/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

Summoners might be a good place to start.

>In relation to mage 2e?
Mage core is only fully relevant book.

If you want more ideas about the kinds of forms they can take, the Intruders - Encounters with the Abyss is pretty good.

There aren't really very many paths besides Humanity that goes along with, 'good christian.'

Why are promethean so weak in comparison to other supernaturals in CofD?

Short of having them fight in a power plant, I don't see how you could have a Promethean fight anything much tougher than a human without getting chumped or relying on the handful of uncommonly stronger alembics.

That's part of the point, I feel. Promethean's more about learning the human condition and surviving long enough to make something of it as opposed to full on monster fights. They can still kick some serious ass, though.

its almost as if you're trying to shoe horn a monster into some religious roll it wont fill.

Prometheans are tanky motherfuckers, what are you talking about?

Compared to a human maybe

They're fragile as shit compared to Vampires and Werewolves though.

Looks like Road of Heaven, Humanity and Path of Redemption are my best chances. So not that hard to fit them into the religous role that is super understandable in a game with God in it

I figured we were talking about super to super power scales. On their own they're pretty poweful, especially when you start pumping Pyros.

>Fragile as shit compared to vampires
Yeah, because prommies go into torpor once they hit full lethal damage.

They also take essentially twice as much damage, can't spend their juice to heal, and don't have a soaking ability like resilience.

>How do you deal with masquerade breaches?

In no way, people just dont wanna believe in the supernatural so the breaches cover themselves.

Prometheans don't get knocked down and don't die when they're killed. Their powers are also pretty cheap (3 Pyros for a whole scene of use?) and all come with a passive ability.

Thinking of not including Rank 6+ Disciplines for my home VtM game among other changes I'm making.
They make things seem too "superhero-ish" (you can literally HULK SMASH with Potence and do the silly "random object as bullet" thing that the Flash does) and when my players see that they start actively questioning the purpose of the Masquerade when Methusalahs can punch holes in tanks, without getting into the psychic X-Men bullshit the mental Disciplines allow.

Does that unbalance the game at all?

99.9999999999999999% of VtM games should never involve characters that are even *capable* of learning disciplines of that magnitude anyway.

Yeah, VtM had something of an identity crisis in the mid-90's and became something of a Vampire Superhero Game, resulting in some pretty silly shit.

That's definitely true of mine as well, but one of my players noted that a Nosferatu Methusalah could tear apart an entire building with his bare hands and then make everyone not realize he was doing it even as he WAS doing it with his Obfuscate crap on top of it.

He questioned the point of hiding from humans in the fluff at all with that kind of power and the only thing I could think of is that human armed militaries might be able to destroy said ancient vampires, which STILL might not be true because it in combination with mental powers they could do things like stop anyone from even WANTING to kill them while they ripped them to pieces. I guess you could carpet bomb a city but you'd have to even locate the Elder for that first, which might not even be possible with further usage of their mental powers.

Well, regardless, it shouldn't mess with anything to kick those powers out. Elders still have some heavy shit and a lot of blood to power it with.

That's what I figured.
That way large numbers of clever or well-armed younger vampires could conceivably take down an elder, giving lend to actual reasons for them using influence and spies.

>How do you deal with masquerade breaches?

A combination of the cynicism of a generation raised on top notch special effects and internet hoaxes, overlapping layers of conspiracy and secret cabals with a vested interest in keeping a lid of the truth and ever-vigilant for leverage over the undead (even the Mortals play the endless game), and finally, the anxious paranoia of Princes demanding players clean up their own messes or die in the attempt.

OP, please stop linking Aspel's pastebin. It just fucking encourages the stupid shitstain.

>Obtenebration

Divinity takes many forms, and we may never know all of it's mysterious ways. All things are servants of God, even Demons serve His purpose in their own way. These shadows I call upon are the Darkness that choked Egypt in vengeance for the slaves, and the Darkness that shall fall when the Seventh Seal is opened. For just as His love and mercy are great, so is His wrath.

>Domination
(tricky... but let's try)
I am but a tool of His divine Will, that heaven-sent command which cannot be refused or resisted. It is not my Will that they obey, but His and His alone. I have been granted this authority for but one purpose; to further His kingdom on earth. I must resist using this power for my own selfish needs... (morality check for "selfish" uses of Dominate)

It fucking ruins it. What's the point of munching your way up the generations if you can't get to 7th and come up with a custom power?

You can already make custom powers with combination disciplines.

Would WoD work as a ruleset for an RPG based in The Secret World? Or is it too tied to its own lore to work?

