Hello Veeky Forums I am new to the board and I keep reading how Camus is shit. What's so shit about him...

They're just rare. You're likely to get better responses if you post a picture of the book itself and your analysis/understanding of it, cause there's less potential there for knee jerk reactions and philosopher drama related shitposting

so should I start with Camus

>"real" philosophers and writers
>no examples

shut the fuck up

I've read most of his books because I used to be an edgy memelord too. Read some quality lit and you'll realise how bad this guy is.

I see. Any pointers on where to start?
Thank you, I will keep that in mind.
I wouldn't consider myself to be very edgy but okay, friend. Any pointers?

Camus is good

postmodern pansies on here pretend to be too nxtlvl to appreciate him

Start with the Greeks.

Greek prose you mean? In regards to Greek philosophy I am rather well read.
I speak German and English fluently, which translation do you think would be better for Greek prose if any?

Did you seriously make a thread because you were confused about people having different opinions

I was under the impression that the general consensus on this board was that Camus is shit i.e. the majority holding a certain opinion and I was interested in finding out why.

So yes, I did.

Oh Jesus you are new, the poster above is one of the knee jerk reaction posters, suffice to say if anyone on this board posts one line with no explanation behind it as an answer to a question you have posed they most likely have no idea what the answer to your question really is.

I greatly enjoy him as an author, but not as a philosopher.

Veeky Forums hates most things. It's a way to maintain the illusion of intellectual superiority. They hardly ever commit to liking anything, as that opinion would have to be justified, something people are too dumb to do. On the contrary, talking shit is cheap.

I have yet to see Veeky Forums hate on Kierkegaard.

Let's be honest here, though, start with the Greeks meme is actually a good piece of advice. He SHOULD start with the Greeks.

If you actually know shit about philosophy and you still think Camus is good, you should probably just off yourself.

At least he's better than Sartre. But that isn't really saying much.

>If you actually know shit about philosophy and you still think Camus is good, you should probably just off yourself.

How so?

I keep seeing this stuff, but no one ever goes into detail on why.

there is no general consensus on this board. Some days a thread is majority pro-x author, than the next it's majority against.

Also, why don't you decide on your own whether or not Camus is good. Did you think this board is very smart? I assure you half of the board users haven't even read book of his.

He's one of original thought and a pretty good novelist too, but both his ideas and novels are accessible to where the average plebs circle jerk over them, thus sparking an undeserved backlash from people who are better read and shitty enough to use a good author as a stepping stone to circle jerk about how much better their taste is.

OP here. Time to out myself as an uneducated idiot yet again. I read Kierkegaard a couple years ago but never really got the appeal. I think the book I read was called "On Marriage" or something similar. What exactly makes Kierkegaard so great? Did I maybe just read the wrong thing?

Again, what Greeks are you talking about exactly? There were many Greeks in philosophy and literature in general.
How would my knowledge of philosophy influence my opinion of Camus' prose anyway?

I tend to give peope the benefit of the doubt, same with this board. I've also read a couple of good posts over the last few days, so it can't only be contrarian memebabies here, r-right?
Interesting. That might be an explanation. Thank you for weighing in on this.

And here you have the basis of most shit posting on this board that isn't meme related, at its root a lot of the backlash against one author or another without any objective criticisms usually stems from some need of an user to express the intellectual superiority of another work (and by proxy their own intellectual superiority), and the expression is usually only for the posting user's sake which is the saddest thing of all.

It's not shit.

But that isn't to say shitposting is not valuable or indeed isn't the lifeblood of this board and all boards. How many posters would websites lose without shitposters, trolls and memesters? Probably enough that it wouldn't even be cost effective to run a board, the same goes for our species as a whole. Knee jerk reactionist morons are the blood running through our species' veins and without them we likely would not be here typing to each other right now.

So to you shitposters of life, this one is in your commemoration.

There was a thread up a day or two ago trying to argue that Nietzsche's entire body of work was disregardable because he got cucked, so I mean you know just always keep in mind ANYONE is allowed to post here with no accountability.

