Not only is SS a troll, but Riptoes most basic advice is bullshit. He's a hack

ift 4 million pounds... how far? Throw something 4 million pounds into orbit = Massive expression of power. Moving a leg press less than a cm... low power output. For a long time. Walking would be more effective for leg health.

Front squat requires so much more overall musculature than low bar squat its insane. Front squats are safer for the lumbar spine AND also use more lumbar spinal erector (as well as thoracic). High bar is a nice way to go a bit heavier than front squats.

I really see low bar squats as effectively the same as a half squat or rack hold: it adapts your body to holding a lot of weight in a small range of motion. Not good for much else besides PL comps.

>user can't make a proper analogy
This is why people think we're retards.

Moving 200 lbs trough the motion of 90 degrees knee, ie parallel squat is the force of Sin 90 = 1.00. 1.00 x 200 lbs x the moment arm (femur say 1.5 feet) = 300 lbs/feet/s. Flexing the knee 4 degrees as shown in the video gives the power of Sin 4' = 0.0697. -- > 0.0697 * 200 lbs * the moment arm (how far the knee travels between positions, say half an inch, or 1/24 feet) = 0.58 lbs/feet/s of force.
It is it is 0.13% of the power output of a whole range motion lift.

BOOM SCIENCE n MATFS n SHEIET

And the difference is at the 'heaviest' part of the lift. Locked legs = baseline of no effort.

If you make a graph, a normal curve up and down, with the seconds shown on the x-axis, and the peak load in the middle, top of curve, then differentiate it, to how much force, for speed, you need to move it too that position (Curve up for explosiveness, longer curve down is resisting (eccentric part, longer eccentric = more energy spent)

Then you do an integral of that new curve, it will display the amount of energy used for 1 rep. Then you put the curve for a full ROM lift, and compare it to his small lift, a tenth the length, and 0,13% the height of the curve.

The energy spent of 1 ROM leg press is like 0,4 kcal. His retard spasms will be one tenth of a thousand less than that.

Why is so many fitizens STEM?

d

Wait so 5x5 compound exercises are a meme now?
fuck, what's a better routine to get stronk then?

This Novice/intermediate program is the best I've ever run.

The fist thing you need to know is: WTF are storm-rows? This is the answer:
youtube.com/watch?v=xGsbwVeTtfk

3 days a week, Full Body training..

Day 1
Power - Push /OHP
Volume - Pull / Storm-Rows
Assistance - Legs / Leg-curls, Farmer walks, GHR, Ab-wheel

Day 2
Power - Legs / Deadlift
Volume - Push / Benchpress, Side raises
Assistance - Pull / Facepulls, Curls, Shruggs, Russian twists

Day 3
Power - Pull - Rack pulls / Chinups
Volume - Legs / Squats
Assistance - Push / Flys, Skullcrushers, front raises, side raises, wrist-work, rotator-cuffs
hanging leg raises.
Power = ramp sets to a 1RM or 2-3RM, then some backup sets of 5 reps.
Volume = No more sets than 5, reps can be 4 to 11.
Assistance = Reps are 10-25 depending on body part and soreness,. around 2-3 sets.

1x10

10x1RM

Squat and OHP Monday Wed, Friday
Deadlift and Bench Tuesday. Thurs Saturday.

Have any of yall even read the book (¬_¬)

>>>
> Anonymous 09/26/17(Tue)03:22:35 No.42993241▶
>Have any of yall even read the book (¬_¬)

see

>squats don't involve hamstrings that much

Opinion discredited

I'm going to forcibly finger:
Your a-hole,
Your father's b-hole,
Your mother's c-hole,
And your son's d-hole.

You got something to say to me, bitch?

i

nuendo

Here is a picture of a person dropping into a sqaut that heavily activates the hamstring.

...

s-son?

Ripple tit would be a better coach if his head wasn't so damn far up his ass

Stop posting your low effort worse version of SS program that only fits your goals because you don't care about any of the 3 big lifting disciplines. Nobody on this board shares your goals.

If he is so awful isnt it time to change sticky?

What do you guys recommend for a beginner work out then?

Yeah but nobody cares about Veeky Forums any more and beginners make the same gains on pretty much every routine anyway.

This is unironically his starting position for a chin up. How the fuck can anyone take him seriously after this?

Greyskull LP

What so wrong about his workout plan? It is just Texas method, but every body part is de-phased with Heavy, Light Medium? Are these the fitizens who give advice?

Ble ble ble just Squat bench deadlift every day lol.