If you stick to Mortal as your basic framework, you should be fine. You might need some custom Conditions depending on how hard you're going with The Filth (that was their name right? It was a million years since I played that game), but the regular Supernatural merits should cover most of the magic in that game.

Either WoD or CoD could work ruleset for TSW, they're more or less the same concept when all things are considered. Besides, it's never that hard to seperate the lore from mechanics.

Thanks man, those are some good answers, I'll think on them.

>consider joining local oWoD vampire larp
>Revised Mind's Eye Theatre
>infernalists, sabbat and anarchists everywhere
>tfw

What can be done?

TAlk to the... Grand larper or whatever and see if there's a place for a moral charecter, probably a antagonist for all the bad boys. If not that, then play a bad boy and if not THAT... Well, go find a new group.

wat

Is that a v20 thing?

You're welcome. I'm glad that my Catholic upbringing is useful for something other than a guilt complex. :)

Get some other new players and join the game as the Sabbat Inquisition. Nobody expects the Sabbat Inquisition!

Am I reading Requiem's ruleset right? If four PC vamps walk into a room with four NPC vamps in it, all four PCs and all four NPCs have to make a resolve check to keep from flipping out for each vampire in the other group. That's literally thirty-two rolls just to determine if your audience with The Prince to discuss the issues of the night turns into a fucking bloodbath.... how does Kindred society even function???

>an individual based Masquerade stat: Then it signifies how well that character is known as a liability. It may signify how much hunters have geared up for him per se.
I can dig it

That's 1e. It's stupid. Pretty much everyone ignored it. 2e is better.

Besides for the beat system being bad and the new mortality stat being shit.

>Beat system is bad
If you like exponential experience costs for advancement, handing all of that off to the GM and avoiding the integration with Exceptional Successes and Conditions. Sure.

Only problem is, I like Beats, Conditions and Tilts.

Oh. Ok.

Second query, does Stamina actually count for anything? Vampires don't tire or get sick, and there's no soak rules anywhere. It seems.... redundant.

Yeah, cause I really want to have to game a system to get exp and put even more work on my table.

You'll need it for other physical rolls, but in general, it's there to serve as a basis for your Health stat.

>game a system
You get points for aspirations, you get beats for drama, you get a beat each session, you get a beat when you resolve a condition, you get a beat when you suffer under a condition, and you get a beat when you opt to make a situation worse for yourself and turn a normal failure into an dramatic failure.

You are making the game more interesting, in exchange for character advancement.
I see nothing wrong with that.

I agree, I like the overall Beat system. I think my only issue with it is that the fractional nature of it feels unnecessary, but I figure that's the necessary evil of trying to make conversion over from a exponential XP system work.

>you get a beat when you opt to make a situation worse for yourself and turn a normal failure into an dramatic failure.

I don't see how being forced to either have a klutz who advances in strength, or a successful character who gets left behind the rest of the party, makes the game interesting. It fairly hobbles the enjoyment factor for me.

Also, the fact that literally anything, regardless of how tough it is, can be bought to it's knees with a can of bear mace.

Third, that aforementioned can of bear mace can be yours for one shitty dot in resources.

Why spend any time developing powers at all? Why bother with any other weapons? Bear mace kills mortals like a fucking freight train, it even brings werewolves and Elder vampires to their knees and allows you to curbstomp them with impunity.

>what is game balance?
>baby, don't hurt me

I don't know, man, you ever been hit by Bear Mace? My buddy was and now he has to live without a face. There's just no face there, just a giant perfect hole with a dark void where it should be. Fucking Bear Mace, man.

It gets far worse if anyone bothers to use Armory. CS gas is listed as giving a -5 to dice rolls AND resistance checks. Given that stat is usually 1 - 5, this makes a cheap weapon into a death sentence.

The book also says dogs are immune to CS gas, what the actual fuck??

Dog watches over her descendants, even now.

In Chrud, there are no damage rolls.

Worse, the amount of damage one creature does with 4 dice is outdone by two mediocre characters with 2 dice apiece and a bonus.

Therefore, there is literally nothing in the Chronicles of Darkness that cannot be defeated by 36 intellectually challenged school children with sharp sticks.

Then you focus on the rest, conditions, aspirations, drama.

Plus if it's that much of a problem your GM can always just use Group Beats, whereby beats are pooled, and evenly divided at the end of the session.

Plus if your aim is to play a "successful character" then I think you're mistaking an RPG for a competitive sport.