>What's so shit about him?
Not much, really. He was a pretty alright dude. I suppose part of the reason people here shit on him is because a lot of his ideas can give off the illusion of being more complex than they actually are, at least from the perspective of someone who hasn't previously engaged themselves in philosophy. That doesn't mean they're wrong, though, and it certainly doesn't make him a bad writer/thinker. There's a lot you can learn from him.

>How would my knowledge of philosophy influence my opinion of Camus' prose anyway?

It wouldn't change your opinion on Camus' prose, but it'd change your opinion on his fiction books.
Camus' fiction is related to his philosophy (yes, I know related is not the word I'm looking for). For example, the Stranger (his most famous lit work) is thematically very similar to Sisy and his other philosophical essays. And since his philosophical essays are bullshit, his fiction makes no sense as well. Read the Myth of Sisyphus and you'll he how retarded it is. Knowledge of philosophy will help you understand why it's bs, if you don't have enough common sense (inb4 Descartes) to figure it out yourself.
Reading Joyce, on the other hand, would certainly change your opinion on his pleb tier prose.

>Anyways, Greeks:

Iliad, Odyssey, Aeschylus, Sophocles and Euripides, just read the fucking sticky, or check the archive. We have "where do I start with the Greeks" threads every few days anyway.

*and you'll see

I have read the Myth of Sisyphus and and found it a rather interesting read. It is clear that he is not a philisopher "by trade" but I found the way he presented his ideas to be rather entertaining and some of his thoughts interesting.
What exactly in the Myth did you find "retarded"? I'll check the thread tomorrow morning to read your answer. Heading to bed now.

Thanks to everyone and good night!

I like his idea of absurdity, man's search for meaning in a meaningless world. Anyways, here comes the bs part: he says that absurd doesn't require suicide, which is all fine and nice, but can you actually imagine Sisyphus happy? Dude has to push a boulder up a mountain 24/7, do you really think he wouldn't kill himself if he could? Just because Sisyphus acknowledges the absurdity of his situation doesn't mean he's happy. Not to mention that Sisyphus is not a very relatable character, because he has no free will. We do, so unlike Sisy, we don't have to push our boulder if we don't want to.

>more complex than they actually
more like the opposite for me.

and in the stranger, if he feared death so much why not just lie and say he accepts god? why stand by his beliefs if his beliefs are just shit?

Can't read him, he's handsome, and when I don't understand a sentence by him, I think, this guy's handsome and he's just confused me with philosophy fuck him.

But yet you keep pushing...

OP here, good morning folks!

Really? That is rather surprising to me. I always felt like Camus' philosophy was one of the easier ones to read and understand.
What book of his did you have problems with?

Isn't that the whole point of the book? We can kill ourselves to escape having to push the boulder but he argues that pushing the boulder is the better option, no? Maybe I am misunderstanding you here.

How is pushing a boulder the better option, though? It will roll down every time, it's absolutely pointless. Sisyphus has absolutely no reason to live, he should kill himself desu.

Sisyphus has absolutely no reason to die.

Also, he's in the afterlife, he can't kill himself.

What are his reasons to live, then?

Also yeah, he can't kill himself, because unlike us he has no free will, which makes this essay even more bullshit.

You're a motherfucking idiot, m8. He's french. Are you sure you read Camus?

Are you sure your can follow a three-post discussion that also includes pictures?

>unlike us he has no free will, which makes this essay even more bullshit.
That's missing the point. He's not thinking about suicide, he's just happy to do what he does.

>What are his reasons to live, then?
I didn't say he had any. Not having reasons to live is not the same as having reasons to die, nor is not having reasons to die the same as having reasons to live. Between 1 and -1 there is 0.

1. His prose is below average.
2. Sisyphus is not happy
fixed that for you

Why do I hate camus so much, like I just can't stop hating him.
someone give me more reasons to hate him

Thats pretty absurd dude.

It's a meme.

Camus doesn't suck. Even after reading philosophers like Heidegger and Wittgenstein, Camus's prose in translation still makes it clear that his writing is better than most philosophers. He is disliked for his association with the French intellectual movement, Nobel prize, popularity of The Stranger, etc.

