Fate Points and other Meta currencies

So practically every other RPG that gets made today has some sort of some sort of 'Meta currency' option that the player can choose to spend to give themselves an edge in a check, usual in the form of a reroll. They typically get called something like Bennies, Inspiration or Fate or Drama points.

Veeky Forums seems to hate the concept with a passion and associate them, 'hipster narrative indie bullshit', but even old school hardcore shit like Warhammer role-playing game has had Fate Points, way back in the 80s.

Anyway do you like or dislike the concept, and if so why?

If you have an issue with them what exactly is your reasons?

Personally playing WHFRP at least. I just them found to do much of a God stat. It was better to be luckier than smart.

I think Meta Currency is acceptable if it is handed out as a reward for roleplaying

Paladin refuses healing even though he has a gaping chest wound because the villagers he just saved need it, give that man a fate point

>If you have an issue with them what exactly is your reasons?

The point of heroism is that it is exceptional and often at personal cost. I think such mechanical awards cheapen the impact of roleplaying heroism.

Second, I find that narrative mechanics tend to reinforce genre conventions more than relying on the pure oracular power of the dice.

Pretty much this.

Beside the points that are usually given they can even restrain the narrative by imposing rules on interaction that would be freeform otherwise.
If the players would like something in a scene, I prefer they just ask me and I wing it.

The only problem I have with them is people either forget them or save them when they should be using them. Go through all of them every session if you need to, the game's math is built around their use. They are there to be used.

>tg/ seems to hate the concept with a passion and associate them, 'hipster narrative indie bullshit',
A very specific and vocal segment of Veeky Forums hates the concept. Whatever. Ignore them.


>Anyway do you like or dislike the concept, and if so why?
I generally like the concept, and find it works for most of the types of games that I run and play. I do acknowledge that it does not work for certain grittier tones of games, and that's okay. Those games probably shouldn't use them, unless it's for a specific reason (to create a sense of dread as the little threads of fate holding back your pathetic mortal self from oblivion are striped from you bit by bit.)

Games built around them that rely on them to function bug me, but as a limited resource awarded for RP or heroic deeds or whatever then I'm okay with them as long as it fits the feel and intended tone of the campaign.

I feel like dramatic editing can be done right if implemented well in a genre where they are appropriate. ADVENTURE! Tales of The Aeon Society did the concept justice I think, and it was very pulpy.

I tend to like them. Usually they're traded in a way, that it's usually a rewarded for good rping/rping your flaws, actually being flaws. It could also be used, when the GM screws you over. I tend to like how ffd6 handled it.

1 is enough to use certain abilities, 5 is enough to do a 'final stand' type thing, usually in a situation when you aren't dead, and you need 7 to 'cheat death'. When used, it involves your character usually disappearing/looking like it was a vague death, only to appear later.

It's a nice way for players to get mulligans, and gives them some power to decide their fate.

Interesting counterpoints.

It seems the issue people have with it seems less about the idea of some sort of expendable resource to improve die rolls, and more about trying to mechanically incentivise role playing
WHFRP would probably be at example of the 'gitty' use of it. It's basically the only real edge you're player has.

The first game I played that used metacurrency was Deadlands: Hell on Earth. Those were very tense campaigns. Hoarding chips was simply impossible as the DM would throw us against impossible odds. We were happy when the characters survived the adventure with still a few chips in their pool to maybe improve a skill in the future.

>>A very specific and vocal segment of Veeky Forums hates the concept. Whatever. Ignore them.
Most of the recent hate has been one faggot shitting up the board.


I had a GM once who gave out fate points exclusively as roleplaying bribes, for playing to the flaws of a character.

For example, suppose your typical greedy rogue is in a room with your typical fuckoff evil obviously cursed magic ring. Rather than the player derping out and taking the ring, or the GM making them roll willpower and forcing them to take it if they fail, the GM offers a fate point if the rogue gives into their greed.

The party situation is now that much more... interesting, and no one had to be That Guy to do it.

I like the way HeroQuest did it, where Hero Points can be used to improve contest results but are also used to gain and improve abilities, so you have to choose between short-term and long-term gain.

