Horus Heresy General /hhg/

Isn't there a rule that if you're a named dude you can't buy shit?

no because corax is (unique)

Yes, pretty rules-lawyery, but yes.

Is it not prohibited by the main 40k rules?

If you subscribe to the idea that the primarchs are based on a tarot decks’ major arcana, the two missing primarchs are the High Priestess (highly spiritual, with an understanding of the workings of the universe) and the Wheel of Fortune (an 8-spoked wheel representing cycles, fate, and major changes). The decal on the Blackshields sheet that looks like a sun with two crescent moons and two hooked pillars looks an awful lot like the High Priestess’s symbol (dun dun dun!). And in The First Heretic Lorgar remembers that those legions existed, and were wiped out and erased.

I assume that’s why Russ thought his orders to wipe out the Thousand Sons wasn’t too out of the ordinary to believe.

How should I build an Alpha Legion army?

Their special units seem pretty lackluster honestly, are they worth taking

>Lerneans being lackluster

Lorgar would be the high priestess surely?
>clerical/holy
>obsessed with understanding the truth of the universe
>somewhat feminine

But they are

Theyre just a cataphractii with a power axe and volkite charger. The only special thing they get is stubborn. Not really interesting at all. I hope they get a rework when the actual models come out.

Why dont terminators get veteran tactics?

Stubborn WS 5 and a volkite charger for 5 points more than a normal terminator? They aren't sper special snowflake unit but they're pretty gud

> That's not a rule

Unique is very, very simple; you only get one.
It mentions diddly shit about having fixed equipment or losing options. In the vast majority of cases they simply aren't given any, but the global character options available to any Legion model remain valid.

Theyre just so vanilla. I wish they at least got a special ability, or a special weapon. Preferably both.

The best legion should have more interesting units.

I also wish Headhunters were better desu

Give them to the Blood Angels then. I would love some Terminators++

He's the Hierophant: a spiritual leader and teacher, a symbol of group identity, calm, slow to change his mind but resolute when he does, holds grudges, dogmatic. One non-40k-related website says, “While the Magician [Magnus] was taking raw power from the Universe and manifesting it in the material world, the Hierophant channels that power through society.”

As for the High Priestess, there’s probably some significance in the representative of femininity having been wiped out before the story even starts.

>Implying BA unique units wont have special rules and equipment out the wazoo

i wish WE didnt suck

cadre weapons definitely need a going over. Their new RoW and redbook changes are pretty decent though

the crimson path is dogshit

>3+ FNP being dogshit

Suck is too strong a word. They're not bad anymore, but they still take massive casualties even when winning.

Lernaens are sweet. They hit other terminators on 3+ and have stubborn, making them an excellent praetor boat. They discount on volkite is great too. They are a bit vanilla but AL in general are vanilla marines +1, so oddly enough they exemplify the legion well.

Also keep in mind they get mutable tactics and benefit from Alpharius' global buffs, so in reality they're WS:5, stubborn Volkite terminators with counter charge/infiltrate/scout/move-through-cover and preferred enemy everything. for 5 points more each. Not bad.

Also head hunters are kinda the same deal, with counter charge they can put out a threatening amount of AP3 rending attacks

Is the Whirlwind scorpius any good? I have 125pts left over in my list, and I'm trying to choose between a scorpius with a HK missile and a predator with HB sponsons, combi bolter, armoured ceramite and a dozer blade.

+1 to your FNP in the enemies deployment zone is dogshit.

typhons/vindicators/scorpius/medusa dont give a shit about your FNP

the crimson path is garbage

Didn't get an answer in /WIP/ so I'll ask here, you guys should know a thing or two about resin.

Is it possible to use hot water to straighten a resin piece AFTER it's primed and painted?
It's only a very slightly bent sword but I'm worried the tension might cause the paint to crack and ruin the whole piece.

>Running your blobs into blob-mulchers

well no shit youre having a bad time retard

No

This is correct

if you arent running 2 spartans or 2 kharybdis WE arent even playable.

Please tell us more about the other primarchs.

Consider bikes.

nah theyd still get raped by typhons/medusa/scorpius/vindicators/phosphex

the only way for WE to even get anything into CC is to take 2 spartans or 2 kharybdis or 5 dreadclaws. its retarded.

400 points of phosphex thud guns or a typhon will kill 1000+ points of WE blobs before theyd ever see combat. 20 man blobs might as well not even be an option in the book

Show me on the doll where Perturabo touched you

>400 points of thud guns

What kind of asshole do you play against
implying you even play

>I play in a meta so saturated by the most optimal units that must mean that everyone else plays with such a setting

How many Typhons and Vindicators are your opponents taking Jesus Christ

1 typhon will effective kill or neuter 3 20x man blobs in 3 turns of shooting.

3-4 thudd guns with phosphex will kill them even faster.

a thudd gun with phosphex and shatter shell is 90 points, somebody taking 3-4 thudd guns is not uncommon. your meta must be pissweak

Do you think everyones army is nothing but artillery and phosphex? Unless you're coming up against the Ironfire no-ones bringing enough heavy firepower to wipe you off the board turn one.

