Warhammer 40k General

Too many points. Odds are poor that you'll make it into combat with any given squad. It's just not worth it to spend sixty points buying a bunch of power weapons if only one or two of them will see use and will often not matter much anyways.

Power Weapons/Fists/Lightning Claws/Plasma Pistols should have their prices halved across all codexes.

At 750pts those first two opponents are very tough. Space Marines can be too.

see

Which one's fluff and look do you like more?

Do AdMech, Cyraxis will give us glorious Mechanicum units.

So just buy more stuff and never field what I got?

I recommend Space Marines since they got variety and more support.

Both can go crazy for scratch building and shit, Nids more so.

Plus if you don't play at GW stores that much, all that 3rd party parts.

Tell me why your favorite army is your favorite army.

Start working on the AdMech. Talk to your opponents about letting you use them as a combined army. Or, shit, just slot together formations/detachments to do it anyways.

There's no reason to think a combined AdMech book would have a dedicated transports, so I don't see why AdMech players make such a big deal about it.

Ignore that guy. Nobody is going to want to play against that list.

Get more infantry and a/some Chimera. You don't have enough stuff to make a Battle Forged list right now anyways.

Lord Commissar is a neat model, but it doesn't really do much for you. Leave it be until you've got enough dudes to use it as a commissar for a blob.

So what about buying the Start Collecting box? That should give me another Leman Russ so I can field a Tank Commander, right?

Figure 2 Veteran Squads (with a commissar each), 1 Company Command Squad, 1 Tank Commander with one tank for its retinue and 1 Manticore?

>Figure 2 Veteran Squads
Yes.
>(with a commissar each),
No.

I will do admech eventually even if i have to wait another year for cyraxis with no CAC
I just need something to break up the monotomy of playing tau
I plan on going to tournaments which are inundated with SM players but my local area has like one vanilla SM guy
GSC seem really cool but theyre a horde army and im so slow at painting pangea happened before i finished one model
Whats the chance theres going to be some Black Friday deals and/or Start Collecting/Start Collecting Prime of GSC? Cause that would sway me even more towards GSC

Why not the Commissars?

Also, of the three games I've played, my Eradicator seems to be very good at taking out Tau Stealth Suits.

Commissars can't be taken with Vets. Regular platoons and command squads, but not vets.

>Whats the chance theres going to be some Black Friday deals
very high but if they're anything like last year they won't save you much of any cash although this is rumored to be changing this year

>Start Collecting/Start Collecting Prime of GSC
Literally anything can happen, that army is a runaway success for GW so I wouldn't be at all surprised if they got a second wave/Start Collecting support. Until then just buy the sprues from Overkill from Ebay and such.

The codex says they can, lists Veterans in the squads that can take a Commissar.

Of course it'll change, Rountree's in charge.

Huh, must've misremembered.

Yeah, I had to double check the codex. New to 40k so lol. Was like....they let me do it on Battlescribe.

I have since i was a kid, always been a huge fan of mechs, mecha and all the tropes and cliches that comes with it. So when the Tau became a thing i was onboard immediatly.

What about you?

While you can attach them to Vets, you can only have one per CCS or PCS in your army. So unless you're going to double up on CCS (hint: don't do this) or run a platoon alongside them (not the worst idea in the world to turn those grenade launcher Vets into scrubs) then you can't take two Commissars.

Are the black friday deals in stores or online?

Yes.

I'm a Tau player as well, actually. They hit combined arms a lot better than any of the other armies do (besides Imperial Guard, my third love), they've got a visually distinct aesthetic among 40k armies, and I like the idea of the elites being, well, elite with equipment to show for it (see: Crisis suits. FSE player.). Plus, they've got a lot of unique and neat things like the Ghostkeel's stealth fuckery, Riptide reactor, markerlights, et cetera.

It's a big toolbox with interchangable answers to everything, wrapped up in neat style. And somehow, it's cheaper than Skitarii to get into.

Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

What are the commissars giving your veterans that make them worth their points?

Are they taking up points that are limitting wargear on your tanks and vets?

