Pathfinder General /pfg/

I just wanna make it more interesting then occasionally saying, my character starts smoking.

I usually game with the same people, and every time I make a new character for a new campaign I always try to either make them related to a past member of the previous party, or someone impacted by them. Makes a lot of decent plot hooks.

Drunken Master martial arts style fighting is at least funny if nothing else. (They also aren't really drunk).

Cigarette smoke cloud style doesn't seem to exist.

SoL?
Start smoking and have your buddies throw you out because you are smoking inside?
Have your character (and possible actually you) leave the room for a "smoke break" whenever it fits?

A smoking character is stupid because the concept is stupid and there is no way to do it. You can make a character play out being drunk. You can't make a character play out smoking without being a twat.

>I'm all for a reason for a little fluff. Two sentences is all you really need to explain why are you in the town/place and why you are willing to go along with the party.

Hmm. What if your backstory was basically one line per level?

And yeah, the thing about backstories is that they're static and don't affect the character, which develops in play.

Smoking IS cool though.
I mean I don't smoke 'cause I like my lungs the way they are, but it does LOOK cool at least.

>GM seems super down for trying out Gestalt and thinks it would be fun
>doesn't actually let the party of only 2 PCs be built with gestalt rules
>GM seems to have no recollection of a week of back and forth discussing the topic

I like my GM but sometimes I worry

Stop lying to yourself user.

Smoking is basically character flavor. You mention it in one line and it's assumed to be going on otherwise. Putting it front and center all the time is basically like blowing your smoke into peoples' faces.

Because what everyone remembers about Lord of the Rings is groaning every time someone started smoking due to their massive twattery.

Let's be honest. It's fantasy. You can do things that would be horrible ideas in real life, and it's just color in the game.. Like being a dirty barbarian who doesn't take showers.

I tend to go half and half on my player's backstory characters. Any of them that make useful contacts and/or safe havens are usually free of trouble unless the PCs do something shitty and stupid that would logically blow back on them. NPCs that don't serve a purpose to your backstory but still exist will usually be left alone...mostly. I have made exceptions.

>doesn't take showers
Jesus. The mold on his feet. My characters always start with at least a bar of soap unless they start with an int of 7.

Someday one of my players will have a character in their backstory.

I've only got one player who ever writes backstories ever, and they're usually along the lines of
"...And then my unit was betrayed, everyone died but me, and I'm out to get vengeance for my men. That's why I'm chaotic neutral."
"You just burned down a nunnery."
"So?"
"AND YOU LOCKED THE DOORS! JUST TO SEE THEM BURN!"

> How would you handle a character that vapes?

>How do you all feel about archetypes that trade the TYPE of spellcasting they get?
Depends on the class. For most classes it can work, ut certain classes have to much of their fluff connected with their magic type. Specifically Wizard, Psychic, Cleric, and the other religious types. Also this should be very rare and special. If any caster can just decide to be arcane or divine, the distinctions of arcane, divine and psychic lose their flavor.

I'm much more in favor of archetypes that change casting stat. Though those have to be well balanced, specially coming to or from Charisma. Wis and Int are just better.

Like a Shadowrun character.

This is why I email my players.

Yeah. You can't touch the 9-level casters too much- their types of magic (arcane, divine, psychic), methods of magic (prepared, spontaneous), and (mostly) their stats for magic (Cha, Wis, Int) are set in stone.

For 6-level casters, I feel it's a bit more flexibile. The Magus has the Mindblade and Eldritch Scion archetypes, the Investigator has the Psychic Detective and Questioner, the Inquisitor has the Living Grimoire, the Bloodrager even has the Id Rager, the Onmyoji and Reliquarian go from psychic to divine casting.

> -4 CHA

I mean, there's not a whole lot to it. Not really something that needs to be "handled".

>You can't touch the 9-level casters too much- their types of magic (arcane, divine, psychic), methods of magic (prepared, spontaneous), and (mostly) their stats for magic (Cha, Wis, Int) are set in stone.

Sage bloodline sorcerers are Intelligence-based.
Empyrean bloodline sorcerers are Wisdom-based.
Psychic bloodline sorcerers use psychic magic, not arcane magic.

