Mental Fitness Thread

I've tried microdosing (and just dosing really low) LSD, personally doesn't make me more creative or 'smarter' but does make small things a lot more enjoyable.
Also went to the gym a few times while on low dose LSD, don't overdo it on the dose and it's actually a really cool experience. Your muscles feel different, some lifts feel sort of light and others way heavier... don't be a retard and try maxing or something though.

Dosing and effect (I am pretty sensitive to LSD):
10mg nothing
20mg slightly more energy, feel a bit different
30mg more energy, different thoughts, minimal visuals (text slightly moving while reading).
40mg noticeable visuals (though only seen when paying attention to them) a lot more energy, feel pretty weird and don't know how to make normal small talk without feeling awkward around people so def not recommended for gym.

>Psychedelics have no positive effects on the mind besides any enjoyment you might feel from the high/hallucinations.

WRONG

hub.jhu.edu/2016/12/01/hallucinogen-treats-cancer-depression-anxiety/
>The Johns Hopkins group reported that psilocybin decreased clinician- and patient-rated depressed mood, anxiety, and death anxiety. The compound increased quality of life, life meaning, and optimism. Six months after the final session of treatment:

There is a lot of research coming out in support of the use of psychedelics for psychiatric treatments. To say that there are definitively no positive benefits of using them is to be ignorant of the research.

10mg is enough acid to make anyone meet god

Tripped on acid once and it pretty much cured by ~6 month depression. Not saying it will do that for everyone but it sure as hell helped me.

Wow, if I knew legitimate refutations to a post required so few characters, I wouldn't have taken the time to write so much out.
To start, aligning with conventional advice doesn't immediately invalidate anything I wrote. Also, I didn't call them "naughty." If he wants to take them and have a good time (although it seems you might be gambling; see and ) then by all means, he cam go ahead. What I'm saying is that the idea that these things legitimately improve your mind or view on things is garbage, usually propogated by users themselves with nothing substantiating it but their word.
I've spoken with many people who have used these sorts of drugs, and some are my friends. They generally fall into two categories: Those who believe they experienced something amazing and unique and won't hesitate to call those who are uninterested "cowards" or "closed-minded", and those who felt they had a good time (if not a bit anxiety-inducing). Guess which one generally has more well-informed and rational opinions about unrelated matters? If you're stupid going in, you're stupid coming out.
I'm aware of that research, and I think its use case for that is fine. However, OP was asking about "improving the mind," and I think what you're talking about more refers to "healing the mind."

>Wow, if I knew legitimate refutations to a post required so few characters, I wouldn't have taken the time to write so much out.

You write a wall of text yourself, but with zero substance. You make broad, sweeping claims about psychedelics and nootropics with no research to back it up. It is both lazy and ignorant. If you claim those things, the burden of proof is on you.

I don't appreciate the accusation of "zero substance" - I have given decent reasoning, drawn on my own experiences with Silicon Valley developers, and shared the experiences of those I've known. That is certainly more substance than the majority of posts in this thread.
When there is a wealth of information out there supporting my claims, and you're the one with the weird viewpoints, you ought to be the one to do the research and the burden of proof lies on you. Moreover, linking to scientific articles is usually pointless in these threads because I'll get claims of "biased scientists." But, here we go...
>Positive effects of nootropics on the cognitively impaired
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5021479/
>An article with its own cites on the current state of nootropics
sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-pied-piper-of-nootropics/
There appears to be a top comment refuting this post, but at least his first refutation is odd; in particular, what he quoted does not exist in the Cochrane study nor does anything like it appear. Maybe you will find things more valid in that comment though - I stopped looking at it after that.
>A quick look at nootropics drug-by-drug
qz.com/1064224/the-science-behind-the-15-most-common-smart-drugs/
In general, it seems "nootropics" may have some promising uses for those with actual problems, but they are not very meaningful for you and I. Here's a guy with a bunch of links that I didn't look at (I expect actual perusing of and scientific articles mentioned therein will have qualifications he didn't mention): ieet.org/index.php/IEET2/more/cannon20160223 Incidentally, he's a founder of the "Mormon" and "Christian Transhumanist Associations."

