Warmachine/Hordes General

Khador. Then picked up Trollbloods and Legion for hordes. I rotate through them on a regular basis but Trolls are my favorite. Also I've been eyeing both of the 2 player starters.

My goal is to eventually own a small army of each faction.

>faction ADD
I wish I didn't have faction ADD. Would love to dive right into a faction and stick with it. But I can't help looking at all the cool stuff other factions have. Stuff I want to build, paint, and play.

Like, I really like a lot of the Khador stuff, but my wandering eye loves:
>Protectorate's plentiful flamethrowers and rockets
>Cygnar's gun mages, with their fancy hats and being gun mages
>Mercenaries' flavorful character solos and units
>Dire trolls with guns strapped to their backs
>Circle's stone golems
>Skorne's titans, cyclopes, and Karax
>Legion's nightmare monsters

Blue elves stronk

>no one here started as the glorious Protectorate

The faith is weak in this thread. The faith is desperately weak.

I did start as protectorate. They had the best battlebox art

Damn good man.

We have all the best models how could someone not like us?

Menoth.

Hey I found the true calling eventually.

Fucking army books when?

Jesus fuck. The wait for them and the theme force models are killing me.

Mercs, dipped cygnar for magnus. Picked up Gators because they're cool. Mk III hit, picked up more cygnar. I thought about dipping Skorne for chain gang, but then Mk III.

Cryx in MK2. I knew nothing about rules and almost nothing about story, but I really liked Mortenebra model. In the end Morty wasn't "optimal" starting choice money-wise, but I regret nothing. Also, until CoC came out I had more warjacks than any other player in my club, and that was kind of funny, considering my faction.

Just getting started with Mk 3 Protectorate.

Started with Mercs shortly after the magnus battlebox was released, halfassedly branching into cygnar when superiority dropped and picked up a sizable cryx force at the tail end of mk1 which I comissioned a then cash-strapped mate of mine to paint.

Retribution since Forces
Skorne since Domination

So I'm probably going to a Who's the Boss tournament, and I can't make up my mind whether to bring Circle or Protectorate.

War Room Army

Circle Orboros - Who's the Boss Circle

74 / 75 Army

WB: +27
- Warpwolf Stalker - PC: 19 (Battlegroup Points Used: 19)
- Pureblood Warpwolf - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 8)
- Pureblood Warpwolf - PC: 17
- Feral Warpwolf - PC: 18
- Wild Argus - PC: 7

Blackclad Wayfarer - PC: 4

Druids of Orboros - Leader & 5 Grunts: 12
- Druid of Orboros Overseer - PC: 4
Shifting Stones - Leader & 2 Grunts: 3

Protectorate of Menoth - Who's the Boss Protectorate

Theme: No Theme Selected
75 / 75 Army

WJ: +27
- Scourge of Heresy - PC: 16 (Battlegroup Points Used: 16)
- Fire of Salvation - PC: 16 (Battlegroup Points Used: 11)
- Blood of Martyrs - PC: 16
- Hand of Judgment - PC: 18

Allegiant of the Order of the Fist - PC: 3
Nicia, Tear of Vengeance - PC: 5
Vassal of Menoth - PC: 3
Vassal of Menoth - PC: 3
Wrack - PC: 1

Choir of Menoth - Leader & 5 Grunts: 6
Daughters of the Flame - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10
Deliverer Sunburst Crew - Gunner & 2 Grunts: 5

Which looks like more fun? Am I overlooking anything?

No sentries / 10

That moment when the victor is growing on me. The real atrocious model is the siege crawler. Dear god it looks bad.

Retribution. Their aesthetic and every individual element of the faction really appealed to me.

I can never have just one army, though, so I've ended up with Menoth and Everblight too. I realize that until Convergence I basically ran all the religious zealot armies.

They both look pretty fun, I'd go with Circle simply because so many casters can make them go completely bonkers compared to protectorate heavies. Imagine Calandra or Venethrax with werewolves.

Nice regulation paint scheme you got there.

That's an official pic from the PP Instrgram.

I wish I could paint my minis that good...

Retribution.

Though I'll admit: I'd have preferred if it was Ios in general rather than the retribution. I got into them for the gunline elves and the robots more than the mage hunters.

