Did the Bolsheviks think they were doing good?

Did the Bolsheviks think they were doing good?

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puyi
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Duchess_Anastasia_Nikolaevna_of_Russia#Captivity_and_death
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grover_Furr
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alain_Badiou
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Hobsbawm
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The ones that didn't were usually shot dead.

Morality was of no relevance. They were simply the harbingers of historical necessity.

>From my point of view, the goyim are evil

No but seriously, they fucking slaughtered the czar and his whole family including all the children. Of course they knew they were fucking evil

Watch The Chekist, great movie

Kys revleft

It was 50 years ago today that Lavrenty Beria, Stalin's depraved and blood-thirsty executioner, was shot in secret by a firing squad.

In 15 years as head of the secret police, the NKVD, he was responsible for overseeing the murder of millions of Russians, some shot at night in the depths of the Lubyanka, others dragged off to the gulags.

In the oak-panelled office where he plotted his victims' fate, a small fire still glows just as it did when he was alive.

In the room where he raped countless young women, the huge bed has been changed for a smaller one but the other furniture remains. Down in the sprawling cellars, the bones of his victims are still hidden behind false walls or cemented into the masonry.

The latest grisly find - a large thigh bone and some smaller leg bones - was only two years ago when a kitchen was re-tiled.

I wonder if any christian churches have systematically covered up the rape of children? Or burned people alive?

...

What are some good documentaries about the 1917 revolution and the Bolsheviks?

It was just banter.

>IT'S JUST A PRANK BRO

you know that saying, the good die young?

Applies here (and for most revolutionaries).

You get your sincere, true intentions revolutionary, your the first to go. destined to die fighting or die when the night of the long knives come along.

What your left with arnt artists and poets, there those who are smart true but mostly ruthless.

Bolshoviks were that.

>
No but seriously, they fucking slaughtered the czar and his whole family including all the children. Of course they knew they were fucking evil


This was evil? How?

It was justice.

Why'd you just randomly go to attacking the church. I mean idgaf cause I'm non-religious but it seems like you were just trying to get under that guy's skin without contributing any substance.

Holy shit why did you put the Colonel on there?

What the hell did the children do?

Could you imagine having your life cut off when you were a child before you really had a fair perception of reality solely because you were related to someone? I would hate it.

When I was 16 I was told I might have cancer. I didn't thank god, but the hours I spent thinking I was going to lose my life before it had even begun were pretty terrifying. I don't give a fuck if you're a supporter of communism or if you're sane but killing children is wrong.

I do understand the significance of it and that they felt they had to wipe out the bloodline but they could have exiled the children to monasteries in the west or some shit.

>they could have exiled the children to monasteries in the west or some shit
so that the children come back as adults with the armies of the surrounding nations with them?

you also have to look at the historical context of it, sure it was in the early 20th century, but Russia has always been at least 100 years behind the actual countries

> muh ahistoric "good" word


they were agent of Satan and adepts of Evil

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puyi

I think Stalin really thought that end justifies the means. He was a paranoid sociopath, but he got the results in the end. I remember reading, that collectivization in Ukraine was absolutely vital to growth of heavy industry. Of course, when the crops did not grow (famines happen senpai), he just decided it would be better to send what food is left to the cities and starve the peasants, rather than save the peasants and starve the workers. The system had many pathologies, yet you would be crazy to think that all Stalin did was masturbate to pictures of GULag inmates.

>After the People's Republic of China was established in 1949, Puyi was imprisoned as a war criminal for 10 years
what did the soviets do with their unwanted?
either the Romanov family ends in a bang or the Romanov family ends in a gulag.

Puyi is precisely proof that the soviets were right in killing the children.

But I'm not the other user and I don't think the bolsheviks saw the murder of kids as something good. They probably saw it as the minor evil though.

It should also be mentioned that the russian royal family, both kids and allies, were killed to prevent the whites from rescuing them. The czechoslovak legion was near and aproaching the city where Nicholas and his family were imprisoned.

No, they thought they were creating a socialist country. Whether what they did was morally good or evil never graced their thoughts.

It proves they should have been used as a propaganda showpiece.

hindsight is 20/20

>Did the Bolsheviks think they were doing good?

Of course they did. Marxism carries with it an intrinsic moral judgement about the world.

I.e capitalists are evil for exploiting the working class and need to be destroyed.

logical fallacy

you dick is actually an alien, chop it off quick! In hindsight it this might turn out to be false, but with our limited information we can't take that risk

>No but seriously, they fucking slaughtered the czar and his whole family including all the children. Of course they knew they were fucking evil

Not if you are convinced that the end justifies the mean

You really should read what I wrote and stop filtering it through your prejudices.

I just love the obscurantists conflating the crimes of individuals with that of ideology,

Well, they were doing good.

The entire purpose of communism is to ensure the most just society for the highest number of people. All communists, when those who do bad things, are driven by their sense of what is good.

