/5eg/ D&D Fifth Edition General: Devourer Edition

I think another thing to be sure to add would be Chill Touch as a cantrip due to its anti-undead capabilities.

I might also suggest giving them some way to have their more fitting necrotic damage spells get around the typical necrotic resistance of undead.

It's an interesting concept.

No, when people see a goblin they assume their first quest has just started. Then they kill them.

Everyone else initially dislike the 5e MM stat block and eventually really like it?

I never really had a problem with it to begin with outside of spells being a pain in the dick to reference.

Anyone* else

>Then you would be one dumb fuck of a peasant

How? I've probably never seen a Demon outside of maybe second-hand drawings or stained glass windows at the local church depicting them getting killed.

If I see something with red skin, glowing eyes, and devil horns, I'm going to assume it's a devil, because I have no frame of reference, since I haven't seen either a devil, half-devil, or devil-man in my entire life.

It'd be like trying to describe the difference between a Wolf and a Husky to someone who's never seen either outside of a vague picture.

Well you're making assumptions about what common knowledge may or may not be here. Is there FR canon (or canon adjacent) on the subject?

your line of reasoning doesn't even support your argument when you think about it.

okay, so peasants probably don't exactly know what a tiefling or a fiend is, what little they do know is based on legends and drawings, so when they see one they will be unsure about it, maybe scared or inquisitive, maybe they ask their priest or something, etc.

but peasants probably DO know exactly what a goblin is and have probably had run-ins with them before (or know of people who have had run-ins with goblins), so when they see one they are for sure going to grab their torches and pitchforks, and raise the alarm

They'll know enough to know that fiends are dangerous and they should probably run away.

Both a Tiefling and the Goblin have the exact same reaction: It's a monster showing up in town. The people don't know exactly how powerful the demon is, so they'll probably run, bar their doors, get the priest, and generally be in fear. They do know what a goblin is, so like you said, angry mob, call the guards, kill it.

That doesn't make the first one somehow excused from people reacting poorly too it. It's just less likely to be kill on sight because goblins are easier to kill than demons.

Just to add to this from my point, people usually know how goblins look and what they are.
People don't know how demons look and what are demons exactly. And they don't know what tieflings are. And probably haven't heard of tiefling exactly doing anything wrong on the level as they've heard about goblins.
Demons and devils in DnD have different forms, they don't necessary look like a stereotypical satan. So they don't look at the tiefling and think that it's a satan incarnated, it just looks like some humanoid, that looks slightly evil looking.

>Demons and devils in DnD have different forms, they don't necessary look like a stereotypical satan. So they don't look at the tiefling and think that it's a satan incarnated
but a commoner has never seen a devil or demon; they're aren't going to be able to know that a tiefling isn't one. Why wouldn't they consider it satan incarnate?

Again, you're taking leaps to justify playing a race that is in-setting canon as evil pests and raiders

So the average villager probably knows some lore about demons and devils. They don't know what they (devils/demons) exactly look like and they probably only have a vague awareness of what a Tiefling is. EVERY villager KNOWS that Goblins are evil little shits.

you are also ignoring that Tieflings can generally be found in cities like Neverwinter, though still somewhat rare. Goblins aren't. Tieflings are not some completely unheard of thing, they're just rare.

In my FR games I'd need a strong justification for playing a Tiefling. Frankly every Tiefling I've played with has been a shitty player, as with Dragonborn. I dunno what it is but i've played with over a dozen individuals who played either a dragonborn, tiefling, or that bird race and they were all trash players.

I wouldn't even consider allowing a Goblin unless you were a warlock with Mask of many faces constantly disguising you as a gnome or something

Who is Satan? Any relation to Khorne or Bane or Asmodeus?
If most demons don't look like stereotype red horned men, then why would a red horned man look like a demon to them?

Why wouldn't they consider a dwarf devil incarnate then?
If they don't know how devils or demons look like, why would they assume that a guy with horns is one?

>Again, you're taking leaps to justify playing a race that is in-setting canon as evil pests and raiders

I'm not justifying playing it. I'm saying that a Tiefling is likely in a similar boat unless you are in a bigger city that gets a lot of strange travelers.

While you do have some Demons and Devils that look different, a lot of the pretty standard basic ones are that sort of Satan look. Big horns, red skin.

Balrogs, Imps, Pit Fiends. Again, if all they have are vague descriptions and drawings of the most common types, then that's what you'd expect to see.

