Who else /STEAM/ here?

That is just wrong.

Fair enough, however should it be an academic plan? I personally don't believe that if one is good at math/science they aren't artistic and vice versa, but there generally seems to be a distinction between the two groups of people, at least was the case when I was in high school. Even now in college the kids in my major aren't particularly artistic. And then we also have to think of job availability and practicality.

Except it's literally true buddy

t. person who has never had a serious thought about either science or art

Oh I thought it was only figuratively true

lol They're always trying new ways to make women, niggers and spics feel better about themselves.

If you want to lump arts in with STEM, they should take the same prerequisite Maths and Sciences. Competency and dedication supercede feelings. In fact, all majors should require maths up to D.E. instead of liberal arts.

t. person who thinks specialist disciplines sprouted fully-grown from Zeus' forehead in the 20th century

/pol/ overflowing again.

t. person who thinks comparing the cumulative knowledge of humanity 200 years ago to the cumulative knowledge now is a valid comparison

Not that guy but the biggest hurdle is clearly the lack of rigor among current Arts students. Fortunately that's exactly the sort of thing that can be solved by a well-designed curriculum.

Some ideas off the top of my head:

- Focus on geometry (develop intuition using Hilbert or Tarski's axioms, but be able to solve the occasional problem with coordinate geometry)

- Practice sketching, lots of it (graph paper for everything, ties in to coordinate geometry, trains accuracy, opportunity for advanced topics e.g. projections, generally useful across a large number of degrees)

- Music and architecture all have overlaps with science (waves, engineering) that, to a certain extent, can be taught under a cultural lens if necessary.
- On a less applied note, color and music theory can get rigorous and scientific fairly quickly (although not necessarily simultaneously)

there's no point in lumping this stuff together. Art has nothing in common with the other stuff.
everyone in STEM is expected to know at least a bit of calculus and programming (for example)
not in art.

I'm that guy and you said what I'd say

>we can make arts better by including more science

lol

>implying we can't

Alright, I could buy that. Just curious, how would we go about integrating that effectively within schools? Walk the halls or hang around a campus and you'll hear students complaining of having to take X class that has "nothing" to do with Y major. I feel as though those kinds of conversations would only amplify if we were to incorporate those two seemingly different disciplines with eachother. Would this change the ultimate goal of a college degree?

scientific art
scientific morals
scientific politics
everything scientific is better! xd!
science is le answer 4 al ur problems
>tfw I have a scientific explanation to why I am still a virgin at 27
>feels good being enlightened by my own scientificism

Why do I get the feeling the people complaining about scientism are the same people complaining about modern art

These are the people who know just enough to know things they don't understand and like are wasteful.

Send everything to kids in Africa.

>having to take X class that has "nothing" to do with Y major
I actually agree with this. For some people, a particular class may genuinely be a waste of time.
How much of all that math/science you learned do you use on a daily basis? Note that rote memorization of facts is quickly becoming irrelevant thanks to the Internet.

The solution would be for the lesson planners to choose their topics judiciously, selecting only those that would develop skills that are useful for a humanities student. (By which I mean higher-order skills like "noticing flaws in other people's work, and offering constructive criticism to remedy the issue", not low-level shit like "able to cite Desargues's theorem".)

You're hitting on what I didn't really say before. This has sort of devolved into the purpose of schooling. We had speakers come to our college once and they all said ultimately what matters is proving you got a degree. You take those math/science courses those to prove you can put in time and effort and that you have some sort of work ethic. Schooling has become more about making people work hard to be ready for jobs. So if we were to add Arts in this would that make people more well rounded? More enriched as people instead of just living machines being shaped for jobs? Maybe I've gone a little out in left field here.

>You take those math/science courses those to prove you can put in time and effort and that you have some sort of work ethic. Schooling has become more about making people work hard to be ready for jobs

I got an art degree and now I'm studying science. Art takes a lot more work hours unless you're an idiot. It's not considered work because it's not considered work, not because it's not work.

this nigga gets it. if you don't believe there is a serious lack of artistic ability, go check out any mechanical engineering Machine Design class. its all hamfisted "just workz" linkages with no thought to aesthetics.

