previous thread A thread for discussing the Star Trek franchise and its various tabletop iterations.
Possible topics include Star Trek Adventures - the new rpg being produced by Modiphius - and WizKids’ Star Trek: Attack Wing miniatures game, as well as the previous rpgs produced by FASA, Last Unicorn Games and Decipher, the Starfleet Battles Universe, and Star Trek in general.
>Eat Genesis, you piss jelly pudding motherfuckers!
Parker Diaz
>Jeffrey Coombs as a freshly engineered Weyoun >the near immediate devastation of Bajor >A likely Cardassian civil war
This needs to happen immediately
Eli Nguyen
>a second Dominion War
When, how, and what'd make it interesting/different the first other than the shit being used?
Aaron Robinson
Well, the Dominion isn't one to give up, nor is it one to admit defeat. Following the Alpha quadrant surrender, the founders retreated into their secured territory, built new ships and waited for the opportunity to present itself. And when you're a functional immortal shapeshifter, waiting is a fairly easy thing to do. They've spied on the Alpha quadrant races for decades. Gauging when the right moment would come.
Now, finally, the time has come. The Federation is a mighty fortress of technological brilliance and diplomatic compromise. But this seemingly impenetrable fortress is built on pillars of sand. Each and every one of Earth's strategic allies has a deep undercurrent of anti-federation malcontents. Cardassia is on the verge of civil war between the pro federation forces of the Union and the nationalist forces of the True Way. The Klingon Empire was at war with Starfleet not so long ago and their treaty is shaky, at best. The Romulan Republic is a military coup away from returning to the old ways of the Empire.
That isn't even to mention the opportunistic states waiting for the opportunity to regain territory from the Federation. The Breen, the Vaudwaar, the Voth.
What if, one by one, Earth's allies were feebled by internal strife? Starfleet would, of course, come to the rescue, offering Military and Medical aid to "their side". And then, as if by happenstance, a Dominion envoy discovers a "malicious plot" by Starfleet to destabalise it's allies and eventually subsume them within the Federation. Well, that might just burn every bridge and olive branch that Earth has. That might just turn the Mighty, impenetrable federation into a surmountable foe.
What was it Weyoun said? "The Dominion has endured for ten thousand years and will endure long after the Federation has turned to dust." I believe.
Jeremiah Bennett
This time we take the war to them.
Isaiah Reyes
You know what I never got about the Dominion war?
They just decided to have a straight up slugging match with a superior force when the 'fleet's strength is it's engineering corps. Why didn't someone look at those mines O'Brien made and then do that with cheap drones?
Just make thousands of them with as little equipment as possible and give them the ability to scavenge their dead for materials to make more.
I mean it was the perfect setup to show that the ideals of the federation, of science and exploration could even stop wars with other nations. But no, we have to have our open warfare.
Jaxon Diaz
>But no, we have to have our open warfare.
Because it's a setting where the stories are about people, not Total Annihilation or Supreme Commander.
>implying Grand Admiral (you) wouldn't just come to singlehandedly save the day >again
Jacob Wood
>The 2800 >Endless parade of Dominion ships comes out of the wormhole >My ship's been hilariously minmaxed for speedrunning STF's >Oneshotting every Dominion ship that gets within firing range
Adam Butler
Has that ever stopped Cryptic before? The various admiral (you)s of the Federation, empire and Republic could reasonably have taken out the Borg, vaudwaar and iconians.
But for narrative purposes that's not the case.
Caleb Sanders
Rework the Cardassian missions again so that the True Way and New Link are expanded on and bring in the 2800 into their fold via Laas, resulting in a Dominion Civil War.
Evan Clark
I'm not asking about STO.
Those hacks and Cryptic couldn't do an interesting second Dominion war even if they literally ripped off every major moment and personality from an actual interesting historical war and simply changed the names.
I'd sooner trust the SFB creator grognards to pull a better story out of their collective backsides.
Cameron James
Star Trek was stories about morality, not about people.
Admittedly that changed with DS9, but that was a divergence from the core theme.
