Is the Nobel Prize of Literature still relevant?

Brazilian literature is 90% monodimensional, edgy, politically forced garbage. There's no depth. There's no perspective on human nature, no ponderation, no analysis and self reflection. It's mostly guys getting mad at elites and saying poor people are opressed. Whooptie fucking doo, shower them with Nobels.
Try reading Melville, Hesse or Dostoyevski and go back to measure them against the authors you posted, colega. It's not even close. These are authors who genuinely try to perceive themselves and others as anything else than charicatures. Shit, try Houellebec or Saramago. Both of them aren't legendary and both try to actually reach insights about themselves and their societies which isn't reducible to "rich people are bad!!!1!" and have actual aesthetic perpectives.
I'm not saying Brazilian literature is all shit. Guimarães Rosa, José de Alencar, Monteiro Lobato and Plínio Salgado are genuinely good. Great, when lightning strikes twice. But they simply didn't have any real impact outside of their limited cultural sphere.

And nowhere did I deny that the Committee let's politics get in their way sometime. But it's certainly not as huge of an issue as you seem to pretend. What would they be trying to achieve? To promote 70s musicians as influential contemporary artists in order to...? Corrupt the world with outdated Americana through their influence in a dying artistic medium? What are you trying to imply?

>virginia woolf
lol you sound like a clown

she a women she inferior

Okay, I see your point, sorry for those rude words up there.
Yeah, I agree with you, outside of our country, our literature is irrelevant, even Machado de Assis, it's nothing compared to the popularity of Kafka for example.
The thing that you said about the themes that our literature deals, I agree too. It's too insular, a nacionalist thing I guess. It's not universal themes. Maybe Clarice Lispector is an exception? I don't know. That's the truth, outside of Brazil, it doesn't have any impact.

Is "colega" bro in Brazilian Portuguese? We use that in Spain too.

Yep it is.
Nice!

Caralho eu vi 'writers from my country that should have gotten it' no catalogo e sabia que era br.
Guimarães Rosa merecia um. Sipá c.d.a.
É isso.

>comparing Josê de Alencar and Guimaraes Rosa
GOD SMITE ME DOWN THIS VERY INSTANT BECAUSE I CAN'T STAND THIS WORLD ANYMORE.

this but unironically

imbecil is such a pretty word

>Still
>Implying it was ever relevant
OP you're a retard.
I'd recommend everyone to go on the winner list and check out how many writers you know. Out of the first 20 writers around 17 (iirc) have basically achieved damnatio memoriae status.

Brazil probably has some good writers lol
And fuck "relevance"

Kafka's works were published posthumously

Nobody in their right mind would even consider giving Joyce a Nobel

It's true, his books were single-handedly responsible for every war that came after they were published

pretty much my thoughts too

Alencar is the best for a e s t h e t i c s
Rosa is GOAT narrative
What are you on about, nigga?

It's a shame, really. Brazil has an interesting historical and cultural position. But we're too caught up in narratives and ideology to actually have any real good literature

Lyrics require instrumental accompaniment. Give him all the Grammys but it's not literature.

Toni Morrison is good though, what’s the problem?

Continue writing >/pol >/pol/ >/pol/ until rupi kaur ends up winning the nobel prize.

damn that would be the end of the white race

get

it's definitely literature

you're definitely a retard

explain for the uninitiated

poetry is literature
well made lyrics are poetry
A = C

building a fence around your personal definitions wont make you any less irritating to be around

>Dubliners, his first book, published June 1914
>Archduke Franz Ferdinand shot June 28, 1914
>Finnegans Wake, his last book, published May 4,1939
>Germans invade Poland September 1, 1939
what more proof do you need faggot

so because his books were published around the same time as some happenings they caused it?

Posts like this are why I still come here

he’s a Hibernian you stupid blue pilled faggot

...

a tru-tru red pill knows that he becomes what he surrounds himself with. or her, whatever.

are you becoming gay and sensitive to the touch user? because if you want, I'll lighten your load.

Are you daft? Of course they did, the proofs are there

ah, how could I have been so silly.

yeah retard thats how physics works

word

It is for getting worthy writers attention they might not ever have gotten. Otherwise, no.

