Warhammer 40k General

Scions even more useless edition

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How do we fix "Tau the anime protagonist the faction"?

put the autists that get triggered by tau into camps

I've been out of the loop for a while and haven't been keeping up with these threads, there have been 8th edition leaks?
I keep reading stuff about rending armor and vehicles with wounds and I am confused

Well first we have to undo the space marine western cartoon protagonist mentality.

It's been rumored that Vehicles will drop HP's and move to wounds and work much like monsters do in AoS, where they have certain negative modifiers the more wounds they take.

This would be good because as it stands right now Vehicles are vastly inferior to Monstrous creatures.

The large amount of wounds (I.E. soul grinders in AoS have 16 wounds) wouldn't be an issue as heavier weapons meant to deal with these things would just do more wounds per shot.

It's all rumors currently, but would make sense.

Reposting from previous.

What do you think about this trimmed down 1000 point list? I feel like with no melee I am not making the best use of kantor's abilities.

On the other hand he still has a lot of utility, good stats, and orbital strike.

Needs more warp spiders

Based on the last thread, cavalry charges

Don't have any eldar models, am pretty new to the game.

again, as long as it has none of that AoS shit I'm ok

>yellow = imperial fist
>skulls = 40k

Destroy their homeworlds and turn them into a race of spacefaring exiles, keeping the lamps lit, searching for a new home. They'll still be anime protagonists but at least the underdog thing will make you want to cheer for them instead of pointing out how stupid it is that they keep winning.

Never mind, that would just make them Eldar.

Cavalry charges are a legit strategy, assuming your opponent has honour.

>but would make sense.

That's what makes it make the least sense. All the rumored changes for 8th so far are shockingly lucid, positive, and community desired. That's hard to believe.

There's nothing to fix. Tau have their share of bad writing, but no moreso than any other faction. If anyone's lore needs fixing, it's the "villain" factions (CSM, Necrons, Tyranids) who are all currently suffering from bad theming in various ways.

You simply don't play the waacfaggots, all the tau fags leave their chineserobots at home because no one plays them. For a while it was riptide wing vs riptide wing in my store before they got bored and started other armies

It's not that hard. Put a hard cap on the number of riptides that are allowed in Tau Armies in order to keep them true to the fluff. Tau players should only be allowed to take a maximum of 1 riptide per 2000 points.
> Remove the Stormsurge outright
> Remove the Tau'nar suit
> Replace the Tau'nar with an xbox-huge hovertank that gets to be the tau "Baneblade Equivalent"
> Give strong incentives for running Mechanized Tau, such as formations that are similar to the Iron Hands/White Scars running Stormlance Companies.
> More melee options.

Oh that's pretty cool

I assume you meant to respond to

Two example from the last thread

>Tau pilots are so good that Necron pilots get emotional
>Pask the guy that never uses Baneblade gets trigger and uses one to hunt a small and fast target

Also Callidus assassins smelling wrong and losing in Melee in close quarters

Normandy-Style Tank-on-tank warfare! The Tau Battlesuits get stuck in mud because of their terrible two-legged design, forcing Farsight to bale them out. Then Pask is called in and we get lots and lots of glorious tank combat.

I want Fury as told by Warhammer and with a million tanks! I want to see Longstrike and Pask constantly one-upping each other! I want to see tank battles bigger than Kursk and more cunning than the Ghost Army of WWII!

And most importantly I want it to end with both sides having a legitimate claim to 'victory'.

What's the best anti air option for a white scars biker army?

I agree wholeheartedly with all of this, though I would say that melee should be restricted to auxiliaries and the option for sergeants and some models to buy double pulse pistols.

I wanna play that army so bad!

There will be no leaks until 2 weeks prior to the editions release
Anything before that is clickbait, and falling for it makes you a fucking faggot

Grey Knights lost a battle brother to medieval peasants armed with sticks

One tactical marine killed about 40 Dark Eldar who were looting a crashed ship by himself.

40K writing has stupid moments across the board.

