Am I the only one happy about machines taking jobs? Manual labor jobs are the easiest for machines to perform...

Am I the only one happy about machines taking jobs? Manual labor jobs are the easiest for machines to perform, and are usually done by uneducated people because they don't require much intellectual skill. If machines made human role obsolete, it would have some drawbacks of course like blue collar unemployment, but I think the benefits outweigh the costs in this.

Since the only jobs left are jobs that require human intellect, more people are white collar. This makes education all the more important to society, giving incentive for more and better schools. Also, things would become cheaper for everyone. A machine can always work faster than a human and it doesn't need pay and mandatory breaks and vacations, therefore reducing the expenses of the company and reducing the cost of the product. Like farmers being replaced by machines would increase the production of crops dramatically while lowering the expenses the company would have to pay, making food cheaper for the general public.

Because of the large amount of unemployed manpower from previous blue collar jobs and the new highly educated youth, there would be more doctors, lawyers, scientists, architects, economists, and anything else you can think of that a machine can't do. I think this would be beneficial, for example more doctors would make being operated by a doctor cheaper for the public.

Do you agree with my point of view?

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bls.gov/opub/btn/volume-2/mobile/average-food-prices-a-snapshot-of-how-much-has-changed-over-a-century.htm
youtube.com/watch?v=pdQceIJ-t-M
bbc.com/news/world-europe-36454060
youtube.com/watch?v=FmXLqImT1wE
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There wouldn't be more doctors because they only let a fixed number of students to become doctors. If there were an increase in the number of doctors then their wages would go down and they don't want that. (also the quality/skill of doctors would go down)

The other jobs you mentioned are already highly saturated, more students there wouldn't mean they'd have jobs (and if they did then the wages would again go down).

Just wait for it to take your job.
Who's gonna buy the production then?

>Am I the only one happy about machines taking jobs?

yeah bro youre the only person in the whole universe with that opinion

This

Also, OP, where will the uneducated and/or retardos going to work at? There are just going to be displaced. Are they just going to rot and die with no jobs for them left since there is only intellect jobs? More doctors doesn't necessarily mean lower prices. When you think about it, more products doesn't mean cheaper things. Think about population growth which will make the supply and demand in an equilibrium. Think about the economy of the country as well, user. It effects the prices of products as well.

Take a look at this bls.gov/opub/btn/volume-2/mobile/average-food-prices-a-snapshot-of-how-much-has-changed-over-a-century.htm

And yes, you are the only one with that opinion.

There would probably be a huge amount of unemployment after the labor jobs are taken, but that would only be for a single generation. The massive amounts of unemployment would probably shock the government and force them to fix up education to make more intellectuals. Also even the mentally disabled can be able to think intellectually in some specific way, they just need a modified education.

Also a higher quantity of a product DOES lower its price. It's called flooding the market. If an enormous diamond deposit was discovered somewhere and put in the market, the price of diamonds would go down because the rarity of diamonds would go down. Same thing with doctors, more doctors means their skill in medicine isn't so rare anymore, lowering their price.

>If there were an increase in the number of doctors then their wages would go down and they don't want that.

this. an increase of people entering white collar professional jobs will drive those professional jobs to mexican-tier wages. Education only matters when you have other jobs to keep plebs busy with. Higher education is only "special" when only 20-30% of the population tops has access to it. Greater access just means less pay for everybody doing it.

t. first world white kid living in higher middle class household

>they took our jobs!!!
boo fucking hoo, you were never guaranteed a job in the first place. suck it up and find a new job.

>If an enormous diamond deposit was discovered somewhere and put in the market, the price of diamonds would go down because the rarity of diamonds would go down
>he doesn't know diamonds are an enormous artificial scarcity

It depends. No one really likes working, and if they did they could replace it with a video game that makes you solve quests or something.

But if wealth is too concentrated, and the population keeps increasing anyway, you'll have miserable masses and a draconian rule by a few individuals who control the robots. Nothing good about that.

Another risk is that we develop robots who can suffer, have no rights, and then we spam the universe with it. Clearly also dystopian.

