I am a Norwegian writer looking for some feedback for the opening lines of his debut novel...

What do you mean "give away" the character? He is one of two protagonists, two young men who escape their families and their town by travelling across the wilderness towards southern Norway, where one of the boy's divorced father has promised them a job on an oil platform. The opening scene involves one of the young men rushing to his mother's hospital bed, where she lies dying.

What do you mean "generic" and what do you mean "impersonal"?

I mean I am writing in third person so it is going to seem a little impersonal.

By the way I am taking the first chapter up to this editor tonight, so hopefully he will provide some feedback too. It will be interesting to see if he and Veeky Forums agrees and what about.

Personally like the first two paragraphs, if only because it's an unusual thing to do. Steinbeck opened with landscape/history too.

>small communities routinely settle and prosper into towns and cities
Using the present tense here (especially with 'routinely') is particularly weird, but I'd say it actually goes with the geological timescale. I don't think it goes with the next sentence, though, since that shifts to a standard timescale. Not sure how you'd resolve that without just splitting them into two very short paragraphs.

>It was the nurse's voice who would still be heard repeating herself from the telephone receiver swinging in the hallway
This is also strange, but in this case I'm not sure what you're going for. It would normally be something like 'the nurse's voice still repeated itself from the telephone receiver swinging in the hallway'.

>What do you mean "generic"
in the sea of untalented authors and irrelevant novels, your opening lines do not stand out as original in any stylized way.

>what do you mean "impersonal"?
emotionally cold, bit clinical in an artistic way, like you're thinking too hard what the opening line should be.

>By the way I am taking the first chapter up to this editor tonight
good luck!

>present tense
>present tense
>past tense
is that intentional?

and as other posters have said, the first two paragraphs don't really set the scene for the third paragraph very well. if you're insistant on using the rivers to set the scene and foreshadow the development of the friendship you'll need to build and emphasize the description even more. as it stands the transition from the description of the river to the action of the story is very abrupt and disjointed.

...ah, worked out how I would resolve the timescale issue.

A valley is slow in forming. A river erodes the land over time, wearing away the rock and soil and forming a depression along which the river stubbornly maintains its course. Within such valleys, sheltered by the surrounding mountainsides, small communities routinely settle and prosper into towns and cities.

Karasjok was one of these towns, lying near the confluence of the two rivers which join the River Tana, in the valley formed by its ancient journey towards the sea. The industries which encouraged the town into being had long become redundant, and over time its youth had learned to limit their ambitions to a scale the region could now accommodate.

I think it's fine if you chop it up and move shit around. I'm not the type of person who would ever use "rushed out his partens' home" but, I think I think his home would be a good way to then say what you want to in the first paragraph. Will require some finagling but the pieces are there to move if you want.

I actually like the first two 'ras more than the third.

Reminds me of My Struggle: Book 1

Right, they're fine, then you get to the garbage that is the third paragraph. And that's where the story he has in mind fails. Christ that is poorly written. Maybe it's not, but, I want to vomit when I read "a strong wind lunged at him from the surrounding darkness".
Still, I agree that OP could sift these sections around a bit.

Except Knausgaard doesn't start his book by describing landscape but with an essayistic approach, around the theme death.

This sounds like a really ordinary and dull premise. Maybe you can make it work, but... not with this writing. A mediocre nature analogy is the least of your worries.

I'm going to guess that there's a shocking incident that changes their lives forever? Maybe some long conversations explaining your personal philosophy? An appearance from one the Literary Drama-in-a-Can triad? (suicide, adultery, homosexuality)?

This novel has been written a million times over. Maybe I'm completely off-track about what you're writing, but, think about it. I got a little smell of it reading your posts.

I like the OPs idea of the two friends making a tributary to converge into something larger. But, he'd just ruin it with something like you suggested.

I love this. Don't really get the last sentence though.

>The story itself is about two young heterosexual (or at least not conspicuously homosexual) men
Couldn't you have just said
>The story itself is about two young men

OP here. Could you post some examples of novels which are similar in their basic narrative structure to my own work?

Also there is no homosexuality in this book, no adultery and no actual suicide. I only provided a very basic synopsis, of course a lot more happens.

are you writing/hoping to publish it in english or norwegian?

>inb4 op lifted the opening paragraphs from some academically and critically acclaimed norwegian novel that hadn't seen translation yet and is trolling us

This is amazing user, how can I read your book when it's finished? Where do I find it?

OP here. The protagonist is leaving the home at night to rush to the hospital. I did not want to simply say "his mother was near" death so instead I mentioned that the nurse's voice is repeating over the phone which, because it is swinging, suggests he rushed away without waiting until the end of their conversation.