Because it's fine?

I fucking love this guy

Vs texas method?
Exercise selection features little carryover to main lifts, weird distribution of work, plain stupid mistakes like farmers walks being a leg exercise. He's already talked about reasoning behind it and it really comes down to "I don't wanna train quads". I don't really think TM is a good routine either and I'm pretty sure Rip doesn't recommend it any more.

But you train the muscles involved with the lifts with high volume isolation (takes just a minute). You can very well adapt this routine and choose your own exercises, after what you want. Btw isolating quads is a bad idea.

>believes low bar squats are excellent for hamstring development when there is no research showing they are better than other squat variations and squats don't even involve the hamstring that much period

There's no contradiction here though. It could still be "excellent" and not better than the others for hamstring.

I'm a couple months into SS, but I'm totally open to being swayed from it. But Jesus, every SS hater is just so fucking bad at forming their arguments.

Convince me you goddamn brainlets, it shouldn't be hard.

Rip's a mixed bag of good and bad advices. Starting Strength is a good book, just pretend the part about 6000 calories and GOMAD didn't exist. Practical Programming has it's merits, but completely lacking overall. The ebook Baraki and Feigenbaum wrote could replace the entire intermediate chapter of that book IMO, maybe save for the split and HLM sections.

If you're a couple months in, trying to sway you would be wasting both our time. You're likely not far off being done with it either way.

It's a 6-9 month program last I checked. That's quite a bit of time you could save me. And what about the others? Why the constant excuses for not providing an argument?

Literally all I ever see is "lol ur legs will outgrow your chest". Like, yeah, no shit. Bigger muscles will grow faster. What's the alternative? Focusing on upper body for slightly bigger arms sooner but being overall weaker because how you look after the first 6 months is THAT important?

You realise GOMAD is only for skinny guys who are literally underweight, and only for 3 months, and only along with an otherwise still calorific diet, right?

9 months is a lot longer than most people manage, in my experience. 3 squat stalls usually doesn't take that long.

If you want to personally know why I dislike it,(and, cards on the table, I'm coming at this from the perspective of long term strength development) it's two main reasons.

One is the fanatical focus on specialisation. It's good for the original intended purpose of the program but it does true beginners a disservice to run them through what is essentially a peaking program without first doing the more general training to make it fully effective (if we're talking about someone who already had a good base from sport or whatever, different story). It tends to end with them becoming much better at displaying strength but not particularly well developed in terms of general strength or mass compared to something with a higher variety and volume of movements. The exercise selection and balance plays into this but its a secondary issue.

The other is Rips insistence that volume and frequency is the enemy. A few sets a week is enough to spur early adaptions but once you're past that you need to have the work capacity to handle the higher workloads and SS actively avoids trying to develop that.

The combination of the two leads beginners into some hard stalls in my experience. Doubly so if they try to milk everything out of TM afterwards because they run head-on into the same problems.

Rip does know his shit when it comes to lifting for the most part, he's not open minded but he still does much more good than bad. Also low bar is better than high bar for almost all gym goers.

1. Use as much muscle as possible
2. Easy to learn
3. No extra mobility really needed

Maybe when you get more serious you can move on to high bar depends on who you are, are all of you Olympic lifters ? His philosophy is teach people how to lift with out making it complex, and unessary.

>imb4 powercleans

Yeah rows would be better

9gag or Ribbit, either way gtfo of here and go back to your shitholes

>9 month
>Starting Strength

Yes. I'm not against the notion of underweight trainees needing to gain weight. I'm just against GOMAD because it's unnecessary.

>Use as much muscle as possible
you should stop posting.

Thanks for the detailed response. What would you recommend for a beginner instead?

strongerbyscience.com/hamstrings-the-most-overrated-muscle-for-squat-2-0/

squats are inherently quad dominant even if you bend over intentionally like a mongoloid

train hamstrings with hip hinge movements

I thought everyone knew this and were just memeing.

Why? You're just mocking me that's not an argument

...

Reminder that this is considered perfect form on SS

instagram.com/p/BYoRfoMnTpw

i read his argument with everett about the whole low bar/high bar thing on whatever WL forum it was on, and as a guy who does olympic weightlifting and still exclusively high bar squats, i have to say everett didn't really rebuke rip's major points

Nah rippetoe is alright
>best novice strength program out at the moment
>discredits silly bullshit by pts
>good understanding of biomechanics
>believes veganism is an eating disorder
>Doesn't take bs from anyone
>hates Hillary and Bernie
>patrician pornfu taste with gianna micheals

If you're already doing SS and you're happy with it thus far, I wouldn't ditch the program. I'd just suggest doing two things.