Same. The mage hunters grew on me, though, and right now the unit I want most is some kind of small mage hunter sniper group that can knock upkeeps off people and disable 'jacks.

It's a shame Clint Elfwood isn't playable.

Skorne, back in Mk 1. I fell in love with the aesthetic, with their disciplined infantry and giant stompy monsters. A weaponised tortured baby elephant was just the icing on the cake.

Also love Cryx, because undead cyborg pirates. The look of the Slayer chassis and eGaspy's model are what attracted me.

Unsurprisingly, the game is currently all but dead to me.

Mk I Khador. Only two books at that time and winterguard were shit tier but Sorcha hadn't had her Feat nurfed yet. So much salt

>Playing Skorne and Cryx
Oh you poor thing.

I asked what faction had the biggest stompiest robots and was told Khador, so I tried to play jacks and manowar.

After learning I couldn't do that, I went Skorne.

In my case I'd have rathered a more general Ios as I'm really interested in the Seekers but they are unlikely to get a warcaster due to being opposed philosophically to the Retribution.

Eh, maybe we'll see an Seeker Merc Warcaster.

>Seeker Merc Warcaster
Who would they fight though and why? Fluff-wise, I mean.

First Mercs against everyone's advice. Didn't want to pick Cryx, had little interest in the looks of Hordes factions and my buddies already picked up Ret, PoM, Cygnar and Khador.

After playing a while and getting the mechanics down I was drawn more and more to the fluff, look and feel of Skorne. Needless to say, a few months after mkIII dropped I switched back to Mercs - just wasnt having fun anymore. Also felt like a dead slot in team tournaments.

I guess you're just not Hoksune enough. Protip, take a Mord list and get yourself dropped against infantry.

IT'S SURVEY TIME

>Your faction
>5 models/units you think will be nerfed in your faction
>5 models/units you think will be buffed in your faction

>Your faction
Skorne
>5 models/units you think will be nerfed in your faction
The only one that might deserve it is Mordikaar's Elite Cadre
>5 models/units you think will be buffed in your faction
Rhidodon
Morghoul2
Marketh
Tyrant Commander
Makeda1 with a letter of fucking apology

Well, being a Seeker involves a lot of 'Going about adventuring while pretending to not be be seeking anything in particular'. So there is plenty of room for an elf 'merc' who's actually a seeker. Plenty of room to learn when working with warcasters of various nations.

>Cygnar
>Nerf
Haley2
Storm Lances
Laddermore
Caine2
Sloan

>Buff
Gunmages
Black 13th
Siege

That's it, I think.

JUSTICE FOR CRYX

You're still paying for your crimes.

Not every Seeker is opposed to the Retribution, they're also looking for other answers. And the Ret is now pretty much Ios' secret service after the war with the Skorne.

Seeker is working with the Golden Crucible in Llael. Khador rolls in, kills all their human bros, steals all the order's stuff. Then Menoth comes in and starts burning the survivors and their work. Seeker is mad, goes full REMOVE KHADOR REMOVE WALLFUCKERS.

It'd be cool if they could take some mage hunter units to reflect the Retribution's interest in figuring out how to galvanise Scyrah and Nyssor.

>Cygnar stuff that will be buffed
Precursors, Stormguard, Silverline, ATGM Officer, Trencher Master Gunner

>Cygnar stuff that will be nerfed
Haley2, Sloan, Lances, Centurion, Thorn

>Skorne stuff that will be buffed

>Skorne stuff that will be nerfed
Morghoul2

>Laddermore
>Caine2
They're not even that good. No, not even Caine2.

>Well, being a Seeker involves a lot of 'Going about adventuring while pretending to not be be seeking anything in particular'.
Going on adventures is not fighting a war though. In fact, wars would probably take a lot out of your adventuring time.

>"We are now very aware that putting Ghostly on Morghoul2 was a complete mistake. It made him far too powerful as with Marketh he could waltz through the opponent's army and Flashing Blade everything to death. It was very powerful, very unfair, and we're very sorry. We're removing the spell from him, making him the game's first 2 spell caster. No other changes are being made to him."

Searforge. I remember my FLGS had been pushing the game fairly heavily, and it didn't appeal to me a huge amount until they got the Gorten starter box in. Then I got into the game in a big way.