Nathan Hill
To add to that: Even if a good story were to somehow make it into STO, it'd still be shit because the gameplay is garbage and you'd need to make it through that to even get through the story.
Owen Stewart
it's like RPG-X but modern
Lucas Peterson
Building a minefield to surround the wormhole took time. And we're talking about a very small spherical space, perhaps a few kilometres im diameter. Doing that across an interstellar border is a whole different magnitude. Hundreds of lightyears of space. Even with dozens of ships working around the clock that's going to take a very long time.
That doesn't even take into account the political fallout of mining an entire border. Rather than preventing war it may expidite it.
And then there's the issue of space being 3 dimensional. Does your minefield only cross the direct borders of the 2 states. If that's the case then the other side can simply go around. The only other option then is to entirely encapsulate one state or the other in the minefield and that's just ludicrous amounts of time and materials, as well as being essentially a declaration of war.
Minefields work across small, manageable distances. Their practicality pretty much maxes out when you reach the scale of a planetary orbit.
Leo Morgan
I said Drones nigga, not mines. Same tech, different application
Easton Rivera
So, what, a bunch of warp capable, self replicating warheads? Like the Cardassian dreadnought torpedo? I doubt a warp core is anywhere as easy to replicate as an explosive warhead.
Carson Gomez
No, have a command ship that deploys and controls them.
Andrew James
I'm confused as to what express benefit these weapons have over regular torpedoes fired from a patrol ship or fighter craft launched from pic related.
Jaxon Green
>that one episode where the Klingons mine the entire Bajoran system
Brandon Gray
Sic drone 0 on an asteroid belt rich in dilithium and wait.
John Cruz
Pic related isn't alpha canon and fighters have squishy organic components that the federation has a limited amount of as opposed to the vat grown Gem'Hurdurr.
You design a drone that can go quick at sublight and can have a phaser mounted on it it, mass produce the shit out of it along with a ship that can deploy them and you've already won.
Isaiah Bennett
Unless your enemy has decent jamming technology.
The only alternative then is to give your drones the ability to self control. Which we've seen has a tendency to go wrong on several occasions.
Robert Price
>the Klingons attempted and failed to mine an entire solar system.
Mason Morales
Tight beam data transmission back up, the only way you can jam it is if you get in between the units, and you do have some autonomous functions
Leo Stewart
You're acting like the Federation's implicit strategy wasn't "Miranda spam while we throw entire planets worth of resources at Starfleet Engineering to improve our shit" and then recreating the American WWII military industrial complex, IN SPAAAAACE. >The early battles of the war, save for the Defiant, were mostly ancient phaser-sponge classes that couldn't be upgraded anymore. >While they were trading territory, ships, and lives for time, Starfleet churned out a bunch of new classes in mass production (Defiant, Akira, Steamrunner, Intrepid, fighters) and massively upgraded the older Excelsior, Ambassador, Galaxy, Nebula, and Danube classes. >The Dominion's closest equivalent to this process was Zerg rushing with their base units, VERY limited creation and production of the xbox hueg Jem'Hadar battleships, and a whole bunch of autistic screeching/splashing to bring the Breen into the war. >That says a lot about the Founder mindset - conquest is preferable to R&D spending, and Dominion ship design was just "make it bigger XDDDD" with no regard for qualitative improvements >Because the Breen had a hax weapon that literally none of the Federation or its allies could counter >except the Federation came up with a counter in like six months and distributed it to the Klingons (and eventually the Cardassians)
Brody Richardson
*eventually the Romulans
Liam Wood
fucking kek'd
Lincoln Morgan
That severely limits their range. Why not put all that power usage and material usage into building a fuckhueg weapons array?
Michael Nguyen
>stories about morality
It's okay to watch and do nothing as millions die because they don't have as many shiny toys as you have. Technology is the only measure of a civilization that matters.
The attitude that identical twins only count as 3/5 of a real person is a perfectly reasonable belief to hold. It's also perfectly fine to murder them.
A medical treatment that could save the lives of billions and improve the lives of many, many trillions is out of bounds because 200 luddite hippies built a commune.