>"It's not considered work because it's not considered work, not because it's not work."

You lost me here because I'm an idiot with no reading comprehension.

Wait, I got it now. Had to see it separated from the rest of the text. I see what you're saying, I'm not saying art isn't work here.

>let's throw in the arts so that we don't get left behind to die
I remember back when everyone shat on STEM for being math oriented. Now everyone's dick riding it because they realize it's where the money is and there is a clear wage gap being formed based around stem and non-stem.

It's sad, and nobody should accept any of the half assed reasoning or logic for "steam". It's a farce because they know they'll die without becoming parasitic to STEM because they can't carry their own weight.

>- Focus on geometry
the types of students you have aren't going to be interested in that and will just drop out.
and the ones that are, are more worried about getting employment after uni

why don't you provide an arguement as to why hes wrong

yes this absolutely deserves to be a respected field...

please kill yourself OP

>tfw quintuple majoring in physics, comp. science, mechanical and electrical engineering, art/music, and math

honestly, society only gives a shit about T and E at this point

Actually, this isn't at all necessary for arts rigor. There is a skill called drafting which accomplishes the same thing. In fact, it accomplishes it a bit better, it includes certain things you've mentioned such as projecting, and it's more tailored towards an art curriculum.

How on Earth would they ever be parasitic? Past the university, no company is going to waste any resource on arts because some fags tried to change an acronym.

the problem is arts starts to gain credibility and respect among small business owners who don't look too much into qualifications if its lumped in with stem.
the logic would be something along the lines of 'why else would it be there if it wasn't somehow recognized in the same light'

goals

>Art takes a lot more work hours unless you're an idiot
You saying I need to be an idiot to be a good artist?

>I thought
...that's where you went wrong.

I'm a spic and I suck at art and am good at math. So they wouldn't be making me feel more included than I already am.Also you underestimate the angst filled white nu-male teens that draw "art".

STEEM
>Sci, Tech, Eng, Electronics, Math
FTFY

Not just you. I think there must be a mistake here. Gave me a laugh anyway

is this what art losers do when they want to get lumped in with people who are actually slightly intelligent?

Steam is a fucking shitty idea. All it does is encourage retard artists to ruin the idea behind having actually TECHNICAL fields. Holy shit, words can't describe how much I hate this shitty meme.

Fuck off faggot.

>Tech
>Electronics
>implying one isn't merely a subset of the other

I can see where the arts being added makes sense. Aesthetic design plays a role in engineering and tech. even so i really don't think it belongs.

I have a BA in Japanese/Philosophy. Now studying for a ECE/Comp Sci double degree.

Multimedia developer here I'm currently doing web application development involving software support.

It's pretty good, but it probably would have been less of a hassle to get to where I am if I had just majored in CS.

I surmise it's okay though since I make around 80k which is better than most of my peers who didn't specialize in technical art/ 3d cad.

1) STEM, and in particular, technolovy moreso than math/science, has always been inextricable from the social context in which its products are used, and more often than not that puts them adjacent to the arts. Just to take a really obvious example, the wedding of a few centuries of ideas about visual communication in 2d objects combined with software n electrical engineering to give us computers as we know them. If anything down the road from you touches the consumers hands, there's an aspect of it that can be understood through the lens of art.

2) Art is about communication, and it's particularly adept at intuitively explaining complex things using simplification (which is why dem stem textbooks all have diagrams - those are made by illustrators, not scientists). Learning a bit about art will help you sharpen your visual communication skills, which will both help you sharpen your visual thinking in general (good for stuff like mental sketching of ideas), and aid you in your ability to communicate ideas (in industry you'll be doing will have far more to do with communication and far less to do with silo'd domain knowledge than just the classes might have indicated - whole careers are made from being the guy who can explain to management what the nerds are doing, and pictures help that).

3) anything that breaks you out of narrow focus will make you better at anything you actually focus on. If you spend most of your life trying to be a stem person, you're not magically gonna become identical to an arts person just cause you dipped into a class or two; you're just gonna have your ability to approach new things sharpened by taking on something p new from why youre used to (and the arts are perfect for that, because they're like 1% technical skill, 99% lateral thinking).