Warhammer 40k General

ya I think that they could be cool if A they had a armored version and B could use the cadian sentinel formation (outflank, preferred enemy(one unit in particular))

>Krieg
>best
what a joke

Found this is the whole thing up yet?

Armour isn't the issue from what we've seen. It's a single BS3 shot with an expensive weapon. The move through cover rule over AV12 on the front is far better for deep striking as well.

they are good looking models and I like the rules for their assault brigade and death rider formations.

I just need to get the money to buy the expensive ass models.

can we at least agreed that both the drop troopers and kreigers are both miles ahead of the cadian troops for their looks alone?

yes, but that's not saying much

If only because they come a bit closer to being the right scale. Cadian Kasrkin are amazing though and I'm glad I have about 30 of them to play small scale games with as Scions are shite compared to them.

Regular Cadians yes, hostile enviroment cadians rank above DK and Karskins... tie with Elysians.

Personally I prefer Modian Guard, but for all my love of lore their sculpts just can't keep up.

>30pts for Counter Attack

Are you shitting me?

Kasrkin are the only good Imperial Guard infantry models.

true kasrkin do look good but I myself intend to never buy metal models. I don't know why I just won't buy metal.

we can only hope our next codex will come with some new models... whenever that happens.

Glad to see Angel's Blade is looking terrible.

t. Salty Chaosfag

Is the .epub for the new Kill Team rules up yet?

And what has changed?

I've had them for years which is why I have so many. Did a lot of trading back in the day at my GW and rarely did anyone value Kasrkin highly. Years later and I look at the ebay prices for Kasrkin and smile.

It's out but as the OP says, Mega uploadfag is months behind.

So last thread I was asking what army I should build next but thinking about it more and more makes me realize I really want to make Thousand Sons, a whole army of them.

Unfortunately fluff dictates there's not many of them in one place since they crashed the party at Fenris but fuck it it's a big galaxy and Tzeench loves fun more than realism. The most difficult part is justifying marines that aren't dust bunnies.

Somebody advised that I wait and see if the new Fenris thing will give any Thousand Sons shit but I'm excited enough to start early.

I'm thinking I can start with a Defiler that I can sculpt some warp fire onto and Tzeenchify. Does anybody have any recommendations for what to do with cultists, since I can't use Spireguard as troops?

Might just get the box. Don't have the rulebooks and I can give the Tau to my brother.

Might do a quick spray paint job on the marines so guests can play as well. Are campaign rules included in the booklet?

>30 points for counter-attack in an army that focuses on the initial charge
k

I would actually suggest using obliterators. The fuckers get to make/change their gun into any other gun every round. If you are already doing conversion work, just take some terminator bodies as the base and go to town on them.

Warp talons are also useful for a tzeench army, but that's depends on how many TS you actually take, because both are ap 3.

Chaos spawn are another excellent option, fast and melee, great vs hordes.

Possessed can be useful, but they are very expensive and I would simply suggest using warp talons right now. You can always make the jump packs removable and have both.

Make the most of you tzeench invul bonus when making your list, but don't forget to bring other stuff as well. You can simply take a sorcerer to make your TS troops, then add other stuff to the army. There's no need for cultists and normal marines if you cover their roles with other units.

make some wizards with beards, cloaks, daggers and guns. something something cultists love to hang out with the 1k sons in the chance to study magic and possibly be made into marines

>but old guys can't be made into marines

eh, due to warp magic it's possible. with the 1k sons i imagine that there's more focus on psychic then martial might

Yeah it's pretty retarded, although I think people are forgetting that it gets conferred to the whole squad if one model has it, so I guess the intention is to run it in a huge Death Company? But it's still pretty stupid even at that.

30 points for an extra attack.... Maybe from your HQ choice.

If that's the intent. GW fucked out.

BRB has counterattack only grant extra attacks to those models with the rule.

Played 2 games yesterday. First vs tyranids which I lost, but forgot to take pics. Here's some pics from the ork game though. 1/4.

Oh holy shit you're right, I just reread it.

Hahaha wow. GW does it again.

2/4

Oh a shitty relic, its not like everyone has them.

3/4

4/4. He had a cool/weird theme for his army. The orkperium.

That doesn't excuse it. The design team should be getting better at these things, we shouldn't continue to have low standards just because most of what they put out is shit.

t. not a mehreens player.

Because Orks have the durability of wet paper and shit strength, sure they have three attacks when you're fighting T4 models they need to hit with all of them just to score one wound.
After struggling and dying to get in to melee they end up getting hit in the face before they get to use any of their attacks.