For >2 Veteran Squads (with a commissar each), 1 Company Command Squad, 1 Tank Commander with one tank for its retinue and 1 Manticore

I hope you added in chimeras for both vet squads.

Don't need the company command squad if you have the tank commander imo.

You are facing people who are bringing tau suits and pure ravenwing at 750, you might have to bite the bullet that you won't be fitting in all your initial purchase below 1000pts.

Oh, okay. So I shouldn't bother with the Start Collecting Box then.

Lord Commissars aren't regular ones, they're their own HQ choice and isn't part of that limitation.

it's a good deal, you just won't be using the spare commissar for much

Any DE players here want to explain to me when I should use Raiders over Venoms? It seems my army should be as MSU as possible but at the same time Splinter Racks seem like such a fun upgrade and I'm going to have Raiders from the SC box since buying the Warriors and Reavers separately is basically the same price as the box.

It's still a good deal. It's cheaper than buying a Russ and an Infantry Squad separately so you can ignore the Commissar if you want since he's essentially free.

Do people actually exist who will not let you use a Lord Commissar as a regular one and vice versa? I mean really.

So I can still field the Lord Commissar? But then wouldn't I have to forfeit either the

Alright.

Also, just found some stuff hidden beneath the foam of the army case, looks like another Veteran squad. The sergeant has a Power Sword and it has a Heavy Bolter team. Don't see any special weapons.

Two CCS is good though

What else are you going to run? Tank Commanders? The only way to play guard right now is infantry-heavy

You could use Raiders as "Distraction Raiders" Fill it with 10 Kabs with all splinter weapons and take advantage of how big a model it is to make the opponent focus it over your MSU's.

Just replace one of the Commissars with the Lord. Or call one of them that. The second vet squad lets you be Battleforged, if you do that.

Where to go next?

>35 Skitarii Vanguard
>25 Skitarii Rangers
>10 Sicarian Infiltrators
>10 Sicarian Ruststalkers
>1 Sydonian Dragoon
>3 Onager Dunecrawlers

>4 Tech-Priest Domini
>6 Kataphron Destroyers
>5 Fulgurite Electro-Priests
>5 Corpuscarii Electro-Priests
>2 beep books and a Datasmith

>Imperial Knight

>2 Captains
>Librarian
>Chaplain
>Techmarine and Servitors
>5 Vanguard Vets
>5 Sternguard Vets
>25 Tactical Marines
>10 Assault Marines
>15 Devestator Marines
>Techmarine and Thunderfire Cannon
>5 Assault Terminators
>5 Terminators

Transports, I guess? I'd like advice for working towards a semi-decent 2k-2.5k list, chapter tactics Iron Hands, though preferably not a War Convo. I really love the look of my army, but it's difficult to decide what I should go for. 250$ is what I'm looking at, I'm considering a Vindicator or maybe some more Kataphrons. Hell, maybe I grab knight renegade, 3 Knights would be fun

Managed to find some bits too, I can give a model a Plasmagun. There's two more flamers, some heads and stuff all on sprues. I don't think my friend realized these were in the case. I'll have to talk to him first.

Havent played in quite a few years by now though, considering getting back into it, assuming i pick up Tau again, what're some good rules of thumb for the army in general? Any pointers you could give?

Don't bring Riptides to anything less than a tournament.

Limit your use of suits.

Sure, though I play at low point levels.

>If you like having friends, don't field a Riptide Wing. One is okay.
>Fire Warriors are overcosted for what they do, so field less of them or play Farsight Enclaves. The latter makes Crisis Suits troops; this is expensive as all hell in real-dollar costs, but surprisingly cheap in points. One suit costs about as much as 7 Fire Warriors, but will last much longer and brings decent firepower to the table.
>The Ghostkeel is good, even on its own, but the Optimized Stealth Cadre makes it great. It will kill armor.

In non-suit advice:
>Don't over-field suits. I'm fielding a suit-heavy army for fluff reasons, and intentionally avoiding Riptides or superheavy suits. But mix other stuff in.
>Pathfinders are relatively weak, but they're one of your two good markerlight sources (the other is a Marker Drone Controller commander).
>Farsight Enclaves is more expensive directly compared, since all units require Bonding Knife Ritual. Whether Crisis suits as troops is balanced enough is up to you.
>Take High-Yield Missile Pods on Broadsides and Ion Cannons on Hammerheads. Railguns are sadly weak this edition. Longstrike with a Railhead might be good enough to be worth doing, though.
>Don't take Skyrays.

