What went oh so very wrong?

So you're denying that 3.5 has major flaws in its mechanics?

Every system has flaws.

Well D&D itself has flaws but 3.5 isn't any more flawed than any other edition.

Sure, why not? We could all use a good yelling sperg session.

That pic perfectly describes my experience on Veeky Forums.

Was about the time that rollplay became far more common than roleplay.
And this shit went downhill quickly.

We got some fair answers in the 4 thread, so we may as well do similarly here too.

>Widening numerical gaps that designers assumed players would patch rather than exacerbate with magic items
>Needlessly complicated skills
>In chargen players make a bunch of decisions that will affect them forever, and since it's an intro game this is often done before playing this or any RPG
>Spellcasters can easily bypass most restrictions placed on them (not just resources via the 5 minute adventuring day; but also AoOs and interruption via feats, skills, fairly easy disengagement from melee)
>Martial characters got pointless nerfs vs. prior editions and under new systems such as skills
>Combat pacing in general was all over the place with hp sponginess and hp bypassing spells
>Poor-ish guidance for DMs, so while there were mechanical bits and bobs for dungeon crawling and so on it was a real luck dependent crapshoot if the guy behind the screen knew how to actually run a game
>Poor adventures and modules contributed to the same problem
>CR as a concept was a mistake, and in practice the listed CR had little to do with how challenging an actual monster was
>steep numerical progression could make monsters worthless outside a pretty narrow band of levels
>While supplements trended toward stronger material than core, character option bloat still fatigues the experienced players and intimidates new ones
>The OGL was a mixed bag that allowed 3pp to play to D&D's base but also stifled innovation, accelerated bloat fatigue, and built viable competitors for WotC in its own niche later

To be fair it's what I cut my teeth on. It had enough going for it that I still had a blast learning to play with it. It seemed like it was going for BRPish elegance but ended up a Palladium-esque mess. And neither of those things is really the worst you could get out of a fantasy game.

Mage is a billion times superior to deendeeshit, please check yourself faggot.

Yes, but there is an upside. This thread could go anywhere. By the end of it we could be discussed who would win in a fight between a Magic-Raptor-Bear and a laser-Monkey-Dragon. We could have a new 3.5 martial class.

Hell, somebody already mentioned Virt. We could discuss that one time he thought he got cucked by one of his players, then raged out of the game store he was in at the time.

Very true, but some flaws are worse than others and can cripple an otherwise fine system.
It is though. No edition before 3.5 was as flawed, and the next two editions have been trying to fix the problems it introduced.

That's why I love Veeky Forums.

Well that's like... YOUR opinion user.

3.5 is the second most popular edition of D&D after 5e.

If you combine it with PF then it's the most popular one.

It's doing something right.

>inb4 appeal to the majority

What it does right is be the favorite system of shitbag GMs, who then force it on everyone else.

It's a heap of garbage.

You sound pretty butthurt about it. You're probably a martialcuck too.

Has it ever occured to you that some people just prefer it to other editions?

>The Female Gamer
>Martial Vs. Caster
I missed those. Were they recent?

> that one time he thought he got cucked by one of his players, then raged out of the game store he was in at the time.
I thought that was fake, still funny.
So now Virt has become a meme?
I remember he still posted.

Laser-Monkey-Dragon hybrid for the win. Dragon is resistant to magic.

Though how are we defining Laser and Magic? Can the Monkey-Dragon shoot lasers, or is he made of lasers?

Also, which Monkey, and what kind of Dragon? I like the idea of an Eastern style Dragon, but Western would be tougher.

Bear has to be a Grizzly, and It's gotta be a Utahraptor if it wants a chance against any type of dragon.

Popularity has never been an indicator of quality. Your enjoyment of a thing does not make it good. By all means, you are allowed to enjoy whatever you want, but you have to accept that there may very well be things wrong with the thing you like.
>I like 3.5 despite it's many flaws.
Acceptable.
>3.5 doesn't have any flaws because it's fun and popular.
Wrong and stupid.

Your favourite game/edition has flaws as well.

"Flaws" are also subjective. What you see as flaws in 3.5 might be the reason why I like it.

>martial kekeke
No, I just hate everything about this shit pile game, from its absolute lack of engaging noncombat mechanics, to the utterly obsolete and inherently idiotic alignment, to the mind numbingly bad system of character progression, to the extremely tonally inappropriate Vancian magic system. Deendee is fucking awful.
>some people have bad taste
You're one, faggot.

If don't like D&D why are you even in this thread?

Go play Dungeon World or whatever other hipster garbage you play.

Look! We've already made someone angry about subjective opinions, this waste of a thread is shaping up as predicted.

Not every game is a "generic" fantasy disaster fuckass. That you think recognizing deendee for the steaming pile it is means being a fucking hipster indicates to me that you're just a desparate NARPfag loser.

Oh, so we've moved on from just 3.5 to all of D&D, have we? Tell me, how was AD&D so bad?

I feel like I see this thread every time I go on Veeky Forums.

That's because it's the same guy who started shilling it ever since the return of the 3.5 General. Might be Virt, can't be certain.

So, you enjoy massive imbalance between the classes, straight up trap options, and things that just straight up don't work mechanics-wise?

I mean, you're allowed to, of course. But I am going to be judging you for it.

The katana stats were sub par. I've got some suggestions on how to fix this...

>Inb4 that's just your subjective opinion mixed with argumentum ad populum.

It's not that I enjoy those things, it's that I don't see them as problems that detract from my enjoyment of the system.

Every system has its flaws and imbalances.

