Jesus Christ suffered less than day

>But I'm not sure having God in Hell would solve as many theological problems as it creates.

It actually does according to satanism.

> Even for smallest sin you go to hell
> And endless suffering in not enough!

where the fuck did you get this from?
in christianity, EVERY human is a sinner by default, only for some you go straight to hell
that's the whole thing, you don't know what you'll get because it's up to god's judgement when one will go after life

Why does hell even exist? What is the point? Because a serpent told them naughty things? If that's original sin, then it seems it wasn't even humanity's idea in the first place. If an external influence can condemn the vast majority of living beings to a fate worse than death, it is like torturing children for being molested by sandusky.

Christianity is entirely a blame the victim mentality.

Jesus ascends to Heaven because he is wholly pure. There is no fallacy in the destination of a sinner, nor is there for the pious. Such a pure being would wash clean the chambers of Hell.

You should read "Three Versions of Judas" by Jorge Luis Borges.

Christcucks are retarded. In other news, water is wet.

There was more suffering combined on an afternoon on July 1st, 1916 than Christ ever knew, but you don't see people forming a religion over that. Christcucks, not even once.

>according to satanism
Why would I be interested in the opinions of edgy philosophical children?

How is Satanism any more philosophically childish than Christianity.

>hey don't whip me ooh ouch
>oh man now I need to carry this wood
>hey stop stabbing me that hurts
>YOU'D BETTER THANK ME FOR THIS YOU FUCKERS
Gee thanks for suffering for a few hours for me to NOT receive your grace because I jerked it before dying, thanks a lot Jesus, that really helped me out.

Maybe if you suffered a bit more it would have covered my fap session, fuck me though, not enough divine blood shed to forgive that one right?

Can forgive Adam and Even fucking you in the ass in the Garden of Eden but can't even let me touch my own dick.

Why does Jesus not have a merchant face?

Why are you so obsessed with touching yourself? That is pretty weird.

You can be a Jew without being a total Jew m8.

Also
>oh but crucifixion was the worst way you could possibly die back in the day
Yeah if you actually stayed alive more than 5 minutes up on the thing it would probably be torturous, but Jesus died before the sun even set, the dude wimped the fuck out before he even got to the worst part.

I'm sure my Mom shitting me out of her vagina was more torturous than the "suffering" Jesus went through over those whopping SEVERAL WHOLE HOURS of torment.

holy shit my sides

It's all made up you know that don't you?

The hell you think God is going to punish you in hell for eternity is of the devil. The devil is not real, and evil is only manifest in a world that is in constant attempts to seperate from God.

>Forgiveness of sins

Basically, the sinner has committed a wrong and needs to make up for it now and because Christ says "I call the sinners", He calls those with heavy karmic transgressions against God and their neighbor, and shows them the Way.

>Love God with all your heart
>Love your neighbor like yourself

When you break these, it is obvious that your actions are taken up in the mode of ignorance which is the first step down a staircase of negative actions and consequences.

lots of people were crucified though

It is important to understand what Yeshua Hamashiach taught, because that is why He was crucified.

If He taught "Satan" worship instead, imagine how much more those who persecuted Him would accept Him.

The teachings of the Christ were of a very simple nature, and each extension of each phrase hold more application to the Universe and our connection to God. They are understood through prayer and meditation before anything else

None of the popular atheists know Scripture well enouh to settle debates; neither do I follow the popular nor do your deluded retarded memes apply to me. My post was antitheist. I somewhat doubt your kind can learn new proper words

Hell is the effect of sin. It is a law that operates even outside of Christianity.

Even an atheist should be able to translate, hell is cyclical bad experiences due to sin, or, unrighteous actions.

>Atheist virgin using masturbation as an example

Why am I not surprised

If Jesus went around Judea praising Satan and his demons he would have been stoned to death or otherwise lynched by an angry mob long before he was ever hauled before Pilate.

>Atheists believe doing good deed is about pleasing God
>Not realizing it has to do more with you and being being spiritual well
>Yet they wonder why their lives are miserable in feels thread

Oh mane

>Atheist virgin
I'm not either

True.

In context, it was supposed to mean if Christ taught something that wasn't contrary to religious hypocrisy.

Regardless, He taught, and that is why He was killed.

It's ok to be honest, c'mon now user.

>Yet they wonder why their lives are miserable in feels thread

Funny, I see many more feels threads about posters who grew to be failures due mostly to the excessive zealousness of their Christcuck parents...

I personally don't forgive someone until they brutally torture and murder my one and only son

But the point is his sacrifice is puny, not worthy of accounting for eternal suffering, hence Christianity makes no sense, that includes protestants.

You're on Veeky Forums, Nigger. What did you expect? Some paragon?

That's not what "Jesus died for our sins" means.

It means he died because of our sins, and also so that we would stop sinning. Him dying doesn't make it ok for you to sin, that's retarded.

I have never heard of that happening ever.

Also hell is actually something you create yourself by being a sinner, it's not God's doing.

I still don't get the whole "eternal torment" thing. Why not have Hell just be a temporary punishment, or a reeducation camp?