So I'm thinking about diving back in with my Dark Eldar. I've got the following

1 Archon
1 Haemonculus
4 Trueborn
40 Warriors
10 Wracks
18 Reavers
10 Scourges
1 Talos
1 Cronos (needs some repairs though)
1 Razorwing Jet
3 Ravagers
2 Venoms
4 Raiders
5 Hellions

And a custom Drazhar model I made.

What do I need in 7e? What should I get to shore up (haven't played since 2013) weaknesses?

Can I make 5 man Tac Squads in Razorbacks work at 1500 with out a Battle Company for my Dark Angels? A demi company would be alright.

Best weapons for a razorback?

I like the twin-linked LasCannon but my White Scars friend insists on LasCannon and twin-linked Plasma Gun.

I'm trying to make a good "take all" list and have everything besides Vengeances, drop pods and land raiders.

Don't play them if you want people to like you. They're almost Eldar tier.

>Fire Warriors are overcosted for what they do
So tell the guy to take more of them, not optimize by taking FE suits...

Put all marker lights in cover when possible
Don't listen to , get an idea of your meta and decide if you want to use a Riptide. Rule of thumb is not to use one under 1500.
Check out the Contingent detachments for building a list
Look into both Farsight Enclaves to indulge in your battle suit fetish
Check out 1d4chan's tactics page for specific info including unit analysis/strategies.

No. Less Suits, more Fire warriors.

There are enough reasons to fill a library.

I'm speaking from my personal experience. A 3-suit unit does more, in my experience, than an equivalent Fire Warrior unit (or multiple smaller units) does. If he'd like to take an expensive infantry option, that's his prerogative, honestly. He also remarked on the fact that *the whole reason he's into Tau is for the suits* which is a pretty big deciding factor anyway.

>A 3-suit unit does more

Yes. Which is why people dislike Tau. Cheap OP suits.

I kinda want to get this mentality out that having a single Riptide is "OP". It's not. They're the Tau's TEQ. It's fair if they can have one if you bring some Termies or a Land Raider. If they bring multiple and in the Wing, then yes that is pretty cheesy.

Also Kroot are shit. They're just expendable meatshields. Having a whole army oriented around them would be incredibly boring. If Tau auxiliaries had the same love that Genestealers then that would be fine.

A "fun" army to play against is something that tries to bring all the neat units into the battle in a combined arms fashion. Not just spamming any one single unit. A good Tau player would know that some well supported fire warrior unit is a cheaper and arguably better source of anti infantry fire power than the other units.

I'm so tired of hearing non Tau players complain about "muh Battlesuits or muh Riptides" They're there in the codex, they have a purpose, just like the FWs.source then any of the battle suits. Just because you get butthurt at the cheesemongers doesn't mean that the other Tau players have to stop using a particular unit. Quit bitching.

Nice meme, classic.

Sure. I'm not disagreeing. I don't weigh in one way or another on Tau power level. My list is gimped on purpose, with more Fire Warriors than I need and with nothing heavier than a Crisis suit.

TLLC on an Rback is pretty reliable. Las plas has somewhat more versatility, having more shots for taking out heavy infantry rather than a more certain chance of damaging a high AV vehicle.

The new 40k player (Imperial Guard) here. My friend said anything in the army case is mine. So I have sprues with a plasma gun, 2 flamers, a power fist and a power sword, as well as 8 more guys and a Heavy Bolter team.

He also informed me that the price of the Baneblade at the shop we play at was just reduced from $150 to $110. Should I grab the Baneblade?

It depends. Do you want to use one of it's variants later one when you've got a larger army, or no? It's not a bad deal at all though.

Post pics of your army. Need to see if you can paint well or not.

No do not buy a superheavy yet.

Thanks for the easy explanation, I think I will stick with the TL Las, I always find myself having big armored targets.

