/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

Generally I prefer not to suffer a breaking point in the afterglow.

I prefer not to be bled dry during the act.

Whens hunter 2e.

>how you know no one plays geist

Going to be running a Werewolf game set in the Reconstruction South, Richmond Virginia
Come check it out if you're interested.
app.roll20.net/lfg/listing/74267/the-lost-cause

The change to magic just being able to happen at the click of ones fingers was the biggest mistake Awakening made.

Makes the game too much like a superheroes game.

How does it feel to be this retarded?

What's the big difference between apocalypse and forsaken?

It was like that in Ascension as well, user.

You suck at baiting.

Forsaken is better.

No it didn't. You needed to come up with rituals and foci appropriate to your beliefs or that shit just wouldn't work that was the best part of the game.

>what are wonders
>what are charms
>what are artifacts
>what are hung spells
>what are preparations
>what is ditching foci

You need to sit the fuck down.

In all seriousness, Apocalypse is about being captain planet Hitler, while Forsaken is about running your territory, and hunting. Needless to say, I consider Forsaken to be a better game.

>No it didn't. You needed to come up with rituals and foci appropriate to your beliefs or that shit just wouldn't work that was the best part of the game.

It really depended on how much the DM enforce it. Some shit DMs allowed for the purple paradigm bullshit or the paradigm of everything i want.

All of those take extensive time to make and have to be done in long drawn out thematically appropriate magics.

Wonders and artifacts alone can take years to make. And the last example is only a thing you can do when you're swimming in arete dots.

The speed of casting in Ascension revolves around your Paradigm.

Also this.

>All of those take extensive time to make and have to be done in long drawn out thematically appropriate magics.
>Wonders and artifacts alone can take years to make
Ummm, no? How about you pick up a fucking book called 'Forged in Dragon's Fire'. Charms literally turn you into a D&D wizard and are made in batches. They're specifically designed to be easy to concoct, same with most other Wonders.

>swimming in Arete dots
More like 3 dots, dumbass.

Ascension is more prep heavy compared to Awakening, and this only makes them more powerful when it comes to spontaneous magic.

It's somehow depressing that Mummy is technically beating Geist out on that... if only to think of it realistically. But hey, technically Geist isn't rock bottom if Beast couldn't even make it to the list.

I understand what you mean, however in Awakening your immediate spellcasting is much weaker than when you have the time to perform a full ritual, with sacraments, an appropriate ritual environment, and perhaps even a grimoire to cast from.

I mean a newly Awakened Mage attempting to instantly cast a spell he has very little proficiency in, has a dice pool of 2, and has to use Reach on instant casting.

But when you spend the time to acquire sacraments, can spend a few extra ritual intervals to boost your casting and chant in high speech, that dice pool can become as large as 6 to 11 dice. Even 10 if you don't have an Order to learn High Speech from.

tl;dr
Awakening doesn't "need" foci to cast, but it's much easier, and you can stretch your Magic much further when you have them.
Which I appreciate more.

It's also worth noting that higher Gnosis is going to garner severe advantages to spontaneous spellcasting.

An Adept / Master casting Psychic Domination in the blink of an eye is one of the most overpowered abilities in the entire setting.

Higher ranked mages can improvise extraordinarily easily with no need to prepare.

>No werewolf going "muh knot"

fail.

Well yeah, but wasn't the situation the same for Ascension? I'm genuinely asking, I have no idea.

Can't a high-Arete Celestial Chorus'er just pray and make whatever the fuck they want happen in a flash of light?

It's trickier, but yes it is the same. Specific Paradigms can also account for spontaneous magics, as well as prepared Wonders and effects, along with hung spells and ditching Foci entirely.

Alright, so group semi randomly decided that they wanted to play a vampire game, so yeah.

Ive seen a largely agreed upon idea that I should use vampire the requiem 2e online.

Any other suggestions? I know I'm being pretty vague, but i have little experience with this system in general other than the games.

Werewolves in OWoD are so fucking mindbogglingly fucktarded that they only exist to be torched by Hermetic mages and then peed on by their Bastet waifus.

Hunters are supposed to be underdogs. One time my fairest changeling managed to kill a whole bunch of Malleus hunters by using contracts to barricade their warded church without being noticed, dousing the whole fucking thing in gasoline, and flipping off crying hunters as they flung themselves out second story windows.

>you will never be a true fay and do literally whatever you want whenever you want
>you will never capture fair human women to become your harem of concubines, pleasuring you in any way possible and making you food as you shitpost on Veeky Forums
lucky fucking bastards

The Hedge doesn't have internet access.