(cont'd)
I have other things to get to, so I'll stop here. Perhaps you feel choosing to reference some things on nootropics was going after the low-hanging fruit, and that the more interesting articles would be those on LSD, micro-doses, shrooms, etc. Judging by the cursory glance I've taken at those, I'd feel inclined to agree with you. This thread would certainly benefit if you were to take some of your favorites and share them here.

Everyone shitting on this post but I've been using adderall, ritalin, modafinil and coke for 5 years and tripped on acid 15+ times and this is honestly close to the conclusion I came to

>Acid
Doesn't help you philosophically or intellectually but can be fun
>Shrooms
Friendlier version of Acid
>Amphetamines
Can be great in the short term, especially for wakefulness, but make it hard to bulk (loss of appetite) and demonstrably negative and still poorly understood long-term effects on brain, liver, and heart

I operate these days on Caffeinated green tea, L-Theanine capsules (200mg/day), CBD powder supplementation (relaxation), and occasional adderal microdosing (half a 10mg IR tablet taken before an intense work period)

At times in my life I've had an extremely high amphetamine tolerance (at least for someone who doesn't use meth), I'm talking 100mg of XR adderall in the morning and still falling asleep at 1 am that night kind of thing, and I honestly hate the kind of person it turns me into

t. Someone that never tried a drug

You should drop the "psychedelics are bad :(((" attitude until you actually tried it. There is a reason people do drugs. From shamans talking to their fucking ancestors and spirits for the past 10.000 years using drugs to people being given drugs to quit addictions. Try shrooms, MDMA, LSD or DMT once and tell me what you think then.

Totally thoughtless post. The enjoyment from the high and the hallucinations has literally changed people's lives. It takes profound stupidity to write that off like it's inconsequential. And I mean that precluding the vast majority of recreational users, speaking only of terminal cancer patients who volunteered to take these as part of scientific research.

Acid cured my depression and motivated me greatly. It's the reason I got into professional school and the reason I started working out. Sometimes I take it and I suddenly know what I have to do to better my life, things i was maybe subconsciously avoiding admitting before.
Now I just use mild doses to enhance enjoyment of movies, albums and nature every so often and to refresh myself.
Overall it's a wonder drug for me but that being said I have had some horrible trips with solipsistic delusions. Learned a few good lessons about having a trip sitter and/or taking very mild doses as opposed to trying to blow my mind everytime.

Not having tried a drug does not eliminate me from being able to comment on it. Also, your reading comprehension is doing you no favors.
>You should drop the "psychedelics are bad :(((" attitude until you actually tried it.
I've already addressed this in another post, and the post you quoted was commenting on a specific use for the drug. Anything you read beyond that was entirely your own addition.
>There is a reason people do drugs: XYZ
You can say that about anything, and I'm not sure why it was worth mentioning since there was never a claim that people had no reason or even that people had no good reason.
>The enjoyment from the high and the hallucinations has literally changed people's lives.
It's more to do with people experiencing something they've never experienced before and feeling like their life or perception has been changed, but I've never heard a satisfactory justification of this, and I've heard enough people who have experienced it corroborating my reasoning. Even if it does change lives, I am incredibly skeptical that it can change lives in a way ordinary means cannot - I have not seen any justification for that either. (Again, and this should go without saying at this point, I am not referring to medical uses, but to claims of "it expanded my mind" and the like.) What I hear is similar to one person seeing a bright light in the daytime and exclaiming "UFO!" and another exclaiming "interesting!"
By all means, have fun with it if you want to, I don't care about that.

The mechanism is fairly simple and has been verified with MRIs. The replacement of serotonin with LSD causes different parts of the brain to interact different than normal, explaining the experience of enhanced pattern recognition, synesthesia and an increase in abstract thinking. This temporarily altered perception may be entirely recreational, or it may help people solve problems or view their experiences in a way that was difficult or inaccessible before. It is not really rocket science why some people claim it is life changing

>Stop looking for short cuts
This phrase made me smile, it's always sneaked in somewhere in these sort of discussions. Sorry but psychedelics are not going away as much as you'd like. The Western mind is a house of cards and you know it!

