Any cons of the keto diet?

Not really constipating but it does make you irregular.

You can still have lettuce and fiber.

It's OK if you define "meal" down to low-carb lunch meat and cheese.

Also olives, sardines, heavy cream. Salami, eggs. Lots of stuff you can just dump in a bowl and shove in your face.

I found a great dish, mixing low-carb vanilla casein with heavy cream in a mini-blender. End up with a vanilla mousse, it's actually pretty good.

But not having bread or anything is harsh.

Yeah, it's been a week and I've lost like 7lbs.

Are you supposed to do Keto for a small time or is it some lifestyle change? and if you do keto for some time and then get off it, will you gain back the weight?
I just don't understand, isnt fatloss all about calories? Will I get the same effect from eating low fat as from low carb, with the same caloric intake?

Ketosis diets intentionally shift your body into "starvation mode", where it preferentially "burns" fat.

Technically, it breaks fats down into ketone bodies, which are used by the liver to synthesize glucose so the brain doesn't die.

I'm doing it temporarily with a deep caloric deficit (facilitated by modafinil, which is a mild appetite suppressant among other things). The idea is to preferentially burn fat, not protein.

It's looking like the calories in/calories out dogma is a bit over-simplistic too. Theoretically, ketosis also gives you a bump because all the biochemical conversions also take energy, but I don't know about that.

when you find yourself having to explain to every intelligent person you meet why the thing you're doing really isn't retarded, you should at least seriously examine the thing

liver toxicity
All you need is CICO, any diet designed to please the morbidly obese american population's preference about butter, bacon and cheap hamburgers with dirty-ass cheese is just a trick. Ketosis is an emergency biological mechanism, not a fucking nirvana you have to experience once in your life because some faggot told you so

Count your calories you fucking fat fuck

supposedly "ketosis mode" burns more fat than muscle which is achieved on low carb.
I reccomend just eating healthy and balanced at a slight deficit.

>stuff your face with fistfuls of cheese and bacon
>carefully measure broccoli and carrots so you don't eat too much
carry on, it checks out

>It's looking like the calories in/calories out dogma is a bit over-simplistic too

Simplistic, yes. Overly? No. The whole point of physics is to explain shit as simply as possible (though I will admit that QP and EM seem far from simple). The extra energy burned through the conversions is just more calories out.

The main reason keto works for so many people is that it's actually quite hard to maintain a caloric surplus when you cut out the largest food group entirely.

...

Best way to get some electrolytes on keto?

>he lacks the willpower to count calories
>he lacks the willpower to eat plenty of vegetables and put the sweets down
>he lacks the willpower to regulate his portions
>he needs to shove buckets full of grease down his gullet before he can even attempt to diet
>he is the LITERAL TEXTBOOK DEFINITION of a cuck
>his face when

I was wrong, your body uses proteins for gluconeogenesis as a stopgap after glycogen is depleted. After that everything just uses ketone bodies.

>liver toxicity
It's a reasonable concern, but doesn't seem to actually happen.

>Simplistic, yes. Overly? No.
Eh, philosophical. How simplistic is too simplistic?
>The main reason keto works for so many people is that it's actually quite hard to maintain a caloric surplus when you cut out the largest food group entirely.
A lot of truth to this, but it would be easy to end up burning protein if you're not careful.

Transitioning into ketosis feels very strange, but you can also feel your body re-equilibriate. You get less hungry, don't have annoying insulin/glucagon roller-coaster effects, and honestly it feels like a natural state.

Thanks /pol/, always good to hear your perspective.

>How simplistic is too simplistic?

When it doesn't agree with experimental results.

PROS

excellent way to burn fat

CONS

nutrient consideration (unless you ave the moola to supplement everything)
price (of supplements)
keto is low fat and no carb

>low fat
you fucking what??

Dietary fat will be preferred to body fat stores for the same reason eating protein keeps you from losing muscle.

totally not true.
Gram of protein per pound, and the rest f your calories can and should come from dietary fat. even protein excesive consume can mess up the ketogenesis state in your body, Lyle mc douchbag Aproves.

How do we know his wife isn't black?

Short term: Loss of lean body mass vs. an isonitrogenous higher carbohydrate diet, downregulation of energy expenditure secondary to lower insulin and leptin and higher stress hormone levels, impaired cognitive and immune function. impaired physical performance and recovery on exercises that are either anaerobic or high intensity.

periscope.tv/w/1vOxwDVvqZgKB
cell.com/cell-metabolism/abstract/S1550-4131(15)00350-2
sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0006291X09011681
ajcn.nutrition.org/content/93/4/748.long
sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S221226721501802X

Long term: Understudied, but probably increased risk of chronic disease.

tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/13590840310001619405

Only advantage is appetite/satiety, really. Which is only relevant if you're so incapacitated that you can't track calorie intake and/or have no self control.