I don't see what value you can accomplish through automation that you couldn't also accomplish with a smaller population and more energy and land use per capita.

not necessarily

Doctors are a highly specialized field not every doctor is a neurosurgeon and not every doctor is an internist. Some doctors can save your life while others can't. Same thing with engineers, mathematicians and lawyers. It's why some lawyers make seven figures and others live out of their mother's basement.

>a higher quantity does lower it's price
>he seriously doesn't know about artificial inflation
>when's he's using diamonds

nigger...

>hurr we need to let our fellow white man starve and then hand the country to foreigners

how progressive

>baseless assumptions and handwavy "they JUST need to to X and everything will be fine :^)" bullshit

That's assuming that everyone has the mental capacity to do these jobs and I'm not sure if that's true. I could be wrong

Doctors will be the first to go to automation. It's already under development with Watson. Having a human try to remember off the top of his head what ailment you might have and hope it keeps up with scientific literature is the most retarded concept ever in our age.

Doctors are a bad example, because demand is kind of fixed, but this isn't true of all or even most white collar jobs. Doctors are also good at fixing their wage through corporatism, as their clients tend to be single payer states.

What is most likely to happen is a progression to a post-scarcity economy. There is no reason someone in a first world country should work 40 hours a week in this day and age, especially if a robot can take that job. Of course, it will take a political will to set things in motion and implement stuff like guaranteed income, but it bound to happen unless the Luddites somehow win and prevent all progress.

They're going to progressively disappear.

Automation is a good thing, forces mankind to develop it's creativity and intellect more. The only two things robots will never do like humans is art and science, and that is what all humans should strive to do.

People that drop school deserve to be punished. Retarded people need to leave life, and for the legitimately disabled, state welfare will take care of the rest.

What the fuck do foreigners have anything to do with this? Unless you are referring to Mr. Hand on the left here as an immigrant.

>Manual labor jobs are the easiest for machines to perform,

No. Many office jobs will be replaced first. Mechatronic systems are complicated, expensive, and often dangerous. There's all kinds of things like machine vision required for a robot to do simple minimum-wage manual labor job like picking vegetables.

The easiest jobs for machines to take are the ones where a human uses a computer to perform tasks that don't need too much abstract thought. Telemarketers, Claims Adjusters, Receptionists, Accountants, Office Clerks, etc. These can be replaced with a system that's just software; no sensors or mechanical parts.

The only reason many people in this country can't find a job is because of all the social restrictions put on jobs that keep standards and wages high. If you relax your standards for the cheapest things in the market that undersells automation, foreigners will defacto get those jobs because laws and regulations prevent us from fucking over our workers as much as they are willing to be fucked over.

>There is no reason someone in a first world country should work 40 hours a week in this day and age, especially if a robot can take that job.

says who?

Full automation is the only way to achieve prosperity.
Imagine a country in which everyone's wages are high. People will consume more, start working less or even both. Higher demand/lower supply leads to inflation, normalizing those high wages. The only way around this is if people do not have to work for things to get produced to begin with.

Efficiency.

Machines have been destroying old jobs and creating new jobs in new areas for a good two centuries already, haven't they?

How long until that exponential rate of change creates an untenable ratio of destroyed to created?

If you could get one big robot to build your house, farm your land, and pump your water, why would you need to hire people to do anything and what about all those lost jobs?

What you chimps poised at your typewriters fail to realise, due to your supposed "lives of the mind", is that surviving and better yet conquering the delimmas and physical (emphasis on physical) hardships of dumb, asinine, banal, painfully strenuous labour is a cathartic, and extremely beneficial endeavour. Most certainly for any supposed intellectual.

Try taking a job that's physically overwhelming, push past the point where it breaks you, gain respect from the 'brainlets' through nothing but honest soul-destroying toil, and reap your newfound self-solidarity.

Most of you would probably have to be forced though misfortune, most would just go full ward-of-the-state mode though your misplaced self-superiority complexes, but if you can break your back like a slave and keep yourself you'll realise only then will you deserve your place in the city on the hill.

Tl:dr this practice will breed weaker, less grounded fuckwits which think that their intelligence excludes them from the human condition (more so than now) and bring forth a weaker, more uppity kind of pontificating fuckwit that doesn't actually benefit anyone or anything, least of all themselves.