Psychedelics are a pretty mind-blowing substance. But the sooner you learn that all drugs are a waste the sooner you'll be happier and a more whole human being. You don't need drugs. This is truth, when you get the message, hang up the phone

I've been caught!

Would you ever do psychedelics if only for fun?

I agree with your tldr in , but in my experience shrooms and lsd have at least made me look at things in a different light and have in turn had a positive effect rather than it being just from taking drugs.

>all these pathetic cunts needing drugs to 'expand their mind'

Jesus christ, just pick up a philosophy book you gimps, it has the same effect

for cycling phenibut should I daily does l theanine and cycle phenibut once weekly, two week on, two weeks off

>all drugs are a waste
>every chemical in your body is made of "drugs"
It's impossible to be human without experiencing drugs every day

>30 replies
>still no Joe Rogan memes

...

There is nothing as priceless as experiencing an altered state of consciousness. The most effective-- and easiest-- way to do this is to ingest or smoke some sort of hallucinogenic chemical. Try taking a mg of LSD or 10+ grams of shrooms and NOT have a world shifting mystical experience. You simply cannot ignore the overwhelming power of these chemicals or dismiss them as simple recreational drugs. The amount of positivity that can be extracted out of these experiences cannot be replicated through any other medium.

>stop looking for shortcuts
A man moved near a river and, wanting to find a way to travel across the water, spent ten years forming a type of levitation that would allow him to float across it. Buddha, who was preaching in town, was confronted by this man, who said, "Look master, look what I have achieved. I can walk across the water." And Buddha said, "Yeah, but the ferry only costs a nickel..."

There is a lot of disagreement ITT but I think we all agree that these substances should not be illegal. Am I right to assume that? Adults ought to be able to choose whatever they want to put in their bodies.

>mg
I think you meant ug.

>My friends said x so I must be right

Nah fuck off dude. A simple read about LSD would clear right up why it has such a marked effect on consciousness. It's a partial serotonin agonist. Serotonin being a neurotransmitter associated with a good mood. LSD, a little like its counterparts intensifies visual thinking while causing a high level breakdown of the "seat of the ego" and a temporary disorganization in the brain that causes thoughts to run in a more disorderly pace. This is why users often report feeling as if their self includes their surroundings while high. And depending on the strength of your religious beliefs, LSD can cause you to manifest its symbols in your own mind. On a tangentially related note this is why União do Vegetal make use of hoasca (a brew containing DMT) in their ceremonies. It is their sacrament by helping them manifest visualizations of their religion.

I can link a paper explaining some of the more bleeding edge research on LSD but the vast majority of fit will never read it anyway. It's pretty long and frankly I had to comb through it with a dictionary to get the gist of it at some points.

frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnhum.2014.00020/full

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/União_do_Vegetal

Fuck off retard, the adults are speaking

>Not an argument

neither is what he's replying to, because it's a retarded statement

The heedless confidence of the uneducated will never not surprise me. I admire your passion user but try again :^)

if it's so retarded then I assume you are able to easily debunk it. The floor is your user.

>get into somewhat prestigious physics program
>no perimeter but whatever it's undergrad
>do absolute shit first semester
>start microdosing LSD next semester
>up all fucking day working like I'm on adderall and shit
>straight A's

Shit's better than addy's yo. No shit effects either. I even got a GF and started lifting. I just have energy all fucking day.

i hate wasting my time trying to debunk people who are so stupid it hurts
>every chemical in your body is made of "drugs"
look up what a drug is before u say such stupid shit

damnit. gets me every time

Woah, woah, woah

I'm adhd and prescribed with adderall - I thought it was fairly well tested by this point. What long term side effects are there?

used to take a lot of acid. it can be the most eye opening, galaxy brain experience you'll ever have. after my first trip i looked at the world from a whole different perspective, and still somewhat do today. but bad trips can fuck you up bigtime.

microdosing is a lot different; ive done it a handful of times and i find that i lift harder and can learn/remember shit much more effectively. no experience w nootropics tho so i cant compare.