1. Gradually add in more volume of assistance work - maybe a few moderate rep sets of variations at the end of a workout and some high rep isolation stuff (this you can shove between sets so you're not sitting around all the time). Emphasise the stuff that isn't really getting a lot of direct work from the five main lifts. Feel free to vary it and have some fun.

2. Add some cardio and conditioning to your off days. Again, build into it. The cardio is good for recovery and overall health, the conditioning is a sneaky way of building work capacity and adding in more volume that's fairly low impact.

Now if I was programming from scratch for a beginner most of that advice would hold true as well. The major differences would be a more balanced exercise selection (something more like squat/bench/row on A and dead/press/chins on B, plus assistance) and building in to a higher overall volume. I might not use linear progression either but that's a lot more arguable.

this. low bar is for absolute retards. anyone who is not COMPETING in a sport does not need to adhere to its rules.
Definition of ego-lifting

Ah yes reaching 3pl8 ohp is typical SS progression fucking sub 2pl8 benchers talking shit

I've specifically been watching Rip's OHP videos to work on my form, you're totally full of shit.

The bar should be aimed at your nose, this guy couldn't be further off.

k

youtube.com/watch?v=2pQZNGdkVck

>suggesting isolation between compound sets
Are you okay ?

wasn't at all the point i was trying to make by posting that article but ok

>3. No extra mobility really needed

in my experience, more shoulder mobility is required for low bar as opposed to high bar

>rippetoe says this is for advanced lifter
>40 year old fat manlet is repping out more than you can bench
When does shame start to kick in?

year old fat manlet is repping out more than you can bench

He is doing a standing bench

And he's doing more than you? Shitpost more

>Weight is all that matters

For stuff you're not relying that heavily on? It's a pretty good idea.

Obviously this is not going to go well if you're trying to hammer out sets of leg extensions when you're supposed to be recovering from squatting or try some full bodybuilder death by dropset shit but your recovery between squat or bench sets is going to be unimpeded by knocking out a set of band pull-aparts or bicep curls or whatever. It's just an easy way to add a bit more work without dragging out the session, similar to how the old 20-rep squats routine had you doing pullovers as active recovery right after the main squat set.

>weight doesn't matter
Someone post that pic of fit faggot squatting 1 pl8 and commenting on a 7pl8 squatter

Oh yeah, to be honest I haven't been doing pure SS anyway. I've had chins/pullups from the start and I've avoided power cleans because I don't think I can do them safely in my gym.

I used to run a mile as a warmup before my workout but I found it sapped my energy more than anything.

Yeah I literally cannot low bar, my arms just won't get into position without a lot of pain.

I'm not a huge fan of running as a warmup. I find it goes better when done away from the workout.

What the internet dubs “beginner programs” DO have a place, and at one point in history they occupied that place well. These programs are excellent for peaking weight room numbers that had been lost due to periods of inactivity; this is why Bill Starr built his program for football players (which was eventually repackaged by Rippetoe, copied by Mehdi who swore he got his from Reg Park, frankensteined by Blaha, etc etc). Bill Starr’s 5x5 was a shotgun blast to quickly rebuild some lost strength with the understanding that the athletes were engaged in some ADDITIONAL training (off season football workouts), and therefore volume needed to be kept low to accommodate training demands of the athlete. Keeping everything else fixed and only adding weight everytime one trains is an excellent way to recapture lost numbers by rapidly redeveloping the skillset under increasing loads. However, we are talking about conditioned athletes who simply lost some numbers due to having to shift their focus to a different physical ability; not lifelong couch potatoes with zero musculature and coordination.

I am still keeping my eyes peeled for one of Mark Rippetoe’s athletes to show up somewhere. Seriously, if anyone ever finds one, please let me know. I figure I could even put the picture on a milk carton; you know one of his lifters would see it then.

With how long Mark Rippetoe has been around, how much he writes, ho well looked up to his is, etc etc, I still don’t know of a single lifter he has trained. I feel like the law of averages would dictate at least ONE guy would come out of the wood work.

