EDH/Commander general

Red is the Best Multiplayer Color Edition

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>Official Site: Contains deck building rules and the current ban list.
mtgcommander.net

>Deck List Site: You can search for decks that other people have made. Authors often have comments that explain their deck’s strategy and card choices.
tappedout.net

>Another resource for commander discussion; they have an entire forum dedicated to discussing decks. People often make primers, which go into detail about how they built and play their deck.
mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh

>Statistically see what everyone else puts in their commander decks based on what is posted to the internet.
edhrec.com/

>Find out what lands you can add to your deck, sorted by category, based on a chosen Commander’s color identity.
manabasecrafter.com/

>CARD SEARCHING

>Official search site. Current for all sets.
gatherer.wizards.com/

>Unofficial, but has GOAT search interface.
magiccards.info

Other urls found in this thread:

tappedout.net/mtg-decks/budget-tricolor-voltron/
combodeck.net/.
tappedout.net/mtg-decks/breya-grave-combos/
tappedout.net/mtg-decks/greek-hug/
tappedout.net/mtg-decks/beast-revels/
tappedout.net/mtg-decks/this-could-be-you-but-you-have-friends/
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

>Red is the Best Multiplayer Color Edition
You got that right. Pic is my deck's multi-purpose all star.

Speaking of Mono-Red, what are the best Mono-Red Mana rocks/fixing?

So my friend bought the old 2013 Naya Precon and doesnt like any of the commanders.
He wanted to try Uril and asked for my help but doesn't want to spend more than $50 to test it out.
Our group is pretty casual with no strong tutors, barely any "good" board wipes and limited control and removal (seriously they all need help because its a bit ridiculous.)

Was wondering how this looked:

tappedout.net/mtg-decks/budget-tricolor-voltron/

>32 lands
Wait. What?

Average CMC of 3.15.

5/6 of its Artifacts are mana rocks

Only one card costs 6 mana and it is Sun Titan

Someone should modify the OP to add combodeck.net/. The search interface is extremely potent and comfy af to use.

Yeah but the mulligans must be a bitch.

I can't read the link, but as a very established Uril player, be wary of the decks power. You cannot get rid of him without exile nontargeting board wipes, and if he builds a cantrips auras deck, it's both very cheap and very strong.

Now, that being said, most of Uril's good cards are very cheap. Rancor is an all-star, unquestioned authority, lifelink and armadillo cloak are all amazing. The most expensive cards worth buying are probably agothoian enchantress and xenagos/iroas. Everything else is under a dollar. Basic land fishing can be done with a large variety of cheap green cards, but like I said, if you build the deck this way, I know your group is going to have a bad time.

>Yeah but the mulligans must be a bitch

I suppose that's probably true.
In play testing I was usually safe with a two land hand.

How many more should I try to squeeze in there and what would be good cuts for them?

The usual Gauntlet of Power (but also Gauntlet of Might if you have lots of dosh), Extraplanar Lens, and Caged Sun. Beyond that, same colorless rocks as everyone else (Sol Ring, Mana Vault/Crypt, etc). As for red-producers, Fire Diamond and Coldsteel Heart are probably the 'best'; the rest cost too much.

I usually start my decks at about 38 lands and adjust from there. 32 sets off alarm bells; even if you have a lot of rocks and a low average CMC, you're gonna lose if you keep having to mull to 4 to see 2 lands.

Sorry, not sure what could be wrong with the link but that is pretty much exactly how I built the deck for him except I put some of the $5+ cards in the Maybeboard.

>Average CMC is 3.15
And that doesn't matter worth a fuck when you're forced to slap those 3.15 mana Auras onto a Heliod's Pilgrim because you don't have 5 mana for Uril.

Thanks for the tip, I usually stick to building dual color decks that average 35 lands and I am not the biggest Green player at that.

I will try and cut for at least 2-3 more lands

Oh I'm on my phone user, I just can't look right now.

My Uril deck reliably kills people turn five nonmagical christmasland, I'll take a look when I can, but if you've already included all that stuff, the only way to slow the deck down is to kill his trample producers. Keep that in mind.

>Reliably kills on turn 5 without magical christmasland
Bullshit.

Gwafa or Hannah for a casual multiplayer Azorius Pillowfort?