> Therefore, there is literally nothing in the Chronicles of Darkness that cannot be defeated by 36 intellectually challenged school children with sharp sticks.
Like... IRL?

Yeah pretty much, retard strength is horrifying.

Wilful ignorance of the system only reflects worse on you.

Such individuals would likely be forced to roll a single chance dice, which have a 1/10 chance of success.
Then even should they manage to succeed, the target could still be wearing armour, of which General Armour soaks damage directly.

So assuming a Flak Jacket, and sharp sticks having a damage of 0 (comparative to a knife).
There's a 0.3% chance of each aforementioned retarded child hurting such a person.

Having to succeed with a 10 on their chance die, then a 10 again for exploding, then an 8, 9, or 10 to have dealt 3 damage, getting past General Armor.

>Plus if your aim is to play a "successful character" then I think you're mistaking an RPG for a competitive sport.

My aim is this funny thing my country calls "fun".

Playing an underpowered virtual nobody with no real reason to do anything except be miserable and fail at life; suffer a series of shitty, awful experiences (which is all Conditions are, at the end of the day); have failures not just fail but blow up in my face because that's the only way my character OR the entire party can advance; and finally, climb to the top of Kindred society when they don't control the government or anything of note and the only prize for Princehood is a key to a private bathroom; none of this is in any way fun to me, and I'm mystified that it could be fun to anyone. You might as well combine all the splats and call it "Depression: the Wallowing".

Except the rules explicitly give bonuses for attacking in groups, not everyone wears a flak jacket, and the flak jacket can only soak a certain number of attacks a round, right?

How is it fun, at all, if you can already largely predict the outcome from the number of dice being rolled? The whole point of rolling dice is randomization!

I think you're massively overestimating the effects of exceptional failures, successes and conditions.

Conditions are usually minor effects, like a -2 to certain rolls until you fail one, or offering you the chance to lose some character agency (losing, mind you, you still choose) in exchange for a beat.

Plus, you generate conditions from dramatic failures AND successes.
So you kick that fuckwit's ass super hard? You get a condition which is POSITIVE, and gives you a BEAT when you resolve it.
Plus, should you take a risk (which can make games fun) and fail, then you just make that slightly worse with a short-lived minor penalty to yourself, in exchange for a beat. And a condition which provides ANOTHER beat when fulfilled.

It's really easy to get Beats in CofD, without even putting yourself at significant risk of harm. And that's a fundamental part of the system. They don't TRY to make conditions something you'd actively want to avoid, they want you to use them.

Really, they have next to no teeth whatsoever for a passably made character.

That's the thing, forecasting is not representative of outcomes. But the fact that you can to some extent predict probability is not bad.

One of those kids could roll really well, and stab the guy right in the fucking eye, dealing enough damage to get him into Aggravated, and deal the Blinded tilt for their dramatic success, leaving him permanently blinded.

You could instead drop a system that clearly isn't suited to that sort of play and instead get any number of other superhero systems that allow you to do the same thing without such arbitrary limitations, up to and including having the character be a vampire?

Just a thought.

Just for the record, 10s on a Chance Die don't explode in CofD 2e.

It still sounds like utterly unneccesary mechanics, leading to either excessive book keeping and anally retentive notes, or the ST ponying up $20 for the Condition cards. If they have "next to no teeth" then they have no point or impact, just free xp for giving up agency and letting your character's theme song become "I Love Fucking Up" by Frenzel Rhomb.

Huh. Good to know.

Well then I'd suggest you look to a completely different system, as what you want is clearly not in the design purview of CofD.

1 Werewolf, Garou Form
Relevant Stats:
Stamina: 3 (5 with Garou)
Resolve: 3
Composure: 3
Willpower 6
Size: 5 (6 With Garou)
Health: 8 (11 With Garou)
Armor: 0

9 Children, Human Mortal
Relevant Stats:
Dexterity: 1
Strength: 1
Composure: 1
Resolve: 1
Firearms: 0 (-1 Dice)
Weapon: BBgun (+1)
Willpower: 2

Round 1:
Garou1: Werewolf looks at children.

Children1 12: Roll 1 (Dex) - 1 (Firearms) + 1 (BBgun) + 3 (Willpower): 4 Dice

9 x 4 = 37 Dice, average Success per 3 dice, 12 Successes.

Werewolf takes 12 Lethal, dies.

>I think you're massively overestimating the effects of exceptional failures, successes and conditions.