Comical to observe is the sliding scale that coincides with how much “crazy” someone preaches. Mark Rippetoe has never seen a “7” as the first number on his deadlift, and yet he is touted like some sort of lifting Messiah because his work is incredibly focused on the basics that everyone agrees with. George Leeman deadlifted over 900lbs in his early 20s, and people will constantly point out that Eddie Hall pulls more, therefore George must not know crap. Why is this? Because George talks about evil ideas like high reps for strength, touch and go deadlifting with straps, non-full ROM movements, and pretty much trains completely “wrong”. George could deadlift 1100lbs tomorrow, and people would still say he is successful DESPITE his methods.

So what is undertraining? Undertraining is the current craze sweeping the lifting internet nation. There are many examples of this, but typically it can include trainees only perform 3-5 sets MAX for a movement for the day, and of those sets, no more than 5 reps, trainees only lifting weights 3x a week, trainees performing ZERO cardio, conditioning or athletic work, and in general a complete lack of exertion and physical stress present in training. Parents and coaches beware; your child or protégé could be undertraining under your very nose! There are peddlers everywhere pushing this stuff on young naïve trainees. They use words like “minimal effective dose of volume” and “CNS burnout” to trick young minds into following their devious and perverted ways.

How can you tell if your child or student is undertraining? Know to look for the signs! Symptoms include a complete lack of physical development despite months of “training”, claims of being a “hardgainer”, claims of “eating everything and not gaining weight” or needing to “dirtybulk”, having to rest 5-8 minutes between sets in order to make their workouts last an hour, a lack of gym clothes in the laundry, an abundance of freetime to argue on the internet about what program is optimal, CARING about what program is optimal, a complete lack of awareness of what an assistance exercise is, zero conditioning base, a complete set of SBD gear and Olympic lifting shoes, having an Instagram fitness handle, and a physical appearance resembling a sweet potato someone left in microwave for 4 minutes too long.

The most mediocre athletes are the best coaches desu.

Oh good. I'm not the only one who reads that blog.

>Mark Rippetoe's excuse, worth a read
startingstrength.com/article/age-and-bodyfat

In my opinion he's just one lazy fuck, but most of what he says stands correct, check barbell medicine for instance. Low bar squats are usually better for everyone.

> I really see low bar squats as effectively the same as a half squat or rack hold: it adapts your body to holding a lot of weight in a small range of motion.

Load of shit, unless you're talking about those fuckers that are actually squatting above parallel with wraps/suits on, then low bar squatting isn't really that much different to other variations and the strength you build is good for anything.

I spent years only low bar squatting because I knew fuck all about training, so I just copied the strong rugby players and powerlifters I trained with.

After hitting a 630 squat in my first powerlifting meet I decided to add more variation to my training and swap most of my low bar squatting out for front squats and high bar, mainly because I was interested in being more athletic and not wanting to pursue powerlifting beyond just doing a single meet for the challenge.

Within a month I was able to hit 500 front squat and 600 high bar, way deeper than my low bar squats.

I understand specificity as a training concept. But these people going on about low bar squats being useless and 'high bar master race' are just the fucking noodle-legged retards squatting sub 3 plate looking for a way to feel like they're better than the fat guys who are just stronger than them.

Did you read the article you fucking mongo?

>630 in first meet

talentchads get the fuck out

This guy is crazy. It's not that people are expecting him to have and and Adonis belt, just not a big fat gut.

It's hard to take someone seriously when they talk about fitness and look like shit. Never trust a skinny chef and never listen to a fat fitness instructor.

>chin ups not pull ups
>Manlet

It'd take an average untrained Manlet 3 months to do that

You have statistics?

That doesn't mean that every mediocre athlete is good coach.

NOT. AN. ARGUMENT
>low bar for oly lifting
He doesn't just say that people should be doing low bar squats. But a combination of low bar squats and front squats. In order to train oly lifts, you preform the Olympic movements. In order to get stronger for the Olympic movements, you preform heavy squats nearly daily
High bar squats work less total muscle than the low bar, and should therefore be less optimal for those trying to get strength
>low bar squats excellent for hamstrings
Hey, you know what's good for cardiovascular endurance? Biking. But wait, apparently I can't say that because apparently two things can't be good for the same thing
>physical therapists are fraud
This is fact, user

Oh boy another SS thread

Yep, he's a clueless hack. Every smart person on Veeky Forums has known this for like 8 years.

You are out of your mind. SS is one of the worst beginner programs out there.

rip says front squats are the squats suited for olympic lifters, not lowbar squats

That's how you're supposed to do it dumbass, otherwise you're just half-repping.

There's literally no way for me to low bar squat without pain. I've switched to front squats and my hip pain faded and my spine no longer feels like it's being torn apart.