Probably Gwafa. Hanna is easier to abuse, and 'Can recur an artifact or enchantment once per turn' is gonna draw a lot more hate than "can bribe your guys to not dome me".

It's true. I can t4 magical Christmas land, but the idea is to hit one price of ramp before turn four, then play Uril and slap on some auras and give it doublestrike and trample t5. That setup is also not including things like alpha authority+iroas, or using rogues passage, and it's not including some of the best ramp cards in the deck. The only problem with it is that after you blow someone out, you eat the full brunt of wrath in the next mutliplayer game.

So, explain to me how "A turn 4 Uril, followed by a turn 5 Battle Mastery and Rancor" is not Magical Christmasland

I've found that Uril needs manadorks.

Or at least something to sacrifice when someone figures they want to drop a Fleshbag Marauder or Merciless Executioner the round you play Uril.

Because that's only one of a variety of ways I can pull it off. The hardest part is getting double strike, so my deck is built entirely around ramping hard and drawing a ton of cards with cantriping auras. Aura tutors are dirt cheap, I run a ton of looting effects, and aura reanimation is hilariously easy to accomplish. Assuming you hit a green mana, the deck basically plays itself. Even if you durdle for a turn, 90% of the time by turn 6 you're going to win. Uril only needs 11 power and a damage doubler to kill someone, which works out to 2 auras and +2/+0 among the effects of your auras. If you played Uril t4, that means you should have 6 mana, and if two or three mana is tied up in auras you just played, that leaves you 3 or 4 mana for any of a variety of double strike enabling cards.

And to double check, I have 10 things that give double strike or will reasonably win the game, and the most expensive is Grafted Exoskeleton which is more niche tech than anything. The majority of my double strike enablers are 1R and I run a ton of cost reducers like thronscape familiar and hero of iroas.

Khalni Garden and the likes should suffice, no? I mean incidental small tokens.

that's like the opposite of ramp though, it's a land that comes into play tapped.

There are exactly two fucking auras in your colors that give double strike.

I'm not doubting you can DO this, but assuming your T1 or T2 is your dork, that gives you a maximum of 2 turns to tutor/loot/draw/discard-the-aura-you-need-and-draw-reanimation, then T4 Uril, and then slap down both the Auras you need on turn 5.

In what fucking universe is that not Magical Christmasland, and IS something you can do consistently?

>10 things that give double strike
Then 8 of them aren't auras, which means you'd need that card, plus something that gives Trample, plus 4 more power from something else.

tappedout.net/mtg-decks/breya-grave-combos/

alright, I keep narrowing the list down. what does it look like now?

someone said mycosynth last thread, but im not really feelin it. what i do, boys?

Besides Crawlspace, Norn's Annex and Portcullis what are some other Pillowfort artifacts?

Ensnaring Bridge

You guys don't understand because you've never played it. A shitload of auras are one mana, I don't particularly care which I hit because I only need two, with additional double strike. I'll show you the difference:

>magical christmasland
T1:forest, sol ring, marble/fire diamond
T2: whatever land I'm missing, it'll
T3: salty tears from rancor battle mastery

>Nonmagical christmasland:
T1: land (hopefully a forest)
T2: land, rampant growth for my third land, maybe a rock or a cost reducer if I don't have rampant growth
T3: assuming I haven't hit any ramp, better ramp, if I have, enchantress/hero of iroas/cost reducer/herald of the pantheon/card draw/removal if needed, depends entirely on what I have, and if I hit ramp already
T4: uril assuming I haven't hit 2 peices of ramp or explosive vegetation/harrow or whatever, into auras
T5: any two cheap auras, one with trample, and something with double strike for the game, or Xenagos, or any variety of damage doublers
T6: this means I hit lifelink instead of double strike/extra damage, just swing again and easily win

Anyone have a good Tariel list or any experience with her? Thinking about building Mardu goodstuff with a mild reanimation subtheme. Seems fun.

Uril t2 magical christmasland, stupid autocorrect

>any two cheap auras, and something with double strike for the game
Okay, so now suddenly instead of you 'consistently' having 2 cards, you need 3 or 4. There's still only two fucking Auras in your colors that give double strike, and one of them costs 5 mana.

Again, I'm not doubting that your deck is capable of curving into a T5 lethal-swinging Uril, but you're fucking deluding yourself if you think that's not Christmasland.