Sleepycast confirmed

It'll make you smell like cat piss. That's the only thing I can think of that hasn't already been mentioned.

Not even joking either.

>Only advantage is appetite/satiety, really
What about a.uguu.se/hmkytj.pdf
>virustotal.com/en/file/62ee65c2bcecbef849c3a71ad52997c42d967a82ae817dddcb31655084131d66/analysis/1462165543/
>In addition, we concede that the substitution of one macronu-
>trient for another has been shown in some studies to have a
>statistically significant effect on the expenditure half of the en-
>ergy balance equation. This has been observed most often for
>high-protein diets. Evidence indicates, however, that the differ-
>ence in energy expenditure is small and can potentially account for
>less than one-third of the differences in weight loss that have been
>reported between high-protein or low-carbohydrate diets and high-
>carbohydrate or low-fat diets.

one-third of 4 kg is over 1 kg. one-third of 40 kg is over 13 kg. Not negligible at all (the "however" is dictated by the theme of the paper, aimed at re-assessing that "a calorie is a calorie"... despite the different effects on weight loss of a "low carb" diet. The difference is not great enough to invalidate that a calorie is a calorie, but it's relevant for our goals)

Also.
>Only advantage is appetite/satiety, really. Which is only relevant if you're so incapacitated that you can't track calorie intake and/or have no self control.
1) there are people who are addicted to shit food. Blame them, as much as you may blame any kind of addiction, but that's it. A natural appetite suppressant is welcome in this area.
2) I guess you may interrupt/break instantly any habit you're accustomed to, all alone and without help - from caffeine to porn and sex. Otherwise, that's a hypocrite argument. People with bad eating habits have bad self-esteem to begin with. First you have to create a starting block where to build self-respect, self-control and everything.

>Long term: Understudied, but probably increased risk of chronic disease.
a.uguu.se/loikld.pdf ( virustotal.com/en/file/bf83e3e433d67b1de2df58ebdf443cc8a8e68be9420ceb0500c3a22deb26c613/analysis/1462168590/ )
That study isn't considering 1) real keto 2) for a prolonged period of time. It isn't even attempting to address that issue from a medical POV. That paper also actually refers to a "Stone age man" and his diet, which is batshit insane per se already.

Yeah, most of the studies just do "low carbs" without bothering to actually induce ketosis.

I didn't read it but you shouldn't ever follow infographics, user. If you do, you're retarded.

no carbs will make your muscles look like shit

Well for one its fucking retarded

>Yeah, it's been a week and I've lost like 7lbs.
waterweight son

High protein diets are obviously superior e.g. ideals.illinois.edu/handle/2142/32055 but that's very different from the claims advanced by keto proponents that fat offers a metabolic advantage over carbohydrate.

When foods rich in carbohydrate (fruits, legumes, whole grains) are known for their health-promoting effects I don't think it's that big of a leap in logic to infer that a diet devoid of them will be worse off. It also makes a good point that carbohydrates are used in numerous detoxification reactions (and insulin increases Nrf2 activity thru PI3K/Akt). To my knowledge the only studies done on keto for prolonged periods are in mice and here they only live as long as controls. Which isn't saying much since mice need a protein restricted diet to get into ketosis (and protein restriction with high carbohydrate extends lifespan)

this is the only advantage of low carb, you'll lose that extra waterweight easier and look more shredded. But you can get the same effect by doing low cal with a balanced diet followed by maintanence cal with low carb after your cut. Low calorie combined with low carb is fucking deppresing

You get weak as fuck, can't really be done properly if you have any strength ambitions.

cons :

can't drink chocolate milk, eat pizza or delicious fruits

pros :

you get to feel unique and edgy

>but that's very different from the claims advanced by keto proponents that fat offers a metabolic advantage over carbohydrate.
But, it offers a metabolic, measurable, not-negligible advantage over carbohydrate. You're goal-shifting with a paper addressing an increased intake (in rats) of proteins and the role of protein in anabolism and catabolism - but you've been presented with a paper considering explicitly the Atkins diet and its virtues in a weight-loss regimen, even if it adversed the Author's conclusions on a related matter. Atkins is the best you can find about keto.

>But, it offers a metabolic, measurable, not-negligible advantage over carbohydrate.
I do not see an isocaloric, isonitrogenous demonstration of this in the paper you linked, like the one discussed in periscope.tv/w/1vOxwDVvqZgKB. Please link it to me directly.