10 Orks 60pt vs 10 guardsmen 50pts.
Orks sluggas go first and they're going to run forward to try and close the gap.
Guardsmen move forward and rapid fire 19 shots in to them killing 3 Orks.
ASSUMING they pass their panic check they move forward shooting their sluggas failing to kill an guardsman, on average, due to their mighty >bs2.
They charge, losing another Ork to overwatch.
The mighty melee race lifts it's arm to destroy the lowly of humanities warriors only to... get hit in the face and lose two more Orks because >I2
The few Orks left finally strike killing 3/4 guardsmen and winning combat at which point they either fail to catch the fleeing guardsmen or get killed next round.

ya, I have seen those prices. though for me I have only been trolling ebay for forgeworld leman russ parts.

I just bought a leman russ forgeworld vanquisher at a miniature market at my FLGS for $30 which I think may have been a little steep for what I got, but at least i can run an imperial army allied detachment now. I still need to buy a 5th one to use the cadian Iron fist detachment.

So far I was planning to run
1 leman russ vanquisher command tank with lascannon hull weapon, heavy bolter sponsons, coaxial stormbolter and beast hunter rounds

1 commissar battle with infernus rounds and heavy bolter hull weapon

1 leman russ demolisher with hull heavy bolter

and finally
1 leman russ exterminator with las cannon and flamer sponsons

I intend to run this with about 1000 pts of infantry for my normal games from now on.

More importantly i had bought the beast hunter shells and infernus shells with the intention to counter a tau friend of mine. That way I could try to instant death his suits and ignores cover flamer round his pathfinders.

But I don't know if this is that cheesy, could you give me some insight on whether that would be too cheesy or not?

We are having a friendly 1750pts tourney in 2 months at my lgs and I was thinking about bringing a Nurgle themed Black Crusade detachment. The meta will be fairly casual so I can allow myself to go for a fluffy list. Here is what I made based on the minis I own. I fall 112pts short, what should I ad/change to make it fairly competitive ?

+++Chaos Warband+++
Typhus 230
Chaos sorcerer – ML2, Bike, MoN 120
x4 Chaos Bikers – x2 Melta, MoN 134
x5 Possessed – MoN 150
x7 Marines – MoN, Flamer 127
x7 Marines – MoN, Flamer 127
x5 Havocs – Autocannons, MoN 130

+++Fist of the Gods+++
Waprsmith – MoN 125
Chaos vindicator – Combi-bolter 125
Chaos Land Raider 230
Chaos Predator – Twin-linked lascannon, lascannon sponsons 140

Drop typhus.

If you aren't bringing zombies your basically wasting points on a Chaos Lord

>The few Orks left finally strike killing 3/4 guardsmen and winning combat at which point
>The few Orks left
>win combat

Yeah. They still fucking win after taking casualties and being outnumbered. So stop complaining.

They're fucking Ork boyz, they're SUPPOSED to die in goddamn droves. Like literal mountains of corpses.

>>WS
>Irrelevant
you what mate?
WS 4 means they get hit on 4 rather then 3 from most units, so its hueg.

>barely better than a FW
>4 fucking S 4 WS 4 attacks on the charge for 2/3rds of the points, while tanking hits at T 4

Oh my god Orkfags are the literal worst. Do all the people who can't math gravitate towards Orks? That would make sense actually.

the red flyer that looks like a devilfish conversion. Whats it supposed to be?

Also thumbs up for Xiphon.

The Chaos Lord is mandatory for the formation unfortunately and Typhus is much better in combat than any geared out Chaos Lord.

It was his dakkajet. And yes it was a tau tank/transport before.

The most most likely survive losing combat and kill the Orks and that's with a 10 point handicap, if I wanted to match the two units I could give them a heavy bolter or some special weapons.

They don't "win", boyz cannot beat their equivalent in points.

>10 Orks 60pt vs 10 guardsmen 50pts.
>winning combat
>complaining

See when I saw all the Ork players complaining in the past I thought it was about legitimate things like lack of invulns, lack of customizability, overpriced vehicles, shit like that.

Now that I realize they just want their mainline cheap as balls infantry which are SUPPOSED to be dogshit and which are already killy beyond their points in melee to just be invincible terminator slayer deathstars I have no more sympathy.

>S4
>Thinks Orks charge

Laughinggrot.jpg

Boys are shit, haven't fielded one in nearly 4 years.

I want:

>invulns, lack of customizability, overpriced vehicles, shit like that.