Not even that guy but Sol Ring in your opening hand is hardly Christmasland.

The only thing from your maybe board I would add is Open the Vault & friends, wear/tear & pyrite spellbomb

I'd take out, Fortuitous Find, B/R Daretti, Panharmonicon (It's great but winmore), Voyager Staff. Maybe the gearhulks, I still need more time to see how they are in edh myself. The red one is really underwhelming though.

Maybe replace Sanctum Gargoyle with Junk Diver and add City of Brass.

Also Marionette Master is a must of in Breya if you have her combo, as he replaces Breya in the combo & just works with the rest of the deck

In summary more eggs, less flicker shenanigans.

No, I was talking about his other example, where he has a ramp spell by turn 2, a Hero of Iroas or Herald of the Pantheon on turn 3, and three different Auras, two of which are SPECIFIC SINGLE FUCKING CARDS on turn 5.

Look buddy, you're under the impression that I use auras for double strike. Sure, some auras will do that, but I'm usually using blood mist/temur battle rage/armed and dangerous for the easy kill. The point is that it's both realistic and probable that after at least 12 cards, I'm going to hit at least 2 auras, something with double strike and something to ramp with.

I feel like EDHREC killed my enthusiasm for brewing. I don't even have to look up cards anymore, I just open my general on EDHREC and include the most played cards. People already figured out all the combos and synergies.

It's like an EDH metagame and feels like netdecking.

Don't get me wrong, it's an excellent website, but it may be too excellent.

Blood Mist or Temur Battle Rage mean that you need that, plus enough Auras to give Uril +6/+6, because those cards aren't granting a boost in power. Which means you need MORE cards. Which means you have even less of a chance of 'consistently' winning on turn 5, because maybe you got Battle Rage and Rancor, but the other auras are 5 costs. Or maybe you got Battle Rage and some 1 cost auras for the +2/+2, but you didn't get any trample.

There's too many moving parts, even with your redundancies, for this to be in the same universe as 'consistent'.

It is a tool, combined with Metamox and the like they can be used to make great decs and give good idea but for budget players like my playgroup it lets us pick out all the good ~$5 cards and fill in the gap from cards that are more expensive with ones that aren't incldued in those sites.
That said even before those sites my Jhoira deck looked like two other Jhoira decks I ran into, same can be said for my Elfball and Sharuum. Those were all my more "competitive" decks though.
When people want to build a good deck they will probably have similar idea to what would make it good.

don't build around a commander. build a deck and pick a commander that fits the deck. look at edhrec for commanders you want to build and refuse to use the top cards.

that's kind of how i feel about panharmonicon. but with the amount of flicker shenanigans I have, it kind of works? junk diver is a good suggestion. red gearhulk will also probably come out, 6 mana for what i get feels too much. ill probably switch it with marionette master

this so much
>hyper competitive spikes usually scoop or sit up to their shoulders in salt having to deal with it
>tfw cast a two mana spell into thieves auction
>whole table scoops in response
Feels good to be able to deal with spikes without being a spike myself

tappedout.net/mtg-decks/greek-hug/

Looking for suggestions/help with my first attempt at group hug. It was made mostly from dismantling the other C16 decks and is trying to minimize red to make the manabase not fucking ridiculously expensive.
Thanks!

I understand that you're a little salty, but if you read closely, you'd know that I'm running cantrip auras. None of them are expensive, I'm running explicitly as many cheap auras that also draw cards as possible. The idea is to play two auras, giving Uril +4/+4 just from the auras. That means he only needs +2/+0 from the auras themselves, assuming I'm using a damage doubler and hit someone in the chops. To do that, yes there are many moving parts, but they all accomplish the same goal. No aura is expensive, I'm using things like lifelink, dragon mantel and that one green mana nonrancor trample card to play them as soon as uril comes out, or the turn after. The most expensive card is blasphemous act, and after that, probably armed and dangerous double casted. Yes, our definition of consistent is different, but half the time in a singleton deck is pretty consistent.

Haters gunna hate, I chump very expensive decks on a regular basis with less than 150 invested.

I'm not salty.

I'm just baffled that you think "If i have this collection of twelve different cards, and nobody in any way interacts with me, I can 'consistently' win on turn 5".