>You will never be captured by a curious magician who will subject you to all sorts of exciting new tortures in the name of arcane knowledge

>You will never be stalked by a Demon furious that you steal people's lives for nothing more than shits and giggles

>You will never be subjected to "cold iron sodomy" by members of ashwood abbey

why even live?

Who loves Brown EYes?
Mage cucks love brown eyes!
Who loves Brown EYes?
Mage cucks love brown eyes!

Magecucks!

Focus most on atmosphere and storytelling. Vampire excels in these areas, and while it can handle combat (and there are some vampires who are good at fighting) that's not really what the game was designed around.

Or just play "assholes with superpowers", that's what my group did

>What's the big difference between apocalypse and forsaken?

Apocalypse mechanics are shit compared to forsaken. Thats beyond discussion at this point.

As for setting Forsaken is a game about managing your territory and hunting 6 things and variations of thereof. With a poorly implemented frenzy mechanics.

As for Apocalypse is a game or ancient warriors in modern times. I feel the true horror element of werewolf is compromise, how much you gonna let yourself go into this society to achieve what you want? Are you gonna defend equality for kinfolk and garous even when the system also exist in part to protect the kinfolks? Are you gonna take the life of baby metis black spiral dancer because she knows the location of the Sept? No? You gonna risk the lives of everyone for your conscience sake? Knowing that leaving her live is gonna add another one to the enemy numbers?

That for me is the horror of werewolf the decision you make and how seductive the garou society is for a garou. "Be a good crusader, kill the wyrm and anything standing in your way and you will get honor, power and be a hero and be right....just dont think too much. Live fast and die young in the name of our war without changing a damn thing of this vicious circle and then an eternity in valhalla awaits you" thats the speech of the garou nation at large. And the horror comes on how many garou buy it.

However i should note that you need a very VERY good DM to run werewolf apocalypse. Bad ones tend to go with the whole Captain planet thing

think of your favorite splat.

What would be a good, fitting OST for it?

>It's also worth noting that higher Gnosis is going to garner severe advantages to spontaneous spellcasting.

The only disadvantages of higher Gnosis in spellcasting is a slightly higher Paradox dice pool, and for mages of that caliber, it's either largely irrelevant due to inherent Reach of higher levels of Arcana and/or mitigated by their dedicated tool or mana.

High Gnosis mages are terrifying.

>Higher ranked mages can improvise extraordinarily easily with no need to prepare.

Higher Gnosis mages also have a higher Yantra cap to use with their spells and can hold and spend more mana to mitigate Paradox.

>The Hedge doesn't have internet access.

You didn't make a Contract for access to HedgeNet? So sad...

>Werewolf
>Tangerine Dream: Zeit
I think this is what the Hisil sounds like

>Geist
>Talk Talk: Laughing Stock
Cryptic themes about life and religion

>Demon
>David Bowie: Station to Station
Perfectly captures the paranoia and dispassionate impersonation of humanity

Their dice pool is also high as it is without any tricks.

>Spellcasting question about potency.

>All spells have a primary spell factor of either Potency or Duration. After penalties have been applied for the desired spell factors, the player may move the primary factor up its chart a number of steps equal to the character’s rating in the spell’s highest Arcanum minus one.

Page 113 in mage 2e core.

Spells that do direct damage almost always have potency as their primary factor.

What would Kars' clan be like if he were the Antediluvian of one? What would it's clan curse be? Would it be independent, or would it join one of the major sects?

Kars is basically Tzimisce.

there is no greater pleasure then playing as a "weak" race like a changeling or a vamp, then playing as a "powerful" race like a mage or a demon and feeling like a god in comparison.
bonus points if you fuck around with a weaker race for fun and/or profit.

...

6/10 bait. It plays off of the recent threat theme of shitposting pretty well, which is a very nice plus, but you went and made it a bit too obvious. Also you posted during dead hours.

They're different games with different themes so they attract different players. Playing one doesn't make you better than the other (although I'm sure that's not what you meant but that's what grogs are gonna interpret your post as saying).

I like vamp myself because my group likes to fuck each other other and it's great for politicing.

I think they want more atmospheric, low combat shit, so that'll work out.

Would you agree with starting with VtR 2e?

If you want to do Vampire then Requiem 2e is your best bet, it's a clear step-up from 1e and, although thematically there's a debate to be had between Masquerade and Requiem, the mechanics in Requiem are universally agreed to be better.

