Fiscal Policy USA

Is globalism really bad? From what I can tell, no one's 401k or pension is going to grow 7% y/y without foreign investment and trade.

Other urls found in this thread:

telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/9006988/Mass-suicide-protest-at-Apple-manufacturer-Foxconn-factory.html
bls.gov/careeroutlook/2014/article/education-level-and-jobs.htm
census.gov/topics/income-poverty/income.html
stratfor.com/weekly/rise-manufacturing-marks-fall-globalization
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperialism_(Hobson)
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

>Is globalism really bad
yes
>foreign investment and trade
not the same as globalism you intellectual prole

Fuck pensions, give us back our jobs

>inb4 OP is a Faggot and disapears

Veeky Forums doesn't know whether it is protectionist, neo-liberal, or what.

Could you please describe to me how anyone can expect their investment or fund to grow 7%, annually and indefinitely, without lowering labor costs eventually?

How much do you expect to make at your job? Do you expect to make enough to save for retirement? If so, are you comfortable having 0% annual growth on your savings?

Id rather have a job and no growth than no job and growth on money I wouldnt be making

you dont need 7% growth
you dont need growth at all desu

So if we abandon globalism, Americans will need to save money instead of buying on credit.

>Implying this is a bad thing

Believe me, I'm not implying that.

What I'm implying is:
>> How the fuck do we convince people to stop using fucking credit.

Then get better jobs. There are millions of jobs the "chinks" can't do. Manufacturing isn't the only job in the world.

You're just a dumb, racist, redneck loser. Opposing globalism isn't an intellectual choice for you; it's an instinctive response of a cornered dumb animal. You need to be put out of your misery, desu.

>Implying the post-Reaganite financial industry isn't a bubble that gets larger and larger every year
Sooner rather than later is better

>huge corporations
Which are owned by individual humans, and which employ individual humans, and which buy products and parts made by individual humans, and which make products and provide services used by individual humans.

The anti-corporate schtick is the resort of low intelligence cucks. Corporations are fictional entities, and exist only as legal creatures. They're no more real (let alone villains) than the anime women you fap to every night.

>You're just a dumb, racist, redneck loser. Opposing globalism isn't an intellectual choice for you; it's an instinctive response of a cornered dumb animal. You need to be put out of your misery, desu.
>this much butthurt

Do you support basically slave labor? You think their worth that much less than you? And yet Im somehow the racist.

>Do you support basically slave labor?
No, I believe that people should be paid commensurate with their skills and talents. Don't you?

I'm sorry that God didn't bless you with either smarts or know-how, but that doesn't mean the rest of us should suffer for your shortcomings. Yeah, we'll chip in so you don't literally starve to death. But you faggots want to live like kings even though you add NOTHING to the society that you leech from.

I'm not racist. I'm a fucking REALIST. If you're worthless white trash, you deserve to live like worthless white trash. Accept it, or better yourself. Simple choice, retard.

>Not thinking people deserve at least minimum wage for a living for working their ass off, versus people getting benefits for even outright refusing to work

Might wanna get that silver spoon out from your ass, buddy.

>Not thinking people deserve at least minimum wage for a living for working their ass off
Whoah, whoah, whoah there redneck. I never said anything about the "minimum wage" -- a concept that you Trumptards oppose with all your might. It's the progressive globalists who support increases in the minimum wage.

Get your platform right, alt-right cuck. Your power level is on display and its SAD.

>Thinking if you support one stance a party has you automatically support every idea of that party
Well now youre not even trying

So you're a protectionist globalist who wants to suppress minorities or foreigners but also increase the minimum wage.

Kek.

You're a troll and a faggot. GTFO my Veeky Forums..

>strawmanning positions and insults

Why do you think you'll get serious replies with this? Or are you just really this butthurt because your side lost?

>if i strawman every position my opponent holds and then refute the strawmen that means I'm right!!!!!

lol someone needs to go back and it ain't him

>elects a globalist businessman with multi-national financial interests and who appoints Wall Street executives to run the economy
>thinks his side "won"

You epitomize the dumb white Americans who are gonna get fucked for the next 4 years. Lube up, cuck.

>white-knighting a retard
Trumptards, ladies and gentlemen.

