>early 20s
>believe in the miracle of existence
>believe in spirit
>believe in true love
>vested meaning in words like "compassion" and "friendship"
>no political affiliation/ideology
>believe that true art lifts man up to the divine
Am I naive to be this way? Is it wrong to be this way? Any books that address what it means to live in a disenchanted world?
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Literally me, I second OP's request.
Yeah, you pretty much got it down, except for the "true love" part, depending on your definition of love.
Read Faust, Stoner, maybe watch some scandinavian kino from the 90s-early 2000s idk
>he took Dostoevsky seriously
read some whitman and sound a barbaric yawp, it's particularly good when you're still young and shiny
>pretty much got it down
I'm not sure what you mean. Got what down, exactly?
Stoner is one of my favorite books, and my exposure to Scandinavian kino is limited to Ingmar Bergman, who I nonetheless love. Something like Don Quixote comes to mind, but even then, the quixotic figure is still regarded as insane and made to be mocked.
This is precisely what I'm talking about. Being naive is the condition for the possibility of taking Dostoevsky seriously. So how does one proceed from there?
Can I have some of what you're having, OP?
Do you know Montaigne? I think you'd love his essays.
>Am I naive to be this way? Is it wrong to be this way? Any books that address what it means to live in a disenchanted world?
Speaking of Montaigne, he really enjoyed living. Altough he suffered from a severe hereditary kidney disease with stones he even wrote about the benefits of his illness. But what if he had a disfiguring cancer instead of his kidney disease? Would he still love life? Or would he hide in himself in his tower not speaking to anyone and being ashamed of himself?
Life is full of accidents we can't cotroll. The best thing we can do is to take the chances the world gives to us. These chances will form us, either in a good or in a bad way. We have to try to make the best of them and of course to make the best of ourself. Some people have bad luck in life and they'll end up in a "disenchanted world".
You seem to life in an healthy enviroment and I guess you're curious to see what is on the other side. My own experience is that this other side means suffering and the pain I had to face at these times of my life is nothing I want to relive. Maybe it's good for a young person to see both sides, but I think only one of them is worthwhile.
If you understand German or Dutch I recommend "Pallieter" by Timmermans, otherwise start with Montaigne. After that you can still decide if you want to change your wonderful view on life.
I'd say I had a rough childhood, from abuse to financial troubles. For whatever reason, though, I have idealistic tendencies.
It's not so much that I want to see what is on the other side, but rather that I feel a deep sense of loneliness in this regard. I feel as if though I am stupid and ingenuous when I even begin to broach these things in the presence of others. I'm not deprived of experience, really. I just find that there is an incompatibility between the way I think, for lack of a better word, and modern life, permeated by secularism, positivism, and materialism. Personally, I have much to be thankful for - a loving girlfriend, our kitten, my books. Perhaps this is just me lamenting my lack of companions...
You're making me jelly, user
you are me let's be friends
Please never change, user. Avoid anything that might alter your worldview for the worse.
Leonora Carrington for the painting?
dali
>no political ideology
This is itself a statement motivated by a political ideology
yeah, in that it is a refusal to take part in politics and a belief that a man with no political power should not affect things in a political way but a human one. OP is a good person with the right ideas
What are some scandinavian kino?
Lars Von Trier?
Roy Andersson?
You seem to have authenticity and peace of mind, what are you even doing on this board
Only problem I see here is believing in the word "friendship". Its a pathetic childish social structure that no man should take seriously
u seem pretty tough.
the only thing that matters is love, friends are passing fancies
Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
>no... ideology
HAHAHAHAHUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHUQHAHAUHAUHAAUHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Please... the cancer of political thought (neuron-torture) is already too widespread and all-devouring. Why do we have to crush every unique form of human perception, expression and communication under this gigantic concrete idol - this deluded eyesore? Let OP be in peace... without obligation, without brutal self-awareness and repression. Cant we just let things exist
Please OP get the fuck out of here before we corrupt you forever. It hurts to imagine you slowly becoming more cynical and cancerous.
You absolutely definitely, positively will not be disappointed a few years from now
>Have a wife and kids to look after
>But I'll die for my fucking drinking buddies
Yeah nah, friends are for retards
Read Loren Eiseley's essays to understand why you're right.
not that user, but nvm. This reply proves you don't have it down.
what a fool. She'll dump you sooner or later. A true friend remains forever.
