rates, and the restriction of education to the clergy

Enamored by medieval scholarship and the loftiness of middle english, they forget what a nightmare feudalism was, and that Christ's message was for the poor.

>his translation of Luke 23:31

share?

Harts translation:
>For if they do these things when the tree is full of sap, what will happen when it is dry?

NKJV for comparison:
>For if they do these things in the green wood, what will be done in the dry?

>Christ's message was for the poor
The synoptic Gospels are apocryphal, if not downright heretical.

Way to prove yourself wrong 'tard.

That wasn’t me, I don’t know why that user said it was wrong, unless he got his verses mixed up. I’m also not sure what he meant by the exegesis comment.

The tree refers to a person, it's not a reference of time. "what will happen when" is shockingly in-line with evangelical theology.

First time reading The Bible.
Reading KJV because of Melville and Moby Dick, Blood Meridian

What should I know beforehand? I finished Genesis. It was a lot ot fucking and birthing. Like a table of people that churche's hold in literature format.

Also what the fuck was Joseph's problem?

>Also what the fuck was Joseph's problem?
PTSD.

There is only one true translation of the bible.

pidginbible.org/Concindex.html

Feudalism is such a wide term it's impossible to call it hell with a straight face. Europe was a diverse continent where certain places flourished for all the classes while others did not.
And we can compare the literate ages with other literate ones, we are certainly less well read in theological matters now compared to 60 years ago in say America or Germany when Catholic schools were Catholic.