*tips fedora* Good one, kind gentlesir. Have a euphoric remainder of the day

You to my kind sir. *cooly tips fedora in acknowledgment*

LSD first motivated me to go to the gym
I stared in the mirror looking at my naked body and thinking how sexy I'd look with muscle

LSD changed my life forever

How about you define it. The definition google gives says its any substance that has effects when ingested. If you extract any chemical compound made within yourbody--like DMT--then you have a drug that can be ingested. This can be applied to any chemical extracted from your body; meaning every compound that makes up your body can be labeled the meaningless word that is "drug".

Have you ever tested your blood pressure microdosing it? Just curious, always felt a little jumpy the day following a microdose.

The guy was mostly pulling shit out of his ass. I don't know about Adderall's long term effects but I imagine they'd involve cardiovascular issues down the line. I read once that Ritalin may increase stroke risk if taken long term, but the case study was based off one patient who'd taken the stuff for 30 years straight. If it really worries you just take small breaks from it and make sure you're not exercising while under its effects.

bump

...

The most common ADHD medication cardiovascular problems reported are hypertension (high blood pressure) and tachycardia (irregular heart rate). Sudden cardiac death may also be a potential side effect of Adderall. Other side effects of abusing Adderall long-term include heart disease.

Any permanent effects on the brain? I do a lot of cardio and eat fairly well so I'm not as worried about the heart rate.

prescribed amphetamines can be neurotoxic. There are cases where these chemicals seem to induce psychosis. You can read more here ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2670101/
Anecdotally I have had experiences with many people where you can tell that they use these amphetamines regularly before they actually reveal it. They never are quite aware and "all there" when I talk to them. It seems that there is a very thin line between abuse and actual necessity regarding these pharmaceuticals, and in this age of chronic stress about work, kids, etc. that line is easily crossed and there is little stigma around abuse. Unless you are completely not functional without these chemicals, I suggest you steer clear.

Look it up yourself

Thanks, faggot. If I wanted to sort through the contradictory clusterfuck that is adderall and adhd research, I would have.

The jury is out.

There's some anecdotal evidence to back up positive effects of psychedelics, but then again people on Reddit say that weed makes you le most intelligent gentlesir that can single-handedly stop global warming with his engorged micropenis. Take all evidence with a gray of salt until they can prove beyond a reasonable doubt the positive effects.

Trying to be more outgoing guys, taking baby steps at church now and started playing for their band, I just want my doe-eyed church qt gf guys

I microdose and take a shitload of other supplements. By the way, if you guys live in North America, there are legal substitutes for LSD. One is called 1P-LSD and the other ALD-52(or 1A-LSD) google it. There is also a recreational lysergamide called AL-LAD (jokingly referred to as alladin). Its shorter lasting than LSD, WAYYYY more visual. Also ETH-LAD but that shit gives me crazy body load.

There's also something called 4-AcO-DMT and 4-AcO-MET (or 4-HO-MET , are almost identical). 4 Aco DMT is basically synthetic shrooms. 4 Aco MET is the 4 Aco DMT is what AL-LAD to LSD is. Tryptamines and lysergamides are the shit. Check out r/researchchemicals for more info

Aren't you concerned about the largely unknown long term effects of most research chemicals?

youtube.com/watch?v=jz9yZFtRJjk

1P-LSD and 1A-LSD are practically identical to LSD.

4-AcO-DMT are also practically identical to psilocybin. Don't judge them simply by the label of "research chemicals". Everything you are consuming in pharmaceuticals and medicine, was once a "research chemical". Even Tylenol.

Oh, the formula for psilocybin is 4-PO-DMT
4-AcO-DMT stands for psilacetin
4-HO-DMT which is another analouge is called psilocin. These are very similar, google their comparison.