I honestly wonder how a person with those values doesn't have a strong political conviction. I share those ideals, but I could not go on living in this rotten world without a deep desire make it a place more fit for these ideals.
Cuck attitude
Love is temporary; true friendship is eternal.
>I want to be stuck with another man for all eternity
Literally homo. My ideal world is me and qt and every other being on Earth wiped the fuck out
There is nothing wrong with being an idealist. I am decidedly not one. However I still find immense pleasure in art, music, literature etc.
It sounds nice to believe in the beauty of life at every turn, but do not let it blind you. Belief systems have to be challenged and tested if you want to develop as a person. Hold onto your core beliefs, but don't be afraid of the other side. It's all shades of grey in the end
no they don’t at all and my wife isn’t leaving me. love is eternal you die bonded till the end of time. if you can’t experience this, im truly sorry
>to be stuck
It's here that you are wrong. Friendship is free, but at the same time strong.
To quote Montaigne, like the man up here:
"We are not here to bring the love we bear to women, though it be an act of our own choice, into comparison, nor rank it with the others.
The fire of this, I confess, is more active, more eager, and more sharp: but withal, 'tis more
precipitant, fickle, moving, and inconstant; a fever subject to intermissions and paroxysms, that has seized but on one part of us. Whereas in friendship, 'tis a general and universal fire, but temperate and equal, a constant established heat, all gentle and smooth, without poignancy or roughness. Moreover, in love, 'tis no other than frantic desire for that which flies from us: so soon as it enters unto the terms of friendship, that is to say, into a
concurrence of desires, it vanishes and is gone, fruition destroys it, as having only a fleshly end, and such a one as is subject to satiety. Friendship, on the contrary, is enjoyed proportionably as it is desired; and only grows up, is nourished and improved by enjoyment, as being of itself spiritual, and the soul growing still more refined by practice."
Enjoy being cucked, or fall out of love.
I'm sorry you never had a real friend.
>literally no true scotsmaning
Your "true" friend will cuck you the moment it suits him more than your temporary non-aggressive pact
eiseley.org
holy hell this felt good to read. Is there anymore like this?
Work in D.C. for a few years, watch all of your innocent ideals be shat upon and torn apart at every level. You try and fight the cynicism, but it rages so strong. In the numbness, you realize that the eternal, never ending, greed for personal gain and lust for political power are the only players on the field. Xanax, weed, and, quality whisky become your only friend.
Depressing
Are you sure you're not in your early 10s
Are you an INFP?
I read it as "not forcing political ideology down others' throats"
>he didn't take Dostoevsky seriously
hows that reading comprehension coming along?
>My nihilist college-student self knows more than a wise old man who has lived through unbelievable times
not that user but probably through a recognition of the fact that politics will never make anything better and that the only way to really improve the world is through those things mentioned in the OP:
Love
Compassion
Friendship
Art
Those things are politicial
please kys commie i hate leftists so much
Yes OP sorry but you are naive
You do 'have' an ideology and you are political, but clearly hide it from yourself, which is an ideologically motivated move anyway
True love is a narrative or social construct - obviously there's a possibility of a genuine explosive passionate and enduring affection for another human, and love is certainly the word for it; but it you categorise your unique experience according to your culturally derived concept of 'true love' what you risk is in a way seeing things that aren't there and covering up things that are. Its the same with the concept of freedom.
And it's always naive to throw around words like art and divine - the more you invest yourself in an art the more complex it becomes, the more down the rabbit whole you go, and the more you develop yourself in this way the more comments like the one you've made start to sound trite and shallow; they literally lose the meaning you think they have now.
Sorry friendship not freedom
But in this extremely alienated world only few of these relations will flourish. I like to imagine a world where these things are the default mode of existence and not a constant rebellion against the tide of cynical "pragmatic" politics.
the older you get the more of those ideals you will have to kill just to earn a living. im considering becoming a monk in the desert to avoid this problem. the system of the world is ruthless competition and murder.
Become a monk, be a man who pursues his ideals at the cost of everything. Its the most noble life anyone can aspire to, but too many are afraid to take