OP here. I wanted to preclude any "trolling" regarding their sexuality.

Over the past few months, when I'm bored and looking for recommendations, I check out goodreads' new releases under literary fiction. They fucked up the format so it's harder to check now, but people have been noticing for a while now that literary fiction is a bona fide genre in and of itself. That is to say, most new releases follow a specific formula.

A Little Life by Hanya Yangiharayanayayan springs to mind.

Are you being sarcastic? Apologies if you aren't, but I struggle to tell sometimes.

I have a long way to go yet, so it won't be finished for a while and finding a publisher will be difficult enough I imagine.

Why, if you are serious, did you appreciate it?

Oh, then I would change the sentence to what suggested (if you're going to write it in English), it's a weird sentence.

I know of this book but have not read it. Do you have other examples? I am just curious as to how cliched this narrative structure is. I am aware of books like Narcissus and Goldmund, Brokeback Mountain and some others which focus on the relationship between two young men, but in my experience it is not something I immediately categorize as cliched.

No, I'm serious. Most young writers I know try to make some grand statement for their debut and overreach as a consequence, whereas your idea seems modest and comfy. If it's written well, something like this could be my favourite book. And although I don't know yet if you write well, I'd happily take the chance to read it.

In short, if I saw a book in a store with on the back, I would immediately buy it.

Giovanni's Room by James Baldwin also comes to mind. Also Morrisey's lyrical contributions to his popular band The Smiths. The forbidden longing of the repressed homosexual is well-trodden ground.

response, op?

try the brothers k by david james duncan. i found it to be tedium incarnate, but if you're interested in writing stuff like it i imagine you're interested in reading stuff like it.

Not that person, but I actually enjoy the prose style. IMO it's detached, but it's also very lucid and effective. Is English your first language? Because your "detached" style reminds me of Jerzy Kosinski, who was not a native speaker but wrote novels in English.

OP, please don't let all this unwarranted praise have an effect on you.

OP here. Neither of my protagonists engage in homosexual acts, nor do they talk or conduct themselves in a way that would, according to contemporary means of perceiving such things, be considered homosexual.

My apologies. It was intentional yes, as I wanted to establish a realistic setting and to, as it were, provide the reader with a distant image of the region in which the story is to begin, and subtly communicate the overall narrative of the story, in the sense that, like human life itself, things begin with small and indistinct droplets or events, which expand and take on meaning and then, at least in the story, become entwined with another the lives of other people, in this case one particular life, from a period which has passed in a region which still exists. I believe something must be added between the end of the second passage and the beginning of the third that will bridge them in a way that is not so jarring and does not read so much like a non-sequitur. I will be writing in Norwegian, though I posted the English version here as I initially just translated what I wrote but then I spent a lot of time editing the English version into the way it appears here. Thank you for your response, it was and is much appreciated.

Do you post this out of concern for the quality of my writing and the fate of my ambition to succeed in writing a meaningful novel, or to encourage me to view myself and my abilities in a more negative light?

Needs more of those things that you pave the road to hell with.

It's not that what you have posted here is of low quality, it is and it isn't, but you need so much work on such a small portion of what you have. I just don't think you should be satisfied with what you have here, never mind the rest of the work.

>I will be writing in Norwegian

that makes quite a difference and makes it very difficult for us to offer any criticism about your writing. fwiw your english is technically very good, but artistically it's a bit weak.

you should write in english mate a lot more people will be able to understand it

I don't believe the quality of my writing in English is sufficient to write an entire novel in the language.

>but artistically it's a bit weak
I actually thought the prose in the first two paragraphs was good- certainly better than a whole lot I've seen on Veeky Forums. Had a nice flow which went with the river thing.

Agreed that it's a bit meaningless for Veeky Forums to offer criticism on the English translation of a work that's not actually in English.

I like the first paragraph, but I just realised it obviously needs editing.
>gather to form two small streams which trickle hesitantly at first in wide meanders across the moor. Eventually these streams grow wider...
Small streams can't trickle in wide meanders. You went wide too early and then went narrow again.

oh it's you again
hi

OP here. Very true. Consistency is important. Thank you.

yeah, the static description where he could focus on a literal interpretation was good. but once the action and story really started and he needed to begin building tension it fell apart.

OP here. Is this an improvement in your opinion?

>"From its twin sources in the highlands of Finnmarksvidda, the River Tana descends gradually and inevitably towards the sea. Droplets of rain, falling tiny and indistinct, gather to form two small streams which meander hesitantly at first across the moor. Eventually these streams grow wider and deeper, their course more assured, their growth checked by a series of reservoirs which contain and dictate the momentum of their flow."