Mostly this. I'd still recommend occasional use for spiritual gains. If one is even so inclined in the first place

More info here

dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=15157

Good info worth reading

can you say more about your experiences and how psychedelics helped you with depression/anxiety?

psychedelics had a negative effect on me. Back in high school i used to smoke week all the time but after i did acid a couple times i lost my chill. Had to stop smoking because i would get too paranoid and drown in existentialism, also it was probably one of the things that led to me being suicidal and having to check into a psych ward so i wouldnt kill myself

I think depending on the type of person you are and your present situation in life it could be beneficial, but it can also drive you crazy if you're not secure in yourself

brainlets can't handle psychedelics. you need mental and spiritual strength to avoid "bad trips" or whatever bullshit you guys are whining about

From what I've read, it seems the new perspective from the altered state of consciousness induced by these chemicals helps people realize a new mode of being outside of their depressive/ anxious state. Basically a catalyst for open-mindedness and insight into just how open to suggestion--negative or positive--your mind actually is. Also the chemicals might make you aware of a negative aspect of your lifestyle that you did notice before.

>after I did acid a couple times i lost my chill. Had to stop smoking because i would get too paranoid and drown in existentialism, also it was probably one of the things that led to me being suicidal and having to check into a psych ward so i wouldn't kill myself
This is what happens when you don't respect the chemical. You were tested and you failed because you weren't ready mentally. Grow a pair.

>brainlets can't handle psychedelics. you need mental and spiritual strength to avoid "bad trips" or whatever bullshit you guys are whining about
This. There is no such thing as a bad trip. Often a trip presents parts of ourselves that we refuse to acknowledge. Getting through those negative emotions and overcoming them is one of the most positive and rewarding aspects of psychedelics. Maybe some people simply don't have the mental fortitude to handle that kind of thing though. Guess they are brainlets.

this is true but thats what was saying you need to be in good mental state. If youre not ready to fully embrace life without thinking twice then it can have a bad effect on you

Yup. Set and setting. That includes where your mind is at.

actually brainlets are the ones who can most easily have good trips cause they dont have the capacity to overthink things, or theyre not inclined to do so. It's harder for people who have larger perceptions because theres more that could potentially hold them back

>implying overthinking means having a bad trip

when im on shrooms i literally have ideas of how to make my life better pouring in, i stopped drinking, stopped smoking, started working out, the motivation i got from that experience was so profound it doesnt even feel like im fighting off those habits, i just dont need them anymore.

No point in them OP. they can fuck you up permanently after 1 go, fuck you up in the long run with myriad mental problems, and everything written/created by some asshole on lsd is quickly replaced by a more useful, cogent version.

Honestly I've had a bad trip before but it wasnt anything psychological it was just that I got nausea and puked after taking 4 tabs and playing BF3

>Honestly I've had a bad trip before but it wasnt anything psychological it was just that I got nausea and puked after taking 4 tabs and playing BF3
Fair enough. I was thinking about bad trip as in falling into your negative thoughts and not being able to get out.

>they can fuck you up permanently after 1 go
completely untrue. LSD, mushrooms, and DMT--some of the most prolific psychedelics--are completely physically harmless; ingesting these chemicals correlates with zero physical ailments. This user obviously has never taken these substances or even researched how they work yet he spouts his nonsense.

To get into a bad mental trip and logic yourself out is my way of having fun

>actually brainlets are the ones who can most easily have good trips cause they dont have the capacity to overthink things, or theyre not inclined to do so.
This is wrong. Just because someone has an inclination for neuroticism does NOT mean that they can extract more meaning from the chemical.
>It's harder for people who have larger perceptions because theres more that could potentially hold them back
C'mon, this is reddit-tier coping. Larger perception means you can incorporate more ideas into your perspective. It is not at all affected by neurosis (what you call "capacity to overthink things"). In my opinion, a goal should be to NOT feel obliged to think about negative things, especially during a trip where you could be exploring the limits of cognition and positive emotions.