I agree with that too. Tau Auxiliaries need more love! My own tau army is going to be somewhere around 60% Gue'vesa, but there's other Auxiliary races in the fluff that get no attention such as the Ranghon(Space Dryads), Formosians(Space Skaven), and Demiurge(Ayylmao squats).

But now for Gue'vesa, I'm going to be more or less putting pulse rifles in the hands of guardsmen, and maybe giving them spare shoulderpads or comm-sets and helmets. That and adding human legs to Stealth Suits.

Sell your disgusting waacfag army. It'll be shit in 8th edition anyway.

As long as my Leman Russ still has different Toughness values depending on facing. Like T10/9/6 or if that's too tough T9/8/5. I just want that strong front armor at the expense of the rear like real tanks!


...They'll probably make it Toughness 8 instead :'(

Deredeo dreadnought. Alternatively, buy an Aegis gun and have a Captain with that ignores cover relic man it.

BL, besaide the Cain and Einsenhorn/Ravenor or what the ever the fuck their names are written. Has a lot of trouble writing worth a damn.

Also Multilaser marines and Eldar using Chimeras

I don't run too many auxiliaries myself, but that's mostly because the fluff I came up with ended up excluding guevesa and Kroot.

I would love to see a lot of the cool stuff they could pull off though. Demiurge Ion teams, Nicassar telekinitic tanks, may be even that one void-faring race they have.

Nagi disuprtion/mind control squads.

Was there ever a tau commander model that resembled the tau commander from DoW I or is it just something relic made up?

>in order to keep them true to the fluff
they changed the fluff, though. they have loads of them now.

other ideas are interesting, though. it would be fun to see farsight train up a melee order of elite battlesuit pilots that run sword and shield like he does.

Shadowsuns XV-22 is pretty close. Just add missile pauldrons.

it's a stealth suit converted into a commander. it's their oc donut steel version of shadowsun, more or less

>they changed the fluff, though. they have loads of them now.

More a matter of it being a shotty and stupid change.

Riptides should be a one-per Sept thing. Maybe 2 for Septs with a really heavy Earth caste industrial presence.

If you see 3 or more Riptides on a battlefield, you should be playing apocalypse. It should be treated the same way as Imperial knights.

Heck. In the war zone books they even have Knights going to to toe with Riptides for one of the battles. They didn't need an even bigger robot. If they really wanted, make it another 200 points and bump it up to GMC like the wraithknight.

It's a made up model. You can find a kitbashing tutorial to make one out of Shadowsun if you Google it.

Eh, as someone who spent a long time moved away from GW and shaking my head at what they do, as of about a year ago they seem to have finally pulled their heads out of their ass and are catching up to what their competition has been doing to take away from them for a while now.

Community outreach including going to conventions, (not only public ones but they were at GAMA...which is huge for them) much more bundled things with discounts, discussing possible changes with their playerbase, Using shadowwars as an entry level point for 40k ect.

It's slow and I normally wouldn't believe 8th might be good, but they've done enough things for it to feel like not a sure thing it will be shit.

Yea, my own Tau are going to be Void Combat Specialists, so they deliberately don't use suits that can't fit in a Space Hulk. Because what's the point of having a Riptide when it can't infiltrate a set of tight narrow corridors to go blow up a ship reactor? Or god forbid storm a moon base? On the upside, Stealth Suits are pretty godly for fighting on Space Hulks, since they're already sealed environment suits with lots of weapons that focus on high-fire rate. And plus they're already great for infiltrating corridors full of genestealers..

My guys won't use Kroot, mostly because Kroot adamantly refuse to wear vaccsuits, and vespid wings don't work in space. But that does leave them with conscripting large numbers of human voidsmen, who are already used to living and fighting in the cold vacuum of space.

>If they really wanted, make it another 200 points and bump it up to GMC like the wraithknight.
That's some dangerour monkey paw you are wielding, user. 6e wraithknights were pretty tame compared to the more expensive GCs they are now.

How well do Magnus lists work at 1500? Pic related is what I'm running next tournament, and I'm worried about complete psychic devastation, but there's just no room for Sisters of Silence.