>adult
>prize

quality

>There's an overrepresentation of American authors in the nobel laureates.
The Americans are 9.6%, the Swedes are 7%
hmmmm

bob dylan won the prize so ummm nope not really

>Jorge Amado

come on man

It's been a joke ever since they gave it to Bertrand Russell

this shit is so good though

First of all, Dylan has published poems, so you're wrong. But even then, literature is not defined by it's medium. The chanson de geste was originally only sung, yet it's considered literature. Therefore, the same can be said about lyrics.

Okay sorry, not Jorge Amado.
You can choose another one.

No she isn't.

I wish the Nobel gave more consideration to aesthetics and less to politics.
It is shameful Borges was denied the Nobel just because of wrongthink.

Can this be true? They gave it to Yeats and Hamsun lol. Also, justice for Nabokov.

Yeats and Hamsun were awarded the Nobel before WWII when Sweden had not yet turned to its current political orientation.

Nabokov and Borges were both considered for the Nobel but rejected for wrongthink. Instead, Neruda was granted one for goodthink.

>Nabokov didn't get it for wrongthink
They love awarding it to USSR critics. He didn't get it because he was "shallow", an aestheticist, he deserved it though
Borges didn't deserve it for Ficciones alone, everything else is kinda mediocre
And you're right, Yeats got it while his fascism was still dormant

How was Borges a wrongthinker at all? He opposed commies and nazis alike, he seems like he was just a milquetoast classical liberal

If I'm not mistake, he was a supporter of the military dictatorship in Argentina.

kafka never finished a novel why would he be awarded one

>José de Alencar, Monteiro Lobato and Plínio Salgado

O fato de voce dizer que esses escritores são grandes - sobretudo José de Alencar, que é terrível - me mostra que suas críticas não são baseadas em critérios artísticos, mas sim em ideologia.

Voce deve ser daqueles "Maldito PT, maldito Lula, malditos Comunistas, viva o golpe militar que salvou meu país dos Comunistas, e o grande professor Olavo de Carvalho, hur dur", com a mente infecionada por dualidades como bem x mal, bonzinhos x bandidos, capitalistas x comunistas, etc.

Não há como negar que existem problemas gravíssimos de desigualde social em nosso país, e isso pode muito bem ser objeto de grandes obras de arte. Quer um exemplo: veja muitos dos contos de Tolstói e Chekhov.

E por acaso voce leu livros de Jorge Amado que estão fora de sua fase comunista? (Dona Flor e seus Dois Maridos, Gabriela Cravo e Canela, Tenda dos milagres, Tereza Batista cansada de guerra e Tieta do Agreste).

Voce leu "O Tempo e o Vento", de Erico Verissimo? (e mesmo eu romance de realismo mágico e política, "Incidente em Antares", que é maravilhoso)

Voce leu Lavoura Arcaica?

E só para constar, uma boa parte da melhor literatura de todos os tempos é Latino Americana. "Cem Anos de Solidão", por exemplo, pode competir com qualquer coisa que Melville e Dostoievsky escreveram.

Abra os olhos. Veja se não deixa todo esse ódio pró-extrema-direita se alastrar por seu cérebro como um fungo.

Mais uma vez: nós vivemos num país de ampla desiguladade social. Existem livos que retratam essa realidade de forma superficial, é verdade, porém também existem obras que falam de nossas mazelas de forma muito humana e sensível.

>Alencar is the best for a e s t h e t i c s

you will never make it

You need to read some Shakespeare, some García Márquez, some Neruda, some Yourcenar, to see just how cafona, brega and bolorento is the style of Alencar.

If you think Alencar's prose is poetic you are beyond saving.

>But we're too caught up in narratives and ideology to actually have any real good literature

But if you show the lives of the poor, the blacks, the índios, the manual workers, etc., in a rational way, without politic comments, but only with a human lens, you can not be called an ideologist.

Showing the reality of a country is not ideology.

In the same way, when you show the lives of the upper classes, you have to show them as human, with faults and qualities, like everyone else: people who suffer and rejoice, just as the poor suffer and rejoice.