Druids (feyspeaker), awful as they are, become Charisma-based.

I once played a Gamla by the name of Jo'oh. He ended up creating a tabacco plantation on a tropical island and got the natives to take up smoking.

>creating a tabacco plantation on a tropical island and got the natives to take up smoking.

Evil-aligned act.

Say what mate? Jo'oh loved cigarettes and he wanted to make sure everyone got to try them. Thats why he made them bargain bin prices, so that everyone could have them.

If the carcinogenic properties of tobacco are unknown, I'd call it neutral.

Are there any products with support for Words of Power besides the Ultimate Magic book where they introduce the system? I'm working on a character for a game with otherwise normal magic that's gonna use WoP (as an ancient form of magic that he discovered in a lost ruin), but there's been literally zero official support for it since it was introduced. I don't mind working from just the basics (the smaller number of words vs. spells is actually one of the major draws for me), but I'd love to see some more options if any have been made.

I think the Interjection Games guy wrote another class that uses them recently. So the content would be there if anywhere.

By being a sneaky fuck about it.

>Alchemist
"I light the weed in my cigar. Its actually a smokestick, and now I have concealment.

>Investigator
"I puff a few smokes from my pipe. Its a wondrous item that grants me Unseen Servant as an ability, and now my servants has unlocked the door from the other side, stole a guard key from the table, and a brought me back my pistol, reloaded, which I dropped on the floor previously"

>Halfling
I puff a few smokes and make a smoke-shaped halfling. Then with a simple prestidigation trick, the smoke looks exactly like me and I can use him to distract the troll while I sneak the other way.

>Kobold
"I take a deep whiff of tobacco, which is actually laced with alchemic charcoal, and I breathe out a thick black cloud which blinds the enemies and reveals invisible creatures"

>in WotR when you get one of iomedae's questions wrong, the unseen choir deals sonic damage with a save for half
>mfw my character has an ability that lets me take no damage on a successful fort save

I want to hit on Iomedae.

>Attempting to resist the TRUMPETS changes your alignment.

Ah, I'm guessing it's the one called "Words of Power Unleashed". Thanks, I'll check it out. Hopefully it doesn't suck, I'd love a new source of cool stuff.

>Paizo releases 1 million arcane magic companions
>Still no PF Incantatrix
>Still no Arcane spellsurge
>Still no Arcane fusion
>Still no Orb spells
>Still no Avasculate
Why must you keep releasing wizard archetypes that no one wants to use?

I actually have a handy list for my investigator:
>Flayleaf
>Smoke sticks
>Investigators' pipe
>Solidsmoke Pipeweed
>Kapre Cigars
>Cigar Holder (its actually a blow dart laced with poison)
>Blinding Cinders
>Choking Smoke

>Cigar Holder (its actually a blow dart laced with poison)

Brilliant!

>Currently running Kingmaker
>Allowed Path of War + Expanded because martials get the short end of the stick.
>Allowed Touhou Battle Grimoire because I wanted to take it easy for this game anyways.
>One player has decided he will become like unto a god.
>One player is from SPAAAAAACE!
>One player is a robot wizard built in Alkenstar
>One player has made it his goal to defeat every enemy in a single punch (His player read OPM before it was cool).

So far, a Werewolf bit the Robot and made him a Werewolf-Robot, because he's technically a humanoid. The space man is just... confused about the whole "magic thing". And they wound up converting the Sootscale Kobolds to the worship of the guy trying to be a god.

There's the Artisan class from drop dead studios, which fits pretty well.
Otherwise a wizard with crafting feats work just as well.

Is it just me or does it feel like there's a sudden rise in people playing Kingmaker?
Starting in lewd kingmaker in a week and I'm just now noticing loads of mentions of it.

Is it just the Baader-Meinhof phenomenon?

Probably. This is our 2nd week of it, I started it because I wanted to take it easy with a nice, slow came where the PCs casually steamroll most fights and spend more time RPing than fighting.

It's weird. I've been GMing Kingmaker for about two months. At least I got you guys to fall back on in case I need advice.