Any Heavy artillery they do bring needs to become target number one, take javelins or jetbikes

>Typhon shooting at units that can't hurt it
>Using shatter shells on infantry

My meta consists of 2 WE, 1 EC, 1UM, 2 AL and me, a SoH player

20 man blobs are common and the most artillery anyone brings is the UM with 2 quad mortars

Just running with the theme of discussion, but is Ironfire a bit of a cock list to run? i have a Hammer list written out and expanding into ironfire is the logical next step, as none of the other rites really interest me.

It's hard to give an answer - it depends on how bent it is. I'd feel comfortable trying it, but I'd start with a hair dryer and a book (that can get a little dirty) to do the clamping.

Not him bt I used to play Black Templars and tried 3x15 footslogging squads and I can tell you from experience that it is fucking awful as you will reach assault by turn 3 IF AT ALL because your opponent will slaughter your shit as you run towards his line and if you ever reach him you will be so fucking depleted it wont matter.

I think World Eaters, much like BT, are kind of fucked not because of their rules but because their rules need them to be in close combat and getting into assault has been awful since 6th edition and that neuters them.

30k has some things that can help in that regard like using Vigilators to infiltrate/outflank large squads to assault turn 2/3 or dreadclaws to shove large squads down your throat and into your ass. WE need dreadclaws.

It's not that bad, there are some pretty hard counters for it, like massed heavy armour, or heavily mobile lists that can be meltabombing your artillery turn 2.

But it is a fucking badass rite to run, a rolling bombardment is metal as fuck.

>Do you think everyones army is nothing but artillery and phosphex?
everybody i play is running ether a typhon, 3+ thudd guns, multiple vindicators, 2 medusa or some combination of the above.

Shit man, actually feel sorry for you there, really shitty meta for a WE player.

Your only hope now is to become the cancer and run Crimson Path with Surlak and 20 man inductii squads in spartans.

I pity you

>outflanks behind your artillery
>unsheathes power dagger

Heh, nothin personal, kid

Smashing. Siege on my battle brother!.

nah crimson path is shit. i run 2 spartans with berzerker assualt. 10x terminators in a spartan, angron, praetor, 20x man in a spartan, and 2 10x mans in rhinos, + some other shit.

the 2 10xman squads in rhinos used to be 2x 20man blobs footslooging, but theyd never even see turn 3 so its pointless.

WE suck balls, the only way to run them is ether dual spartan, dual kharybdis, or dreadclaw spam, and even then i dont think WE are the strongest melee legion anyway, at least without berzerker assault.

Only Perturabo sieges.

menducia.atspace.com/primarchs/I.html

It's at least a decade old, but the newer fluff isn't contradicting much of it.

The numbers don't line up, and it isn't perfect but too good to be coincidence. Also, there are 22 cards in the Tarot's major arcana: the 20 primarchs in the middle, bookended by The Fool and The World. In this interpretation, The Emperor (the character, not the card) plays the role of The Fool, who's basically the protagonist of the story with a fatal flaw. The World is his great project.

Sounds like somebody needs to run an Armoured Breakthrough list with 4 Sicarans and at least 3 Laser-Vindis.

Why do you play them then? Legitimate question. Is it a lore thing? If so I commend you.

When will outriders be able to use nuncio-vox? I want to teleport my termies next to my drive by ganger

i played khorne chaos warriors in a game that no longer exists, so i like khorne.

also i like their color scheme/fluff

im going to be starting a NL army soon enough, for the same reasons. theyll probably fair badly in the meta too, but im going to run a few dreadclaws with sev and DS like 20 cataphractii all up in their shit.

So whats the difference between 'Siege Warfare' and 'Stronghold Assaults and Attack and Defense fortifications in extremis'?

I'm kidding, I am the same pedantic user from a few days ago who made the same argument.

Its bait, sorry user Kun.

I'd also use Wikipedia to see what the cards actually look like. Some fit, others don't. In many cases you have to know a lot of symbols to get it.

Probably never, but you can take a siege breaker with a bike, and siege breakers come with a nuncio vox standard.

What if I run 1 Spartan 1 Kharybdis?

My meta is rather Mechanicum heavy...as a WE player myself, it hurts. Very robot heavy, lost of T7, and Scoria. I've only played at 2000 pts, but even as my lists grow I'm really just spending too damn much on transports. I can't even run my Leviathan, which I love because it's such a great model, without really gimping my infantry ability because transports are a good 1/4 of the list, and then a 300 dread (Admittedly, Contemptor-Cortus are a bit fluffier anyway and pretty effective so I'm going to start running those). I'm going to start using Assault Marines to try and counter that a bit, but those are godly expensive as well and can't take the Apothecary with them. Luckily there's no Typhons or anything yet.

It's tough to field a list that's both practical and fluffy for World Eaters, but I'm sure it's manageable. I've read that they were pretty into Speeders as well, which is good since I plan to grab some Javelins for outflanking lascannons. Plus, I'll have Angron soon, and that deathstar of Butchers alongside the 20 man Spartan party just might make me That Guy.