This is most important

I ate a lot of mushrooms and acid in my party days
Some trips were fun, listening to good music surrounded by cool people in backyards draped with Christmas lights, going on day hikes talking to real life elk etc etc
But I've also had trips where I was sitting in the corner stuck in 4 hour thought loops completely convinced I was dying and a terrible person
The only long term effects I've seen is I overanalyze everything more than I used to but that could be from something else that I don't realize
It looks like some of you are arguing about what personalities bring out what kind of trips and to add to that I've seen my normie friends first hand not be able to get much out of them because they didn't bring much into them, they just want to see walls breathe and have stereotypical trips instead of trying to be introspective and figure things out about themselves

Look, I don't agree with most of this post but if you guys are getting triggered the phrase

>stop looking for shortcuts

then you're a weak willed cuck with a guilty conscience.

...

>not able to get much out of them because they didn't bring much into them
This seems to be true pretty often. Most of the magic happens in the mind, and if someone doesn't have much going in there, then their experience may be limited relative to other peoples' experiences.

The point of the story with Buddha is about not wasting time doing something, though very challenging, that ultimately has little significance. Turning your nose up to whatever could be called a shortcut is a good way to get stuck chasing your tail in a circle thinking you are making progress. An example related to this thread is: Why meditate in a cave for 3 months just to replicate the same experience you can get out of 1 tab of LSD? Experience is experience. Whether its rooted in some sort of perceived rule of reality or not does not matter.

>massive creative boosts
yeah the new software is great

acid shouldn't drastically alter your personality or view of life. only retard hippies are different people after tripping. it's just a drug, when you're tripping you think about things differently. Then you come down.

I just take acid to get fucked up, i double tabbed a few weeks ago and that shit was fun as hell.

All I can speak from experience is for lsd.
Microdosing gave me the energy to get out of bed, go to the gym, etc. from """depression""". 100μg makes me see only the good in situations ("it's shitty that I have to live in my car" turns to "holy shit I'm not tied down to anything, I can go wherever I want right now, how cool is that?"). 300 ended up being a bad trip, but all the problems I saw in my sitter was just me projecting internal problems (gluttony, self hate, blaming everyone for my own failures, etc.). At the end of the day, it's a drug just like any other and all the spiritual shit talked about is the person forgetting that. It helped me find the path to improve myself, but I could have gotten there in different ways.

You aren't taking enough. Two tabs is comfortable. The best parts of LSD reveal themselves at around 600ug and up. I recommend beginners/ first timers take 300-400ug. It gets harder and harder to deny the personality changing effects the higher the dosage you go to

in my experience, Acid is neutral by itself and the experience and possible effects after taking it are dependent on both your own active mindset immediately before taking it, your long term mindset and mood, and the environment you are taking it in. it doesn't make you smarter or dumber, it merely allows you to address something from another perspective. the use of tarot cards holds a similar purpose forcing one to answer a question by using Jungian archetypes and symbolism to provide new stimuli to allow you to imagine new scenarios or explore other angles of a topic you wouldn't of thought of on your own.

to someone not well versed in symbols a lot of the imagery would just appear as dreamscapes when viewing closed eye visuals. with some reading of basic universal archtypes you can begin to make sense of what your brain is attempting to tell you. i'd Reccomend reading Carl Jung's Man and His Symbols for this purpose.

also don't take it in the gym for god sake, your liable to hallucinate that you put 2 plates on the bar instead of 5 and kill yourself.

yea i'm not interested in altering my personality and tripping so hard i forget who i am and forget what being alive is. I just wanna have fun.

recent studies have shown the brain LOVEs LSD
it treid to lock it in with a little flap on the receptors
as far as lifting wieght goes you dont even need to do that once you become enlightened
AMA if you want
im at 100% super saiyan energy and my body naturally buffed out like a greek god once i became enlightened

Did LAST twice. Didn't care for it because I felt like shit after. Did shrooms for the first time a week ago, I've felt great ever since. Really motivated and high energy.

So much so I decided to be honest with my oneitis and now she's acting really weird. Said she's felt the same for years but she's just being really
reserved now.

Shit'soaster brehs. If you have the opportunity to do shrooms I'd say go for it