Just read Frankenstein for a college class...

Just read Frankenstein for a college class. Would you say that the monster's actions are it's own fault or would you say that it is a victim of its circumstances? Also, is it a sympathetic figure?

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OP here, I think that the monster is to blame for its actions though many in my class say that he can't be blamed for some reason. I feel no sympathy for the monster because every bad thing that happened to it after the murder of William was its own fault.

The monster was brought into this world without its consent, though.

That is true but it possesses the faculty to understand what it is doing wrong. The only unjust thing the monster ever suffered was to look like a monster. Every thing it did was wrong because it used its understanding of human emotion to try to manipulate Frankenstein. Of course Frankenstein would attribute malice and brutality to the female creature when his only reference point is a remorseless creature threatening death upon all of his loved ones.

I'm reading it right now. I just got to the part where he's talking about spying on the family and so far I have to say the monster is responsible for his actions and he knows it. However, he explicitly tells Frankenstein he is the only one worthy to judge him and the monster compares himself directly to Satan from Paradise Lost. In that work, Satan is also sympathetic but also wrong and self aware of that fact. The monster only wants a mate and promises Frankenstein he'll seclude himself from man if he makes one but swears vengeance on all men if he doesn't. I think people see him as sympathetic because he's something other than man and a product of his circumstances but even half way through the monster shows he's probably more aware of his actions and guilt than most people.

The monster had an opportunity to act on its good intentions after the killing of William but he chose to double down. If he hadn't condemned Justine or shown some amount of remorse for killing William then Frankenstein probably wouldn't have attributed great ,malice too him and made him a companion. I agree that the monster is aware of his actions and its doing the monster a disservice to say that his lack of upbringing absolves him of his sins.

I love how self centered Victor is. He sat and watched a girl get sentenced for a murder he knows she didn't commit all because he assumed people would think him crazy. The monster is just him too.

I will admit that Frankenstein acts very foolishly

Is anyone really brought into the world without their consent? The monster isn't a special case in this.

If the monster can self educate himself better than some people on this board then his upbringing (or lack thereof) doesn't absolve him. He realizes he's incompatible with the world. Victor is too short sighted and self absorbed to put his feelings behind him and make a companion for the monster which would remove the monster from ever interacting with society again. But I haven't got that far and my opinion is only based on foreknowledge of what happens.

Is Victor's self centeredness intentional or is this simply a product of the female brain who wrote it?

>le female brain
Seeing as how all the women are passive, stock characters, I don't think she had a serious feminist bent to the story. If anything, Victor is self centered because she was a Romanticist and wary of the inhumanity of science and the industrial revolution.

I hate to explain jokes but the implication is that females are self centered and think that's how normal people act, thus Victor is self centered simply because the author is female. See what I did?

>I don't think she had a serious feminist bent to the story
no, it's more a commentary on the fast advances being made by science at the time and a reflection on events in her own life

however
>all the women are passive, stock characters
is not quite correct. the most important female character is the one who doesn't actually appear: the monster's potential partner, with whom he could forgive the rest of humanity. only with a woman in his life can the monster find peace.

>The only unjust thing the monster ever suffered was to look like a monster
I think you're trivializing this. His appearance caused him to be met with fear, disgust and anger wherever he showed his face. From his point of view, he was doomed to a life of hiding and solitude. Of course using threats and violence wasn't very nice of him, and probably not the most effective either, but definitely understandable.

He's a bit of both. He's a victim because he was abandoned at birth, left to fend for himself without any understanding of the world, and the cruelties and constant violence and rejection he has to endure simply because he looks different makes him become a cruel and vengeful. He never had a chance to become a good person. That said, he isn't blind to the nature of his actions, quite the contrary. He's entirely self-aware that he does evil things to punish his father. But he also sees himself as entirely removed from human society and its laws, so can you really apply human morality to him?

my bad if I needed to expand on my statement but I did mean to imply that his misfortune of looking like a monster would lead to his foul treatment.

>so can you really apply human morality to him?
probably the hardest thing to consider when judging his actions. I would say that you could since hes shown himself to be a keen observer of human behavior and he feels sympathy for humans.

And you still can’t empathize with him?

But he knows he's an other and outside humanity. Dogs keenly observe human behavior but we don't judge them by human morality. I mentioned it earlier, but he identifies with Satan more than Adam since Satan was also an other, cast aside because he didn't belong. I think he understands human morality and society very well but resigns himself to being above it as no human can truly understand him and I think I agree. He's his own entity and he simultaneously loves and loaths that fact.

I can empathize to a degree but I'm not going to give him a pass on killing Frankenstein's family to spite him.

hmm i see where you're coming from, didn't think of it like that. Although he did mention the effect the murders had on him and how much he disliked doing them. Don't know where that fits in to what you are saying but we do get his thought process on that.

To spite him? Surely he enjoyed Victor’s misery to a degree, but didn’t he do it because he wanted a companion? Been a while since I read it.

He killed William on accident but framed Justine on his own volition. Later he brought Frankenstein to a hut and told him his story. The monster then essentially blackmailed Frankenstein into making a companion or else the monster would kill Frankenstein's loved ones. Frankenstein almost made a companion then tore it up in front of the monster because he was afraid of an entire race of malevolent beings like the monster. The monster was enraged and killed Clerval then told Frankenstein that "he would be there on [Frankenstein's] wedding night." He killed Elizabeth after Frankenstein assumed the monster would kill him instead.

At their first meeting in the hut,the monster doesn't express remorse to Frankenstein and instead confirms Frankenstein's beliefs that the monster was only capable of violence.

Ah, right. All horrible acts, still I’d say they’re understandable. You can’t expect someone to be good when no one has shown them any kindness.

I'd agree with your second statement but I think that the monster understands what taking a life means. I don't think I forgive him for that and he barely forgives himself. Sure he shows remorse in the end after Frankenstein is dead but that's the same as a convicted murderer confessing remorse, they still did the crime and remorse isn't enough for an acquittal.

Exactly, my friend.

I think we’re roughly on the same page then.
I do feel like you’re letting Victor off the hook though. Him abandoning the monster and not showing him any conpassion is what caused it all.

franken(((stein)))

it was the jews fault.

The guy was named after this rather non-jewish castle:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankenstein_Castle

right that was a major mistake

When I read this in high school we had to look at side characters so i chose the turk, talked about how she was a subtle jab at women's lowly role in the ottoman empire and islamic society. Then the turkish kid in my class got pissy, emailed the teacher and then she had a class discussion that the role of women in the Middle east was better than in Britain at the time.