Demons and Devils in D&D do have a lot that look like stereotypical satans, because D&D is written by people from our world where that's the normal assumption.

so can I play a demon or devil or almost any fiend in Forgotten Realms without persecution? I mean, your average person isn't going to know what a Slaad is

Some do look kinda like this, some don't. They don't exatly represent the general representation of a demon or a devil.
The thing is there is a lot of weird shit out there just to assume that a dude with horns is the satan incarnate. And goblin is always a goblin. It is in no way in the same boat.

Yeah, there is a lot of weird shit out there, and most of it can be assumed to be monsters trying to kill you.

I mean, people probably don't see Mind Flayers very often or know what they are, though I doubt they just give a friendly smile and wave to the nice octopus man.

I want to point out that, back in AD&D, Diaboli were mistrusted by humans because they looked a lot like your stereotypical devil - goat-like legs, tail with a stinging barb on it, forked tongue, big nose, and tiny little horns on the forehead. Except they were purple rather than red.

Of course, diaboli thought humans were just as scary and ugly looking.

The thing is educated people know about demons and devils and know that they are evil. As well as they know that tieflings are not always evil.

Used some of the new Orc statblocks, they absolutely thrashed my party. Caused 1 death, actually.

Why would they have any idea what a tiefling is? Do they do a PSA after the preacher stops talking about evil demons?

And angels in D&D look like a bunch of weird stuff too.

But if you had a stained glass window or a painting in a church depicting a bunch of angels fighting a bunch of demons, you'd probably get some glowing people with angel wings up against some red skinned horned things with wings, because both Pit Fiends and Balors fit that description.

There is a very clear stereotypical 'devil' look in D&D.

Would these villagers be more receptive to a Bugbear or a Hobgoblin? Those are both Goblinoids that don't look like Goblins. Can a Hobgoblin stick a pair of horns on their head to pass for a Tiefling?

...

ohshitbtfoTRUMP2016

Well if they can correctly identify a demon, they can probably correctly identify if someone is not really a demon.
Do you have any sources on glass windows with red skinned horned demons in the lore anywhere?
I mean, let's be frank, in tiefling race description, and at least by them being a vanilla race, it seems that people don't mind them that much as if they were actual demons walking on the level of being able to walk in cities.
It doesn't say anything good about goblins though.

It's a bit more evil looking than a regular tiefling tbqh

Yep. Tieflings are totally fine. Nobody would ever run in fear for thinking they were a monster, right?

Idahoanon here, writing up that dungeon you guys voted on earlier; Underwater Monstrosities is the theme. Gonna use some stuff from Volo's for inspiration, and just wanted to share the shitty map that's gonna go along with it. Use it for whatever, if you want.

those two don't even look much alike lol, you could have cherrypicked better than that. the point is that known full monsters like goblins would be killed on sight in most places, while mixed monsters/humanoids that resemble monsters like tieflings, which people aren't sure about, would be treated with fear/suspicion/hatred in most places (and in some places, where people are more educated and know that they aren't monsters at all, they might even treated quite normally)

it's like the difference between seeing an arab guy walking down the street in america, he might get treated racistly but that's it, then compare to a literal ISIS fighter in full garb and armed to the teeth walking down the street in america

This is just an art, lore says that a dude with horns and a tail is suspicious but ok, but the way that goblins or hobgoblins are known are always evil monsters.

So can walk around in town without getting killed?

Not him, but that's a good point.
I don't understand the "Strike Fear" thing though. Any good assassin, if you see them, omae wa mo shinderu.

They are just hobgoblins in devil masks though, no?

Making a paladin - favored soul

Life domain for favored soul, vengeance for paladin (undead hunter)

Can I make a GFB attack, then quicken and make another GFB attack? Don't you need to make an attack as part of GFB?

also the character will be level 9, what's the best way of splitting that up between the two classes? 3 paladin 6 sorc? extra attack and 4th level spell slots (though I'd only have 1st level paladin spells and 3rd level sorc spells) is dope

6 Paladin 3 Sorc? 3rd level spell slots, only second level spells for both.

could I take my two attacks and then Quicken a GFB?

I'm leaning 3 pally 6 sorc, extra attacks while having access to shit like Revivify and fly and fireballs and sorcery points and a dick ton of smites sounds awesome. though missing out on find steed and aura is a fucking tragedy I'd put my next 3 levels in pally.