>VtR
Everything from Nostalghia. Both lyrics and this slow, lazy rhythm that picks up and becomes more sinister as the song goes on. Listen to things like Plastic Heart or Homeostasis and see if you get same vibes

>Demon
I would probably pick anything from Perturbator or Kavinskys collection.

Thank you.

I would say Requiem is more about personal experience and carving out place for yourself so it should be a good bet.

However I have to admit my games often get derailed by players deciding to do stuff like ghouling donkey that is Univerity mascot or doing job interviews for potential secretaries

>Nostalghia

Just listened to it for the first time and love it. But where the fuck can I find downloads for it?

This I can't help you with sadly since I'm using spotify for all my music

Another suggestion for Requiem I would give are:
>The Romanovs songs King, White Flag and Kiss
>Nico Vega
>Gary Numan
>Me and that Man

>The change to magic just being able to happen at the click of ones fingers was the biggest mistake Awakening made.

This wasn't a change, they only made it easier to cast on the fly without the need to prepare or take risks. Mages could always look at you dead.

Yeah, I don't like those. Nostalghia just clicked well for me.

If playing New Wave Requiem, google "minimal synth," you are welcome in advance

What's the old WoD metaplot regarding the first 3 crusades?

Is it just a normal mortal issue or was it secretly fueled by vampires?

The Tuetonic Order was secretly under thr control of Hardstats childre who had a hate boner for pagans and could only feed on Prisoners of War.

The Crusades also were a big internal conflict for Clan Lasombra.

Assamites were also pretty dominant in the conflicts on the muslim sides

And a piece of the original cross was in Acre which made the place impossible to enter for Vamps.

What the hell is wrong with Philadelphia?

And has anyone here links to good guides on how to build my own campaign in Hunters: The Vigil? I need more guidelines than what is in the official stuff.

>think of your favorite splat.
>What would be a good, fitting OST for it?

Music from the Succubus Club

youtube.com/watch?v=vympzV240mM

IT'S THE EMPIRE OF THE VAMPIRE

Beginner here, Serious question.
What is Reach in this context? Just a general word to describe higher inherent capabilities, or a game mechanic? Also, How much does a dedicated tool do for you?

Deception's my favorite. Fits so well for the Ravnos.

Game mechanic.
Spells are at base quite weak.
They take a ritual interval to cast (starts at 3 hours), can only be thrown or touch vector, last for a few seconds, and frequently have weak abilities.

You can spend reach to make them instant casting, sensory range, advanced duration, activate abilities, have more than your Gnosis derived limit in spells active at once, and so forth.

You get free Reach by meeting, and exceeding a spell's base requirement, so a Master can squeeze a LOT more advanced factors out of a weaker spell than a novice. Rotes set your reach equal to a Master's, so they're extremely powerful for weaker Mages.

If you don't have enough free Reach, you can reach beyond what is safe for you.
Each extra Reach adds Paradox dice, which can fuck up your spell, or you.

Question! Is the Death Arcanum absolutely mandatory to become a Lich or are there perhaps other ways of prolonging your life without the meddling/dispelling of other mages without it?

Could I become a Lich solely using Life for instance?

What the fuck even caused the Mage spergout?

Fucking a Promethean should be illegal, it's basically child abuse

The only way to avoid Death in a way that other Mages can't simply dispel requires you to become something other than human. Even then you can still be permakilled with Unmaking.
Usually this means becoming a being that exists under the same purview as ghosts, goetia, or spirits.

Otherwise you can just use spells, like maintaining a Life spell constantly to mod your biology so you never really "age", or a time spell to freeze your body's biological clock.

Should we not fuck AI sexbots when we're advanced enough then?

Assuming we're all still alive by then. Backs would be cracking.

I mean... you wanna use life magic to prolong your life you're not really a lich. You're just alive for a long time...

A Lich is a mage that lives for a long time.

Yeah, but then you got the Tremere and body-snatching mages.

>Yeah, but then you got the Tremere and body-snatching mages.
Tremere are a different template in 2e, and the body-snatchers haven't been explained yet either.

Find a willing (unlikely) and unselfish (also unlikely) Archmaster, and the necessary Quintessence (a nigh death wish) for an Imperial spell to forever prolong yourself.

Archmasters being Archmasters though, it would be easier to discover your own method.

Couldn't a Life mage found his/her own Legacy dealing with harvesting healthy bodily material and applying it to the weakening body?

You can't dispel Legacy Attainments usually, so it would work.

>"that wizard stole muh kidney!"

only if it is a Beast

Kind of. Most mages see adopting a legacy as 'putting on your big boy shoes'. It's a rite of passage and generally most mages will want to gravitate towards a legacy that is both core to their ideals and carries a degree of pedigree.