It's shadowsun's suit, just worn by a tau who doesn't need to look effete.

a plastic XV-22 commander would be fucking sweet, and probably get me into collecting tau again

Just bought the last unit I needed for a full GLTF & NMTF. My local shop usually plays 2,000 point games, any recommendations on what I should spend the last 365 points for? I'm thinking an allied detachment of something with Celestine leading them, mainly for flavor. Maybe some more anti-armor stuff since all I've really got right now is the dreadnought and the land raider.

Don't need much anti air since nobody really plays flying units at my shop, except for Magnus but he gets fucked by SoS anyways.

You should take SoS. It's so fucking funny to watch the look on the Tsons player's face when you break the ladies out. Last game I played my Vigilator Sister Superior got lucky and killed Magnus in melee combat.

thats because the wraithknight went from MC to GC, and added sD to its weapons all for only 50pts increase.
at +200 points, the riptide as a GMC would probably be underpowered.

200 points to make it a GC would be worth the points, though. Stomp is a game changer, it's why the Stormsurge is so versatile. If anything Tau shouldn't have any GCs to begin with because giant melee robots just isn't very Tau.

Ke'lshan are the Void Combat specialist sept IIRC, and they're also one of the main FW septs and are part of the focus of Fires of Cyraxus. They might get some new toys if/when that finally rolls around. They never did make rules or a model for the elite void suits they use for boarding actions, so that would be cool to see.

Yeah. Its a similar thing for my guys. They operate in the blasted ruins of a Hive city, and do so pretty on the fringe. This means they're sticking using older and more varied equipment that works in tight urban environments. Lack of humans or Kroot is due to the hostile conditions in some sections of the city. That, and I feel like Kroot wouldn't look great with a grey and purple color scheme.

My Tau are from an ocean planet. So I really want to run a Firestream Wing. I feel like Fast Skimmers and water mix pretty well.

>You should take SoS. It's so fucking funny to watch the look on the Tsons player's face when you break the ladies out. Last game I played my Vigilator Sister Superior got lucky and killed Magnus in melee combat.
Yeah, but what the fuck do I drop, then?

Yea the only Voidsuit they ever made was the Coldstar, and it's astoundingly mediocre on the tabletop(Why the fuck did geedubs force make it so that you're forced to give it that one assinine loadout?). The Coldstar was originally intended for void combat, and it's fluff was in existence for almost a decade before the model came out. On the other hand Breacher teams were ostensibly meant for boarding actions too. so at least we've got that much.

I'm making my own cadre called Darkstar(which is the translated name). The neon blues of their armour are actually supposed to be an ultraviolet light source, which can easily be picked up by friendly helmets in a vacuum.

Pretty much 380 points for a Lord of War Gargantuan Riptide would at least be reasonable compared to the wraithknight. It would gain a lot of melee ability from stomps, though you could give it a rule like:

Lightweight frame: The Riptide is designed with minimal bulk to aid in flight. Add 2" to jetpack moves, but subtract 1 from stomp rolls.

Now it isn't heavy enough to properly crush a lot of things.

No idea, I don't know space marine formations. Still, if you know you're going up against Tsons, sisters are worth 3 or 4 times their point value.

I have a similar setup for my Eldar. They've got an ocean-resort craftworld, so they heavily favor Jetbikes and skimmers.

Probably pick up another two Rhinos just for horrible horrible bubble doom and to keep the squishy ladies safe. After that, I would recommend some Inquisition for psykers, but you've got that locked down. A non-psyker Inq with some servo-skulls can get you non-scatter DS for the Custodes, and a couple Heavy Weapon Acolyte warbands with a monkey in each would really help shore up the backline and give you some AT worth the name to boot.

AAAAAAAAAAA SAVE ME BLOOD RAVENS

> Giving the riptide the ability to stomp
> But also making it suck at it, and be unable to use it to outright remove models
This is now giving me the hilarious mental image of a riptide trying to drop-kick a Contemptor, only to break it's feet because of the Contemptor's AV13(Which is immune to all but 6 on the stomp table)

That's my problem; I have no idea what to drop for them.