If you have doubts about him, seek out his political side. Read his writings with Combat. The man clearly was more of a humanitarian than a "philosopher."

Saying that he has no reason to die is wrong. An eternity of struggle is, in my opinion, a fairly good reason. He has no reason to be happy either, something that would outweight his reasons to die/be unhappy. While our lives are as absurd and meaningless as Sisyphus', we can distract ourselves from that meaninglessness by doing things we love, which makes life fairly enjoyable. Sisyphus has no such luck, he's pretty much tied to his boulder. He's unhappy, he's got no hope and his life is nothing but struggle.

But whatever, we have different opinions so there's no point in further arguing, I guess

this user is right. Start with Camus' essays, they're concise and serve as a good entry to his work.

Life does have meaning friend, that's why we live

He's a shameless hedonist

>Life is absurd
>Look at these absurd arabs
>Killing them is absurd, but so is letting them live
>*pops collar and lights cigarette*

fuck, *Camus'

caffeine hasn't kicked in

Too late, post discarded

>muh prose

his prose is actually great. Just because it's not in the style of Pynchon or Nabokov and is more simplified doesnt mean it isnt great.

You're not wrong for liking him or him being your favorite OP, there is merit in his work.

you completely missed the point but ok.

...

Only reason reason I like Camus is the sentimentality I have for it. The Stranger was my dad's favourite and non literary cuck book so it reminds me of hi

...

I love reading philosophy but I get bored of novels.
I read Sisy, and while I like talk about the absurd, and while I think I get the point of the essay at least to some extend, I don't find it insighful enough or convincing - if you're actually not well off to a good extent (e.g. if you have a painful illness or if you have to do work you hate with no way out), then I feel the pain and nobody is mentally strong enough to think a real situation away. Imagining Sisy happy - and realizing that a meaningless life can be worth living for some still - this doesn't take my pain away and doesn't prevent suicide. If thee is a power and you conclude you can't rebel, I don't see how Camus helps us. If you're not in that position, then why read Camus ideas as such in the first place?

it always is in the top 10 rankings of our book charts

popularity brings contrarians

recommend a good existentialist philosopher

But you're pushing for a type of escapism as the answer to meaninglessness. Camus is much more about arbitrary refusals when faced with the inevitable. Sisyphus is happy because he chooses to be so defiantly in the face of the miserable world.

>>No more tears
There is all sorts of especially ancient philosophy about why your pain doesn't matter, and that you should deal with it (through virtue, God, or according to the existentialists, free choice). Camus would probably say your pain is just as meaningless as everything else in the world.

Because you have an independent will you can always rebel; rebelling doesn't necessarily mean defeating your oppressor. Merseult rebels in such a situation at the end of The Stranger.

>OP here. Time to out myself as an uneducated idiot yet again. I read Kierkegaard a couple years ago but never really got the appeal. I think the book I read was called "On Marriage" or something similar. What exactly makes Kierkegaard so great? Did I maybe just read the wrong thing?

try Fear and Trembling

>What are his reasons to live, then?
to oppose the gods that punished him
if sisy gave up and wanted to kill himself then those who put the punishment on him have "won" but if he continually pushes it without complaint then they who punished him have not really punished him, because they do not break him down, which is the whole point of pushing a boulder up a hill for eternity

>And Veeky Forums is hyper elitist so they hate any existentialist philosopher, don't take it seriously, most of the people here seriously have not even read any of their work or even the work of the people they praise.
t. pseud who knows extremely little about Veeky Forums and should fuck off back to his containment board

>reads translations
>complains about prose

>Are they bad and I didn't realize?
>You can't trust your own opinion

I assume that you'll say that you want someone to show you why they are objectively bad somehow, but that's nonsensicial because you already enjoyed them

Lol so sad OP

300% mad

This. He's good but Veeky Forums won't admit liking something that is easy to read and understand.

They just say he's bad because he's good so they can feel smart for not liking someone who's good.

That makes no sense desu

It's still the case though.