It's fine to fill a ship full of civilians and children and then send it out into unknown or hostile space and intentionally prod hazardous anomalies with it.
It's also okay to ensure the safety of about a thousand people to the piloting skill of a 12 year old because you feel sorry for accidently killing his dad and want to fuck his mum.
There is no inherently obvious hypocrisy in letting someone train at the academy, attain officer rank and then forcibly strap them down to an operating slab to figure out how they tick because when convenient they no longer count as people.
It's also okay to abduct a mans daughter for science.
Gavin Flores
>TFW everyone assumed the Feds were the good guys. THEY ARE NOT!
Charles Nelson
But feds ARE the good guys!
Josiah Thomas
Was the head Starfleet strategist Russian?
>Sacrifice the trash and give up territory until the heavy shit is ready and get allies to come and divert some attention
Nathan Russell
Well there's a good chance it was Admiral Nichayev, so yeah I guess.
Ayden Collins
Relative to their neighbours, they're "good guys" but the Federation isn't an inherently good institution. It is an economically beneficial megastate that offers the average layperson comfort, security and decent personal freedoms.
Ultimately, any large bureaucracy will act in alignment with its own interests and towards its own self-preservation. But as a democracy, its self-interests may vary wildly depending on public opinion.
If the average Federation Citizen fears muh 200 year old boogeyman then you best bet that Human augmentation is gonna stay off the menu. And if helping a developing civilisation in the past has seriously bit you in the ass(TNG S4E15, "First Contact") then you're unlikely to agree to do so again, even if it is the morally correct thing to do.
Aiden White
I only recognise about half of these - explain pls?
Nicholas Rivera
Pretty much entirely Season 1&2 TNG plots + Insurrection, with some twisting and removal of context to make it look worse.
Grayson Nelson
First is any "interference against a less developed race" episode, in particular Pen Pals and Homeward.
Second is Up The Long Ladder.
Third is Insurrection.
Fourth is TNG in general.
Fifth is Wesley Crusher n general.
Sixth is The Measure Of A Man.
Last is The Offspring.
Carter Barnes
Huh, I thought second was Tuvix. My bad.
Lincoln Smith
Starfleet really had a hardon for getting a slave race of non-people. First they came for Data, then when they heard Data built a daughter, an Admiral immediately materialized on the bridge with repo orders. Finally they settled for using the old EMH's.
Apparently in a "do what I feel like" economy that pays in "feel good" and "personal growth", getting people to do the shit jobs is really hard.
Nicholas Davis
The Federation's biggest blind spot is that seeking out new life and new civilizations is always a process from without: venturing into unexplored space and seeing what's out there. Any human creation, like Data or the EMHs or those Exocomps, is assumed to merely be a tool instead of sentient life unto itself.
I liked that Q turned that around in All Good Things though.
Brandon Phillips
In addition to a severely limited range, it also might be vulnerable to Very High Frequency transmissions.
I CAN'T STAND IT I KNOW YOUR PLANNED IT BUT I'M GONNA SET IT STRAIGHT, THIS WATERGATE I CAN'T STAND ROCKING WHEN I'M IN HERE BECAUSE YOUR CRYSTAL BALL AIN'T SO CRYSTAL CLEAR SO WHILE YOU SIT BACK AND WONDER WHY I GOT THIS FUCKING THORN IN MY SIDE OH MY GOD, IT'S A MIRAGE I'M TELLIN' Y'ALL IT'S A SABOTAGE
Leo Cruz
Today i learned that i could transfer lobi crystals are account binded and so i could transfer them from character to character. My WoK character is yet another step closer to being complete.
Jordan Carter
>Ambassador in the background NICE >that four nacelled monstrosity Wut
>I liked that Q turned that around in All Good Things though. >How? I don't think the humans really learned anything from Q except maybe be slightly less tight asses but I really call that a win.
Austin Martin
That or Starfleet made Zapp Brannigan an admiral.
Which seems unlikely as Brannigan has proven himself to be far more competent than most Starfleet admirals.
Jeremiah Mitchell
*but l really wouldn't call it a win.
Hunter Green
>How? When Q basically said that true exploration was improvement of humanity internally rather than simply exploring physical space.