>there is no IRL equivalent of it
when I see minorities walking around my white neighborhood I stay stay indoors and lock up so I don't get shot and robbed

The difference is that one is very commonplace for murdering average folk and the other is just creepy as fuck holy shit hide your kids before they start reading tieflings bizarre adventure

>Can I make a GFB attack, then quicken and make another GFB attack? Don't you need to make an attack as part of GFB?

You can do GFB + Quicken GFB. You'd get two attacks, one for the standard and one for the bonus.

>could I take my two attacks and then Quicken a GFB?
Yes.

>levels

Maybe go for a 4/5 split to get 2 ASIs?

>Furry hands
>no tail
>visible mask seam
>goblinoid facial features still visible
>distinctly "up to no good" outfit

Devils aren't that ugly though. Hobgoblins are fucking ugly though, they're bersmirsching a devil's good name.

True, but seeing as hobgoblin societies ten to be LE, it would make no sense to associate with Demons, so they got saddled with Devils. For the worse on the part of Devils.

so i just went though Volo's excited cause ive wanted to make a Kobold character since i heard of 5e and all the homebrew was a little lacking, and am kinda disappointing with how weak they are.
are their any other player races that get minus stats let alone 2 points?

Orcs, which also feel quite weak. Though I still think kobolds are more salvageable than orcs, they can still be decent and Pack Tactics does a lot. As long as you have an ally by your side, you can NEVER have disadvantage.

What's the point of mastermind rogue for the 'help' action when you could just go AT, wizard or warlock for a familiar and make your familiar use the 'help' action every turn for you?

You could get a familiar and help twice!

mastermind is shit

Mastermind doesn't seem too bad if you have no need for your bonus action.
Say, you sit back and use ranged attacks instead.
Also better with booming blade or green flame blade.
However, all those things need a feat or a multiclass to work, not that taking your first level in barbarian or fighter will hurt at all.

Still, it kinda sucks when find familiar doesn't give a shit and lets you give advantage to yourself.

Wait, can't you make a single attack with the hand crossbow as an action and then a single attack with the hand crossbow as a bonus action without crossbow expert?

If you have a feature granting you a bonus action attack with the weapon, yes. The loading property states that you get one attack per action; 2 actions, 2 attacks.

You shouldn't need a feature, hand crossbows count as 'light' so it-
Wait a moment.
>two-weapon fighting
>melee attack
So you need crossbow expert to even use hand crossbows with two-weapon-fighting (which technically isn't two-weapon-fighting).

Guess ranged rogue is gonna mostly be throwing daggers. Doesn't actually sound so bad.

Ranged rogue can use whatever they like; daggers limit you based on how many you can draw per turn (one, two with dual wielder feat), but you only get one sneak attack per turn anyways.

The game still lacks love for thrown weapons outside of being a back-up for barbarians or maybe strength fighters or strength paladins.

You could go dual wielder and fighter levels for heavy armour and try throwing javelins as 1d6 thrown weapons 30/120ft, but unless you already had them drawn you'll lose your +1 AC and you can't get sneak attack because it's neither a ranged weapon nor a finesse weapon.

They didn't really design the aspect properly.

The bonus action attack helps, because it means you have a second chance to hit if you miss your first.

I sent an e-mail to Sage advice regarding this, haven't seen a response yet. Maybe they'll be nice and at least let darts function as ammo.

That's fair I suppose.

...

Don't forget that you can only draw 1 dagger per round, unless you spend a feat.

I am curious here: how good are your parties at distributing loot? And how good are the GM at tailoring the magic items to fit the party?

My current high level party (everybody is level 17) is way unbalanced in terms of the power, and I was curious if this was just normal shit that happens, or just my GM that fucked up a bit.

To the topic of goblins in villages, remember that yes, if the villagers see a love gobby in town skulking about in the middle of the night with rags and a big cloak they will call the guards.

It's different if the goblin is decently dressed and groomed in decent armour and he walks into town I broad daylight with a crew of adventuring folk who are famous for being eccentric do gooders odds are they will just keep a close eye on the thieving shit.

It's like the art in volo's of the tavern. Spot a kobold lurking around the outskirts of town they are up to no good plotting something call the guards.

A kobold walks into your tavern the middle of the afternoon, climbs up onto a stool plants three silver on the table and asks for a mug of ale and the steak pie with mash. You don't know what's going on but it's more of a curiosity than a concern.