I'm not hating. I'm not telling you that your deck is bad. I'm not saying you're a bad player. I wouldn't even bat an eye if you Christmaslanded me on turn 2.

I'm saying that mathematically, you are wrong. You are mentally blocking (or lying about) the games where you get stuck on 4 lands and don't cast Uril until turn 7. The games where you never find one of your Double Strike enablers and have to kill 2 swings at a time. The games where you DO oneshot someone, but it's on turn 6 or 7.

There are simply too many moving parts for you to "consistently" be oneshotting on turn 5 like you claim.

tappedout.net/mtg-decks/beast-revels/

What can I do to improve my Xenagod Beast Tribal deck?

>Haters gunna hate, I chump very expensive decks on a regular basis with less than 150 invested.

Thats the best feeling.

My friend took his Skullbriar deck that was ~$100 to our EDH one night, and our group usually plays at a kitchen table, and ended up taking third because no one had played Voltron in our Combo/Control competetive meta in a long time.

Maybe enchant wise add a dictate of kruphix and maybe a dictate of karametra other than that maybe a otherworld atlas and a walking archive would help along with a magus of the vineyard and maybe a solitary confinement

I though he was talking about insurance against edict effects, not ramp.

Ward of Bones?

I'm pretty sure half the time is both a reasonable estimate, and a generally consistent deck. The thing is, I didn't build the deck to quickly kill people, it just does. Is it hermit druid or crazy t1 mimeoplasm consistent? No way, but for a budget deck using odds and sods it's too powerful to play with most playgroups assuming similar budget. I have much more expensive much less consistent decks that are still very good when compared to an average meta.

It happens all the time and it's the best feeling ever, you're right. I build creature heavy decks that are tuned 1v1 and some combo/control decks just can't handle it. Where I've gotten better lately is dealing with multiple threats at once with better cards, but being able to melt someone before their setup is established scares a lot of people, particularly if you're getting stronger and swinging harder the next turn.

You're assuming people on EDHRec know how to build without making 50% of their deck XY goodstuff

>You're assuming people on EDHRec know how to build without making 50% of their deck XY goodstuff


So much this, every time I look through those sites half the lists are the same for each color combination.

Touché.

It does not list the best cards for a certain commander, just the most obvious ones.

I disagree. Edhrec is helpful for your first time building a commander, but in general, it's not assembled with a good internal logic. It's based on aggregate totals of deck builders posting things online, most of which are both notoriously terrible and notorious attention whores. It's good for a post-modern midrangey goodstuff deck, but once you start getting better, you'll see that it's really limited and generally thematic based on colour and commander with little variation.

man, i am really going to hate hearing "post modern" constantly in mtg soon. in fact, it may be what makes me leave the game altogether.

I don't even get what it's supposed to mean

I don't understand it, did they put a stop line on sets allowed for modern or something?

If so, who cares? We play EDH

Why? It just describes cards that are good, but not good enough to be played in modern. I could give a fuck less about that stupid moon format, it's a good way to describe things like archfiend of depravity, atarka, or new thalia.

well postmodern is already a big complicated topic, but relating to mtg it could either mean anything printed since modern became a format or the format that will eventually replace modern. Either way i will hate it because of any relation to the other definitions of post-modernity. im a lil autistic

Ooh I forgot about walking Archive. That's definitely going in, same with Dictate of Kruphix.
Any other suggestions?

Happy to provide decklists upon request, so that you may relentlessly mock my terrible decks.

Ah a fellow art fag. I use it to describe modernism parodying itself. The idea that people are born into a world that's self referential and only understand Indiana Jones by the tropes applied to more recent movies that they've seen.

In terms of magic, I use it to describe the self referential power level of the current sets, where few things are broken, most things are garbage, and after standard rotates, like 3 cards a set are playable because the rest just aren't good. It's a fine design philosophy for limited, but it has very little impact on eternal formats.

I generally suggest building commanders that are a little off the beaten path, plus every deck takes some personal tuning.

For example, I've been playing Ixidor for years now and I've never seen anyone with a Ixidor build like mine. Some of the all-stars in the deck aren't even listed on EDHRec.