>"That is the exploration that awaits you; not mapping stars and studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of existence."
Jaxon Torres
Space Suit Dave?
Luke Evans
Shouldnt he be innatubes?
David Brown
He has been to known leave the Kingdom Innatubes. It usually means nothing good.
Something to do with the Godzilla Threshold being crossed.
William Jackson
GET OUTTA MAH TUBES!
Logan Cooper
THE KINGDOM MUST GROW!
Jordan Walker
OUR CONQUEST WAS SUCCESSFUL! THE KINGDOM IS NOW AN EMPIRE!
Ethan Butler
>Just make thousands of them with as little equipment as possible and give them the ability to scavenge their dead for materials to make more.
Do you want Borg? Because this is how you get Borg.
Lucas Long
>Space Suit Dave has moved to ESD for the extra tubes.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPE!
Ryan Thomas
>Which seems unlikely as Brannigan has proven himself to be far more competent than most Starfleet admirals. It's funny because it's true.
Jason Taylor
that was actually a really good movie and this is coming from some one who hated with a violent passion the previous two.
Jeremiah Perez
That's because there is only one actual Starfleet admiral left and that is Admiral Janeway. The other """admirals""" are
Founders
Undine/8472
Genetic throwback ridgeless Klingons
Romulans pretending to be Vulcans
Borg with only a few brain implants
And a single Section 31 operative who genuinely rose through the ranks on merit.
The S 31 Operative is the only one that knows about the others. The rest of them all think that they are surrounded by other humans and vulcans and andorians and shit. All the oddities are ignored because nobody wants anybody to have attention drawn. S 31 dude isn't going to do anything about this because, with the exception of Janeway, shit hasn't worked this smoothly and efficiently in 70 years.
Parker Flores
....well I guess it wasn't a J.J. brand production, so I might take your word for it and finally give it a watch sometime.
Into Darkness really chapped my ass though
Brandon Gonzalez
Yeah, no, Beyond is SOOOO different from, and better than, Into Darkness. It's still not REALLY Trek, but it's actually moving in the right direction.
Thomas Baker
It felt very much like TOS to me. The good bits of TOS, I mean.
Kevin Mitchell
Fucking kek'd, when Janeway is the most legit officer that high up - apart from Fleet Admiral (You) - and things are going fantastically well, there's a problem.
Leo Cruz
UFP is basically being used as a tech-farm.
Starfleet engineers are notorious across the galaxy for being equal parts maverick and genius. If it's possible they will build it. If it's impossible it may take them all evening to build it. They can wire anything to anything, even things without wires.
Every other empire in the galaxy wanted a slice of that.
So now they have covertly infiltrated the highest echelons of the government completely sure that they are the only ones to have ever done so in total ignorance that everyone else has done the same and they have never met a real admiral bar Lord Big Dick (You) and Janeway. Neither are representative of typical.
Section 31 dude can only look on the bright side. EVERY major interstellar power has a vested interest in the continued survival of the UFP.
Jaxon Allen
hc that everyone's convinced that Admirals (You) and Janeway are actually the infiltrators
Mason Ramirez
What is that costume please i have to know.
Carter Harris
Lockbox Star Trek VI space suit.
Luis James
..... what lockbox is it from? and is it resellable?
Ryder Anderson
>implying Grand Admiral (you) is legit I don't think ranking up to 5* by virtue of killing the most dudes with your bare hands/laser batleth/scavenged disruptor machine blaster/time-criminal tetryon dildo since Kahless is exactly legit, even by Klingon standards. It's lobi store I think.
Nolan Rivera
Admiral (you) is pretty much a force of nature. Whoever controls them controls the quadrant.
Joseph Bell
>new Trekyards episode >the costumes don't look like Klingons >the makeup doesn't look like Klingons >the ships don't look like Klingon ships >but they're totally Klingons because one random person on the production team supposedly said they are even though other members of the production team also said they aren't I had high hopes for these videos after how their one discussing the new ship from the Discovery promo was pretty decent, but I guess I'll just quit while I'm ahead.