Oooh, I like the inquisition idea, but I'm completely unfamiliar with their codex. I'll take a look at that.

Drop literally anything, sisters will bring more value from their bubbles alone against a psyker army.

I mean, that's sensible, to a degree. The Riptide is designed to be as large as possible while still being capable of flight. The legs weren't designed for kicking through armor, and so shouldn't be. If a Riptide gets into combat with a Contemptor, it can use its big thrusters and try to Smash it with one big swing.

I mean, if Tau's weakness is supposed to be melee, then they should stick with it.

>The neon blues of their armour are actually supposed to be an ultraviolet light source, which can easily be picked up by friendly helmets in a vacuum.
That sounds like a recipe for disaster if they come across anyone with multi-spectral cameras, Predator 2 style.

You know a Sept is an entire system, right?

Yep. I see no problems with the rare, giant prototype specialized in heavy point defense and siege breaking to be something that's very limited in supply.

It certainly isn't something every Cadre should have one of by default.

Or totally pointless if someone is rocking Gen V nightvision equipment, which is the good stuff that uses starlight alone to turn the entire landscape into full-colour daylight. It could turn an assault on some moonbase into a hard ambush.

So I just finished converting up a wagon park of looted vehicles, from predators and russes to buggies and basilisks.

How do I best utilize them on the field?

I know buggies do decently but I'm not sure what to do with the captured imperial armor? loted tanks, big trakks?

Tau isn't IoM, they actually advance in tech at rapid pace. Besides this whole lore wankery is stupid because the rules don't match it in any other part either for any faction. Game should be balanced on game terms not on lore terms or even worse based on "muh feels".

There's a lot of middle ground between one and the other. There are only like 2 dozen developed septs. How many stormsurges should there be in total? 3? Half a tau'nar suit that's out of budget to finish, 2 y'vahras, and 1 r'varna?

...

well, yeah, but warhammer operates on mid-late 80's level of space tech. And visors that swap between vision modes are cooler than the more advanced stuff.

>want to run Imperial Guard Kill Team for SW:A
>rules aren't available unless you buy the book
>other factions get them for free

If things were like the fluff, CSM would have proper drop pods and shit. That's just not how it works.

>They actually advance tech

And yet they apparently put the Riptide into mass production without fixing that whole unstable reactor problem.

So 25 or so septs with around 100 worlds between them. That means a Riptide for every 4 planets. If they're a LoW knight equivalent, which would make sense, that'd be perfectly fine.

>How many stormsurges should there be in total? 3? Half a tau'nar suit that's out of budget to finish

None, because Tau making anything bigger than a Riptide after expressing how they think titans are stupid and wasteful and mobility is important is dumb.

The other variant Riptides would be the sort you'd find on those very resource rich Septs that happen to have 2.

I think making the Riptide into a 400 point gargantuan LoW that actually follows the LoW limit and doesn't have an easy formation to circumvent it would be fine as far as balance goes, and it fits this sort of fluff well.

Looks fun and fluffy, if a bit small on the body count. You've got some expensive units in the form of the centurions and Pedro.

I'd like to point out that the free faction rules are completely useless as well without the core rulebook, because the core rules aren't free. Everyone is equally shafted.

Are Sisters Superior worth it, for the extra swing at init 5 ap2?

Who makes for good fluffy allies to a custodes list other than SoS because I really hate the look of them

an actual army with long range shooting or faster movement

Normally almost no one would be a fluffy fit, since they almost never leave Terra.
Imperial Fists could kinda fit though.

Now that Bobby G has sent them out into warzones, you can practicaclly pair them up with any IoM force without too much trouble.

Their ion weapons still overheat and sun shark's pulse bomb generator still has persistent glitch that short-circuits it sometimes. Nova reactor was deemed stable enough for mass production. And speaking of nova reactor, it's such a game changer on big suits.

Good news then that they are releasing the book in both ebook and physical within a month or 2, and all the rules have been fully leaked for 3-5 days via a google doc and a set of mega PDFs.