Okay, again.
Woldstalkers and Stonewarden - worth picking or not?

I doubt any Ret stuff will be nerfed. They seem like they're the level the were aiming to put everyone at.

Some stuff may get buffed. MHI are basically useless, and around three of the casters are pretty much unplayable tier in competitive games. I doubt anything else needs changing.

Ossyan takes a hit, I bet. His kit is just too perfect

A seeker would be more likely to get non-mage hunter parts of the Iosan forces.

Not as good as sentries, but I don't see why they wouldn't be viable.

As good as he is, he's hardly game breaking.

He's not even that hard to fight, as to pull off his big feat driven killing spree he has to move up into perilous range. I can't count the number of times a player assumed he was going to mow down all position and gave me an easy assassination.

Doubtful. That stuff doesn't leave Ios often.

If a Seeker is operating alone out in the IK they're not going to be getting help from the houseguard. The only elves they're likely to have relatively nearby are mage hunters, exiles, and nyss.

>As good as he is, he's hardly game breaking.
As a Skorne player, I don't know how I can beat his feat. Ossyan can feat, mini feat his two units of Invictors, walk forwards, and on average rolls blow two of my titans off the table from 14" away. And that's just two of his units on feat turn. +2 to damage rolls I could understand, but a whole extra dice? Get fucked.

As a Skorne player, I don't know how you can beat anything.

The problem here is that you need a massive buff.

And the Mage Hunters/Seekers are rather opposed in how they want to solve the problem.

I'd likely say non-houseguard, non-mage hunters. So Stormfall Archers or Mages or other groups that are not official military or dedicated retribution.

The most obvious thing is spreading out. He needs to get your stuff in his control and while he's FOC7 that's still avoidable, especially with Rasheth. Play PGBRMTs (that name is long as fuck even if you abbreviate it). If he's bringing double Invictors, those guys will turn into gods of slaughter, especially with Rasheth or Hexy2.

And finally, his feat needs to be backbraking, or he's already lost. Outside of his feat, he's not all that crazy. So if you can bait the feat while still retaining about half your list, you're good to go.

Or play Zaadesh2 and fuck him over entirely.

>As a Skorne player, I don't know how you can beat anything.
It's not THAT bad. It's just control and massive ranged damage output that screws us over.

Pickable in any list? Want to use them to sort of support Kaya2 beast-heavy list from range.
They seem good to me, yes, but i thought if maybe i was missing something.
Basically they seem like good ranged support unit to me. Not miraclous but pretty good thanks to concentrated fire.
Yet i wonder if i can use some of Tharn units like Ravagers or Bloodtrackers.
I do realise they got hit by -3 boxes per model, but did it make them useless?

Bloodrackers (the girls with spears, right?) with UA are still good. Woldstalkers should be perfectly fine.

The thing is, that they are both eclipsed massively by sentry stones. That might change in January.

Nope, bloodtrackers are dudes with bows. Ravagers - dudes with axes.
Why are they outclassed? Because sentry stones are cheap as hell and can boost their sprays?

>Because sentry stones are cheap as hell and can boost their sprays?
That combined with silly strong recursion and Stealth on a high-arm model. Oh and forest creation.

They're not really opposed. Seekers are just looking for more knowledge about what's going on, they don't know if the Ret are right or wrong. Something they may have gotten in abundance during the time skip, since there was a big currently unrevealed revelation regarding Nyssor and Scyrah.

If a Seeker turned up at a mage hunter enclave like "hey I'm looking for info on the gods and our withering problem, here are my leads, here's what I need help with" there's a good chance the hunters will help. Iosans outside Ios tend to look out for one another, and both the Seekers and the Retribution want to know more about what's going on.

>As a Skorne player, I don't know how you can beat anything.
You're just shit then. Skorne's biggest problem is having no tools to beat strong ranged armies. Take that weak ass Krea shit and shove it up your fucking ass PP. And there's the obligatory 5-7 point tax on every Skorne list that some people refer to as "Beast Handlers".

I can't magically spread out my titans. They have to be somewhere near the frontlines, and once they are, Ossyan feats, and my titans melt.