Try it out, you will learn about your body and the more you experience the better you can make judgements on weightlifting routines/meal plans

I personally don't do it because I see no benefit over going low carb except for post-workout where you add back in carbs. Thats what works best for my lifestyle and tastes but maybe keto works great for you. (Sidenote, carbs taste great)

I don't know, I just crapped and it looks like I've lost 10 pounds since I started.

There was an immediate drop of 5lbs right after I started that I could believe was water weight. These last five pounds... probably not. This is after a week.

I am eating at a pretty significant caloric deficit, too, around 1500kcal. My basal is supposedly 2000, so yeah.

Part of the reason it appeals to me is that I stopped working out and started smoking, so a diet that works even if I can't exercise is ideal. It's a lot easier to get out there when you're not a lardass.

I don't know what you mean by "metabolic advantage", the goal is to lose fat quickly.

>Sidenote, carbs taste great
I can't even bring myself to watch the yuri bread anime this season ;_;

>am eating at a pretty significant caloric deficit, too, around 1500kcal. My basal is supposedly 2000, so yeah
You are indeed loosing fat but be careful when you stop doing keto. I put on more than 10 lb after I stopped keto as I was insulin (hyper) sensitive.

>I don't know what you mean by "metabolic advantage", the goal is to lose fat quickly.

It means you would be able to lose more fat, with the same amount of calories, by eating a certain way.

No, most people can do keto with more than 20g of carbs, it varies from person to person. Some people can fully transfer to a ketogenic metabolism in two weeks, but for some people it takes a bit longer. The "diet" there is simplistic even by keto standards, you can eat more than chicken, eggs, and vegetables.

Also, this chart makes no mention of broccoli, which means that it is utter trash. Broccoli is the god food of a keto diet, minimal carbs with lots of vitamins, fiber, iron, etc. Did I mention it has lots of fiber? FIBER MAKES YOU POOP BETTER SO BROCOLI IS BRO-COOL-4-ME.

Just make sure you don't steam the broccoli, since that removes a lot of the vitamins and stuff due to them being water soluble.

Do independent research through multiple sources and draw your own conclusion after a period of in depth study of the subject. Doing anything else is asking to get memed.

>Ketosis is hands down THE fastest way to lose fat and preserve muscle

hahahahahahahaha

I guess it can work as long as you don't go too long with it. I made a mistake sticking for a few months and as a result, even though i did lose a bunch of weight, i went on a eating spree afterwards and got back most of the weight that i lost.

>inb4 weakwilled faggot

Yeah sure, see you in a few month you ubermensch you.

Brocolli and spinach man. Fish oil is a good point tho.

I find it's better to go sub 10 or 5g a day to get into ketosis as quickly as possible. Then when I'm properly in ketosis it's really easy to stay in.

Keto is supposed to be 20% protein, 5% carbs, 75% fat, more or less. I can't imagine how bad the shits are.

Keto is a meme

I've heard of guys who can do it with 40g, though I can't substantiate that. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say part of it is genetic, and that part of it is how big you are personally. I imagine that bigger guys can go keto with more carbs.

>Fish oil is a good point though.

I would argue that you could just have the whole fucking fish with the oil and reap the benefits of the infinite protein and marine fat and make a fucking meal out of it instead.

If you're doing keto, why the fuck not? Besides, fish is fucking delicious.

Seriously OP, a lot of these carb-addicted memers don't realize the elite healthy meals you can make on keto. My go-to is chicken tenderloins friend in coconut oil with mustard and sliced avocados, with a bowl of buttered broccoli or spinach on the side.

Tbh keto is fine for 8-10 weeks to get definition.
You should also carb up once a week.
Doing keto as a livestyle is irrelevant as it remains a fad diet. And fads are not good for your hormones.

I did it last year but I wouldn't do it again. Avoiding good things is not good for your morale because you will end up eating tons of crap once you say yourself I'm done.

>fried chicken
>coconut oil
>butter
>being out of the AMDR for carbohydrate

None of those are healthy, retard.

On keto none are unhealthy either.

Been in ketosis for 1 1/2 years now. Started because of migrain and weight. Lost the weight, migrain went down 96%. It's not that difficult and it's safe. There are enough studies, most for epilepsy. Just read them.

You're making shit up.

This guy gets it. IMO keto is great to cycle, but for the long haul I prefer a targeted keto diet, consuming ~50g of carbs before and/or after a workout.

A true patrician can live off 100g of carbs or less his whole life, only the plebian classes have to rely so heavily on grains and legumes to survive.