Ok then buddy.
10 Orks v 12 guardsmen, 60pts
Orks run.
Guard kills 4.
Orks miss with shitty pistols.
Ork dies in overwatch.
3 Orks die in combat.
2 guardsmen die.
Guard wins combat and sweeps the remaining two Orks.

Happy?

>can't figure out how to get off a charge with a unit that can run and charge in the same turn and re-roll one of the dice and has open-topped transports
I have a friend who plays Orks at the FLGS. He's very fucking good and wins around half his games. Against Tau and gravstar IF.

This "boyz need to be buffed with 4+++ and 5 attacks base for 4ppm" meme needs to fucking die.

Only people who defend Orks are the mathhammer guys and people who don't play them.

>Boys
>Good

>I want:
>lack of customizability,
So you want less options...

>overpriced vehicles,
And even more expensive vehicles?

You okay user? You sound like you hate Orkz

Try using cover, faggot, you have stikkbombs for a reason.

>Trukks

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaa

No he's not?

Nurgle Lord on a bike w/ power fist/lightning claw and gift of mutation. Like 170 points, max.

>unit that can run and charge in the same turn
Waagh must be declared at the start of the tuen before movement, ONCE per game, giving you a 6" move and a d6 run then allowing you to charge with poor-man's-fleet
>has open-topped transports
That get blown off the table 9/10 times because they're 10/10/10 open topped.

>cover
>difficult terrain tests
>-3 to charge
>for a 5+ cover save against ap- weapons
Orks are a laughing stock.

Laugh all you want, meanwhile Tyranids have no transports, no assault grenades, got nerfed to WS 3, have CCW that do nothing, cannot run and charge despite being so fast in the fluff that Eldar Jetbikers won't stop and shoot for fear that the swarm will catch them, have to stay within 12" of a shitty overpriced and fragile as balls synapse creature or they literally eat themselves even WITHOUT being forced to take morale checks from enemies, can't take a squad leader with a special weapon, don't get to shoot at all before charging, AND have lower Toughness.

ON THE RACE THAT WAS EXPLICITLY DESIGNED ORIGINALLY TO BE *THE* *DEADLIEST* *MELEE RACE*.

So suck a chode, faggot. Green Tide is literally viable, while the race that should fuck EVERYTHING up in melee by direct word of the creator can't even remotely do that.

that math isn't even a little bit right

I have a question about wargear for CSM.
Under ranged weapons, it says
>A model can replace one weapon with one of the following:
Does this mean only one ranged weapon choice can be taken per model? So, hypothetically, I couldn't replace a bolter with a combi-bolter AND replace a CCW with a plasma pistol on the same model. I can only make one replacement, correct?

Everyone in here complaining about Orks and im just adding AoS Feral Orks to my collection

Oh my god make me stop please /40kG/

10 Orks v 12 guardsmen, 60pts
Orks run.

>Guard kills 4.
12, rapid fire for 24, dealing 3.33 wounds. I see you round up to 4.

>Orks miss with shitty pistols.
6 shots, dealing. 889 wounds, but you round down here.
>ok.jpg

>Ork dies in overwatch.
>24 shots, 4 hits, 1.11 wounds

>3 Orks die in combat.
12 attacks 6 hits, 5+s for 2 wounds. Leaving us with 1.667 usw
>1.667 rounded up to 3
>wat.jpg

>2 guardsmen die.
3 Orks attack at 3×4 for 12 attacks
8 hits, 5.33 wounds. 3.5 usw

>Guard wins combat and sweeps the remaining two Orks.
>Guard kill 2, Orks killed 3-4
>Guardsmen lost combat.

>Happy?
Not really.

Orks start at 10
Lose "4" (3.33) to shooting (6 left)
Lose 1 (1.11) to overwatch (5 left)
Lose 2 (1.67) to I2 (3 left)

I don't know what kinda rules you're playing with, bro, but it's -2" to charge through terrain and almost all cover is 4+.

You forgot to do Mob rule test after that first shot.

Orks have no transport, there was a stiff breeze and it fell apart turn 1.

>People STILL advocate Boys and Trukks and wonder why Orks lose and then ask why they're losing

Leadership is 7. Average roll is 7. They make it.

>rapid fire for 24
23.
>but you round down here.
You seem to be missing thing, care to guess what?
>12 attacks 6 hits
14 attacks for 7 hits.

If you don't even know what you did wrong then don't even bother responding, you're wrong.

>going off the premise of first user that they pass Ld. But you are totally right.
>At Ld 7 they're good 50% of time
>tho at that size and no Nob if they fail Mob chart does nothing (no character and less than 10) so other 50% they run.

>almost all cover is 4+.
Read the rulebook again.