I should just keep my razorback squads at 5 guys with no wargear right?

Super-heavies a shit.

Make Artillery Great Again.

Haven't painted anything yet. Been playing the army as I got it.

And yeah, I want to play the one that comes with the Vulcan Mega Bolter.

Not even to paint/assemble?

Was already planning on getting 3 Wyverns and 3 Basilisks.

>Not even to paint/assemble?

I mean if you want to, go ahead, but there's no point from an army building perspective.

To be fair, the Baneblade isn't as effective as it used to be, but it's still solid.

Just know it won't last if any Walker, Monstrous Creature, Super-Heavy Walker or Gargantuan Creature reaches it in melee.

Don't be afraid to look into the Baneblade variants rather than the stock one.

And don't just take it to walk all over someone on the table. Have a good reason for having it in your list.

>He also informed me that the price of the Baneblade at the shop we play at was just reduced from $150 to $110. Should I grab the Baneblade?

I only get to bring out my Baneblade at lists 1501+ which isn't too often and I play in a casual meta.

Well, next month I'm getting $500 from my grandma for Christmas because my grandma is awesome. I just remember loving the Baneblade in Dawn of War.

Thanks, will have to get a hold of a rulebook and see if i cant tinker up a list from this.

Any trap options for crisis suits? How many weapons per suit is enough, can they still take drones and if so, which and how many are good.

If people judge me satan for my choice of plastic minis then i doubt i'd want to associate with them in the long term anyways.

Markerlights seem to be mentioned constantly whenever the tau come up, what are they?

The fact that fire warriors are bad makes me sad in a way that is hard to describe.

What are some common point limits? I see 750 and 1850 being mentioned here alot, any others?

>The fact that fire warriors are bad makes me sad in a way that is hard to describe.

Fire Warriors aren't fucking bad, they're one of the best shooty troops in game. Crisis suits are just really good.

Wyverns are good but get artillery carriages instead of basilisks. Unless someone in your group is autistic about Forge World.

That would be the Tau, Imperial Fists and Space Wolves players. The IF and SW players LOVE bringing out Warhound titans and one owns a Warlord. But I only have to worry about them in 2000+ games from what I've seen.

Fire Warriors aren't bad, that guy is just trying to get you to WAAC by telling you to load up on suits.

Tau are legit almost Eldar tier, which is why I said people won't like you if you play Tau.

Warlord titans are 2745 points, iirc.

You have drones and pathfinders fire them, when another unit fires at a unit that has marker lights, you can spend them to do the following:
Spend 1 or more to up Ballistic Skill by that amount
Spend 2 to completely remove cover
Spend 1 to fire a Seeker Missile (Tau hunter-killer missile essentially)
Spend 1 to make a Stormsurge's Destroyer Missiles D strength.

They are really important in making sure your shooting phase is accurate, and provide a powerful anti-jink/cover solution. You can activate the abilities at the same time (so firing at BS5 and ignore cover for example).

Also take 2 weapons per suit. Plasma is a safe bet for MEQ/TEQ, but Cyclic Ion Blasters work for anything flimsier. Fusion Blaster suits are very reliable for anti-tank you have assuming you deep strike close enough.

Did not know that. Was watching an Apocalypse game that was 20,000pts per side. Imperium vs Xenos vs Chaos. That's the only time I saw the IF player field the Warlord.

Fire Warriors absolutely aren't bad, and I'm not trying to argue they're objectively bad, you just have cheaper options. I run a grand total of 3 Crisis suits, no Riptides, no Stormsurge, no Tau'nar, in my army. My investment's in vehicles. But I keep my Fire Warriors limited, as well. Because they're expensive as hell.

Don't forget you can take a master or ordnance in your ccs for even more artillery barrages.

And the Cadian Supplement has a warlord trait that allows my warlord to call down one artillery barrage per game.

Glad theres merit to them, i like their design almost as much as that of the suits.

I've been outta the loop for years so "eldar tier" is lost on me, are the top-mid tier, mid-top tier? Absolutely undisputeably top shelf?

Markerlights sounds neat as fuck. And as for suits asides from two weapons a pop, any other equipment thats worth taking?