I acutally like how Fate Core does it. It can be used to add more to a roll or reroll a result provided you have an aspect to draw from that makes sense in the context of the roll.

It can also be used to declare something in the story that makes sense for your character. A thief coming to town would likely have a contact in the underground, the players can offer this and offer a Fate point. If the GM agrees it goes through and the player spends the point.

Points can be earned by accepting complications due to your aspects, also known as Compels, and refusing a compel costs you a Fate point in addition to not getting one from the Compel.

It really mechanizes the narrative which I think is pretty cool.

So don't award them for heroism. There are other things to RP as.

It's fine in the right context, it's just a vocal minority of morons who are so invested in their one right way to roleplay that they violently reject anything they see as other than that.

The Star Wars one has an interesting variation on it, where the 'fate points' start at either Light or Dark, where Light side can be spent by the players, the Dark by the GM, and when used by either they flip to the other side.

How about Sex or ERP as a meta currency?

5e feels like the mechanic was tacked on last minute, or was the the only way Wizards could say "this, DM, is our way of nudging the players to RP instead of treating the game like a vidya".

Our group has been playing 5e now for almost a year, and inspiration is still basically "make the DM smirk or do something RPish for a free advantage throw later". Nobody goes out of their length to get inspiration, and the "reward" of having an advantage throw doesn't really feel right. I hate to say it, but games that encourage RolePlaying not RollPlaying are like Dungeon World - where your RP comes from resolving intraPC bonds and such, but I still love 5e to death.

I'm addicted to them. My 5e game is using both Inspiration (advantage or reroll, limit 1 per person at any given time, expires at end of night) and Cyphers* (specific named benefit, no limit, no expiration) and it has upped the fun phenomenally while dropping my work equally phenomenally.

My favorite thing about Cyphers is the way they reduce my book-keeping astronomically. I can just grab an index card, scrawl "GOOJF: The town guard of Nightstone owes you 1 looking of the other way" and hand it to the rogue and be done with it. They'll cash it in when they want to and until they cash it in I don't have to worry about it. Coupled with their twin, Titles (doesn't go away when used, but can be lost by change in circumstance) I can literally hand a large portion of the book-keeping off to the players themselves in a way that makes them feel more engaged, not less.

My other favorite part is because I'm not over-loading so much onto XP I can give tangible rewards for lots and lots and lots of things and still use milestones, and provide ways to spend money on things that aren't equipment/consumable items. Paying to have a bridge rebuilt is a lot more fun when it comes with a card that says "I.O.U., The Mayor"

*Inspired by, but mechanically distinct from, the ones from Monte Cook's Cypher System

I actually kinda do this in an ERP I run.

The system has two types of metacurrency, one which boosts your rolls and one which penalises opponents, but I added a third lewd type. I award it to players for accepting silly sex-comedy style hijinks happening to their characters, and they can be spent for either of the benefits of the other type, with silly sexy side effects for the current scene.

It's pretty funny, and helps naturally incorporate that sort of element into the flow of the game.

I feel like a "meta currency," as a narrative mechanic, should be used for narrative benefits, moreso than mechanical ones.

On the losing end of the spectrum... Inspiration from D&D 5th feels like a half-assed effort to stick to modern trends. It's tacked-on and easily replaced by the Lucky feat.
Savage Worlds (despite my adoration for the rest of the game) is also guilty in this respect. Because success is so common among wild cards, bennies are usually left on the sidelines and saved as a pool of extra health. If Bennies replaced wounds for Wild Cards, the system would probably work smoother.

On the winning end of the spectrum... FATE does high-volume meta currency right. Fate points are a core mechanic that serves multiple purposes, including ensuring that no one player takes the spotlight too long.

My favorite meta currency is the Drama Point from Riddle of Steel - Companion.
The drama point is considerably rarer, being non-refreshing and only available as an RP reward; however, in scope and scale, it is like a little deus ex machina.
Need to keep your head upon receiving a deathblow? Drama point. You're alive, albeit injured.
Stuck in prison awaiting execution? Drama point. A dove just arrived with a set of lockpicks.
Accidentally missed one too many leads on an investigation? Drama point. Flash of insight!

TL:DR
I feel that narrative player resources should be awarded for narrative reasons and offer narrative benefits.