Enjoy poverty, cuck.

Oh, you're just pretending to be retarded.

4/10

No, I think as many people as possible who are willing to work hard for quality work deserve a livable wage.

Globalism in its current form means taking jobs that meet that standard here to somewhere where theyll work someone for slave wages until they literally kill themselves.
>Opposing this is discrimination apparently though

>When confronted by overwhelming facts and logic, the Trumptard will always attempt to end or belittle the discussion.

>I think as many people as possible who are willing to work hard for quality work deserve a livable wage.
Explain to me how this is in the slightest imcompatible with globalism. Because I don't know a single progressive globalist who doesn't hold this as his or her highest ideal.

In other words, you really have no fucking clue what you're talking about. Maybe you've been reading too much fake news.

>Globalism in its current form means taking jobs
How do you "take" a job? You don't own your job. You didn't buy it or inherit it. We don't live in a feudal or serf economy, dimwit.

Economies are fluid. If you worked at Blockbuster did Netflix "steal" your job? No, it went away because the times changed. Same with your coal and manufacturing jobs. No one stole them, faggot -- times changed.

So two choices:

1. Roll back time, which is literally impossible.

or

2. Get a better job.

The ONLY problem is that #2 requires you to get off your fat ass and better yourself. And because you're so fucking stupid and so fucking lazy, you'd rather elect the guy who somehow promised you #1 even though it'll never happen.

You deserve the life you're living. If your life sucks, then you suck. Don't like it? Improve yourself. Complaining and acting like a faggot won't get you a job, and neither will electing a clown who promises you things everyone knows are beyond the laws of physics.

>P.S. You're not racist because you're stupid and worthless to society. You're racist because you use terms like "chinks." Get it through your head, you stupid fucking retard.

LOL at the corporatist apologist. They don't necessarily buy products and parts, they could literally just buy up parking spots off of govt. land, and start raising the prices. Corporations can also afford to partake in illegal activities that ordinary individuals can't, with practically no repercussions, depending on the industry, and the buying power. Not all are bad, but saying they're just contributing to the economy, isn't accurate. Saying they're fictional because it's a legal designation, is like saying oil underground is worthless due to it's legal designation as real property.

>People should be paid commensurate with their skills and talents.
What irritates people, is that corporations will seek the lowest cost of production outside of the U.S., but will reap the benefits of having their corporation in the U.S., and having their company's shares publicly traded on U.S. exchanges. A lot of people believe that a company who is incorporated in the U.S., should use U.S. labor, instead of exploiting labor from developing countries. To say these people add nothing to society isn't accurate, they may or may not.

Also - to suggest people should better themselves isn't realistic. I'm referring to the rust belt region specifically. Many towns made concessions to corporations in order to have labor placed in their city. The resulting jobs were often blue-collar, non-trade jobs. To expect massive amounts of these individuals to just "better themselves" isn't a realistic expectation. In their job that they were making a livable wage from, you'd expect most of the employees to have earned a degree, and move onto higher earning jobs, however, they didn't. This is the main reason why people are worried about job automation.

Globalism is just a meme. There are no unironic globalists that I know of. I only ever see anti-globalists claiming it is somehow magically wrong to buy from people far away instead of people close by.

2/10 downgraded for trying way too hard

[spoiler]I voted for Clinton[/spoiler]

>They don't necessarily buy products and parts
Um, that's literally what corporations do: buy things and pay for things that they use to make other things or provide other services. It's called "business." If you weren't a mongoloid, I wouldn't have to explain this.

>these people add nothing to society
When I say you people add nothing to society I mean it literally. You are stupid and you are talentless. You bring nothing of value to the economy or to society. Don't overthink this: I'm not being figurative or make a point. You are literally human garbage, and you don't deserve financial success.

>to suggest people should better themselves isn't realistic
You mean other than the millions of successful Americans who did exactly this? You can't say it's not realistic when it happens every fucking day.

What you're really saying is that its not realistic for YOU. Because you lack the intelligence and wisdom to better yourself. And therefore we don't care about you, as explained above.

>When confronted by overwhelming facts and logic, the Trumptard will always attempt to end or belittle the discussion.