And since you've clearly never played with PGMTs, let me tell you now that they are NOWHERE NEAR as good as people claim. They have a single thresher attack which will hit 2-3 guys, then they can sprint away 7". Then next turn you just blow the thing off the table with ease. I can't count the number of times I've taken out 2 models with a PGMT then lost it next turn, having not even made its points back. It almost makes me want to run a TyCom for the +2" move, but now I'm spending 6 points to support a 4 point model.

The only way I can see myself beating Ossyan is with the warlock that's grown on me slowly like a cancerous lump; Mordikaar. I can push forwards, feat for +3DEF and Poltergeist, throw my Void Spirits forwards in a piece of terrain, putting them up to stupid DEF, especially if I have a Bellows Crew, then next turn they take out entire units on their own. But I wouldn't be surprised to see Void Spirits take a hit in the upcoming errata, what with being in Skorne's top 5% right now. Hell, they're Skorne's #1 most powerful model right now.

I wish Ios could get more involved with the main plot.

I want to see screaming religious zealot humans fighting screaming religious zealot elves. It'd be pure pottery if they cooked up some crazy scheme to bleed off Menoth's power into Scyrah or something.

Menite and Iosians have very little reason to fight, beyond the normal hatred elements.

Menoth doesn't give a shit about non-humans who don't worship the DW and neither do his priests, by and large, and Ios is concerned with arcanists, not priests.

Well, the Retribution 'knows' what's going on. Humans did it, humans need to die. Which is the major point of contention. The Seekers are not willing to blame other races for it until there is proof while the Retribution wants...well, it's in the name.

They want Scryah?

Yeah, Menoth is the god of humans. He doesn't give a shit if non-humans don't worship him as long as they are not worshipping the devourer.

>I can't magically spread out my titans. They have to be somewhere near the frontlines, and once they are, Ossyan feats, and my titans melt.
You don't need to magically spread them out. You can do it with regular movement. Yes, you need to get them up the field, but the field is two-dimensional. And if you're bringing Cannoneers, holding 1-2 a bit further back is also an option.
>And since you've clearly never played with PGMTs, let me tell you now that they are NOWHERE NEAR as good as people claim. They have a single thresher attack which will hit 2-3 guys, then they can sprint away 7". Then next turn you just blow the thing off the table with ease. I can't count the number of times I've taken out 2 models with a PGMT then lost it next turn, having not even made its points back. It almost makes me want to run a TyCom for the +2" move, but now I'm spending 6 points to support a 4 point model.
I don't know what to say. Honestly, just play better. If you get ~3 Invictors with a PGMT and then Sprint in to jam up a few more you've bought the rest of your army a turn of safety from them. That's all it takes.
>The only way I can see myself beating Ossyan is with the warlock that's grown on me slowly like a cancerous lump; Mordikaar. I can push forwards, feat for +3DEF and Poltergeist, throw my Void Spirits forwards in a piece of terrain, putting them up to stupid DEF, especially if I have a Bellows Crew, then next turn they take out entire units on their own. But I wouldn't be surprised to see Void Spirits take a hit in the upcoming errata, what with being in Skorne's top 5% right now. Hell, they're Skorne's #1 most powerful model right now.
If you've already got a solution, why are you asking me?

Locating Nyssor technically did not help get retribution for Scyrah, but the Ret still devoted a ton of resources to that.

If a Seeker comes and tells a bunch of mage hunters they need help with figuring out a bunch of stuff about the gods and the elven soul, they are likely to help. They're not completely myopic. Most mage hunters would welcome more knowledge about the condition of the elves and their gods.

>If a Seeker comes and tells a bunch of mage hunters they need help with figuring out a bunch of stuff about the gods and the elven soul, they are likely to help.

Hey, I've got a great idea. I'm gunna need some souless children though!

That's probably where the crazy plan comes in.

That said, I could see Ios wanting them and Khador out of Llael. Historically, the Llaelese have been great neighbours who leave them alone. Khador and the Protectorate aren't guaranteed to do that.

May genuinely be canon.

PP have been pretty hush hush about who saved Shyrr and pushed back the Skorne.

Honestly, Ios supporting Llael sounds more interesting than Llael being basically 'Cygnar light' as it is right now. I don't see it happening/being justifyable but Llael has a kinda dull identity right now.

It's fucking Goreshade.

If it's not Goreshade, it's incredibly fucking stupid.