The irony is that lewd Kingmaker isn't a good idea because of succession crises. While you were an adventurer you could pop out bastards everywhere, but now people will use them as figureheads and weapons. Kinda unfair to the poor kids.

I was playing a faerie foxboy in Kingmaker, alongside a fae foxgirl, a fae catgirl, and a fae batgirl:
archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/47280805/#47280911

Our party had (non-lethally) cleared out the Stag Lord's Fort as three 1st-level, 20 point buy characters. Suffice it to say, we had exceeded all expectations of the adventure path and the GM:
archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/47719513/#47724010

Unfortunately, the GM had cancelled the campaign after I protested why the GM had docked the XP rewards we would have gained from the Stag Lord's fort:
archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/47834385/#47835937

With all the party being female(except one who is undecided) I think trying to have lots of children would be a bit impractical in the first place

Hopefully they know to abandon ship and rewrite the last book. Its complete horseshit. A strong start for the AP, but a horrible finish.

Question for any DSP folk around (or anyone who's seen them answer this question before): say I'm a non-initiator who took Wisdom in the Flesh to use Wisdom instead of Dexterity on Stealth, then I take Martial Training I (Veiled Moon)... is my initiator level equal to half my level plus my Dexterity, or half my level plus my Wisdom? Do I use the original ability score of the discipline skill, or do I use the ability score that I use for the discipline skill?

You use wisdom right now. 99% sure after the errata it will use Dex.

Does that really matter when the guy the party is setting up to be King is an immortal God-King? His portfolio being science, technology, and nuclear fusion? Who is so charismatic that a slap from him, the sort meant to snap a man out of his idiocy, can hurt as badly as a shortsword being swung by a man with 18 Strength?

Because such is the nature of Holy Ithmander, God of the Atom's Warmth.

Yeah, from the look of that I can see why the GM ragequit. To start, he's a fucking shitty GM who doesn't know how to play his NPCs properly (they should have heard you when you beating the guy, as attacking someone, even in their sleep, is not quiet, and in fact constitutes "Sound of Battle". Yes, even if you roll Stealth.).

Unless you were Coup-De-Gracing people, but that can't be right, as you took them non-lethally.

(In other words, 99.9% sure you either cheated, talked your GM into allowing things that aren't allowed in the rules without having an extensive number of feats and or vigilante talents, or your GM had no idea what the fuck he was doing).

>even in their sleep, is not quiet, and in fact constitutes "Sound of Battle". Yes, even if you roll Stealth.).

>Unless you were Coup-De-Gracing people, but that can't be right, as you took them non-lethally.

By "clobbered a drunken and sleeping Stag Lord into subconsciousness," I meant "use a nonlethal damage, held touch attack as part of a coup de grace."

I specifically asked before the campaign started if the GM would allow a non-lethal coup de grace, and the GM agreed.

Dealing nonlethal damage ultimately did not matter because the local authorities demanded that they all be put to the sword without a trial anyway.

That said, yes, by RAW alone, this should have been impossible even with a lethal coup de grace.

d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/silent-kill-combat

>Prerequisite(s): Stealth 12 ranks; assassinate advanced slayer talent or ninja master trick.

>Benefit: When you kill a creature during a surprise round, you can attempt a Stealth check, opposed by the Perception checks of potential observers, to prevent them from noticing your action and subsequently identifying you as the assailant.

Paizo's Stealth rules are so harebrained that only a high-level character with a specific feat can ever make a silent kill through non-magical, non-supernatural means.

Fortunately, since we were playing with various modifications to the base rules (as the first of those archived posts points out, we were using Dreamscarred Press material, Radiance House material, and even a homebrewed tier 3 Unchained monk), we were not quite bound by Paizo-only rules.

Thinking of making a Theologian cleric with the Ash domain. What're some good feats I could take? Should I go human for the bonus feat or Half-Orc/Elf for the favored class bonus? No 3pp and it's coming in at level 6.

>Should I go human for the bonus feat or Half-Orc/Elf for the favored class bonus?

Why not Ifrit? the Cha/Wis sucks but its thematic.

It is very thematic, and I was considering it, but again that CHA/WIS hit reeeeally sucks.