>releatedly uses redneck, trumptard, white trash = not racist
>uses chink once in a forum where its common slang and proceeds to stand for them afterwards = TOTALLY FUCKING RACIST

>liberal logic
(I always find using this term funny because any test puts me right in the middle of the left)

>how is this incompatible with globalism
>LITERALLY QUOTES WHERE I ALREADY GAVE AN ANSWER
0/10 bait quality here

>How do you take a job somewhere else

>Labor needs done for a company in Country A
>If its done in Country A, the company has to pay a (debateably) livable wage
>If its done Country B, the company can pay an unlivable slave wage
>Thanks to current trade laws, theres no penalty to exploit Country B
>This is "moving" the job because its the SAME labor moved to a different location
>Examples you gave was labor being replaced by different labor (Netflix), or straight up disapearing (coal)

Why are you so adamant about defending suppressive slave wages, user?

0/10 downgraded for continuing to try

>mfw I'm the only one feeding you by this point
>mfw my face is hands

When edgy libertarians they're anti-globalist, you can easily dismiss everything they say.

Free trade spreads freedom.

>libertarians
>opposed to free trade

I'm convinced nobody on this board knows what libertarianism even is outside of the Penn & Teller's Bullshit! episodes they watched on Jewtube as a kid.

*repeatedly

>redneck, trumptard, white trash = not racist
Again, I'm being literal. You folks are white trash, human garbage. It's not a function of your race -- its a function of your stupidity, your ignorance, your delusions, and your self-imposed bubble of denial.

Let's be crystal clear here, cuck: I'm judging you on your lack of intelligence, wisdom, talent and reasoning skill -- not your race. Get it?

What you're doing is trying to dismiss my criticism of your character by demonizing me and labelling my posts as "racist." All without making a single logical or reasoned argument. This confirms my evaluation of you, by the way, and highlights the fatal flaw that's going to doom you ignorant cucks.

>thinks he's on reddit and can downvote my posts
Trumptards, ladies and gentlemen.

>tips fedora

>When confronted by overwhelming facts and logic, the Trumptard will always attempt to end or belittle the discussion.

-2/10

>Again, I'm being literal. You folks are white trash, human garbage. It's not a function of your race -- its a function of your stupidity, your ignorance, your delusions, and your self-imposed bubble of denial.
>white trash
>not racist

Folks, can a bait score go into the negative? Because I think we got one

>All without making a single logical or reasoned argument.
>Completely ignores the rest of my post

>When confronted by overwhelming facts and logic, the Retard will always attempt to end or belittle the discussion

>slave wages

Most people in China literally lived in huts and shantytowns 25 years ago, and could barely afford a family bicycle. Now there's a growing middle class, with more and more people living in apartments with electricity. Unless you're disabled, dumber than a box of rocks, and addicted to drugs, no one is chronically in poverty in the US. I'm using the UN definition of poverty, not the cushy US one.

Sure sounds like a shitty situation user. The Chinese surely are suffering.

telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/9006988/Mass-suicide-protest-at-Apple-manufacturer-Foxconn-factory.html

Because dying in the countryside from famine is much better.

You're falling for shire fallacy, user. Things were A LOT worse, user. Things are getting a lot better in China.

Found the rejects from T_D.

To improve you need to change and with every change there will be both advantages and disadvantages, if you can't handle the disadvantages nothing would improve. I assure you the advantages will outweigh the disadvantages.

But user, why would they be dieing of famine?

Dont you know that when theres no jobs you can just better yourself to get one.

>when theres no jobs
Strawman much?

>Um, that's literally what corporations do:buy things and pay for things that they use to make other things or provide other services

Except that's not what you originally wrote in post where you wrote:
>Which are owned by individual humans, and which employ individual humans, and which buy products and parts made by individual humans

Nice try at moving the goalpost and thinking I wouldn't notice. Pray tell, when is the last time Berkshire Hathaway has bought a product or part? No, I'm not talking about outstanding shares of another company.

>When I said you people, I mean it literally

user, how can you value someone who you don't know what they do for employment?