I'd honestly like to see Merc Epic Ossyan if that ends up confirmed. As there is no way in hell Ossyan would stay and work with the man he devoted his entire life to proving he wasn't a monster like.

>If you get ~3 Invictors with a PGMT and then Sprint in to jam up a few more you've bought the rest of your army a turn of safety from them. That's all it takes.
That's still pretty shit desu senpai considering they can do their shit at any time. And the longer you wait, the more chance there is that something happens to your PGMT. It's not even a reliable answer to the gunline meta because lots of shit can see through its stealth. Sure if you tailor a list to beat Ossyan you'll do it, but a PGMT isn't a reliable solution.
>If you've already got a solution, why are you asking me?
Well firstly I wasn't asking you. Secondly it's only theoretical, I'm yet to try it. That Invictors can blow my valuable shit away from 24" may prevent any of this from being effective.

Could be Ossyan.

I want that nerd to catch a break.

I think one possibility is that Goreshade's eldritch allies betrayed him. They were pretty geared up to fight the Skorne, and only stopped because he didn't want to be detected. Goreshade could have been abandoned by them at Shyrr and BTFO by someone at the Fane of Scyrah.

Reminder that the Skorne can only be defeated by asspulls and montages.

Yeah. Ossyan really deserves a win of some sort in universe (Not just on the TT).

>Literally invents Chronomancy
Human is more notable for it/has more natural talent.

>Devotes entire life to redeeming name of house after failing to stop Elf Mengle
Elf Mengle might now be Elf Jesus.

>Finally gets a showdown with his old mentor.
Gets shitstomped.

>That's still pretty shit desu senpai considering they can do their shit at any time. And the longer you wait, the more chance there is that something happens to your PGMT. It's not even a reliable answer to the gunline meta because lots of shit can see through its stealth. Sure if you tailor a list to beat Ossyan you'll do it, but a PGMT isn't a reliable solution.
That's why I told you to Sprint TOWARDS the unit you just attacked. A single PGMT doesn't obliterate a unit of Invictors. Would be fucking broken if it did. But it can buy you a turn and if you play it well, a turn is all you need. And taking 1-2 PGMT is not "tailoring your entire list against Ossyan". They do work in other matchups.

>Invictors can blow my valuable shit away from 24"
They can only blow it away 14" from Ossyan. Any other range in the entire matchup is irrelevant.

>Well firstly I wasn't asking you.
>As a Skorne player, I don't know how I can beat his feat
You are technically correct. It isn't explicitly worded as a question.

>Secondly it's only theoretical
That is a fundamental mistake. If you approach the theory behind your list building with a defeatist attitude already, you are of course not going to reach a satisfactory result. Because at that point, nothing short of a hard counter will be satisfactory. And you're not going to get a hard counter. What I am proposing will get you a game, a fair chance at winning. Take it or leave it.

>a fair chance at winning
Nigger I'm up against Ret. Either he curbstomps me or I curbstomp him.

That's how they get all their victories, too, so it evens out.

Falling Elephant is a legitimate military tactic and totally not an asspull!

>Nigger I'm up against Ret. Either he curbstomps me or I curbstomp him.
I am sorry to hear that. I know his faction is easier to play, but that matchup is winnable.

Then we could have Ghostshade. Not as good as Pistol Wraith Caine but serviceable.

Please, it's not like you're up against Cygnar.

Ret can be beaten fair and square. It's uphill, but it can be done.

Technically he was the most responsible party for getting Nyssor back to Ios.

Vyros may have been a huge gloryhound and stolen all the public credit, but Kaelyssa, Ravyn, etc, and most of the action Retribution know that without him Goreshade would have the winter god.

Sentinel's probably lose reach

Eh. They probably lose if they invade the Broken Isles, unless you consider Toruk inherently an asspull.

even taking Godzilla off the table cryx still has the advantage it terms of terrain knowledge and navy power. to say nothing of the fact their fighting on home turf with a gorillion bodies to throw at the problem while skorne would be overextended and exhausted from fighting their way to the nightmare empire.

ALso it's shitty land with nothing to enslave. Why bother?

Also true. And I imagine Cryx would be mostly as happy to camp outside the "Western Skorne Empire" as the are Cygnar.

My response was to the "can only be defeated by" part, not that Skorne should or would invade the isles.