Also when you go for the most popular commanders, they're generally just goodstuff or have super linear strategies. I'm not saying pick a bad commander, but pick one that requires some personal flair. Choose your favorite legendary creature and brew it, regardless of how bad it is. I've done that with three of my decks (Ixidor, Lin Sivvi, and Phage) and through years of playing and tuning, they're all pretty competitive.

The problem with actual Eternal formats (Legacy and Vintage) is they have such an insane power level already that it's hard to make things "for" them without drastically fucking up Standard and Modern. You do have things that are 'good' in Standard and way stronger in older formats (Ponder, Preordain, Delver, etc), but generally speaking you're not gonna see them developing too many JTMS level cards because those really fuck Standard up, and that's their primary design focus.

Plus, a lot of the 'trash' in current sets is absolutely perfect for Commander.

But if they're on tappedout, can't we just google them?

What's your secret tech for Trostani?

did you enjoy your exemplar foils? :^)

THE RESULTS ARE IN

Prolly, but I'm fine providing links so you don't have to google my asinine stand names.

Trostani's tech isn't really secret; the most "oh shit" tech I have is using them to populate 'temporary' tokens from Blade of Selves and Mimic Vat. There's also the rock-obvious shit like the lifegain laser and Phyrexian Processor.

And yes, I did! I actually need to build more blue decks to put those Drains to good use.

A good example is Atraxa's EDH page. Not a lot of odd-ball counter-based stuff, like level-up, etc. Just fathom mage and forgotten ancient and whatnot. And every non-red planeswalker ever made... which misses a lot of options for her.

Cards also diminish in power level as more players are added. Like JTMS is a perfect example. In a 1v1 format he can really lock down the board, mixing insane card filtering with some protection to make him hard to beat. In multiplayer, there's 3 other people to kill him, and most times he ends up being a 4 mana sorcery speed Brainstorm that soaks up a few points of damage. I've never seen someone take over a game of EDH with a JTMS compared to large scale Planeswalkers like Elspeth, Sun's Champion, Ugin, even Chandra, Flamecaller.

Also, a big complaint I have against WotC's Commander design is they're not willing to print specifically broken cards that only work in Commander, because with 3 people even "broken" cards have answers. Like my proposal for undaunted was "4U: Draw three card." In multiplayer it's a 2-mana Ancestral Recall, in 1v1 it's just a slight upgrade on Concentrate, which isn't quite good. Instead Undaunted cards are minor upgrades of okay commander cards like Day of Judgment or Restock.

>go for a quick visit at my flgs to get some sleeves
>EDH table is three Atraxas and a Breya
Jeez, these new generals are where creativity and pride in brewing go to die.

I think the problem is that because Commander is MOSTLY played as a multiplayer game, something like your 4U Undaunted would be a snap auto-include in every blue deck.

I get wanting them to go ham with "We can make this weak everywhere but Commander, but REALLY GOOD there", but they have to tread that line or they end up releasing something too strong into the environment that has to end up banned.

it was a shit poll desu
>black borders all one category
>not post-8th edition borders vs. current borders vs. the black bordered cards that still have the brown frames
>including silver- and gold-bordered for god knows why

Atraxa is, in all honesty, incredibly boring. Like there's 3 builds for her: +1/+1 counters, stax, or superfriends. +1/+1 counters is fragile, stax is annoying, and superfriends is boring. It's a shame because I really liked her when she was spoiled but I haven't been able to brew anything interesting with her.

I'm also annoyed that there's been no real support for the partners, I've been playing Vial Smasher x Thrasios and damn that deck is fun. It's not broken like Kydele and it's a fun control deck that turns Shriekmaw into a Doom Blade + Lava Axe.

To be fair, this happens every year. There's a big surge of people playing the precons (or modified precons, or entirely new decks with the new hotness) for a couple months, and then it calms down.

>Surprisingly, people enjoy the flavor of the month.

>mfw my friend got beat when his Atraxa was straight out of the box and is now building it full on infect.

I.
Hate.
Infect.

It should definitely be higher than 10 counters to kill someone. Haven't faced it yet but it sounds terrifying.

Infect is awful. There's like, two decent Infect creatures in the whole game.

How do you guys get away from your regular playstyle. I'm a predominately green player that loves value. I love Birthing Pod effects and grindy matchups. Every deck I've every played runs pod. Its fun. But I don't wanna do it anymore. How to get into the mindset of a color identity that you don't normally play? What kind of playstyle do you think is opposite to what I'm currently playing?