>You mean other than the millions of succesful Americans who did exactly this?
The median household income in America is just under 52K, and the majority of Americans aren't educated past high school, to expect the majority of the population to become educated or gainfully employed because others did is ludicrous.
bls.gov/careeroutlook/2014/article/education-level-and-jobs.htm
census.gov/topics/income-poverty/income.html

7/10 I bit and was hooked, it was pretty high quality bait, or maybe user is pretending to be retarded?

>When confronted by overwhelming facts and logic, the Retard will always attempt to end or belittle the discussion

They're dying of famine because there's no capital coming in because you're denying them the opportunity to use the two assets they do have: the ability to work cheaply, and access to a local market with a favorable purchasing power conditions.

You're also denying your own citizens access to cheaper goods, reducing their real income.

>Berkshire Hathaway
Berkshire Hathaway is a publicly traded investment corporation. They do M&A. They create value by integration, optimization, and management centralization.

Don't offer stupid examples to smart people. We can knock them down without effort.

>the majority of Americans aren't educated past high school
And yet they expect to live the same life that I lead, despite the fact that I have a Ivy League degree and a post-grad doctorate. Fuck that. You stupid people deserve stupid people lives. I don't feel sorry for your hardships at all.

Actually, I wasn't attempting to end or belittle the discussion. I was pointing out the latest in your long string of logical fallacies.

Retard.

But user, why cant they just better themselves to find work?

Because they're near death from starvation, and your own government is threatening their own citizens with violence not to offer them work.

Statist.

>Asking about when theres no jobs when you bring up there not being jobs is a strawman and a logical fallacy
Uh huh, sure.

Someone doesn't know what a "strawman argument" means. It's a shame there no such thing as an interest search engine or an online encyclopedia of facts. You might be able to better yourself if only Google and Wikipedia existed.

>every time Trumptards try to debate....every time

But them not being able to better themselves despite situations entirely out of control their control means they are, what was it? Oh yeah:

>You are stupid and you are talentless. You bring nothing of value to the economy or to society. Don't overthink this: I'm not being figurative or make a point. You are literally human garbage, and you don't deserve financial success.

Im off work and getting off now. But enjoy being BTFO by your own argument

>talentless

Their talent is being cheap. I've said this multiple times. You fail to grasp this. Your government points guns at their own citizen's heads and says "Don't take advantage of their talents, Cletus needs his job, and you're going to give your money to him because he's American and THEY are not."

>Berkshire Hathaway is a publicy traded investment corporation

By definition, they aren't producing/buying parts or products. I was refuting your original point about what corporations do, this has nothing to do with creating value or optimization.

>And yet they expect to live the same life that I lead

(Citation?) Also, I'm glad that you know exactly what the expectations are of over one hundred million Americans are.

>s globalism really bad? From what I can tell, no one's 401k or pension is going to grow 7% y/y without foreign investment and trade.

The U.S. has seen very little private investment since the start of "free trade". This has been a big problem for many years.

Also, free trade is ultimately a meme. Every country engages in some form of protectionism. They either subsidize industries, or they outright ban foreign companies through regulation. Essentially everyone is breaking the rules.

>they aren't producing/buying parts or products
Yes they are. They're buying other companies and producing more efficient versions of them.

Retard.

>The U.S. has seen very little private investment since the start of "free trade".
Why do I even come here? This board and this thread in particular is FILLED with idiots.

>They're buying other companies and producing more efficient versions of them

Let me explain this to you, since your Ivy league education has apparently failed you. A product is defined as: "an article or substance that is manufactured or refined for sale."

This is semantics at this point, where you are attempting to argue that because corporations add "value" they aren't worthless, which was never my original point. You also wrote that Berkshire Hathaway is in the M&A business, they're a holding company. They're not buying other companies and producing more efficient versions of them, they're just buying shares of public companies.

Trump will turn America in to China 2.0 but with out anyone willing to buy the exuberant prices.

So get rid of your drop ship dreams and star to get ready to work 10 to 12 hours on a sweet shop

>can't comprehend abstract concepts
>thinks he wins arguments with a dictionary
You're a moron, and I blame your parents. You apparently not only got bad genes, but a substandard education as well. Sad.

>Why do I even come here?

To troll, then you got hooked on the conversation and ended up being the one getting trolled.