Pretty, but looks messy and confusing as fuck.

Some GMs cater to the players and give them some tailored items, others go strictly by the rolls, someone may get a legendary item while others a few healing potions. The first one is of course better but it takes more time and GMs who don't want to risk making a mistake will always go rolls.

Because any Gm who isn't mentally challenged will kill your familiar whenever possible if your using it as a front line combatant like that. Via aoe attacks or simply "Gah get if oaf me summoned shoot dis bird it keeps pecking my nose.". A player at our table cheesed this and after 3 sessions of it getting killed in the first encounter of the day each say he backed off the meme.

The difference is the one on the left wants to murder you for being a human while the one on the right wants to have sex with you (hopefully) because it's a slutty slut slut with a tail and horns. Mmmm.

Hey, maybe the one on the left wants to have sex with you too, you never know.

Shit, yeah, you're right, I'm sorry.

I explain calmly to him that he's not my type and that I'm far more into the horned, tailed, and actually devilish/demonic blooded type. Then I try to help him hook up with the elf.

You know for sure he wants to fuck you up.

Our GM doesn't roll, the magic items are far too specific to be just rolls.

We are a 4 man group:
Paladin with a Great sword +4 that can convert all its damage to radiant, and he can stick it in the ground to gain resistance to all damage, or immunity if he already has resistance, and makes him immune to anh effect that would disarm him. He also has a plate armour +4 that is immune to spell effects and grants him advantage on all saving throws, and a cape that lets him add his charisma to his AC.

A warrior "witch hunter" styled, with a +3 shortsword that also grants +2 AC and has built in haste. A hand crossbow +3 that can be used as a melee weapon with no penalties and anyone hit also suffers from the spell effect slow, and he is wearing a plate mail +4 that lets him turn into a mist as a reaction 4/day and let's him reflect all damage taken back on his attacker 1/day (if he takes 20 damage,he can immediately return this damage to his opponent, sucks for assassins trying to kill him), and a hat that grants him +1 AC and +4 to perception checks.

The wizard is a wizard, and has a cloak that sets his AC to 20 and makes him immune to non-magical, non-silvered attacks, and gives him advantage on all saving throws, and succesful saving throws that only reduce damage by half, instead negates it entirely. He also has an orb that lets him cast chromatic orb 10 times a day, infinite charges, and at the highest level he can cast it himself. (his signature spell)

And then we have my thief, who has a +2 dagger that also functions as a thieves tool, as well as being impossible to spot through non-magical means if I am hiding on my person, and a cloak that renders me immune to weather effects and grants me +3 to stealth.

It feels a bit lopsided, but a lot of the gear is either impossible for me to use, or given very specifically to a certain character, by an NPC who would often freak out if he had just given it to that shady thief they had in their party.

>implying

Enemies won't use AoE attacks on creatures they can't see (invisible familiars) that aren't within their accidental AoE range (Say, the familiar is above an ally)

>killed in the first encounter of the day
Implying you can't have like 3 familiars every day, and each time they die (presuming it's a non-invisible one and against enemies with ranged attacks) the enemy has just used a ranged attack they could have just used against your party, and your familiar has already used at least one 'help' action anyway.

If you have the money for 10gp / familiar, it's viable, it's stupid, obnoxious to bring to the table but considered fine by wizards.

It's also a pretty common-sense house rule to ban the use of the Help action to help in anything you couldn't do yourself.

Are you stupid? Tieflings have cities,we share a common culture, etc, they're basically decendants of ancient humans who made a pact with a demon for knowledge and power centuries and centuries ago, that's fucking it, they aren't demonic now, they don't have to be evil, etc.

Hobgoblins are fucking warmongering race what side with bugbears, goblins and orcs, they vast majority is evil

You're basically comparing Spaniards (who had the Inquisition back then) and ISIS and saying they're the same thing.

Any way to make a trial by combat encounter fun? My players just convinced the court to settle the case by combat. The barbarian volunteered to be the champion.

I'm just thinking of throwing in the usual combat encounter but I'm wondering if there's anything to make it interesting? I might make the champion a Battle Master to add that layer of combat with the maneuvers but I'm wondering what the other 4 party members who are watching at the sidelines can do. Maybe perhaps spot someone who might sabotage the fight? Any ideas?

Can anyone explain me why martial adept is so shit?