>I'm really just spending too damn much on transports.
yeah we are fucked since assault transports are 100% necessary. a 2500-3000 point WE list will have at least 700 points worth of transports, unless you run 5 dreadclaws. which would only work if you were spamming vets or some other high cost unit so its the same anyway.

>What if I run 1 Spartan 1 Kharybdis?
should be fine. just remember without berzerker assault or a chaplain WE blobs arent even that good in melee.

assault marines/rampagers are overcosted and many other legions do jump troops better than we ever can.

basically the only thing WE have going for them over other melee legions, is 20 man blobs with berzerker assault, but they are easily destroyed by the abundance of cheap pie plates in 30k.

without berzerker assault giving us hatred we arent even a top 3 melee legion imo. rage isnt that good, especially compared to SoH/EC/NL/BA/etc. overcharging the butcher nails is a double edged sword since itll kill 1/6th of your own unit, its like shitty counter attack.

>>What if I run 1 Spartan 1 Kharybdis?
>should be fine
That was kind of a joke desu.

In other news, fuuuck the Dreadnought Drop Pod. Shitty thing hardly stays together, and I had to greenstuff the bottom pieces because the large solid areas don't like sticking together. If I didn't find this band, I'd probably never keep it together. I'd hope I got all the agent out, I soaked it for a day and a half and then scrubbed it good.

I cant tell if it's the picture, but that turbine on top looks like it's pointing off at an angle

Fuck, you're right, good thing you noticed or I wouldn't have until it was too late

Do the doors open?

Yes, that part I at least managed. If the greenstuff manages to hold everything together I won't have to glue them shut to support that damned engine.

Ya did good, user. Ya did good.

Really cool, but inaccurate IMO.

Lion- Hermit
Fulgrim- Empress
Perturabo- Devil
Khan- Chariot
Russ- Judgement
Dorn- Hierophant
Curze- Moon
Sanguinius- Hanged Man
Ferrus- Justice
Angron- Tower
Guilliman- Emperor
Mortarion- Death
Magnus- Magus
Horus- Strength
Lorgar- High Priestess
Vulkan- Fortune
Corax- Star
Alpharius- Lovers

Leaves Sun and Temperance as the missing Primarchs.
> The tactless paladin and the hyperactive optimist

Help me /hhg/, what happens to a Glaive when a Venerator pens it, does the Volkite Carronade just ignore the snap firing or does it not fire ?

Never used PoTMS being a CSm guy so I'm not really sure how it works with cruising speed.

If I move my vindicator with a machine spirit at cruising speed do I get to fire the demolisher cannon at full BS?

Rogal Dorn walks up to the wall and deconstructs it so his breachers waltz through.

One is better than the other.

Strong hold assualts involve taking the stronghold, Siege warfare replaces it with a (sometimes irradiated) parking lot.

Ive been overlooking that forever, I even fielded one a few times. Tank hunter bikes and now no scatter termies, I think I'm in love

Upvoted

It's only tankhunter for the heavy weapon shooting of the attached squad, so take multi-melta jetbikes for maximum SYNERGY

Seige typical involves bombaring the fort for weeks while cutting them off of supplies. After the defenders are shell shocked, sleep deprived, starving, and dehydrated only then did the Iron warriors start to paint the outsides of their walls a pretty super human red

So the TT matches the lore

I already ran that and ussually gave a majority of them power weapons. Typically shit works out real well minus few times the squad bit it on the first couple of turns.

Jetbikers can't take power weapons though? Or are you referring to Outriders?

Outriders, I tried jetbikes but they weren't tough enough for the points I sank into them

Fair enough, looking at what I said before the Siege breaker gets tank hunter on all of his attacks, not just his Heavy wep shooting, so he could have Tank Hunter Meltabombs, which is some scary shit when you think about it.

Weapons that do not roll to hit or hit automatically cannot be fired as snap shots.

Someone pls reply I want to go to bed :(

Got a sweet template set off of ebay. Check em.

Cut ten points elsewhere and bring a Sicarian

I was actually thinking this as a secret third option but didn't post it

Congratulations user, you win the secret prize

It's nothing there is no prize

Follow up question: Are sponsons worth it on the sicaran? And if so, which ones?

That's are pretty huge, what're you going to spray it on?

If you're strapped for points, not really. If i have less than 60 points free at the end of a list, i'll buy them, but otherwise skip

Sounds good, I'm just a bit worried that with one bad penetrating hit it'll be gunless

what about sponsons on Predators with the standard cannon? I kinda wanted to build them with heavy bolters just so that a weapon destroyed doesn't neuter the whole tank automatically.

Personal preference really, and meta. How often will you be receiving a pen without being totally wrecked just from HP loss? Near me everything antitank is either HSS/Havocs with lascannons or big stompy things with chainfists, which means anything that gets hit is going to die, so i keep them cheap. If you think theres a risk of weapon destroyed without dying, and you have the points, try it out and make your own decision.

It's templates for blast, large blast, and flamers. Funny thing is I actually have a lot more use for them in 40k than 30k, but it's still my legion and I have a few weapons to use them with.