A core tenant of Marxism-Leninism, developed by Lenin and codified under Stalin, is that it is acceptable to commit an act that is otherwise unthinkable if the alternative is even worse. Essentially all atrocities committed by Marxist- Leninist regimes are justified by this conception. Lenin and Stalin, for instance, truly believed that terrorizing Ukrainian peasants was necessary to prevent the mass suffering of many others.

I really can't tell if this is bait or if you're just really short-sighted. Obviously the murder of the tsar and his family was inconsolable. But the massacre was committed by a small group of individuals who believed that the Romanov participation in the Tsarist system was fundamentally unjust comma and for this, they must be brought to Justice. The Bolshevik leaders who excused is atrocity did so out of the perception of revolutionary necessity. If the Romanovs had been left alive, they reckoned, reactionary forces would be able to much more easily find a Romanov heir to rally around and destroy the Soviet Union, replacing it with a return to Tsarist feudal oppression.

If they didn't what the hell else where they in it for? The bitches? The fame? The power?

General stuff I've read kind of suggests a few of them were fame-hungry nerds, in particular Trotsky who moved to Lenin's side after he started to pull ahead, but the general gist of Bolshevism was to create a better world by force.

the whole point of bolshevism was that any method was ok for achieving the greater good that is communism

if trotsky truly didn't care he wouldn't have opposed stalin

Are you joking? Almost NO ONE believes they are evil. Those that do almost never find themselves in power and are limited to acts of petty and ultimately insignificant violence like serial killers or mass murderers because they don't have the charisma or wherewithal to harness any popular movement.

And I don't get this constant whining about the Tsar and his family. Acting like some rich asshole and his kids' deaths are the most tragic things to come out of brutal dictatorships like Soviet Russia is an insult to all of the millions of common people who suffered a thousand times worse under the Bolsheviks.

I guess the comparatively quick death by bullet and bayonet is worse than slowly starving to death or being tortured to death in a GPU prison because they were princes and princesses.

Fuck the Tsar.

Are you for real? Do you argue like a 13 year old for sports? Of course they can kill the czar and his family. They are the symbol of your repression of your friends and family, neighbors and coworkers. It is because of their foreign policy your country is in tatters. Your soil burnt by Germans. Brothers dead. Economy shattered. And all of this can be fixed. They just needed to root out the evil with the stem.
Imagine they thought like that

t. Not a communist

The JudeoBolsheviks knew exactly what they were doing

Please prove that the Bolsheviks were driven by ethnic hatred and not the desire to build a new and better world, however misguided and horribly futile it was.

>le no one talks about soviet atrocities meme

If you say "I like Stalin" in the west you will only get marginally better responses than if you say "I like Hitler". Communism is synonymous with labor camps, mass executions, and secret police in the western world.

To say the global media is in the hands of Bolshevik sympathizers is fucking retarded.

Because jews were overwhelmingly overrepresented. This isn't a coincedence they believed revolutionary politics were in their racial interest.

>If you say "I like Stalin" in the west you will only get marginally better responses than if you say "I like Hitler".

That's ridiculous there are opnely identifying communists and Stalinists in every single campus in the West. There are people in media academia and politics that are self professed marxists and suffer no consequences.

but Soviet Communism was filled with human rights violations, genocide, and brutality from start to finish
they are not blemishes on an otherwise neutral or decent system, the blemishes ARE the system

source on image? not trolling, just curious
I already know about the Solzhenitsyn quote

Show that the Bolshevik Jews were acting out of any sense of 'racial interest'. I suggest that they weren't, because they were Communists, which is directly opposed to any sense of racial loyalty. Maybe some lower-ranked Jews joined the movement because they saw it as striking back against the Tsarist regime, but the people who orchestrated the revolution (Lenin, Trotsky, et. al) were diehard Marxists who would have rejected any sense of allegiance to the 'Jewish race'. Remember that Judaism was suppressed just like Islam and Christianity in the USSR.

>That's ridiculous there are opnely identifying communists and Stalinists in every single campus in the West.

When was the last time you met a self-identified Stalinist? And identifying as a Marxist is different from supporting the USSR. Haven't you ever noticed how quick communists are quick to distance themselves from Stalinism and other similar regimes and say they weren't 'REAL communists'? It's the same as self-identified right-wingers who like to pretend they have absolutely no common political ground with the Nazis or Fascists.

A million times this. The weird, backwards apologism which led to the US Orthodoxy's canonization of the royal family, and the Russian Orthodox making them "Christlike persons" or whatever is a particular brand of revisionism which I have difficulty understanding. They were a totally apathetic family at the top of an autocratic regime which allowed millions of people under them to die from the First World War, the Russo-Japanese War, famine, pogroms, civil unrest stemming from the aforementioned realities, etc.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Duchess_Anastasia_Nikolaevna_of_Russia#Captivity_and_death

Commieboos WILL justify this

>>>/leftypol/
Not only using false documents but also the world's most heavily airbrushed image.

Yes. Do you really believe that they are some sort of perhaps Empire of Evil, who just wanted to fuck up with eveyone?!

The vast, vast majority of Bolshevik party members were ethnic Russians from an Orthodox background.