You get one manuever and you get 1 dice to use it with, and the die is a fucking D6
It's good when you're playing a fighter who gets maneuver dice but doesn't get the normal maneuvers, so then you get the ones of that subclass and one from battlemaster.
Otherwise it's a once per short rest piece of shit that is outclassed by lots of other feats

Why not bring back what the martials got in the playtest packets?

I just hate the asian look that D&D always put in evil monsters.

>Has martial in the name
>In D&D
>"Why does it suck?"
Well gee I dunno

>Warmongering culture that has a weird code of honor
>Not Asian
Kay

You are definitely a little lower on the flat increases, but that impossible to spot should be very powerful. Are you sure you aren't getting lesser items cause of roleplay? A paladin wizard and fighter don't have negative stigmas and NPCs probably trust them a lot more than you. Maybe you should try and ally with powerful sneaky NPCs.

A feat that grants the same mechanic as an archetype needs to be highly restricted or it steals too much thunder and makes the archetype superfluous, especially given BMs don't do anything significant outside of spamming maneuvers.

The problem comes from Battlemasters getting relatively few maneuvers and uses. They come into their own when chained together in the same turn or round after round, not from a single use every other combat.

Magic Initiate at least gives the capability for magical, scaling ranged damage to classes that ordinarily wouldn't have it, or other minor things that can be spammed forever. And while a single level one spell is pretty weak on its own, it's a bit more powerful than any maneuver can do on its own save Menacing Blow. There's also a variety of new abilities that can come by way of a single spell, not to mention the potential for spam by taking something that's a ritual instead.

You can't really improve the maneuver side of Martial Adept without detracting too much from the uniqueness of the Battlemaster. It should probably have a second feature, removed from the maneuver mechanic, to do something for you all those times after you've spent your one attack.

Battlemaster ends having 9 maneuvers know, 6 maneuvers per short rest (you refresh 2 every time you roll ini) and deal 1d12

This gives you 1 know, 1 per short rest (period) that deals 1d6

I don't think increasing it to 2 per short rest would fuck anything, as it's is shit, nobody ever picks it

Not that guy, but if you boost it, it becomes even more of a necessary pick for BMs. I would kill a nameless NPC for 2 superiority dice or a fighting style added on.

Compared to Magic Initiate, a feat that a lot of people pick (Rogues specially or BB and familar) is quite funny.

for*

Don't fall into the trap of considering balance at the Battlemaster's endgame. That's not where the game takes place.

Most games don't reach level 10, and even those that do will have spent far more time at the previous levels than they most likely will spend there or beyond. For most of the game, Battlemasters have three maneuvers and four uses, and this only improves to five and five at level 7.

This is a feat that's a fourth of an archetype. Any improvement makes it half, and that's still of debatable usefulness. Anything more and now you've got every Battlemaster wanting to take it just so they can spam six or eight uses a short rest long before they've got their third attack (which, again, they're not even likely to get).

Mostly a "stick to the shadows" thief whose allies are literal nobodies. My main contact is in a smaller town, operating an orphanage my character built with the accumulated wealth gained over the adventures.

Still, that accounts for 3 of the items, the rest are loot from dungeons. One would think dungeon loot wouldn't be too biased.

I mean thief as in "the class", not profession. If anything, the profession is taking orphans off the streets, and into homes and businesses. That just doesn't translate well in terms of people with enough influence to carry magic items they can just hand out.

K.

Well take it as a roleplay deal, a very noble sacrifice of damage for story. Sounds like your character has good story and roleplay. Be happy with what your character is doing and try not to notice the items. Cause your campaign isn't about numbers it's about story.

Escale it, give them one extra use at 10th or 11th level instead of 2 uses the moment they pick it. Though it will still be a shitty feat nobody is going to pick though, maybe battlemasters, maybe.

It's sad, I once picked it for a Monk so he could "Shoryuken", not worth it, like a fucking all.

Battlemaster's starts with 4 uses and deal d8 since the beginning though, might want to reread the class, broseph

Oh fuck, I'm a retard, you said 3 manuevers and FOUR uses, forget my non existant reading comprehension.

It actually escales though...for Battlemasters, rest of people deal 1d6 once per short rest. So yeah, ironically is a feat only useful for Battlemasters, game design at its finest.

I have a shitty idea for homebrew.
Warlock who make a pact with succubus.

Gotta have sex once every three days to active power.

Why is /pfg/ still here?