After driving them more than halfway across the board.

>After driving them more than halfway across the board.

As nothing more than a grave marker when it blows up and all the boys die inside, making it irrelevant that it was even on the table in the first place.

Or is your unit of 3 boys and that 1 Nob you still put a PK on (ahhaahahhaa) gonna be scary after it fails its mob rule and punches itself?

"RUINS
Ruins are difficult terrain. Models in ruins receive a 4+ cover save, regardless of whether
or not they are 25% obscured."

Which makes up 99% of all terrain on all game boards in every LGS ever, so what the fuck boards are you playing on exactly?

>Leadership is 7. Average roll is 7. They make it.

Pls nerf.

On average a Trukk won't explode when it dies and even if it does it will kill less than half of the boyz.

You got me :)
>but you know what YOU MISSED

I'll give you a hint
>10 Orks vs 12 Guardsmen

Although funny thing is considering Lasguns / Guardsmen CC are both hitting on 4+, wounding on 5+, and no AP it doesn't change much

(3.33 drops to 3.19) you still rounded up to 4
(1.11 drops to 1.06) no change
(1.66 raises to 1.97) you still rounded up to 3

Why are you assuming every bit of cover is ruins?
Why are you assuming there is a convenient building for the Orks to hide in, that the guardsmen are too stupid not to move away from?

> no AP
>thinking this matters against 6+

REAL FIRED UP

If Trukks and Boys are so good why doesn't it win consistently?

If Trukks and Boys are so cost efficient why aren't you worried when your opponent puts it on the table?

>guardsmen retreating from the front line
That sounds like a suspicious lack of faith in the Emperor

And to add to that:

"BARRICADES AND WALLS
Barricades and walls can be hastily assembled obstacles or the remains of once proud
structures.
A model in cover behind a barricade or wall has a 4+ cover save."

"DEFENCE LINE
Defence lines are armoured shield sections that link together to form makeshift
fortresses.
A model in cover behind a defence line has a 4+ cover save."

"GUN EMPLACEMENTS
Though once abandoned to the tides of war, this gun battery still functions and will
serve the cause of carnage once again.
A model in cover behind a gun emplacement has a 4+ cover save."

"IMPERIAL STATUARY
The cold and noble gaze of this ancient hero inspires determination in those who have it
not.
A model from the Armies of the Imperium that is within 2" of Imperial Statuary terrain
has the Fearless special rule. A model in cover behind Imperial Statuary has a 3+ cover
save."

"RUBBLE
Detritus of battles past litters the ground – twisted metal and shattered ceramite that
can be used as cover, if the conflict is desperate enough.
Models in rubble terrain have a 4+ cover save, regardless of whether or not they are 25%
obscured."

"TANK TRAPS
These obstacles allow all but vehicles to pass by unhindered.
Tank traps are impassable terrain to non-Skimmer vehicles, dangerous terrain to Bikes,
and open ground for other units. A model in cover behind a tank trap has a 4+ cover save."

I think you're the one who needs to read the rulebook.

No, you fucking retard, you forgot 5+ armour saves.
You forgot the Sargent that has 3 attacks in close combat.
Even within your own calculations 1/3 of 12 comes out to 3.33(???).

>that the guardsmen are too stupid not to move away from?
Where are they gonna go, retreat off the board? What guard player doesn't line his guys up at the ass end of the board in a gunline which never moves?

Its likely my meta, but its also likely the internet blowing things way out of proportion, but the regular orkbro at my flgs brings a list with like 6 trucks and 2 battlewagons full of boys w/ nobs and claws.
Most people don't have the firepower to blow all that up turn one. The internet tends to look at "boys in a truck" as easy to explode, and forget that you can have 6+ of them, all of them in your face turn 1

As opposed to say SM which are S4 in both melee and shooting, but their shooting is AP5 while melee is AP-, so that error of forgetting about the sergeant having a pistol and extra melee attacks vs having a gun matters if comparing say SM vs Guardsmen.

Ah, your meta is shit.

Moving along.

One that isn't a retard.

This guy gets it.

You can lose half your boys and all your trukks and still make it into combat with battlewagons full of tankbustas alive and shooting while the horde crushes through gunline armies. I watch this happen like every friday.

See

I literally do not understand this argument.

"It doesn't matter that orks win games consistently some places, because they don't win consistently other places."

What exactly are you even arguing?

Could anyone who isn't too busy arguing about boyz give me their thoughts on this?

Just because someone plays in a meta that ostracized Eldar scatbike faggots and superfriend Librarian bikestars doesn't mean it sucks, it means it's a regular normal playgroup.