Thanks!

It isn't the most competitive meta so all he needs to do is get a couple Poison Counters on us in a multiplayer game and start proliferating.

I don't disagree, and my son is brewing an infect deck, per , and isn't wrong. I think sometimes he struggles to pilot well (he builds just fine), but he's going with one of the more linear options with Atraxa. If I were building her, I'd be aiming for the aforementioned level up creatures, just start putting them out and letting them develop into larger threats on their own. A lighthouse chronologist starts to look fairly threatening if left alone to gain counters, for example.

But the point is ultimately that EDHREC really points out the obvious auto-includes. It does not include the depth or breadth of strategies available for a given commander whatsoever.

I just don't force myself into anything I don't feel like.

I mostly play RWx decks in EDH and can't stand Green or Black. So I don't play them.

So don't let him proliferate eight fucking times, genius.

>Can't stand green or black
You poor bastard

I forced myself to make an elf deck with no instants and only 2 sorceries.
My other Five decks are Blue, U/G, U/B, U/W, and U/R.
I am working on a R/W now mas a group sluggy deck.
My friends may not always like it but I am the only control player at our table and someone has to do it.

atraxa hugely enables the infect archetype. Before infect decks were basically relegated to newzuri and skittles (though skittles was more of a voltron deck). Having a constant proliferate on your commander with your colours including all the best infect creatures. Each of the small, shitty infect cards boost in power, and you can include them in a high enough number your will reliably poison at least one or two players, before you start proliferating those counters.

It's strong, but like i said, limited in who you can run as your commander for it. 10 is a fine number right now, though if they ever printed more efficient infect creatures then the number mght need to be raised.

>Using Atraxa for a level deck.
That sounds fun as hell.

There are two different problems here. As a green player, I know exactly how you feel. I've branched out into all sorts of nongreen decks, and the way to do that's to just build in colours you aren't familiar with. Now, changing the mindset is a little harder. Basically every deck I run is a ramp deck to some extent, and I always run giant splashy creatures. But, that being said, memnarch is a monoblue artifact ramp deck, while volrath is a reanimator and ramp deck, both of which utilize totally different card pools than most green decks. Just be you and use different things, try building a black deck or a red and blue deck. The card pool alone will force you to build something different.

Voltron is also very good route to take. Sure, you ignore the proliferate portion of her but she's pretty goddamm annoying as a voltron general.

This is the Atraxa my friend is building :

tappedout.net/mtg-decks/this-could-be-you-but-you-have-friends/

It will be pretty spooky in our playgroup just because not everyone builds well for the early game and he can just keep dropping solid low drop creatures and a bunch of infect things.

What can I say. I'm the most unique snowflake at the table. I do like Selesnya a little bit.

Until the first Wrath hits the table. Or the fifth.

I would start getting worried if they were all playing the gay kangs.

>Voltron is also very good route to take
>Tutor your Grafted Exoskeleton
>6/6 Flying Infect
>lol 7 Poison Counters

God forbid she has double strike.

>grafted exoskeleton makes saskia 1 hit people
feelsgoodmang.png

Maybe I just don't understand how to fully play other colors but ill look at something like mizzix or like teysa and I just don't get excited. I just don't know who to run :/

>God forbid she has double strike.

You don't even need double strike, those colors have plenty of extra turn and combat phase options.

I didn't either. My first three decks had ~20-25 creatures so when I switched to Elves (~40+ creatures) I was learning an entire new aspect of the game which was cool to me.

It also helped me play my control decks better as I better udnerstood how people protected their creature spells.

Build Memnarch. He's a fuckhuge monster that exists only to suck up mana. Throw in big monsters, all sorts of cheap card draw, and as many good rocks as you can fit. Brago is also a fun choice along these lines, just fill it with etb effects and have a good time.

Alternatively, I'd suggest branching out with a tricolour. Maelstrom us both fun and super easy to build in a green style, and I'm sure you could make a fun Mimeoplasm reanimator deck. Since you have experience building green, you know how good basic land ramp can be, and it will save you a ton on lands.

Thanks for the advice boys!

Any of you guys have a Saskia list or two to get some ideas from?

I was thinking running a small amount of infect enchants and equips. Don't have a huge amount of ideas besides that