Because that's just the way it is. If you sin and never repent, your hell will last forever.

What if you repent in hell? Like, why you can't do that? It isn't like you need a biological body for it, just soul would be enough.

At some point it becomes too late, but that's a personal limitation.

>Because that's just the way it is
Don't think about the status quo just because it's the status quo?

And what if you repent once you realize (after death) that the whole heaven & hell thing is for real?

It's not a status quo, it's a simple reality. People who live with violence and hate will suffer. Jesus never says this happens after death. And you can't repent or correct your actions after you're dead.

So there are good people in hell?

> you can't repent or correct your actions after you're dead
But you can somehow feel pain? Doesn't really adds up.

No.

Why not? You no longer have any freedom to choose or perform any actions. There's no way you can repent. You're passive.

There are no good people, basically. Just ones who are forgiven and ones who aren't.

>No.
So what exactly is the difference between the repentant man on Earth, who is good, and the repentant man in Hell, who is bad?

I understand there is a deadline you need to follow to get into heaven, but I did not know the deadline also deemed one bad forever if it is missed, even if they are perfectly contrite.

Because Sinners don't believe they're being punished. Look at this guy:

He is being tormented. He is so enslaved to his passion of lust that he's letting it drag him to hell, and he's openly wishing a human being suffered more torture so he could masturbate some more.

Full Disclosure: I am not judging user (to the best of my ability). I am a sinner and probably more deeply chained to my lust then him.

You can't have a temporary punishment, because people like him (and me, in a different sense) don't fear the punishment, they fear the reprieve. If Jesus came down and said "Your prayers have been recieved, you're never going to masturbate again." He wouldn't be relieved or happy. He'd be horrified and look to inflict the punishment again.

As for a reeducation camp, isn't that kind of totalitarian?

If you still been able to experience something than you could repent by the means of your internal life that still exist in some shape or form.

>As for a reeducation camp, isn't that kind of totalitarian?

Is this a serious rebuttal

> Sinners don't believe they're being punished
So... God uses punishment as some kind of mind rape to like really prove this point about you being punished?

As much as it's a serious argument. I know I just argued that sin tricks sinners into loving it, but how many people here are actually mad that they're not in a christian reeducation camp right now? If it's a serious argument, why aren't they pursuing that?

> sin tricks sinners into loving it
How you can know if you are sinner or not then? Everyone can be tricked and even Christianity could be some kind of punishment for you that you doesn't understand as such.

The issue is with eternal torment. A temporary punishment, one that is appropriate to the nature of the crime, seems like a better idea than eternal torment, which no crime can possibly be bad enough to require. Or even better a more rehabilitation focused "punishment" instead of the fire and brimstone approach. Both of these are more reasonable if we're trying to help as many people as possible.

The notion that permanent torture in hell is less totalitarian or indeed that the god of Abraham isn't himself totalitarian as fuck is what surprised me though.

No. God tells you not to do something because it's inherently, unreasonable, unethical, and self-harmful. We go ahead and do it anyway, determined that we must know what's in our best interest. God, in his love and mercy, allows our disobedience. When we turn away from him never to seek him again, that is called hell.

If I tell you "Please don't rub icy hot on your dick, it's a big mistake" and you go do it anyway, did I mind rape you?

>How you can know if you are sinner or not then?
Oh that's easy. You're a sinner. There's zero doubt about that.

God says that I am not. I believe him, not you.

>The notion that permanent torture in hell is less totalitarian or indeed that the god of Abraham isn't himself totalitarian as fuck is what surprised me though.
But this is bringing us back to the first argument: A temporary torment is a temporary free will. The punishment fits the crime, because the punishment and the crime are the same act.

The question "Is eternal punishment for masturbation suitable for the crime" is the same as asking "at what point should masturbation be made impossible" except even if the act were impossible, the sin would still exist in the heart, and thus the torment.

Well, God created this system. If I poison your drink and say 'don't drink it you will die' and you drink it and die anyway, then how can you not blame me? Especially, if I say that I poisoned it to really prove my point about how you would die form drinking it.

As you should. The point is, we're all sinners. Wondering "how do I know I am a sinner?" is a waste of time. All of us are flawed, and we need to try and find God's way.

I'm getting jumbled up on this logic. Isn't the reward also suspending free will? If I'm a god-believing christian and avoid touching my dick does that mean my desire to touch my dick goes away once I'm in heaven?

>If I poison your drink and say 'don't drink it you will die' and you drink it and die anyway, then how can you not blame me?
Easy: Because I knowingly drank poison.

>Especially, if I say that I poisoned it to really prove my point about how you would die form drinking it.
Why would an omniscient entity need to prove a point?

> we're all sinners
This certainly simplifies the problem. Good job, brother.

>Why would an omniscient entity need to prove a point?
Because it's fucking boring being omniscient

>I just can't see how that trick works.
Neither can most of the rest of the planet. Is this bait (obviously (and it worked))?
>Can someone explain me this logic?
Why should we bother? You obviously know the answers to this question and how Christian eschatology developed.
If your not Christian, your post is an insult to your own intelligence. (it really is a pretty stupid post)
If you want serious answers about the development of Christian eschatology as it relates to the crucifixion, change your attitude and be respectfully instead of providing us with the daily Jesus shitpost.