Alright, that's perfectly fine. But I do have to ask why you wouldn't move to a system that has everything that you like about 3.5, but doesn't have as many problems?

>Big Bang Theory
Started out decent, went to shit very quickly.
>Critical Role
Wasn't worth my time at any point.

I've got a question for this thread. What's your preferred percen of Dragon to Human ratio? I could go 100% Dragon, but I'm more of a 30% Dragon type of guy.

Might as well post it here, since there's nothing else of substance on this thread.

I don't play 3.5 exclusively. It just happens to be one of the more popular systems out there with a lot of source material written for it.

I like 5e quite a bit actually.

Virt was always a meme. A shitty, shitty meme.

I've always been partial to "100 percent Dragon, but can become a humanoid also"

Gotta be a muzzle or collection of nonhuman facial-features at the very least. Otherwise it just feels like 'human wearing fancy costume'.

Not hating on that sort of thing though, different strokes for different blokes.

Posted that because it's the default. Preffered 30% is fully scaled human with crests and horns jutting out of the chin, and lacking a nose. Soft, flexible scales though, like on a Snek.

I like your style, user.

Virt is a lot more...subtle, if you could call it that.

His shitposting is easily spotted since it's usually a just too long vomit of words describing him acting like a completely reasonable chap then dropping some shitstorm bomb that he knows will stir up /tg (-4 strength, my opponent is cheating and I'm too much of a pussy to call him out, then they started magical realming, etc.). This is doubly enforced by the fact that he quickly loses his temper and doubles down on autistism when you address the very obvious fallacies in his arguements

Game was designed by autists who let simulationism go too far at the expense of game balance, then when they decided to fix it couldn't muster the guts to slaughter all the sacred cows they had spent previous years fostering.

Martials weren't actually needed till ToB, you could replace a martial with a half caster or a full caster and the group not only wouldn't suffer it would greatly improve. That seem slike a flaw.

Those are his good, "original" arguments, back when he was being creative, if you could call it that. Recently he's taken to shilling the same old arguments over and over again because he's out of ideas. Most of that includes Shilling Dungeon World on /5eg/, the attempt at Female Gamer posts earlier, and the 3.5(and Martial/Caster) hate as of now. He's run out of ideas, and is just using the same basic shills over and over again, mainly because he can't be bothered to learn a new system enough to rag on it.

I mean, even if it isn't him, this is just lazy workmanship. Sure, Shitpost, but Shitposters well, you know? Take some pride in your work.

Imagine being so paranoid that you yearn for Virt to return

It took Pokemon damn near 20 years to take the sacred cow known as "HMs" to the slaughterhouse.

Nobody complains. Sacred cows are purely in the mind of the developer and people who don't really count.

Oh, he's still around. You can check his Tumblr for screencaps of his latest trollposts.

this

His dedication is admirable, in a retarded kind of way.

At first I didn't believe, but then I red a couple page of http:// virtualoptim .tumblr.com/ .
I am quite happy that we can play 'catch the Virt' again.
Just don't make it a witch hunt, boys.

it's hard to witch hunt when everyone is anonymous

now that he can't use his trip we just call people Virt instead of faggot/cuck/retard/SJW

I fear it'd only excite him, like a rabid retarded ferret. Better trying to spot him & report.
Do anyone know if there is any possiblity of a rangeban?

There's caps of his bans on his tumblr, you could use that to give the range to the mods.

But I have a plan for something more... delicious. Virt has a Tumblr right? What would happen if we found ourselves a literal Tumblr SJW who loved Critical Role, fought for the rights of men in dresses to use the girls bathroom, etc... and showed her a couple of Virt's Sadism posts, then directed them towards his Tumblr.

Only if you're a total moron and look at being flawed as a binary state. 3.5 has more content that does not work as intended than every other edition combined.

>Nobody complains. Sacred cows are purely in the mind of the developer and people who don't really count.
False.
Such a large number of fans lost their shit over how different 4e was that it spawned Pathfinder and drove it to being one of the best selling RPGs of all time.

There was just as much outcry over 3e from AD&D fans but it remained largely unheard because of the infancy of the internet and the community being MUCH smaller. WotC's marketing grew the community and playerbase exponentially by making the game more accessible, so 3e was many D&D players first game.

>I hate mice getting in my basement
>what if I get a bunch of snakes (which I also hate) and fill my basement with them, that will deal with all the mice

someday you'll realize you'd be a happier person if you just ignored things you didn't like instead of endlessly antagonizing them

That's something that could backfire

You cannot ignore cancer.

>I missed those. Were they recent?
This right here is a sure sign of a shitposter feigning ignorance.

Every time someone mentions this shit happening constantly in other threads is always this shit.

>This right here is a sure sign of a shitposter feigning ignorance.
I am .
Stop projecting, calm down. I do not live on Veeky Forums.

Both the projecting claim and "I dont live on Veeky Forums" defense in one post.

Like every time this shit is called out.

Ok, you're Virt, I take it.
Now I can happily say >>>virtualoptim.tumblr.com

I don't really play DXD but from what I've heard the 3.5edition made magic dudes overpowered as fuck and the grognards like it that way and will defend it to death, right?

Only a very small part of Veeky Forums complains about it.

You really need to stop taking the butthurt trolls seriously already.

Sort of. Most of them just deny caster supremacy and cause rage amongst players of other systems when they claim it as the One True RPG System. Other than that it is usually accepted as flawed but fun. No other edition had so many build options, even AFTER you cut out the ones that suck ass. Hell, even the ones that suck are fun to play.

Seriously guys?