-8/10 trolling meant something in the old days

Naw, I don't actually think there are trolls in this thread. I think there's just a bunch of really stupid motherfuckers. And they don't like being told how stupid they are, even though its painfully obvious to anyone with a brain.

Only stupid people get found out as stupid people and then pretend that they were only trolling. You're really just embarrassing yourself at this point, not that you care.

>can't even follow IDs properly

I feel sorry for the woman you end up bedding and putting a baby into.

Oh, hey /b/iz.

>he thinks his brand of stupid is any different than the other brands of stupidity in the thread

Kid, you're dumb. Period. You can't argue or post yourself out of that hole.

This is how they installed a reality show clown in the highest office in America why would they change tactics now

>Everyone who makes fun of me online is the same person

Yup, its truly frightening how many stupid people there are in this country. Keep the faith, user. We'll win out in the end.

Wow, you can't even grasp elementary statements of logic. You really are a classic fool.

>Reaction images trigger me

So you're conceding, right? Feel free to keep posting retarded images, but at least include some form of substance if you expect anyone to take you seriously.

>Can't actually form a coherent debate
>Moves goalposts and resorts to ad hominem attacks.
>Drop second argument because said argument had no merit

It's not an abstract concept when you're making assertions without evidence, and get exposed for doing such. I assume that you think since corporations add "value" that they should be able to get away with murder, but my point was that corporations can be scummy, and that there are a lot of people that rely on entry level jobs for employment.

Curious, what is your degree in?

>it's another "the poors complain about globalization" thread

>Implies anyone takes him seriously ITT

No body is going to win, trump is about to trigger a run away recession and probably another market crash while trump fags post pol memes about Pepe and liberals sweet tears

As I thought.

Keep going, your posts are comedy gold

t. triggered

>Dont you know that when theres no jobs you can just better yourself to get one.

BTFO

>ITT:
>Comedy gold
>Low quality bait
>Retard fights

Automation will probably end "globalization" in the classical sense for better or worse... China will probably be the last nation that caught the wave of modernizing themselves off exploiting their cheap labour supply. If that's true it means there's no real way of developing third world countries out of poverty and they will have to accept they will always remain poor while the first world develops even faster... that'll cause a real geopolitical mess because the majority of the world won't accept they have no chance of ever catching up.

stratfor.com/weekly/rise-manufacturing-marks-fall-globalization

You're not just competing with third world labour for employment but also machines and AI. The amount of "jobs" necessary for the same/more amount of output will keep decreasing because that's how development works.

>So if we abandon globalism, Americans will need to save money instead of buying on credit.
You mean hoard money/gold under their beds or find profitable investments at home? The maldistribution of income, favouring the wealthy, is what led to imperialism in the first place, the wealthy had such a high rate of savings in the 19th century they could only find profitable investment opportunities overseas without triggering cut throat competition that would ruin their investments.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperialism_(Hobson)

Pensions are for old fucks, and corrupt government workers.

Calpers actually had a loss of 2% last year, because they put everything in hedge funds.

State of Nevada has one guy to manage their funds, and he does a straight 70% VOO, 30% Bonds through vanguard.

He works about 4 hours a week, and in turn is the world's best pension fund manager, because he uses vanguard...

We need H1B visas, but they should be getting paid over 100k a year, not the cheap ass minimum wage H1Bs we see a lot in the valley.

Fuck illegal aliens, yes they reduce the cost of your vegetables, but you pay about 10 times more than the reduction with increased police, prisons, and welfare for their families.

Keep up the globalism and there won't be 401Ks or pensions period.

true Veeky Forums is ancap
I wanna buy a harem

Ever since TRUMP starter trolling the election this pol cucks contaminate this board cus now every 2 bit dumb fuck red neck wants to be a racist Veeky Forumsness man.

I don't even know if it is a bad thing since this board was pretty empty anyways the only problem I see is that they don't contribute for shit on the overall of this board other than their lame memes and (((epic))) trolling.

You fucks are nothing but leaches, seriously go back to pol and r9k and talk how much you're afraid of get a girlfriend cus she might be a coal burner

lel

There's a difference between globalism and globalization.

learn a useful skill you nigger. Standing at an assembly line an repeatedly pressing a button shouldn't deserve anything.