Have a blessed day.

>Isn't the reward also suspending free will?
No, the reward is to exercise your free will appropriately. To put it in starker terms, if you're an alcoholic you're faced with two choices for eternity: drink as much as you want, or never drink again.

We have this life to prepare us for the second decision, and the courage to chose the choice that will actually make us happy.

>If I'm a god-believing christian and avoid touching my dick does that mean my desire to touch my dick goes away once I'm in heaven?
Depends on the nature of your desire. Masturbation is a complex, multifaceted psychological act. You will still be capable of sexual arousal in paradise, because that's still part of God's plan and desire for us. All the desires that you abuse in life will still be there, but perhaps by being close enough to god, we have the strength and clarity of vision to not abuse ourselves in such ways.

Why? Boring is a created function. Why would an omniscient, omnipotent entity create boredom merely to make itself bored?

How can you be not close enough to omnipresent God?

So... You are saying that God can't feel boredom?

Nigga you can't repent if you're dead.

You also can't suffer if you are dead if you think about it.

Not speaking in a physical sense.

I think to answer that question would require a number of clarifications of meaning, and also an agreement on the nature of the Trinity (if there is one) to answer the question.

But so far, the idea that god must be proving a point because he is bored still rests on him creating boredom and making himself experience this. So what reason would we have to believe this is the case?

Why? I understand if you can not be forgiven, but that doesn't mean you can't be repentant. There is a difference between being forgiven and understanding you were wrong and asking to be forgiven. Is forgiveness necessary to be considered good? If so, why does god withhold goodness from anyone who truly repents simply because they missed the deadline?

That's pretty fucked up, he knows you could be in heaven fine but keeps you in Hell because a hundred or a thousand years ago you died before you repented, and now even though you finally see the error of your ways you are still doomed to suffer forever, just because you were too slow on the uptake.

Why the fuck put a deadline on this thing at all? Why not just punish us until we learn our lesson? This one thing makes me think God is far more a tyrant than he is some benevolent father, it's just a fucking game to him, a game with stupid little rules.

According to Christian theism, God is impassible. He isn't capable of boredom, and couldn't create it in himself (just like he can't make himself a sinner). God is never the victim of circumstance. Also, to experience boredom one would have be a temporal being, and God exists outside of time.

And if Jesus is perfectly sinless, how can the devil tempt him? Or, if the devil can tempt him, is Jesus perfectly sinless?

That's just atheists trying to shill for atheism desu

Source: I've made up shit about being raised in a Christian home and more recently about being raised in a Hindu home.

>he doesn't resolve to stop sinning and seek to do penance
Its like you don't even want eternal paradise.

Oh this scares me even more about the afterlife. You could be a motionless being who is fully controlled by God or the devil (depending on how you did in life).

what is allegory

Salvation by works is heresy

Something the Abrahamist himself threw out of the window when he conflated religion with descriptions of reality.

You dug this grave, now lay down in it

It's kinda funny how Christians think Jesus' Crucifixion was bad when he actually got crucifixion lite (died in the same day he was hung as opposed to screaming like a madman there for days).

Protestants explain where is the Penal Substitutionary Atonement?

The precise way in which an expiatory sacrifice was thought to ―work‖ is never clarified. It has been maintained by some that an element of substitution was always understood and that the sacrificial victim was thought of as enduring the (divine) punishment for the sin committed, thus enabling the sinner to go free. Such a model has of course exerted considerable influence on popular Christian piety as an interpretation of Jesus‘ atoning death. This probably reads too much into the rationale of the sacrificial system. It is in fact very unlikely that the sacrificial victim was ever thought of as a substitute in this way. Such a rationale might lie behind the ceremony of the Day of Atonement, when the priest laid hands on one of the goats, thereby transferring the sins to the goat (Lev 16:21). However, this goat was not sacrificed: the goat on whom the sins were ―laid‖ was the scapegoat which was driven away into the desert, and it was the other goat which was offered in sacrifice. In fact it was considered vitally important that the sacrificial victim should be pure (see Young 1979: 52). Thus it is unlikely that the sacrificial system was ever conceived of in such a substitutionary sense.-Atonement in the NT, Anchor Bible Dictionary pg 815

what is allegory

Eastern Orthodox tradition also has Christ going through the prior underworld / hell to open the gates of heaven to save people. Death is defeated through accepting God incarnate in human form.

Crucifixtion was just one of the worst ways to die on Earth at the time.

>even for the smallest sin you go to hell
WRONG
This just shows you know nothing about Christianity so shut your mouth kid

So then why doesn't God "un-create" it?

see

Hell is the absence of god, just death. Ignore the catholicfags plz.

see

I thought The Catholics believe in Jesus was in Hell story too? Pretty cool thing to do from him and I always liked that part. Weird...

>And if Jesus is perfectly sinless
He is

>how can the devil tempt him?
He can't

>Or, if the devil can tempt him
He can't

>is Jesus perfectly sinless?
He is