I notice you said nothing about "Playing an underpowered virtual nobody with no real reason to do anything except be miserable and fail at life..." or "...climb to the top of Kindred society when they don't control the government or anything of note and the only prize for Princehood is a key to a private bathroom."

Oh, I never got past reading the source material. I'll never run a game, let alone play one now. The mood, the lack of direction, the lack of purpose, the confusing mechanics have all put me off, and you've just convinced me to give it up for good by confirming all my worst suspicions.

I'm sorry guys, I really tried to like Requiem, I really did. I even got the dice (red granite, numbers 1 - 7 in black, 8 - 0 in grey). It's just too disappointing after the grandeur, majesty and relative simplicity of the old world of darkness.

But hey, at least Requiem isn't Rolemaster. Never seen a book that was almost entirely percentile charts before or since.

Umm. No.
First, BB guns deal Bashing damage, not Lethal.
Second, full lethal doesn't kill you. It puts you in DYING, yes, but it doesn't kill you. The werewolf will regenerate the damage and still be standing, thus reduce the incoming damage the next turn by a significant amount. (Killing one kid, probably more considering 1e fighting styles).
Third, the Werewolf will probably win initiative, considering that at MINIMUM it beats the kids by 3, which is a significant amount
Fourth, Werewolves also have armour in Gauru form, reducing the incoming dice by nine (one each)
Fifth, 9*4 is 36, not 37.
And if you use 2e rules, this applies instead:
First, weapons no longer add skill modifier, so the kids would roll one die.
Second, Werewolves apply defence against Firearms, so the kids would roll significantly less.
Third, the Werewolf would be completely unharmed by the second turn, due to Gauru regeneration.

Oh, and you mis-spelled Gauru.

Bleh. One die less, I meant to type. But you get me.
Anyhow, all this also hinges on that the kids can fight at all. Lunacy will leave the kids as urine-soaked wrecks of fear.

That's not Chronicles of Darkness hombre
1. Firearms don't give bonus dice any more, so that dice pool is 3
2. In Dalu or Gauru, you get Defence against ranged attacks, so odds are Defence 3 (not unreasonable, assuming no Athletics) will fuck your dice pool down to 0
3. Even assuming you can ignore Defence, that's 8.1 lethal, which wouldn't be enough to completely fill their Lethal track (11)
4. Gauru regenerate all Bashing and Lethal each turn
5. If they pass their Lunacy test, they suffer -2 to all tests. If they fail their Lunacy test, they flee like the idiot children they are
6. Filling Lethal track doesn't kill them, filling Aggravated? That does.

So no, it doesn't.

B-but muh lunacy, armor and regeneration...
Gauru gonna run like a dog he is.

Why should he?

So what ability is even used to disguise yourself as someone in 20th edition vampire?

We are playing Innocents.

Werewolves kill children all the time, who cares.

Then don't use a Forsaken as an enemy.
That's like saying "The train will stop, because I'm standing in front of it."

I'm a player character, everyone nows that makes me immortal

Do you mean Ability ability, or Discipline ability?

You're on the EDGE of EDGINESS
And I'm hanging on a moment with you, user.

ability ability, I don't want to have to spend a fucking point of blood every time I want to make a disguise. best I can find is a secondary ability that appears to have been dropped from Revised/20th versions of any gameline.

my friends dont really go for the horror RPG genre
>fucking pussies
but someone had the idea of adapting the core WoD book for a StarGate RPG
any advice, we have the humans, goa'uld and tok'ra worked out pretty well, but that about it

In my experience nobody takes the dramatic failure for beats ever, so nobody takes extra beats to advance so is a non issue really.

I am thinking of maybe giving a beat for exceptional successes just to get things moving.

And what might the source of this image be?

Is there any reason for that?
You've already failed, it's basically meaning you get a Condition worth two beats.

Because it means harming you in the short and possibly long term. Actions have consequences man.

No idea, best of luck checking

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jenna_Coleman#Filmography

Probably not Dr Who

But it's just a condition, and a non-persistent one at that.

In my groups case they come from D&D so they relate dramatic failure with critical miss (double 1s from the d20) no matter how many times i explain it to them they want a failure to not have any extra consequences at all cost.

And a massive failure at either a physical, mental or social task.

Eh, I'd include it under "Performance", which was a Talent, I believe. It's supposed to include dramatic theatre presentations, which in turn would incorporate theatre make-up and costume choices.

Gonna eat shit man, lasombra probably suck at making disguises themselves. Fucking Curse.

Yeah, that's the problem. Still trying to communicate that to my group without them seeing it as irrelevant.

From which the only additional effect is the Condition.