Jonathan Rodriguez
You'd think that after 2 or three instances of the same thing happening they'd learn to just program dumber machines. And maybe put a few cpu limits on the holodeck. God knows how many ships have lost crew members to rampant Moriarity/Kublai Khan/ Yandere Bajoran Waifu simulations across the years.
Brandon Long
>You'd think that after 2 or three instances of the same thing happening they'd learn to just program dumber machines Every hack Trek writer wanted their own BUT THE MACHINES ARE ALIVE episode which is why this happened. In universe there's no goddamned reason for it.
Charles Jackson
Unfortunately that pretty much the case. It worked pretty well for Data. It was more of a show-long arc for the Doctor. But then we had random one-shot holograms, exocomps, weapons guidance systems and a whole fucking starship pull the same shit. That isn't even to mention the sheer number of self-aware AI suicides that Kirk was responsible for.
As an overused plot point it's up there with "Starfleet crew/officer you came to the rescue of is actually evil."
Cameron Moore
Star Trek 2009 was okay
Gavin Ross
what do people here think of the podcast running with Hoffman? ENGAGE
Matthew Thompson
No it wasn't.
Matthew Hall
Just finished watching it.
I can say that it's a hell of a lot easier to stop focusing on inconsistencies and plot holes and just watch the movie when the character interactions are well directed. It gave the cast a bit of time to breathe in between the big dopey action pieces, and character moments are where delicious Star Trek flavor gets harvested.
I just wish they'd stop inventing new ways to butcher crewmembers left and right.
Ayden Howard
Get out, tripfag.
Grayson Wright
>I just wish they'd stop inventing new ways to butcher crewmembers left and right. Chekov brought it on himself by triggering the Trump Curse.
It's actually very nice. The best environmental suit (defensively) that I've got, and I've got the Lobi store Dyson Enviro suit. It compares favorably to most rep set armor.
Juan Cruz
>I just wish they'd stop inventing new ways to butcher crewmembers left and right
TOS and TNG were also pretty guilty of this to be fair.
Stand on explosive rock Turned into Styrofoam D20 Blood replaced by paint Blood drunk by vampire cloud Infected by paracites and have head shot till it explodes despite the fact that Riker and Picard know it's possible to have that shit extracted and survive. Infected by nanobots and eaten alive from the inside Merged with the floor Mutilated by transporter and left to spend last few moments in inhuman agony Killed by Jack The Ripper
There are probably more especially from VOY, DS9 and ENT. Killing off the lower ranks in stupid/cruel ways and not really giving a shit about it is very much Trek.
Jose Gutierrez
In DS9 it was mostly just standard deaths. Killed by terrorists, killed by Cardassians, killed by equipment malfunction. It was easy enough for them to play it off as part of being in a warzone.
In Voyager they tried to make a big deal whenever somebody died but eventually they just shrugged it off. In one episode they straight up never mention the ensign that died. As if they just sort of forgot she was there.
Enterprise was similar to Voyager but, on occasion they had one of the characters actually react to the death of a subordinate. Like Commander Good-Ol-Boy having to write a letter of condolence to the family of one of his engineering team.
Asher Wright
>TFW Voyager has a funeral for a guy who's been a mummy for over 200 years they just found. While they just torpedo all their dead crew members into space to be violated by grave robbers and then get asspained after the fact. When they show up again as remade aliens. God did Voyager did shitty stuff to their crew.
Dylan King
Still not as annoying as what Worf and Bashir did to Worf's brother.
Oh it's totally not suicide. We just erased all your memories, surgically altered you and reset your personality. There is nothing left of the person but it's totally not the same as suicide.
In B5 Earth Alliance actually use exactly that as a form of execution.
Henry Lee
Hell even in other trek death of personality is considered one of the most horrific things that can happen to a person.
Ayden Green
Yes, but even saying that they did it twice in TOS. One for sick and twisted reasons and one for 'good' reasons but that still doesn't make it right in either case. And a gun to the head might how been more merciful in both cases.
Brandon Hall
*have
Julian Walker
>Brother Edward: Is there enough forgiveness for what I've done?