To be fair even if suits were shit i'd load up on them anyways. Is there merit to a fifty fifty approach? Half suits, half infantry backed by vehicles possibly?

>fifty fifty approach
Absolutely, that's what most people do in my experience.

Eldar infantry can get D weapons.

I want to play Blood Angels, are they that bad?

Eldar, Genestealer Cults, Tau, Space Marines, Necrons. In that order or so.

Let's not exaggerate here user. The meme weapon for Eldar infantry is the scatter laser, which is a very scary weapon but by no means is it D.

Yes since the FAQ you can play all Wraith all the time but frankly if that was the most viable thing people would just have run Wraith Hosts and so on before it hit.

>How to make a good Eldar list
>Step 1: Open the Eldar Codex
>Step 2: Pick units at random until you have a battleforged (Non-Unboun) army.
>Step 3: Win. Win against everything.

Oh wow

>Autarch with randomized wargear
>Storm Guardians
>Any of the melee aspects especially if no Aspect Host
>Wraithlords

Just shut the fuck up already. Eldar are good but you can't literally pick units at random and expect to win unless you pick the RIGHT units.

depends on the meta.
If you aren't going to tournaments and play with enough terrain that you have a chance to work your way into assault then they can be great fun.

You can always play renegades of Vraks and play artillery as elite, heavy support, and troop choices.

Ok, I play Tempestsus and just bought two Imperial Knights to go with them.
Most of my gaming buddies said that's great, awesome, glad I got some big boy toys.
Except one. He called me out for purposely trying to just beat up on his Chaos army (not true at all, by the way) and now refuses to play me if I request to field even one of the knights.
Am I in the wrong here?
It's Temps and Knights. They're not THAT good...or am I missing something?

What's his list look like? CSM are a fairly shit army but even they can answer Knights (thoguh not always in efficient ways).

However a lot of CSM players know this and won't shut the fuck up about how they're always the victim. Regardless of what his list looks like, remind him that he can bring a Renegade Knight to level the playing field if he considers Knights to be that unfair (they aren't, they are merely good).

I don't think you're wrong at all. That said, depending on how good a buddy he is maybe its worth the effort to go the extra mile to mend things. How did your games with him go before the knights?

I do not desire to commit heresy.

He typically runs land raiders (nothing special anymore I hear) with Chosen, and then maybe a hell Drake and then berserkers and the like. So he's CC and tank heavy. I mean, yes, that's giving me free shots but...
This is what i run at 2k and he calls cheese:
HQ
Command Squad 85
Plasma Pistol 15
Plasma Gun 15
Plasma Gun 15
Plasma Gun 15
Plasma Gun 15
Command Squad 85
Bolt Pistol 0
Hot Shot Volley Gun 10
Hot Shot Volley Gun 10
Hot Shot Volley Gun 10
Hot Shot Volley Gun 10
Command Squad 85
Bolt Pistol 0
Melta Gun 10
Melta Gun 10
Melta Gun 10
Melta Gun 10

Troops
Scion Squad 70
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Bolt Pistol 0
Hot Shot Volley Gun 10
Hot Shot Volley Gun 10

Scion Squad 70
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Hot Shot Volley Gun 10
Hot Shot Volley Gun 10

Scion Squad 70
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Plasma Pistol 15
Plasma Gun 15
Plasma Gun 15

Scion Squad 70
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Additonal Scion 12
Plasma Pistol 15
Plasma Gun 15
Plasma Gun 15

Knight Crusader 425
Rapid Fire Battle Cannon 5
Storm Spear Rocket Pod 40

Knight Crusader 425
Rapid Fire Battle Cannon 5
Storm Spear Rocket Pod 40

Typically he wrecked my ass. Every time. I mean, Tempestsus are paper mache in CC and even IF I took out his land raiders, that requires melta so I just get charged right away anyway.

>Two Crusaders
Okay that's pushing the boundary a little but then
>2k
He should know what he's getting into, even one Knight at that points level is perfectly fine.

Also, work on your formatting.

>Footslogging Scions
>cheese
What a faggot. To be fair he IS using Berzerkers