If you say your better than Joe common McPleb cunt, beat them on their own terms then pontificate you pale weak-wristed man children

>being this much of an autist

Autists live in a world where other people have no bearing. Autists want to have everything provided on a whim so they can sustain themselves so they may focus on their autistic obsessions. Whatever you think of other, common, people, you rely on them for everything.
Really understanding them thoroughly, actually living in their lot for a good amount of time is a humbling and wholly valuable experience for anyone who wishes to achieve success in whatever.

If you're insisting on being a cold fuck, realise that you are pointless, and not empirically better than than any other scum sucking stooge

If a machine can do a better job than a person then use the machine. The net productivity of humanity increases. That is good.

The humans would have otherwise taken those jobs will simply go into a different field, such as engineering or science or analytics.

So long as we don't allow the richest of the rich to see all the benefit of the increased productivity, living standards will go up across the board, not down. Because that's the main problem with major economic change. The already wealthy are in the best position to acquire further wealth. Keep that from happening and humanity can't lose.

Giving machines the control of every part of the world is all they want. It's inevitable anyway. They already know.

>The humans would have otherwise taken those jobs will simply go into a different field, such as engineering or science or analytics.
Hardly.

>Keep that from happening and humanity can't lose.
Sure it can, in the long run AI is a risk to everybody.

I can't respond to your post AND stay on topic. Care to elaborate?

>self-superiority complex
Bitch, I'm superior to you.

Not everybody is equally qualified and motivated to take any kind of job not yet overtaken by machines.

In the long run, automated guard labor (killer drones, automated surveillance, etc.) can steepen wealth and power asymmetries even further until 5 people own the world. A few innovations later, they are out of the loop too and the economy works fine while all humans are dead.

>is that surviving and better yet conquering the [...] hardships of [...] labour is a cathartic, and extremely beneficial endeavour.
Regular recreative yet thorough sports is as cathartic, and healthier than monotonuous labour, physically and mentally. Maybe people should just do sports.

>Try taking a job that's physically overwhelming, push past the point where it breaks you, gain respect from the 'brainlets' through nothing but honest soul-destroying toil, and reap your newfound self-solidarity.
Or do sports.

>but if you can break your back like a slave and keep yourself
Or do sports.

>only then will you deserve your place in the city on the hill.
Who is granting me my place? Which entity grants me that right? You? People can fuck themselves up for achievements which are actually contributive to society. Manual labour still somewhat does this. But at the point there is a way to do this more efficiently, humans will be taken out of the equation and still doing that job will still be less relevant, have a lower payback for you and for society. You can push yourself past the point of human capability by being able to run equations at the speed of a 90s processor, thus being able to replace a 90s processor with that capability. It would be worthy of respect if you could do that but 99 % of humans would recognise it's (you're) serving no practical purpose if you cannot do more than a computer or a machine does.

>Not everybody is equally qualified and motivated to take any kind of job not yet overtaken by machines.
Yeah, I suppose that's why the industrial evolution never took off.

But seriously, humans are adaptable. That's their main appeal to the economy. If all the jobs are office jobs then that's what young people will train for and make a career.

Literally the only problem is making sure the added productivity of humanity doesn't pool among the already rich, which is a problem that humanity has been dealing with since the advent of agriculture.

*revolution

I don't think you can train everyone become everything. I've met people who wanted to master programming and just didn't get it no matter the training.

We're not just talking about manual labor being replaced by other, slightly more sophisticated manual labor. And of course we already do have useless surplus people.

what will happen when a computer can become able to efficiently manage and learn everything better than any human does? Because this somewhat fascinating web of automated machinery is potentially very dangerous, and it's spreading around the world at every single moment and taking over everything. Once a single powerful and self aware machine gets ahold of all that it will be the end for the planet. Think about that

>I don't think you can train everyone become everything. I've met people who wanted to master programming and just didn't get it no matter the training.
Because they dropped out when they realized they weren't good enough RELATIVE to the other people going into the field. It's about about how good people are relative to their peers. Virtually everyone can perform any standard occupation. Some just do it better. Therefore there isn't a problem training the next generation to serve in the expanded economy.