>(In other words, 99.9% sure you either cheated, talked your GM into allowing things that aren't allowed in the rules without having an extensive number of feats and or vigilante talents, or your GM had no idea what the fuck he was doing).
Calm down, friend. Is something angering you? Let's talk about it.

>characters come into conflict over their methods
>"character drama! Lets see how they handle this"
>players bicker in ooc, complain to me gm in private
WHY CANT YOU CUNTS
R O L E P L A Y

Stalwart or?

Do you guys consider judgement light to be a good spell?
I can maybe think of it being decent after like 3rd judgement, but at second two abilities still seems kinda lackluster.
Is that just me?
What are the ones you're supposed to be casting with it?
I can see smiting being a rather large buff with a large party of mainly martials, but otherwise... eh.

Hey there, /pfg/

Can I get some more input and criticisms for my homebrew class? I'd gladly appreciate it.

docs.google.com/document/d/1xQMlB45-UFEWCB2ffqoBUMhR-t4afSXLk29fgTJNVyw/edit

Clearly this needs to be a PbP somewhere.

>Characters come into conflict due to in campaign reasons
>Expect character drama
>Instead the most experienced player begins plotting the most elaborate way to destroy the group one at a time using the mechanics to his full advantage
>Combat is the quietest thing in the world as people begin keeping their actions in secret with player going "Give me a DC XX Spellcraft check to see what spell I'm casting, oh wait you didn't put points into spellcraft so now you have no Idea what I'm doing."
>Refuses to craft for them on the grounds that he has a "project list as long as his arm"
>Every important NPC that the pcs rely on for items have either been paid off or replaced with a simulacrum
>All wondrous item orders by other PCs are still being crafted by him through said proxies
>Literally all their new items as well as some of the old ones that they brought in for repairs has now been cursed
>He literally has them at their mercy while pretending to not have a chance and acting frustrated at being outmaneuvered at the table
I guess a noobstomp isnt such a bad thing to witness from time to time.

Hey user I have no balance input but I liked the concept so I copied it to this. Feel free to add whatever you want to it/disregard completely.

homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/edit/rygcRSdIa

I like it. Thanks, user.

>Local Authorities
>Kingmaker

Nigga, you ARE the local authorities.

And yeah, the GM brought that upon himself.

Nothing's angering me, so much as I suspected that they did... well, exactly what they did. Which was talk the GM into allowing them abilities that they do not actually possess.

>Nigga, you ARE the local authorities.

Not throughout the first book, wherein you are simply explorers and bandit-hunters.

>Which was talk the GM into allowing them abilities that they do not actually possess.

The alternative is the absurd, RAW scenario wherein absolutely nobody short of a 12th-level character can silently take out another character through non-magical, non-supernatural means, and wherein it is impossible to reliably knock out a sleeping character without also killing them.

Pathfinder's coup de grace rules, by the way, also make it impossible to perform a coup de grace with a bow or a crossbow.
>As a full-round action, you can use a melee weapon to deliver a coup de grace (pronounced "coo day grahs") to a helpless opponent. You can also use a bow or crossbow, provided you are adjacent to the target.

Essentially, Pathfinder's rules for stealthy kills, knockouts, and coup de graces are nonsensical. It hardly seems unreasonable to ask the GM to rectify them before the game begins, especially if the GM is already allowing Dreamscarred Press material, Radiance House material, and a homebrew tier 3 monk.

>make it impossible to perform a coup de grace with a bow or a crossbow.
>You can also use a bow or crossbow
Wat

It's worse when you're the only one trying to roleplay out the issue, and everyone either ignores you, stares at you like you've got a third eye, gets unreasonably hostile to your character or gets turbo butthurt at the DM actually rewarding the person trying to play their character.

Know what's always a hoot? Letting yourself lose if the argument turns violent. It seems like people never want to describe their characters getting battered and beaten anymore, which is a shame since that's so much more fun than endless victory.

You can use them if adjacent, but not for silent sniper kills.

It's not bullshit to say "yeah fullplate in this world is designed in such a way you can put in on by yourself." right?

>? His portfolio being science, technology, and nuclear fusion?
Um, what fucking class covers all of that?

By this, I meant "firearm."