>chicken breast tendieloins
>god tier coconut oil
>grass-fed butter for those CLAs
>not healthy

>treatment of last resort for intractable epilepsy with numerous documented side effects
>not approved by any credible health or medical organization in the world for "migrain and weight"

changingminds.org/explanations/theories/post-decision_dissonance.htm

Why should it be unhealthy?
Chicken is fine. Coconutoil is rich in mcts. Butter is a ok source of fat.
It would be unhealthy to this with carbs. But without carbs it's fine.

Don't try to reason with the carb-slaves, they will do anything to justify their addiction.

>Chicken is fine.
Not when fried. ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3704564/
>Coconutoil is rich in mcts.
lolno
heartfoundation.org.nz/uploads/Evidence_paper_coconut_August_2014.pdf
nutritionreviews.oxfordjournals.org/content/early/2016/03/05/nutrit.nuw002.abstract
>Butter is a ok source of fat.
heart.org/HEARTORG/HealthyLiving/HealthyEating/Nutrition/Saturated-Fats_UCM_301110_Article.jsp
>It would be unhealthy to this with carbs. But without carbs it's fine.
Where's the evidence for this? Burden of proof is on you.

Not necessarily. I meet my protein per lbm per dat and eat around 140g+ of fat and still am ketosis. The diet still preservea my muscles and is helping me lose this shit stubborn fat

>m-muh saturated fat
Literally 1970s tier "health" ideas. But keep consuming the whole grain Jew, I'm sure that inflammation is way better than consuming fats
:^)

>Literally 1970s tier "health" ideas.
Just like 1858s tier "biology" ideas (evolution) and 240-BC-s tier "physics" ideas (earth being round) right?

>But keep consuming the whole grain Jew, I'm sure that inflammation is way better than consuming fats
Lmfao

diabetes.diabetesjournals.org/content/52/12/2882.long
online.liebertpub.com/doi/abs/10.1089/jmf.2014.3394
nutritionreviews.oxfordjournals.org/content/72/12/741

Why are ketosis diets so popular with /pol/posters?

Go suck your own dick b r e h

A desire to be edgy and different perhaps?

rationalwiki.org/wiki/Essay:Second-option_bias

It's easy: pol posters tend to think there's a conspiracy involved, whether there is or not. The "health" organizations in the US always tend to recommend high carb low fat diets, and the US grows a shitload of grains, which just so happen to be recommended as dietary staples.

It's easy to make the connection that perhaps they just tell you to eat like that because they want you to buy their product/keep you fat and stupid/whatever else you may conclude, and it doesn't help how many shady corporations are involved in the process or intricately tied to the USDA/FDA and so on.

And as an added anecdote, keto tends to clear your mind and speed up your thought processes.

>good goy, keep eating those Whole Grains™!

just came off a 2 month keto run

it was pretty good but it was draining how much effort it took

now I'm just doing intermittent fasting. God it's nice not to have to think about not eating carbs 24/7

...

I'm a big proponent of it, but I believe keto is best used to get yourself used to using fat reserves for energy, and to help regulate insulin levels. After that, keeping yourself pretty low on carbs is easy enough, you just have to get used to not splurging on pasta and shit like that.

I've heard that after you cycle off of Keto and reintroduce carbs you'll just rapidly regain the weight you lost, any truth to this Veeky Forums?

Also, will I be flat the entire time due to the lack of carbs? I want to be shredded but I don't wana look like a bitch :(

I've done keto for almost two months and I've not experienced any weight gains after I dropped out of it. Lost 8kg in 6 weeks or so.
Just don't eat like a hypo after you return to normal diet and you will be fine

Lifting sucks.

I can't phrase how much lifting will suck. You know how workouts sometimes don't get along well? You're missing your lifts, get winded after the first rep, fill like shit throughout?

That's the best you can hope for lifting on keto.

I wish I were joking. My training sessions went from an hour to 2 hrs after a couple of weeks on keto.

You just don't have enough carbs to have consisten energy during practice.

If you want to go keto do it only if
a) you're a fatass
b) you want to lose fat more than retain muscle
c) you don't care about your lifts falling down

if all apply to you swtich to keto, be prepared for major suckage. I amied for my BMR when cutting and it seems adequate for a sustained 0.7kg/week fat loss (started with about 1-1.2 fat los got progressively slower as the weeks go by). Ignore the scale for the first week or two you'll be mostly losing water and glycerol (it's a good idea to do a glycerol depleating session as your first training on keto)

Also the diet is not for everyone - your food will be dull most of the time, take fiber suplements and good luck.