>"A valley is slow in forming. A river erodes the land over time, wearing away the rock and soil and forming a depression along which the river stubbornly maintains its course. Within such valleys, sheltered by the surrounding mountainsides, small communities have traditionally settled, some developing into towns, some towns becoming cities. Near the confluence of the two rivers which join the River Tana, in the valley formed by its ancient journey towards the sea, lies the town of Karasjok. By the latter decade of the twentieth century the industries which encouraged the town into being had long become redundant, and over time its youth had learned to limit their ambitions to a scale the region could now accommodate."

>"In the winter months no sunlight contradicted the shadow which settles stubbornly across the town. Magnus Ellingson cold barely tell midnight had long passed as rushed from his parents' home and mounted the bicycle leaning against the fence nearby. A strong wind lunged at him from the surrounding darkness. Trees shivered and shed their leaves nearby. He peddled quickly along a wide road lined with homes whose windows emitted no light. It would be the nurse's voice coming from the telephone receiver swinging in the hallway. The hospital was seven miles away."

it doesn't really matter how many rewrites you offer, op. judging your english writing will provide little help with the original norwegian.

This, your writing isnt bad, but it's not exceptional either.

How does it read in Nowegian though?

it's a cooll concept, but the reader doesnt know that unless you specify it beforehand and otherwise it's a boring and longwinded description. shorten it and make it more bold.

>The two measly tributaries cut through the lonely landscape and converge at the river Tana

you can fill in the details later on and in parts, no need to flood the first two paragraphs with a geology lesson.

>measly

Oh fuck off

Read the Start of Under the Volcano if you want to see this beginning done properly.

This is that 100 post user again.

Newfags, there is a poster who constantly creates really elaborate schemes to mess with people by getting them to feel sympathy for his character and then slowly dissolve into autism, it usually always begins with calling himself a genius (I've noticed this pattern) he used to joke about his 6 volume memoir or this time that he paid a publisher to publish his book and he scheduled a book signing at a barnes and noble where only his mom came and bought 3 copies of the book. He does this because he's admitted he has nothing else in life and gets some sort of pleasure out of it, anyway, he had me going for a little bit until I saw him descend into cunty autism but the nail in the coffin is this quote that he always uses when people ask to see his writing in these threads (because it's pretty good but it comes from an archived post from years ago back when warosu was up, someone else found that one out, he usually takes any written material from past critique threads but almost always this one):
>"Magnus realized, with a sort of laugh, that every joke he had recently heard had been told by himself, to himself, and at his own expense."
Anyway OP, you should really find something else to occupy your time if this is all you really have.

Update: It's the cabin guy as well.

bump

Heh. Right now I can't think of a worse word to use in fiction.

Why does it descend inevitably you little shithead?

Down the years many strong burly Norwegians have attempted to evit it, but all without success.

Post norsk/bokmal version

It's obviously a metaphor for something that will take place in the story, or perhaps life itself. Are you really so dense?

> "Fra sine to kilder i hoylandet i Finnmarks, går ned elven Tana gradvis og uunngåelig mot havet. Dråper med regn, fallende liten og utydelig, samles for å danne to små bekker som slynger seg nolende forst over myra. Omsider disse strommer vokse seg bredere og dypere, deres selvfolgelig mer trygg, deres vekst sjekket av en serie av reservoarer som inneholder og diktere fremdriften av deres flyt. "

> "En dal er treg i forming. En elv eroderer land over tid, ifort bort stein og jord og danner en depresjon sammen som elva hardnakket hevder sin gang. Innenfor slike daler, skjermet av omkringliggende fjellsidene, små samfunn har tradisjonelt avgjort, noen utvikler seg til byene, noen byer blir byer. Nær lopet av de to elvene som blir med elven Tana, i dalen dannet av sin gamle ferd mot havet, ligger byen Karasjok. ved siste tiåret av det tjuende århundre bransjer som oppfordret byen til å være lenge hadde blitt overflodig, og over tid sin ungdom hadde lært å begrense sine ambisjoner om å en skala regionen kan nå ta imot. "

> "I vintermånedene ikke sollys motsagt skyggen som legger seg hardnakket på tvers av byen. Magnus Ellingson kaldt knapt fortelle midnatt hadde lenge gått som stormet fra sine foreldres hjem og montert sykkelen lent mot gjerdet i nærheten. En sterk vind sparket på ham fra morket rundt. Trær skalv og kaster sine blader i nærheten. Han peddled raskt langs en bred vei foret med boliger som har vinduer slippes ingen lys. det ville være sykepleierens stemme kommer fra telefonroret svingende i gangen. sykehuset var syv miles borte."