It is impossible to perform a coup de grace with a firearm in Pathfinder.

Most people who buy full plate are murderhobo loners, so yes it's not unreasonable.

HOWEVER, if you want to actually give significance to the character getting a suit of full plate, associate the armor with getting a knightly title or something similar, and with that comes a scrappy young man/woman who insists on sharpening your sword, feeding/watering your horse, putting on your armor and hanging off every word of wisdom that drips off your tongue.

GIVE THEM A SQUIRE, MASTER/STUDENT RELATIONSHIPS ARE AMAZING.

This just makes me miss the older editions when fighters got a free keep, land and followers. Certainly gave them connections to the world.

zenithgames.blogspot.com/2016/04/dragons-are-above-my-pay-grade.html
Where can one find this AP without paying?

>Certainly gave them connections to the world.

Silly user, Paizo does not encourage you to get a solid connection to the world unless it's Kingmaker; you are merely a visitor of their magical realm!

Does anyone have the condition cards to download? I mean the official ones with the goblins.

Were firearms even in the game when the rules firt came out? It's still shitty wording, regardless.

I want to play a pow expanded mystic, using elemental flux maneuvers. What other discipline would work well and complement it? Also, what interesting race could I pick?

>What other discipline would work well and complement it?

Piercing Thunder and Primal Fury are pretty good, as for an interesting race it really depends on the mood and tone of the campaign... However I've always enjoyed the Tiefling for Elemental Flux.

Quick question:

Inquisitor Smiting Judgment - can it

A) Be applied to thrown items, like a flask of water;
B) Turn a flask of water into holy water (it does imbue the weapon with divine energy)

No set in stone campaign I just like making characters. I was thinking a dumb orc because it fits mystic playstyle of not controlling the maneuvers

If you want to go MAXIMUM DAMAGE then you want Mithral Current, along with that feat that turns silver vulnerability into elemental vulnerability.

Piercing Thunder and Primal Fury have absolutely nothing that makes them sync with Elemental Flux.

A super good unorthodox discipline for the mystic is sleeping goddess.
Makes a lot of use of Autohypnosis, a wisdom skill, and most of all its style feat + psionic meditation lets you use a move action to bypass mystic's random recovery and get any readied maneuver you want.
As /another/ bonus, you can change your active element every time you do this.

Solar Wind allows you to change its damage type to your active Elemental Flux element if you take a feat, so you can become a cool elemental archer.

A) Yes. B) No. It's still just a flask of water, it deals no damage.

How well does Automatic Bonus Progression work for simulating a low-magic campaign/setting? Are there any tweaks that need to be made to it? What are YOUR experiences with it? How would YOU simulate a "lower fantasy" kind of game in Pathfinder (i.e few high-level casters, most are six-level casters, etc.) using Automatic Bonus Progression, by modifying it or otherwise?

I'm asking these questions because I've got a campaign in mind, set in a homebrew setting, and I'm not intent on switching to 5e for it because I prefer the wealth of options that 3.pf brings. I'm thinking of using Spheres of Power in conjunction with Automatic Bonus Progression.

Thanks!

Honestly, just keep the stat ups and resistance bonuses. Atonement is weird out of the box.

Refluff +X Weapons as just being high quality blades. Ban magic item crafting

Really, you could just refluff all but the most bizarre enchantments as being a mundane inventions.

How do you guys deal with rolling a lot of D6s or D8s?

I have two sets of Chessex dice currently, one of each of my characters, but we are starting to hit the point where we need more than 2-3 D6/D8.

>How would YOU simulate a "lower fantasy" kind of game in Pathfinder

I wouldn't. Literally any other system will be better for that.

Not really, but that really depends on what you consider to be lower fantasy.

I still believe the Stag Lord's Fort is one of Paizo's most well-made endings in a book 1. Tons of ways you can get past it, and the combat with the entire fort is one of the most memorable battles in any campaign for my group.

>had some character drama on the ship in skull and shackles
>level 1 brawler beats up my level 1 druid
>little does he know i have create water
>solidify his position on the ship as the guy who pisses himself in bed every night

D A M A G E D

Buy more dice? Or use a dice rolling program. I use one when I play my high level TWF rogue.