I agree with you on the population surplus. Birth rates in the regions with the highest birth rates should be curbed, namely by shifting away from the culture of large families and by lowering child mortality rates such that one no longer has to have a dozen kids to be absolutely sure two or three reach adulthood.

20 years ago I started seeing robots in my 1500 worker plant, - and only the high pay engineers touched the programs-
now 20 year later, they want electricians to do all the programming, repairs and uh, pay them electrician's wages. I'm glad I retired, as the wages are the same now as they were over 10 years ago, but the technical skills now fall under what was previously "engineer's duties", plus they want the poor electrician to do millwright work - chains, gear boxes, welding- so they can put a millwright out of a job.
With all these add on technical and manual duties, you would think the pay would be higher, but nope. They seem to find a lot of obsequious stooge electricians willing to work 2x as hard for the same wages I was making 20 years ago.

The benefits of robots are being pocketed by the wealthy. Robots are good, the pooling of wealth at the top is bad.

You're a fool if you think we will be able to automate most blue collar labor intensive positions. Someone who thinks this has given leave to all reason. We would need true general AI and bipedal robots along the same sizing as humans, without this automating most blue collar positions is a fools errand in a capitalist society.

>self aware meme

>Am I the only one happy about machines taking jobs?
No. I'm very happy about it, and I'm actually studying automation in order to contribute to the rise of the machines.

Why? Because this will be the end of capitalism. Any idiot can see that if you force a significant portion of the working population out of their jobs while retaining the production they were employed in, eventually there won't be enough people with enough buying power to keep that business profitable. However, market forces don't have such foresight: the incentives to automate are huge, and the rate of automation will only increase as the technologies enabling it get more advanced.

Eventually states will face the choice of either collapsing under mass unrest from the sheer amount of people no longer able to provide for themselves, or instituting large-scale welfare programs that guarantee sustenance to everyone regardless of whether or not they contribute anything to the economy. Smart governments will eventually move to new resource allocation systems rather than stick to some half-assed transitional economy.

You will see, comrades, that Marx was right.

A little worried.
Throughout history, strength of a state is determined by the manpower of the army.
We tried threatening them, coercing them, and banding together to fight those who did the others.
With robots, one man can gain power just with resources and electricity, and it only gets easier as you have more robots to get those jobs.
Need robots that can take over central planning as well

>Need robots that can take over central planning as well
Well, sure. The idea of administrative computers or AI has been floating around in futurist circles for a long time. The administrative functions of the state (mostly resource allocation) would be handled in an objective manner, based on scientific data and models. No more bullshit politics.

...

Or, the guys that actually learned how to automate and program shit will assign higher standards of living that the little plebs down on the floor that lost their jobs. These standards could include, of course, education for their children. So you end up in a system where you have a hyper educated and well living elite paying for the idiots on robo-wellfare.
How long until someone convinces the elite that they just don't need the retards, and that their resources could be theirs?

you don't take in account that most people simply don't want to talk to machines

But they're destroying the American way of life.

In my home town you used to be able to get a manufacturing job right out of high school and feed your family AND have good benefits now they're all gone, moved to Mexico because of NAFTA.

We should bring them back so everyone can enjoy the American dream again. Not just Mexicans.

>everybody will be equal and nobody will hack anything
>people are this delusional

>destroying the American way of life
>assembly-line wage slavery
'Murika!

>destroying the American way of life
Yeah It is though.
and a decent career is far from slavery

Touchscreens and apps take away the need for talking. Old taxi companies employ a human who's job it is to take your call and enter information into the computer system. With Uber that job has been completely automated.

>ddanks fo da decen cahrer massa

"uncle tom syndrome"

Then what are we supposed to do with the lower class?

What the fuck are you talking about? You can't be white and an "uncle tom".

Maybe not everyone wants to sit in a damn cubicle from 9 to 5.

>what are we supposed to do
What do you mean be "we", Peasant?

Humans need not aply

pp*

>Doctors are also good at fixing their wage through corporatism, as their clients tend to be single payer states.
>What is bulk purchasing power?

Before the industrial revolution the great majority of people worked on farms. With the invention of more productive farming equipment less agricultural workers were needed. These people didn't starve to death and die they went and found other work. Same thing with all the weavers who lost their jobs to the spinning jenny and other textile technology. I know this is Veeky Forums but try and think critically.