Alternatively you can forge your own legacy like you suggested but despite how simple mechanically the rules lay it out, it's a deeply personal and spiritual pursuit and often one that won't win you many friends in your Order.

Additionally the legacy concept you came up with almost certainly would be a Left-Handed legact which would earn you a special kind of ire amongst the Pentacle (and remember, it doesn't take much Prime to get a look at your soul and see that you suddenly have an unknown legacy that you're refusing to acknowledge to the Hierarch or Consilium).

>>Spellcasting question about potency.
>>All spells have a primary spell factor of either Potency or Duration. After penalties have been applied for the desired spell factors, the player may move the primary factor up its chart a number of steps equal to the character’s rating in the spell’s highest Arcanum minus one.
>Page 113 in mage 2e core.
>Spells that do direct damage almost always have potency as their primary factor.

Okay thanks for the clarification. So going with my previous example.

Gnosis 4 arcanum 4 to kill a regular human with health of 7.

Base dicepool: 8

Penalty for potency: -10 (5 extra potency required as he get 3 potency for free because arcanum 4). And each yantra after that will take more turns to cast making it using it on combat not a viable option. But that aside says they got yantras/turns to use.

Let say he somehow can justify 2 tools for the spell: +2 (+1 turns)
Mantra:+2 (+1 turn)

And uses concentration yantras for a +2. (+1 turn)

So for a somewhat secure success (Dicepool of 4) i need 4 turns of uninterrupted casting. Which makes combat magic face to face inefficient unless one got a rote with applicable mudrass (Do using mudras take an action? it doesn't say).

Though the aimed spell rules could tip it, if one could use the successes of the aimed spell rules to add bonus to the roll.

You get 4 Potency. Everything starts at one, you then move up the chart (Arcana -1) steps.

The first yantra you use is reflexive and doesn't add to the casting time. High Speech is the exception and always takes a turn.

If he has 7 health you only need 7 damage.

Base of 8 dice
Base Potency: 4

-6 for potency 7. You have two dice left.

Dedicated/Path/Order tool gives you 1 die, if applicable. Being your first yantra this is reflexive.
spend a willpower and gain 3 more dice. You now have 6 dice and a really good chance of success.

If you cast this at range and instantly the target will drop if a normal human with 7 health levels.

A lich is usually doing some manipulation to the soul for extended lifespan. A reaper is using souls for various left handed practices. The tremere are a wonderful combination of the two.

I haven't kept up with this entire topic. Why do you need to do direct damage instead of anything else to end a fight?

At the adept level there are several easier ways to finish combat.

Because classic pewpew weezard?

Sure, but you could also use space to teleport a dude 30 feet straight up so that he suffer 10 lethal damage from the fall, or use spirit to send him into twilight/shadow to get torn apart by your minions, or use life to seize all his muscles so he's incapable of moving, or mind to make him kill himself, or fate to curse him so any attack will only hurt himself, or matter to turn the air in his lungs into nerve gas, or forces to increase gravity to 8 times earth normal etc.

Like if the end goal is to take a dude out of a fight there are easier ways that are gentler to your wisdom.

Are there lichs in Ascension?

>Why do you need to do direct damage instead of anything else to end a fight?

Because i want to make direct magic a viable option in my games. Less mages casting in their sactums safely and more them being face to face casting. Personally i find it more dramatic than the whole who snipes the other first.

As for why not just teleport them 1000 feets in the air, that raises a good question. Why fraying exist when indirect damage is better

Kinda sorta, they get mentioned here and there but are very minor. I could sworn there was philactery merit.

>Why fraying exist when indirect damage is better

Because of shielding spells and withstand which are harder to deal with at lower gnosis/non whiteroom scenarios.

What are everyone's favorite examples of editing derp from WoD? Mine is probably from the Ordo Dracul book: "Muslim scholars and scientists were testing hypotheses long before the birth of Christ."

>Why fraying exist when indirect damage is better
Fraying exists as a Practice because it's a viable and distinct application of magic, and codifying the applications of magic is what the Atlanteans were going for. It's also a perfectly viable application in the right situation, and one user already laid out how to get a good pool on fraying spells. Sympathetic magic is fine as is. If you've been playing games where it's the only thing that happens then you should probably talk to your ST or something, because that's gay.

Thought that was a typo and meant "hypotheses that dated back before the birth of Christ"

>Sympathetic magic is fine as is.

Except is not fine for what i wanna hack the game for, more face to face offensive magic and less casting from your sanctum/using space 2