The key is to show that anywhere a human being is a human being, not an ideal, not a symbol, not a philosophy of life.

But to show corruption, crime, exploitation, racism, prejudice (or, in the past, corruption and violence of the military regime, for example): this is not "ideology": it is talking about the country as the country is and was.

Amigo, pare de projetar sua paranoia em outros. Você tentar encaixar meu post em seu arquétipo demonizado mostra claramente que você nem tentou considerar o que escrevi.

Acredito que questões sociais podem ser excepcionalmente exploradas em um contexto literário, desde que não sejam reduzidas a panfletismo e pelo menos tentem explorar aspectos universalizante, exatamente como Tolstói e Chekhov fizeram. Minha crítica à literatura brasileira principalmente se concentra no fato que ela, em grande parte, concentra-se somente em aspectos superficiais da sociedade. Machado de Assis, mesmo sendo, admitidamente, um exímio novelista, mostra exatamente tal tendência. Sua ironia, seu sarcasmo e sua obra se reduz a repetidamente explorar os mesmos temas de opressão da classe superior, o que não dá muito mérito às suas obras ao tentar analisá-las fora do aspecto político.
Em nenhum ponto eu critiquei a literatura latino-americana como um todo. Na verdade, o exemplo que eu daria de um autor excepcional que trata de temas sociais e, ao mesmo tempo, universais seria Garcia Márquez. A literatura latino-americana do século XX conseguiu, ao meu ver, transcender os seus aspectos temporais para criar coisas realmente duradouras e sensíveis à condição humana. Os brasileiros estão ficando para trás de seus vizinhos nesse aspecto.

Sua tentativa de descartar meus argumentos simplesmente por um viés ideológico imaginário é uma das principais questões que me fazem achar que é baixíssima a chance do Brasil perder o aspecto monodimensional da sua literatura. A deificação de seus autores simplesmente por eles marcarem as caixinhas certas para a política acadêmica é o maior câncer possível para a produção nacional.

>Showing the reality of a country is not ideology.
Yeah, it's just exposition, not art. Frankly, after Manuel Antônio de Almeida, no one really did cross that barrier.

Iracema is pure poetry in prose form, though. The reason I like Melville so much is because he's basically Alencar with added depthness and better overall production.

Concordo com voce. Esse seu novo post me fez perceber melhor seu ponto de vista.

Como eu queria ver algo como Cem Anos de Solidão ser escrito por um brasileiro. Algo como "Viva o Povo Brasileiro", porém com uma prosa mais poética, com maior sutileza e sem essa eterna briga entre ricos e pobres.

Concordo com voce que temos grandes problemas com o panfleto invadindo o poema, mas espero que isso possa ser vencido no futuro.

>Yeah, it's just exposition, not art.

But if you do it by creating life-like characters (like Quixote, Snacho, Zórba, Falstaff, Ahab), using a beautiful prose and weaving meaningful plots, then it would be art.

I always seen Melville as some sort of Shakespeare in novel form (although Melville is not even as great in language skills as Shakespeare is).

>it's another thread by Brazilians shilling their writers

>vegan
Don't put us in the same group as those cucks, veganism is a logical, moral, healthy and environmentally friendly lifestyle choice.

Estou junto de você com a esperança. Poucas coisas me fariam tão feliz com meu país do que nos ver produzir arte significativa.
Mas creio que teremos que nos resignar à esperança, pelo menos no futuro à frente.

I agree. But very few Brazilian writers have ever achieved that.

I really need to get my Shakespeare level up. I read some plays and sonets back in highschool, but they were translated and didn't quite convey his mastery. I guess I'm just scared of Ye Olde English.
No reason to not dive in it nowadays, though

Leave us alone.

If you read some of the recent laureates like Modiano, Herta Müller or (god forbid) Munro you'll realize they're just absolute trash. Don't direct any attention that way, it's pointless.

>Munro

C'mon, she is a very talented realist short-story writer

Not all of them desu.

i see people memeing this on this board all the time. like none of you have actually ever read anything i gather, you just come on here to pretend?

Then if I wrote a very good screenplay for a movie, can I get a nobel in literature too?