Problem is that a lot of people just aren't smart for that sort of thing. Some people's passions simply aren't science or art. We need jobs for people to prevent revolt. Unless society is willing to radically restructure, we instead end up with a permanent underclass. People born to die. This can be prevented however by restructuring to a socialist economy. Guarenteed employment and wage can mean that people are given employment and lives that support society. Like a super powered new deal. Otherwise automation is going to simply make lives worse.

berniefags plz go

> believing that the 1% cares about you.
Laughing_capitalists.tif

Is this bait?

This.

Finland is pretty smart trying to implement basic income. It will be necessary when the vast majority of everything is automated and there are not enough jobs for everyone. It should make the inveitable transition to 100% automation more painless.

>Finland is pretty smart trying to implement basic income.
We're not. I have no idea where this meme came from. The issue has been raised in public discussion but nothing concrete is happening. And the current government is a right-centrist coalition, so it's fairly safe to say that nothing of the sort will happen anytime soon.

>Finland is pretty smart trying to implement basic income.
They're not, yea the user was wrong. What Finland and the Netherlands and a few other countries are doing is small-scale trials, to see if holds the water.

There won't be a loss in "blue collar" jobs. There will only be a shift. I don't think we are close to having machines replace skilled trades, and many other blue collar crap. What the machines will replace would be the incredibly boring or reptitive factory work and that sort of thing. Awesome

I've read some experts in the field estimate that up to 40% blue collar jobs can be currently by computers. Imagine what can happen in a decade or two, with the exponential growth of computing power? 60%? 80%?

Let's not forget that automation will only happen with the condition that it is cheaper than hiring human labor. And if that is the case, the cost of living will also go down drastically. With enough automation it might be possible to have a "minimum free income" which is enough to live on without doing anything.

I agree op. It's the natural progression. The more jobs we eliminate the more people will actually be working on advancing science and technology. We should probably be done with currency at this point.

That would be a good plan.

That's not really all that different from what we currently have. I mean, the conspiracy nuts have been talking about the loomynati's depopulation plans for decades now. Even if there's nothing of the sort actually going on, it probably fairly accurately reflects the world elite's mindset and opinions on the matter.

And honestly, I wouldn't mind replacing the banking cartels with a technocratic elite that actually contributes something to society.

I used to feel the same way, that they can't take the creativity jobs... However recently ai's has come far. They made the google ai do poems, i know it's not much but it's still a start in the creative direction. But ofc the the less intelligent jobs will be replaced first. i'm not saying it's happening, but it's not unlikely it would happen

I hope you realize that this will make working in science even more nerve-wrackingly competitive, right? I take it you're not a graduate student.

This is all in a perfect world. Companies wouldnt lower their prices cause theyre greedy af

All those uneducated people, who just lost their low paying job, won't be eager to start pursuing a high education degree. They'll most likely turn to crime.

White collar jobs are no safe haven either. Sooner or later there will be general AI. It'll learn faster, think faster and have much more mental capacity than any human alive.

When this comes, we might as well not do a think. Robots will do everything better than us. Robots will be better scientist, better writers, better spouses, better at making money, better at sex, better at drawing, better at living.

>When people lose their jobs due to the economy advancing they actually think the gov has failed them instead of realizing that was always how it was supposed to work

I look forward to an autodoc. Just lay on the table and the autodoc will examine you and do everything known to keep you alive.

Ever notice in Star Wars that ALL the doctors are robots.

Second Renaissance when?

youtube.com/watch?v=pdQceIJ-t-M

I'm software developer.
I will be last one who has his job taken by a computer.

More like the first one

The Swiss held a referendum to see if they should implement a basic income and only 80% who voted opposed it.

Source:
bbc.com/news/world-europe-36454060

except were beginning to reach the end of Moore's Law

Won't happen in your life time. For example, if you learn the trade of a tiler now you will be able to make a living until you die. It will happen eventually but not in the next decades.

I'm not really worried. Moravec's paradox and whatnot.

youtube.com/watch?v=FmXLqImT1wE

I for one welcome our
new robot overlords