The reason why disproportionate members of Jews, Georgians, and Turkic peoples supported the revolution is because it was the biggest alternative to the ethnic hierarchy of the Russian Empire.

kys

In 'Ekaterinburg' by Helen Rappaport she details the executions of the Romanovs using Soviet archives and sources, and she concludes that the Ekaterinburg Bolsheviks were far less enthusiastic with killing the whole family (I believe they shot the doctor and some senior servants as well.)

She says that the central command of the Bolsheviks were keen to cover the whole thing up to avoid internal strife. Basically it was a necessary evil for all but the most zealous Bolsheviks. Even the Bolsheviks who were ordered to execute the Romanovs were said to be uneasy about the whole ordeal. Ironically the Romanovs had been sewing family jewellery into their clothing so when they were shot the bullets fractured on impact.

You could say that this is all Bolshevik propaganda to be sympathetic to their actions but I think that it shows that they were far more human than their decontextualised actions show.

aristocrats shot quickly and efficiently yawn what's to justify

but da joos user

I'm a communist and a member of a socialist political organization and I have never once met a Stalinist

I doubt it. They were a gang of murdering kikes who acted out of hatred for the Russian people.

Then why did they do everything possible to improve the living conditions of the Russian proletariat?

>That's ridiculous there are opnely identifying communists and Stalinists in every single campus in the West. There are people in media academia and politics that are self professed marxists and suffer no consequences.
get off the internet, fuck.
>communist = stalinist
>marxist anything = stalinist

This. I have never met an unironic Stalinist in socialist circles. Some people defend aspects of it, but for the most part everyone seems to be Trotskyist.

Youre joking, right? They created a totalitarian state where millions of Russians were murdered. You can look up the facts yourself, if youre truly this ignorant

kys

I love this meme.

The Bolsheviks were incredibly brutal and evil in pursuit of an impossible goal. But to pretend that they were just pure evil through and through and did what they did because they were cartoon supervillains who hated Russians is childish.

They sincerely thought (at least most of them; as in every movement, there were a lot of people in it for personal gain) they were doing good for the world and would liberate 'the workers' from their chains.

A murderer firmly convinced that he's a noble fighter for the future of mankind is worse than one who kills for no reason.

Literacy skyrocketed, as did life expectancy.

This. Trotsky, for example, when he proposed collectivization of agriculture and militarization of industrial labour, knew that this meant a second serfdom for peasant and unprecented slavery for urban workers. He still pushed for it because he was motivated by Jewish ethnic hatred.

The only time people talk about Soviet atrocities is when they talk about the Great Purge, whose victims were other communists.

No one talks about dekulakization, when communists killed mostly anti-communists.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grover_Furr
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alain_Badiou
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Hobsbawm

All unrepentant Stalinists/Maoists who worked at academia and never suffered for it.

No, he pushed it because he thought it was going to bring about socialism. Prove that he was 'motivated by ethnic hatred' or stop saying it.

I'm not a socialist by the way so don't accuse me of apologism or anything.

According to Soviet data.

Next thing you will tell me you believe in Cuban HDI.

> millions of Russians were murdered
Thousand survivors was better in the end and it is all that matters anyway.

you're right, people who work in academia and do not have political views fitting their contemporaries, whether its relevant to their work or not, ought to be purged. this what you're getting at? Milton Friedman unrepentantly supported policies that killed thousands and he won a Nobel prize.
>No one talks about dekulakization, when communists killed mostly anti-communists.
people who recoil from the name "Stalin" don't care who was killed and when, they are only interested in a body count which is widely reported. They probably don't even know what the Purge was or that it was communists who were killed.

> According to Soviet data.
According to Soviet peoples too. What is your trustworthy alternative sources anyway?

Daily reminder that Mensheviks killed more people than the Bolsheviks during the civil war

But people who work in academia and do not have political views fitting their contemporaries are purged regularly. Just see what happened with conservatives at U.S. academia during the 70s, or anti-communists in France.

Are you saying that France is a communist state?

>all the commie cucks

No, just that anti-communists were purged from academia.

>But people who work in academia and do not have political views fitting their contemporaries are purged regularly
yes, what's your point? That it's not okay for 70 year old Stalinists to be teaching literature and it's also not okay that there aren't many conservatives in US sociology departments? You can't have it both ways.

>Just see what happened with conservatives at U.S. academia during the 70s
In what US academia? Non-conservatives in US business and economics academia were purged at the same time, if they were allowed to exist there in the first place.

The USSR, even under Stalin, was a fucking paradise compared to the old Empire

No. They were vicious, vengeful Jews.

Trotsky actually killed the most Jews out of anyone in the USSR. He violently repressed supporters of Makhno's Black Army, which operated in heavily Jewish parts of Ukraine.

topkek.
Tankies deserve to be in the garbage.

If communism was just a plot to screw over the stupid goyim, how come there's no record of any Jewish Bolshevist ever saying so?

Because the records that do exist are called "hoaxes".

Such as?

KULAKS DESERVED IT REEEEEEEEEEEEEE