Not I don't condone Gw here should of announced it as a limited box set £185 rrp for £80 with everything released properly in the near future.

Even some of the people with the box set feel hard done by because the new rule book will be like 80 pages more as it will include all the factions, plus Sisters plus inquisition.

We have some new players starting up soon. This is fine for them to play against, right?

I'm just pointing out he's not got much reason to bitch.

Still fits better as a rare prototype, no matter how much new fluff you post that GW made in order to justify selling more Riptides

Fair enough, you are right army rules without game rules offer very little extra value over no rules

>8th won't buff bikes.

i.4cdn.org/tg/1491694080060.pdf
Never an official model, but a pretty neat conversion guide

Should other armies work like this too, then?
>marines are limited to only max 750p strike forces and can be called in once another imperial army has lost at least 10 games in a row
>Eldars get to write their own win con before each game
>nids have unlimited points
>All dark eldar units have webway portal and they get 2 free game turns before 1st real turn.
>IG has to play logistics minigame before each game to determine their ammo&morale level before game, getting bonuses or penalties depending on the minigame
>Ad mech only has the relic objective regardless of what mission the other player is playing
>Orks can join in on any ongoing game with whatever. They never have win condition, the fight itself is the win con.

>eldar player writes their own win condition
>puts down all squads of guardians killed
>you have to avoid hurting them because they're so easy to kill
>they rampage through your lines
>eldar player wins anyway

>Make a rare, large battlesuit a Lord of War
>The Lord of War slot is designed for Superheavies and other things that are similarly rare to find on the battlefield
>This is the same as making minigames and capping armies at 750 points

>Should other armies work like this too, then?

You mean having one LoW slot in a CAD? Or having certain units that you can only take one of per a certain chunk of points? Because there are other armies that do work like that

I'm shocked, GW has made the right call for a change. Keeping the Thunderhawk resin was the right move. Imagine a game where they're shilling it like fuck to get the production cost back and every match has 2 super-heavy fliers raining down fire on your 30 army-men.

Keep it a collectors piece and for scenarios, it belongs in Epic only.

Bruh, none of this is even close to making tau respect a "25% Rule" just like what 30k has.

riptide at 400 points would be garbage

There is only 1m marines and like gorillion warfronts in the galaxy. And marines make precision strikes and don't wage large scale war. It fits the lore. All those parts of the lore that says otherwise is just bullshit new stuff GW put there to justify selling more marines.

>single guardian survives
>eldar player lost

If you want to get technical, I suggested a 200 point increase. This comes with all the standard gargantuan creature benefits, including higher movement speed, nigh immunity to poison and snipers, and free feel no pain. Suggestion was to tone stomp down and increase assault move range to compensate.

Considering a 50 point bike was clearly too cheap for the wraithknight, and the Riptide is already undercosted, I figured I would play it safe with my suggestion.

If you want to go down that route, everyone should roll a d20 when they're picking an army. If they get a 20, they can play what they want. If they don't, they have to play guard, nids, orks, or traitor guard.

>Orks can join any ongoing game

I support this stupid rule! This alone would be enough for me to buy a whole bunch of orks just so I could drop them on Tau players semi-randomly.

>Ok, now my Riptide Wing will start overch-
WAAAAAAAAAAAAHG
>Goddammit
Ok, look at me. Now look at your riptides. Now back to me. Your Riptides are now surrounded by 2000 points of Grots, Killa Kans, and Grot tanks. Now look at your riptides; they are loosing in melee to grots. Back to me I'm bringing on a 'naught. Can you guess what's in it? That's right; Grots with nob hats.

And we don't typically see large scale war on the table, just fractions of larger engagements. With the LoW suggestion, you'd still see a Riptide every match. It would simply be actually on par with other Superheavies in how relatively rare they are.

Why do you seem so concerned about Tau not having access to Triptide, Stormsurges, or the Tau'nar?

It was never going to sell as much as knights anyway. It is a fucking huge flyer with weak rules for its point cost, WHILE still being to unwieldy for casual play.

there's probably about as many riptides per tau than marines per imperial citizen